Spirituality and Nutrition

I use endive all kinds of ways. Throw a few leaves in our afternoon smoothies, raw in salads, mixed into stir fries, nibble on some plain, raw leaves just because....

I'm going to try growing it this year but it's a little complicated to get it to harvest apparently which explains the higher price. But I'm going to give it a try and see what happens.

Originally Posted by DebbyM

As to government and regulations and such, I think that I have to agree with Stephen in that this era sees those agency directly affecting our levels of spirituality through 'enforcement' of health debilitating policies, regulations and education. Informing on this sort of issue might be an encouragement to those who aren't as committed as we all are (the unhealthy lurkers) to reconsider how they 'tune' their spirit's vehicle, i.e. the physcial body.

Most wonderfully summarized Debby!! :^)

Originally Posted by sesheta

Love that answer - well said :)

And Thank You Sesheta!

Originally Posted by knightofalbion

Blood on your hands?

Nutrition through guilt is it? :^)

All of what you quoted is a perfect indictment against the process of feedlots and factory-farming practices... this isn't what's traditionally
occurred.... and this very process is not only deeply horrific to the animal involved via the chemicals used, and that are hormonally stimulated ( heavy
adrenaline stimulation, anti-biotics, the poison neotame being now used as a sweetener to mask the rancid products they are being fed during this
process) but the meat that emerges from this also poisons the people who eat it...! There is karmic revenge for such brutality! You focused on the cow
but the same holds true with the way chickens are treated, in both the meat and egg industries.... I've seen this upclose and personally and I can
tell you it's horrific!

But then this manor of treatment is new... the family who raises their own animals don't go about it in this way... the hunter/gatherer who tracks and
prayerfully extracts the animal from the wild and expresses gratitude while doing so does not participate in the debauchery you mentioned....

For you the subject of animal foods is emotional... but nutritionally speaking it's shallow.... The healthiest cultures traditionally world-wide participated
freely in animal products... not to mention the food needs for our fellow creatures on earth like the:

<snip>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_apex_predators

...And None of these species participate in the debauchery you mentioned.. animal-eating-animal is "Natural".... only "recently" we've turned into something quite
different....! Animal foods in it's natural state is historically healthy and nutritionally relevant! :^)

Edited by SF Staff

[knightofalbion]

Originally Posted by StephenK

Nutrition through guilt is it? :^)

All of what you quoted is a perfect indictment against the process of feedlots and factory-farming practices... this isn't what's traditionally
occurred.... and this very process is not only deeply horrific to the animal involved via the chemicals used, and that are hormonally stimulated ( heavy
adrenaline stimulation, anti-biotics, the poison neotame being now used as a sweetener to mask the rancid products they are being fed during this
process) but the meat that emerges from this also poisons the people who eat it...! There is karmic revenge for such brutality! You focused on the cow
but the same holds true with the way chickens are treated, in both the meat and egg industries.... I've seen this upclose and personally and I can
tell you it's horrific!

But then this manor of treatment is new... the family who raises their own animals don't go about it in this way... the hunter/gatherer who tracks and
prayerfully extracts the animal from the wild and expresses gratitude while doing so does not participate in the debauchery you mentioned....

For you the subject of animal foods is emotional... but nutritionally speaking it's shallow.... The healthiest cultures traditionally world-wide participated
freely in animal products... not to mention the food needs for our fellow creatures on earth like the:

<snip>

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_apex_predators

...And None of these species participate in the debauchery you mentioned.. animal-eating-animal is "Natural".... only "recently" we've turned into something quite
different....! Animal foods in it's natural state is historically healthy and nutritionally relevant! :^)

'Spirituality and nutrition' is the title of this thread in case you hadn't noticed, Stephen.

Sometimes when I come to this forum I can only hold my head in my hands in despair.

"The sorrow that lies in dear, dumb eyes"...If you need it explaining, there'd be no point in explaining.

Man was created "to walk with the angels" and to be "the sanctuary of love and justice", not to hurt and kill.

Alas, there are many who do hurt and kill. But for everything there is a price to be paid. Suffering can only be requited by suffering...

The day will come, when their 'eyes of spirit' are opened, that such people will look with profound regret on every helpless life they took and every pang of pain they caused.

I think you ought to read that quote again. It tells of the physical and astral horrors of the slaughterhouse - and the same applies to any slaughterhouse, past, present or future.
And there is complicity. People should give thought to what they are party to.

I refer you to my first post in this thread.

Originally Posted by knightofalbion

'Spirituality and nutrition' is the title of this thread in case you hadn't noticed, Stephen.

Hmmm... you brought up the issue.... :^) which is totally okay... clearly animal products are a nutritional/spiritual issue... If a healthy body is the
contributing doorway to our greater connection with our deeper self, then it's good to be aware of other animals potential place in our diet...

Originally Posted by knightofalbion

I think you ought to read that quote again. It tells of the physical and astral horrors of the slaughterhouse - and the same applies to any slaughterhouse, past, present or future.
And there is complicity. People should give thought to what they are party to.

Seriously, I read it and addressed your points directly.... if bad stuff on a spiritual level is the result of responsibly consuming animals and animal products then god
would have a great deal to answer to! How you personally feel about the process seems to be mostly at play here... If a lion saw me out on the
plains, and decided to pounce-on and then eat me, would that then be evil?... would the lion then be faced with: "The day will come, when their
'eyes of spirit' are opened, that such people will look with profound regret on every helpless life they took and every pang of pain they caused. "

I'm totally with you as to horrors of factory farming practices! It's mindlessly brutal and spiritual-guilt by "those involved" will likely occur at some point! But if
you're suggesting that all manor of animal consumption, (back to the founding of mankind) is equally as horrific then clearly we're not on the same page...

