Hi! I am a Chinese Buddhist.

Originally Posted by Mayflow

As far as I have seen, the Buddha and many followers did have a lot of what many would call super powers. He always cautioned them to not show them off as he considered them to actually be natural abilities that would be come across in the search for the goal of full enlightenment, but the temptation to show them off or for them to be a goal would not lead to full enlightenment.

Can't agree with you more!!! I always admire your English Mayflow!~~ It took me so much efforts to write the paragraphs expressing the same thing.

With regard to CrystalSong and Running's discussion, I am not going to join any more. Think the previous posts had clearly stated my position.

Like with financial investment. I believe the knowledge there was fine to enable one to make an informed decision. In sum, even if you do not pursue Buddhism, it can be dangerous to pursue superpower. And I honestly believe it's always very dangerous.

[CrystalSong]

My point was many people are awakening and instantly getting these super powers, one day they are shopping, playing computer games and watching the news and gossiping with neighbors and the next day the world is spinning and they don't know up from down and can read peoples minds talk to trees and heal people and travel to to other timelines and access the Ashkaic records and they have NO IDEA what just happened. Many think they've lots their minds or are about too.
Buddhism says search for Enlightenment and it will come when you are ready, what running and I are saying is you may not have to search - It may find you - ready or not!

We didn't pursue superpower - we didn't even believe in them, it was against our religion and against our culture and people who claim to have them are looked down on in our country, locked away in a padded room or medicated until they are numb.
It HAPPENED to us anyway.


So the whole idea that this stuff happens in some particular order is flawed. This step doesn't lead to that one and that one onto the next one. There's nothing orderly and predictable about being struck by lightening
And telling the person who just got stuck by lightening that they did things in the wrong order isn't helpful for anyone and a true enlightened person would know that.

Originally Posted by Mayflow

As far as I have seen, the Buddha and many followers did have a lot of what many would call super powers. He always cautioned them to not show them off as he considered them to actually be natural abilities that would be come across in the search for the goal of full enlightenment, but the temptation to show them off or for them to be a goal would not lead to full enlightenment.

[running]

Originally Posted by Mayflow

As far as I have seen, the Buddha and many followers did have a lot of what many would call super powers. He always cautioned them to not show them off as he considered them to actually be natural abilities that would be come across in the search for the goal of full enlightenment, but the temptation to show them off or for them to be a goal would not lead to full enlightenment.

When it comes to bliss i have found for me it doesnt matter. What i mean is the bliss grows with and without spiritual experiences. I cant speak for others but i know its not in my make up to want attention. But did want to get to the bottom of whats going on. . My only intention in my case was so my dad wouldnt lose his house. Now i pay for part of it for him. I dont mind as i dont care for material posessions. Everything i own fits in three bags. I love being by myself with the energy. So i give a third of my money away. I dont need anything.

Originally Posted by icy_su

With regard to CrystalSong and Running's discussion, I am not going to join any more. Think the previous posts had clearly stated my position.

Like with financial investment. I believe the knowledge there was fine to enable one to make an informed decision. In sum, even if you do not pursue Buddhism, it can be dangerous to pursue superpower. And I honestly believe it's always very dangerous.

Agreed.

[CrystalSong]

running I do believe we're being politely shown the door!
We've been naughty heretics! We didn't awaken according to established rules. Naughty naughty!

Please excuse us icy_su and mayflower, we meant no harm and were just sharing other cultural perspectives and our personal experiences in learning about awakening backwards having never have sought it to begin with. =)

[running]

Originally Posted by icy_su

With regard to CrystalSong and Running's discussion, I am not going to join any more. Think the previous posts had clearly stated my position.

Like with financial investment. I believe the knowledge there was fine to enable one to make an informed decision. In sum, even if you do not pursue Buddhism, it can be dangerous to pursue superpower. And I honestly believe it's always very dangerous.

I dont remember anyone talking about trying to obtain anything. Nor do i understand how you or anyone can come to believe to know anything for sure. Especialy one on a spiritual path. From what i have seen it has to do with not knowing and being innocent. Not acting like you are the one who has the answers. This is realy weird and not something i would of ever expected to see in a spiritual website. If this is how Buddhist believe im glad to find out sooner rather than later.

If its not your setting a poor example.

I personally do not consider any type of spiritual awakening as a superpower...It is natural and normal once you get accustomed to it, just as mediumship and other psychic abilities are normal to those that possess the gift.. Just as there are many, many Christian denominations, there are many Buddhist sects as well--some meditate, others chant...It is kind of you to share the tenets of your sect of Buddhism with us...It opens the mind to different possibilities....

[CrystalSong]

Originally Posted by icy_su

I noticed that many people who meditate end up in illusions. They see strange things, hear strange voices, and have other mysterious feelings. There are even posts in this forum that claim having a 3rd eye.

