Does there have to be any meaning or design to it all??

[PassionOfHybrid]

Originally Posted by metal68

Yeah, I will admit to being depressed.,. I suffer from it generally and then losing my mother in January just made it all worse. I do see things very negatively and I do have a natural tendency to see the world as a materialist. It doesn't offer much though!

I hope you overcome your situation.But, yes, it's just depression.I've had them multiple times to know well enough what goes on.My first legitimate depression was around age 11-12.I even started puberty early, haha.

Do you struggle with anxiety?

[lemex]

Originally Posted by metal68

I think we are all searching but is it fruitless??

What if it all really has just come about by accident/fortune and there is no meaning or reason for it? That we really are just biological robots with this illusion that we are something more. We're here for 60 to 90 years (if we're lucky) and then gone for good? That it is almost a cruel joke that we are here at all in the first place. And of course there are no higher beings, spirit guides etc

I find it hard to believe there is no design (not sure about the designer) and that it's all happened by chance but the likes of Dawkins seem to argue their case persuasively. I haven't read his books, I suspect I would find it too depressing.

My gut feeling is we are all desperately searching for meanings and seeing faces in clouds etc when there is nothing there.

Wow, you ask the hardest questions. Should it really matter? It shouldn't but it does. Why, because that which we seek tells us it does. Why does the thought bother us we must continue to be (as we are). Can we put a finger on why we search. Why it matters is what you heard first. The answer may be seeing why it matters! I suspect there are things people still must do and we certainly aren't quite ready.

What do you see. From my perspective the world hasn't changed very much. I still see the world divided into religious ideologies. Ironic as it is, everyone believes in God. If God is real why isn't the message the same, why because it seems evident, God represents society. Who see's the real God.

What if God came down and said nope, you got it wrong. It may have happened. If it happened again, do you think it would be any different today. Cause and effect would happen.

I don't like playing the role of pessimist but it has to be said if the question is asked. My own feeling is, it may not be the proper time to know anything, and it is not our decision. (by this I mean it is our decision to know but not be told) I see spiritually we're very young. Spiritually we are evolving of which I hope there is some freedom in that, something I picked up being human....lol. I would not want it one way.

And the world simply may not be ready though a single person may be. Who is more correct, the masses or the single person. I could see the reason not to because I'm not sure the world could handle it well. Human nature.

Based on what I see some still would not like God and some would, some might even call it a lie. If God made itself known would free will still exist so there could definitely be a reason. What if we are here to learn and we are the cause. An old thought for me. God may not be the illusion but belief is. If we are beginning to see through it, there will be resistance and discomfort and breaking old attachments, nothing more.

Imagine this as heaven on earth. We do want things so quickly.

If you knew then everyone would know.

[Uma]

I am tempted to contribute here...

Does a human heart cell beating in sync
with a bunch of other heart cells
closely grouped together in the perfect shape of a heart -
does it know that it is part of a vast cardiovascular system?

No one will ever convince me that things are random in this universe

[H:O:R:A:C:E]

Originally Posted by John32241

Hi,

I can only speak about my mind set when it come to intelligent design.

The core belief would determine anyone's perception. Those that see every human as a divine piece of God would know that we do everything with an outcome expectation in mind. The pure intellectual would not be able to sense the energies of love. Their perception would not pick up on how everything is about expanding and expressing love.

John

like!

[r6r6]

metal68--I think we are all searching but is it fruitless??

We exists as some of the many kinds of fruit.

What if it all really has just come about by accident/fortune and there is no meaning or reason for it?

We apply purpose, meaning etc......

That we really are just biological robots with this illusion that we are something more. We're here for 60 to 90 years (if we're lucky) and then gone for good? That it is almost a cruel joke that we are here at all in the first place.

Not cruel at all, unless someone circumstances are full of cruelness during their journey here.

And of course there are no higher beings, spirit guides etc

Again, there those that we apply.

r6

[brianjamez]

Anything can exist in any definable or undefinable format, known or unknown at any given time for any reason. Just because something exists doesn't mean it needs to be created (What came first, Chicken or the Egg). On that note there need be no basis for anything unless you or your preffered system of beliefs deems necessary.

Our general understanding of "things" typically relies on the teachings or beliefs of other sources if you see it that way. It doesn't need to be this way or that way unless you deem it so. Two completely conflicting understandings of things can co-exist at the same time and never conflict.
Gotta love this self awareness thing we have going on.

