What did the Buddah actually achieve?

satorimind · #1 25-01-2018, 03:09 PM

I've pondered this one many times. What exactly was the Enlightenment that the Buddha achieved under the Bodhi tree 2,500 years ago.

The obvious answer is the ending of suffering. But didn't the Buddha still have a bad back after Enlightenment?

My guess he ended suffering, not pain. We all have pain; it is part of life. Suffering is what we add to pain, create on top of it.

I think it is this that the Buddha ended.

Anyone else got any ideas?

#2 25-01-2018, 03:46 PM

Nope. That's it pretty much. Pain is there, but suffering is optional.

With Love
Eelco
ps. forgot who said that initially

sky · #3 25-01-2018, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by satorimind

I've pondered this one many times. What exactly was the Enlightenment that the Buddha achieved under the Bodhi tree 2,500 years ago.

The obvious answer is the ending of suffering. But didn't the Buddha still have a bad back after Enlightenment?

My guess he ended suffering, not pain. We all have pain; it is part of life. Suffering is what we add to pain, create on top of it.

I think it is this that the Buddha ended.

Anyone else got any ideas?

Yes, ' The four noble truths '

The truth of suffering (Dukkha)
The truth of the origin of suffering (Samudāya)
The truth of the cessation of suffering (Nirodha)
The truth of the path to the cessation of suffering(Magga)

BlueSky · #4 25-01-2018, 05:10 PM

So in essence suffering is the effect of ignorance and his enlightenment was the ending of ignorance which I'm sure brings with it much more than the end of suffering.

#5 25-01-2018, 05:18 PM

Very possibly.

With love
Eelco

BlueSky · #6 25-01-2018, 05:19 PM

Personally if this truth he is said to have learned is at odds with the world, with living life and with relationships, I prefer suffering.
I mean if enlightenment means no me, no children, no mate as far as relating to one another then it's not something anyone would normally want.
If a loved one dies, we suffer. What state of mind or being would one desire to eliminate that kind of suffering?
This was my resulting understanding of what Buddhism has to offer and I consciously chose not to persue it.
I prefer to love and suffer if need be if that is the price of loving.
I'm not looking to be convinced otherwise. Just sharing.
Suffering is part of living

sky · #7 25-01-2018, 06:03 PM

"Pleasure is not a reward and pain is not a punishment. They are just ordinary experiences.” Our running from one or toward another is what heightens our suffering and exactly what the Buddha was referring to when he talked of freedom from suffering. He wasn’t saying that we will never experience pain or sickness or depression ever again (he needed periods of seclusion to re-center himself), he was saying that with awareness we can lessen our suffering. We can behave in such a way, understand in such a way as to not make it worse and even make it better.

So no, suffering is not optional, but our level of attachment to it can be."

Chogyam Thungpa.

#8 25-01-2018, 07:21 PM

"Sensing a feeling of pleasure, he senses it disjoined from it. Sensing a feeling of pain, he senses it disjoined from it. Sensing a feeling of neither-pleasure-nor-pain, he senses it disjoined from it. This is called a well-instructed disciple of the noble ones disjoined from birth, aging, & death; from sorrows, lamentations, pains, distresses, & despairs. He is disjoined, I tell you, from suffering & stress.

Sallatha Sutta

WIth Love
Eelco

BlueSky · #9 25-01-2018, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sky123

"Pleasure is not a reward and pain is not a punishment. They are just ordinary experiences.” Our running from one or toward another is what heightens our suffering and exactly what the Buddha was referring to when he talked of freedom from suffering. He wasn’t saying that we will never experience pain or sickness or depression ever again (he needed periods of seclusion to re-center himself), he was saying that with awareness we can lessen our suffering. We can behave in such a way, understand in such a way as to not make it worse and even make it better.

So no, suffering is not optional, but our level of attachment to it can be."

Chogyam Thungpa.

I hear you but you don't need Buddhism to realize that.

BlueSky · #10 25-01-2018, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by catsquotl

"Sensing a feeling of pleasure, he senses it disjoined from it. Sensing a feeling of pain, he senses it disjoined from it. Sensing a feeling of neither-pleasure-nor-pain, he senses it disjoined from it. This is called a well-instructed disciple of the noble ones disjoined from birth, aging, & death; from sorrows, lamentations, pains, distresses, & despairs. He is disjoined, I tell you, from suffering & stress.

Sallatha Sutta

WIth Love
Eelco

Would you define your natural attachments to your loved ones as stress?
I define them as special relationships created by the bonds we share.