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[jonesboy]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Thank you, Jonesboy and also thank you David for taking the time to reply. I am happy now.

Whatever resonates with your core is the most appropriate path to follow, although at this present time, I find myself in slight disagreement with you, Tom.

I am of the view that each path up that mountain will eventually lead to the same destination... either sooner or later, depending on karma, as realisation is the ultimate goal and end point.

As you know, I also ascribe to many of the tenets put forward by KS, but I also have a hard time letting go of the Puranic aspects of Siva and so, although being 'one like Siva' is indeed the ultimate goal, I find my path to be more devotional than KS and thus more in accordance with the teachings of either Pashupati Shaivism or the school of Shaiva Siddhanta...but of course, that is my way.

The point I am trying to make is our beliefs/concepts and practices lead to different realizations.

The progression can take countless lifetimes.

Some traditions don't believe one can be One like Siva.. it is all Brahma and you just return.

A Buddhist would say a Buddha is beyond One like Siva.

I wish you all the best on your path

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by jonesboy

The point I am trying to make is our beliefs/concepts and practices lead to different realizations.

The progression can take countless lifetimes.

Some traditions don't believe one can be One like Siva.. it is all Brahma and you just return.

A Buddhist would say a Buddha is beyond One like Siva.

I wish you all the best on your path

I wish you all the best too,.

The point I am enquiring about, is that are there many realisations, or just one realisation with many ways to achieve it? I shall use the example of Siva being Brahman, so to be 'one like Siva' is to attain Brahman, which would be the same outcome for an Advaita Vedantin, would it not?

[happy soul]

Originally Posted by davidmartin

Hi
I'm quite interested in Shakti and Shiva and the school of thought that says illusion and maya are only a step in realisation they are part of God and not an illusion in the grander scheme of things. So a sort of dualism hiding behind non-dualism. This resonates with my own thoughts
I can't seem to find a proponent of these teachings to read up on, ancient or modern and wanted to read something really esoteric and full of symbology. Samaya tantra interests me again could find nothing to read to pass on insights prefer something difficult to read than easy

Also wondered if any sages taught there is only one chakra that connects all the others together

thanks for all help!

The chakras are connected in the same manner as everything is - they're all manifestations of the same universal energy/love/consciousness.

Until the early 1600's there hardly any mention of the 7 chackra system as we know it in writing..

I wonder how pliable the concept of chakra's really is.
At some point I removed them energetically in favor of an integrated energetic whole..

In the end though it is about how we relate to grouped concepts.
Which is why a 7 chakra system works so well.

With Love
Eelco

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by Eelco

Until the early 1600's there hardly any mention of the 7 chackra system as we know it in writing..

I wonder how pliable the concept of chakra's really is.
At some point I removed them energetically in favor of an integrated energetic whole..

In the end though it is about how we relate to grouped concepts.
Which is why a 7 chakra system works so well.

With Love
Eelco

You are correct.

The chakra philosophy was codified in the 1600's in the Hatha Yoga Pradipika, by Swami Svatmarama.

Before that, it was probably part of an oral tradition which had its origins within the Yoga Kundali Upanishad, which was said to have been narrated by Lord Rama to Hanuman during the Yajur Veda time and even before that, when Lord Shiva instructed the first sons of Manu and the Sapta Rishis.

I would be interested to read how you 'removed' them, because as far as I know and I am aware, the human body needs them to function and it would be like ripping all your glands out...and of course, I am an adept in Tantra and Laya Yoga, with extensive knowledge and experience on this particular subject.

Granted, chakras, Kundalini and all of those things are just concepts, but so is everything else when you look at it, whereby a label is required to explain a phenomenon so the knowledge of it can be explained to another who may have had a similar experience and wondering what the hell it is.

Aum Namah Shivaya

I've written about the process in the threads i link to below.
I've had a wondeful in depth conversation on another forum once, which sadly got deleted. I am more than willing to discuss the finesses of the chacra's as concepts and my experiences with and without them in a less defensive manner if you want to.

WIth Love
Eelco

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/sh...ad.php?t=50083

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=50084

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by Eelco

I've written about the process in the threads i link to below.
I've had a wondeful in depth conversation on another forum once, which sadly got deleted. I am more than willing to discuss the finesses of the chacra's as concepts and my experiences with and without them in a less defensive manner if you want to.

WIth Love
Eelco

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/sh...ad.php?t=50083

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=50084

Thanks so much for that and I shall peruse those links in due course because I am on a mobile phone and it will take some time.

Being on this mobile, I cannot post links, unfortunately, but I just got through explaining the energetic intricacies of the whole chakra system in a thread about Kundalini, started by Bartholomew in the Spiritual Development Forum. If you read that post, you can understand why I hold certain reservations about what you stated.

I will never criticise, condemn or treat you in the same way others did, it's just that this goes against everything I was taught and what I have come to know and understand personally and I would like to know why that is, besides just sitting here shaking my head,

So I thank you kindly and will read those links over the next few hours.

[Shivani Devi]

I just skimmed the first post of the first link and what you described as the two facing triangles or vortices in the crown and base chakras, looks for all the world like a torsion field rotation along a central axis and so, I am going to have to take my time with your posts.

Having said that, I get rather dubious and skeptical about every unsubstantiated claim I read which basically states "evil beings/reptilians/Satan just created the whole idea of this to lead innocent human beings astray and or control them/ deceive them for their own evil agendas" I mean, I'd love to have a dollar for every time I have heard it or read it somewhere...so now I find myself totally desensitised to this mode of reasoning and ESPECIALLY if it is part of my whole culture and tradition... The only thing I can say in regards now, is if that is the honest case, then I am totally happy and blissful being mislead and deceived...so, if it's true, I guess I'll just have to deal with it NEXT lifetime, because I don't believe it in THIS one...And this is in no way a personal criticism, this is me being stubborn to the words of my Gurus...And of my own Faith and conviction, in which I will not be moved.

The imagery closest are the drawings of the chacra system as depicted in healing hands or hands of light by barbara brannon I think it was.

I am not very visual, so I intuit and imagine a lot in stead of clear seeing like the movies.
This was a long while ago I am a bit more mellow when it comes to the chakra these days. I see the chakra more as "tools" one can use to work with certain types of related energy in ones field.

A symbol if you will to connect with certain parts that need tuning..
The darker stuff that got me to get rid of them are no longer my concern..

With Love
Eelco

[Shivani Devi]

This is meant just to be a casual observation and nothing more, but it also comes on the back of murmurings from my Higher Self in regards, who is alluding to the difference in perspective and philosophy which exists between an 'old school' and Bona fide traditional Hindu who has immersed themselves totally IN the Hatha Yoga Pradipika, the Yoga Kundali Upanishad, Patanjali's Yoga aphorisms, the Maha Nirvana Tantra...and, may I add, I was raised by Balinese Shamans in the tradition of Bambu kuning and the left hand occult Tantric path, who just live and breathe this stuff....verses those of the New Age movement who wouldn't understand traditional Hinduism and Tantra anyway, never read the same Scriptures, never had the same teachers, basing everything on second hand information and beliefs...now, this is no way directed towards you whatsoever, but those who say stuff like the chakras are influenced by the rings of Saturn,.... what a load of ......

These are mainly the opinions of that 'voice within'...My Inner Guru...