[r6r6]

Originally Posted by brianjamez

Anything can exist in any definable or undefinable format, known or unknown at any given time for any reason.

If there exists a finite set of cosmic laws/principles, then no, not anything can exist, only that which does not violate or contradict any of those cosmic laws/principles.

r6

[wmsm]

Originally Posted by brianjamez

Anything can exist in any definable or undefinable format, known or unknown at any given time for any reason. Just because something exists doesn't mean it needs to be created (What came first, Chicken or the Egg). On that note there need be no basis for anything unless you or your preffered system of beliefs deems necessary.

Our general understanding of "things" typically relies on the teachings or beliefs of other sources if you see it that way. It doesn't need to be this way or that way unless you deem it so. Two completely conflicting understandings of things can co-exist at the same time and never conflict.
Gotta love this self awareness thing we have going on.

What about a truth that if human beings did not have sex and create new life there would be no one questioning anything about creation.

[RyanWind]

Originally Posted by metal68

I think we are all searching but is it fruitless??

There are some God like qualities implied with that statement which is nonsensical because we are not gods. None of us have any memory of creating anything we find here on earth and none of us have any actual powers to create ourselves or the world around us. Yes we can manipulate things we found here into new configurations and creations but the basic building blocks were here when we found ourselves here. We found ourselves on this ball in a seemly infinite space and no one else we found here has any idea who or what is responsible for us or anything around us. We are all searching? Not really. Most of us are obsessed with animal drives and desires. We want love, comfort, food, sex, shelter and on and on. We want escape from" reality" so we get lost in movies and books and tv and video games and belief and opinion and on and on. There is no limit to the amount of stuff we create to entertain ourselves and others.

Originally Posted by metal68

What if it all really has just come about by accident/fortune and there is no meaning or reason for it? That we really are just biological robots with this illusion that we are something more. We're here for 60 to 90 years (if we're lucky) and then gone for good? That it is almost a cruel joke that we are here at all in the first place. And of course there are no higher beings, spirit guides etc

The meaning or purpose would be from the creators of human life. Our wanting meaning has nothing to do with it. We are dust in the wind as the song says. The things humans obsess over are largely invented by humans, not the creator of realty. I doubt the pleasures and pains of one animal on a planet of billions has much meaning to that which made this all this possible. Concluding there are no "higher beings" is also pure egotism and arrogance. We did not create the planet earth or the sun or anything else. Funny a small animal that finds itself in this infinite universe can make a statement like, I don't think there is anything that exists more intelligent or powerful than I.

Originally Posted by metal68

My gut feeling is we are all desperately searching for meanings and seeing faces in clouds etc when there is nothing there.

Thinking is not searching. It's like looking in a mirror to see what's behind it. You are like the air inside a balloon trapped within your own space. To actually search beyond yourself, you have to let go of yourself. You will never see whats beyond yourself until you can let go of yourself. So I would not call what we do "searching." The meaning will not come from you, it will come when you see what is there beyond you.

[RyanWind]

Originally Posted by wmsm

What about a truth that if human beings did not have sex and create new life there would be no one questioning anything about creation.

You are basically imagining what would this planet be like if no humans were on it. Every living thing has a consciousness. There is a point of awareness and perception inside every living thing. So even if humans were not here, conscious energy would still be here. Also, since this conscious energy is interacting with physical forms and data, it is evolving. So what is, is evolving into higher forms. Now say there was nothing living on this planet and conscious energy did not exist. If that was true, the planet would not exist.

Did you know rainbows don't exist if no one is around to see them? Moisture and light created light waves enters the human eye and looks like a rainbow. If there were no animals with eyes to translate the light waves into colors etc, they would not be there. The light waves would be there but they need an eye or lense to receive the data and a translator of that wave/data and then a consciousness to perceive or "experience/see" it. Really all there is is tiny atomic particles. Energy and matter. For a planet to exist there has to be a living things to perceive the atoms etc as a planet. The perceiver is the creator and so the perception itself is a sign of the intent of the ultimate creator. Look around your room. That is all atoms. We know this because we have microscopes that can look up close. Buzzing moving energy particles of electrons etc. That's what's here. The fact this buzzing hive of particles looks like a table or chair or bed etc is because of us. We are turning the minute particles into objects.