I'm sorry you feel so bad about the natural process... but I wouldn't take it out on the forum itself... I suspect that few here actually own their own stockyards.... :^)

Originally Posted by DebbyM

I use endive all kinds of ways. Throw a few leaves in our afternoon smoothies, raw in salads, mixed into stir fries, nibble on some plain, raw leaves just because....
.

Sounds yummy! :^)

I'm finally getting a small dehydrator over the weekend (that we've had in storage), along with a meat slicer in order to slice-up pineapple and things into dehydrator size portions!
(I'll be driving to the western side of washington state for a few days to do some quick work on our home over there... :^)

We've also been having a gas with this whole fermenting process! So far home-made yogurt with whole organic milk, as well as kefir using whole organic
"raw" milk (the yogurt we have to heat to 180F anyway so it seemed silly to sacrifice the more expensive raw milk when the "already pasteurized" will do! )

And then the veggie fermenting is well under way... gotta watch that one though.. fermented veggies are pretty heady stuff... there's a thing called
the die-off that occurs when the good biotics in the fermented veggies attack the bad biotics in our gut... made me queasy the other day when I
tied it... this process is for real! :^)

[knightofalbion]

Originally Posted by StephenK

Hmmm... you brought up the issue.... :^) which is totally okay... clearly animal products are a nutritional/spiritual issue... If a healthy body is the
contributing doorway to our greater connection with our deeper self, then it's good to be aware of other animals potential place in our diet...


Seriously, I read it and addressed your points directly.... if bad stuff on a spiritual level is the result of responsibly consuming animals and animal products then god
would have a great deal to answer to! How you personally feel about the process seems to be mostly at play here... If a lion saw me out on the
plains, and decided to pounce-on and then eat me, would that then be evil?... would the lion then be faced with: "The day will come, when their
'eyes of spirit' are opened, that such people will look with profound regret on every helpless life they took and every pang of pain they caused. "

I'm totally with you as to horrors of factory farming practices! It's mindlessly brutal and spiritual-guilt by "those involved" will likely occur at some point! But if
you're suggesting that all manor of animal consumption, (back to the founding of mankind) is equally as horrific then clearly we're not on the same page...

I'm sorry you feel so bad about the natural process... but I wouldn't take it out on the forum itself... I suspect that few here actually own their own stockyards.... :^)

Actually it was Mayflow who "brought up the issue".

Man is more than a beast. (Though some people don't seem to have got the memo.)

I say again, man was created "to walk with the angels" and to be "the sanctuary of love and justice", not to hurt and kill.

If 'you' hurt and kill, be the victim man or beast, there is a price to pay. That is the Law.

In the beginning man lived on a purely plant-based diet, so it was and so shall it be again, eventually.

Incidentally, you said "the healthiest cultures traditionally worldwide participated freely in animal products". That is not true. Indeed, the very opposite is true, it is those cultures who eat very little or no animal products at all who are the healthiest and most long-lived.

Originally Posted by knightofalbion

Actually it was Mayflow who "brought up the issue".

Man is more than a beast.

Man is more than a beast is officially now my new signature.

Originally Posted by knightofalbion

Man is more than a beast. (Though some people don't seem to have got the memo.)

I say again, man was created "to walk with the angels" and to be "the sanctuary of love and justice", not to hurt and kill.

If 'you' hurt and kill, be the victim man or beast, there is a price to pay. That is the Law.

So simplistic.... you're born into a complex physical world and define it as you see fit... and then call that a "law".... you realize of course that's how
religions and new-age fly-by-night awareness is achieved...

We are currently in a state of transition... humans have been historically fighting for survival against weather, disease, and the hunger-of-other-
animals... you now sit at a computer and rant in the comfort of an insulated home, your belly is full of ... uh... veggies... and your bookshelves have
been padded with mass produced books...

You are living in a party of plenty... and you judge...

It may be that our species will have to make numerous mistakes before waking-up to the complexity of this newly found freedom... but the
mistakes were spurred-on by the difficulties inherent within nature itself, and our response to this "freedom" has long been spring-loaded.

Here's the deal... if we don't correct our current habits we'll die... it's as simple as that... not for some high-falutin spirtualized reason, but for the simple sake
of cause and effect... if we mess up the quality of our food sources we get sick and die... if we destroy the delicate environmental balance and poison
our surroundings, we die...

You seem to be building your whole case around the exaltation of spiritual guilt... meanwhile, we were each born into an animal body... we are surrounded by animal
influences.. our default is to be animal by nature... so odds are we humans will act a bit animal till we die.. and then we transcend... likely to re-enter
and do it again...

Your beating your chest won't change that... :^)

Originally Posted by StephenK

You seem to be building your whole case around the exaltation of spiritual guilt... meanwhile, we were each born into an animal body... we are surrounded by animal
influences.. our default is to be animal by nature... so odds are we humans will act a bit animal till we die.. and then we transcend... likely to re-enter
and do it again...
:^)

I believe that the good Knight is saying we CAN transcend while in the body. If we can not do it now, how will we do it after death?