However, if you go back to the true spirit of meditation, you will know that it is a way to peace, wisdom, joy and comfort. If you are experiencing fear, anxiety or other negative emotions, that means you need to think whether you are going wrong. I don't know where the illusions will lead you, but it can be dangerous.

Why so many people go wrong in meditation? It's because they do not have a proper goal. Put it simple -- you get what you pursue. If you pursue fantasy, then you will go into fantasy.

This is where the conversation got muddled - the judgement, labeling and dismissal of others experiences. It is good to share one's approach and its welcomed by many, its one of the many beautiful parts of sharing the internet with the citizens of the world and we all learn much from each other and grow.

You may find judging others experiences as illusions and fantasy's won't gain you popularity in an International forum with many who experience and use such as daily tools. They come from many religious backgrounds and training or none at all - yet each has found their own way and their own abilities.

Dismissing their experiences and knowledge on a mere taught belief that such doesn't exist, is dangerous, is bad or otherwise not worthy - is something you were taught by others, and have adopted as a personal belief for yourself without first hand proof. It is not however consistent with many other peoples reality and first hand experience.

You have much to offer in teaching about this form of meditation and I would like to see you continue teaching it and leave out the judgement bits as they seem to not be working well for you in this thread and have derailed it from the intention you had to educate and share a meditation style.

Wisdom is not judging that which you do not know. =)

[Gem]

Originally Posted by CrystalSong

This is where the conversation got muddled - the judgement, labeling and dismissal of others experiences. It is good to share one's approach and its welcomed by many, its one of the many beautiful parts of sharing the internet with the citizens of the world and we all learn much from each other and grow.

You may find judging others experiences as illusions and fantasy's won't gain you popularity in an International forum with many who experience and use such as daily tools. They come from many religious backgrounds and training or none at all - yet each has found their own way and their own abilities.

Dismissing their experiences and knowledge on a mere taught belief that such doesn't exist, is dangerous, is bad or otherwise not worthy - is something you were taught by others, and have adopted as a personal belief for yourself without first hand proof. It is not however consistent with many other peoples reality and first hand experience.

You have much to offer in teaching about this form of meditation and I would like to see you continue teaching it and leave out the judgement bits as they seem to not be working well for you in this thread and have derailed it from the intention you had to educate and share a meditation style.

Wisdom is not judging that which you do not know. =)

As I have understood it, Pure Land Buddhism meditation involves chanting Buddha's name... and I don't see that being inherently different from visualation. It doesn't seem to have much to do with the Meditation that Gautama supposedly taught. As far as I am aware, Gautama was the proponent of Vipassana, which involves neither visualisation or chanting. Actually, all beliefs are baseless assumptions, including my own, but in the absence of reality, belief is all there is, and in the absence of Truth there is only trust... and I guess that's the recipe for faith.

The most fundamental teaching of Buddhism is anatta, which in the western view, can be inadequately translated as no-self; but the eastern mind thinks less in nouns, so it's not accurate to interpret is as an absence of something...

OK... it's more the verb, which we can call behaviour, so in Buddhism there isn't a soul, there isn't some thing which is there at all. The Western view is of an ego, something which must be transcended, and that notion has been used in modern Buddhist sects as well, but it wasn't Gautama's concept at all... and it was probably Freud who brought that term into common speech, it's not an Abrahamic Religious notion or a Buddhist one, and as far as I'm aware it wasn't partial to any world religion.

Buddha suggested that there is Dukkha, which refers to the temporal changing universe in context to personal reactivity to it, your reaction to the universe, basically.

Re-incarnation isn't a soul that moves from body to body... it's the continual reactivity creating a perpetuated motion of thought, which manifests as 'I' reacting to the universe...

Reaction stems from two underlying factors, aversion (hatred) and desire (greed), and these two go hand in hand together and are the sourse of all suffering. Now suffering is not discomfort or pain, it's the personal reaction to them... and pleasure is also suffering, not because of the sensation of it, but because of the desire for it.

The core tenet of Vipassana is non-reaction, and as one sits in meditation they merely remain aware of discomfort, pleasure or any sensation that occurs... they don't chant to invoke a desirable vibration nor do they visualise their desired imagery, they do not seek out any experience, they are aware of the experience as it spontaneously occurs.

The aim of Buddha's technique is the quell the habitual reactivity of the mind, because when reactions cease there is no self. Anata, therefore, means non-reactive. Without reaction, there is no more cycle of birth and re-birth because there is no construction material to build a self with.

When the person reaches Anatta, their self continues for a time while the old storehouse of reactions dispell their energy... it's kinda like, just you stop adding wood to the fire, but it takes a while to die out.

Well, that's the way I interpreted the thing, anyway.