The Truth About So-called Astral Projection

This unpleasantness seems very surprising to me personally and unneccessary. I do so wish people would act their age.

I am saddened by this lamentable display And I'd bet that not one of you feel ashamed of your hostile behaviours.

This is as good an example as any why I don't visit SF as often now .

[jhawk1206]

Seems to me that we are still missing the point. We are so busy just trying to disprove one another. The fact that there is a community dedicated to furthering human understanding of consciousness is amazing but the rest of the world is trying to tear human communities apar. Why are we doing it? There's no way to have an absolute truth. Maybe a personal one. And that's OK because this is just a playground anyway right?

Originally Posted by jhawk1206

Seems to me that we are still missing the point. We are so busy just trying to disprove one another. The fact that there is a community dedicated to furthering human understanding of consciousness is amazing but the rest of the world is trying to tear human communities apar. Why are we doing it? There's no way to have an absolute truth. Maybe a personal one. And that's OK because this is just a playground anyway right?

If it were just a "playground" it would be a mind creation and that would be fine... However you can't treat it like that knowing that people you meet there might actually be real. E.g. If its in my mind then it's fine to get an astral person to pull me out every night as the perfect exit technique and it's simply a result of the placebo effect. If not that's slavery to that astral person because if they are real it would morally treating them wrong to do my tasks...

It goes a lot further than that simple scenario... It's effects the world world in a way you would never know. If the astral really is real then gods, aliens, entities, afterlife and heaps more exist and well... Next year will be one of the biggest events In the history book. This has extreme importance more than any of you could ever know! That's why I need to find out the answer...

[Dezzymandius]

I don't think it's childish to become defensive about the views you share. We should be more like children because children see the world as an exciting playground. Seriously Peter Pan had the right idea!

But on the actual discussion, your theory is interesting because some would say that Lucid Dreaming is actually Astral Projection. There's a theory that we actually Astral project in our sleep. So i can sort of see where your idea stems from however I don't feel like its the truth or at least it's certainly not my truth. I like my views on astral projection, I believe in different dimensions. Also I think that too many people have accidentally APed for it to be a creation of the mind. I mean I first Astrally projected when I was ten and I knew nothing about it nor had I ever heard the concept before.


Alas it doesn't matter because this will probably go ignored, which is fine because if you were to call me clueless to science or narrow-minded and tell me my views are foolish I would simply ignore you too. :) Negativity is not my style and this means I'm ignorant so be it! I shall happily wear a crown of ignorance upon my head and declare myself the Queen of ignorance, because I stand by my views as you respectively stand by yours.


Hope you have a nice day, please feel it in your heart to reflect some positivity. People don't respond well too negativity here because we generally like to maintain a positive atmosphere.

Bless you!
Namaste!

[Lynn]

Originally Posted by Dezzymandius

I don't think it's childish to become defensive about the views you share. We should be more like children children see the world as an exciting playground. Seriously Peter Pan had the right idea!

I so like this idea. The world is a playground and we do not have to fully ever grow up. When we look at the idea of Peter Pan he could be serious when need be but too he remembered life was about the explorations.

But on the actual discussion, your theory is interesting because some would say that Lucid Dreaming is actually Astral Projection. There's a theory that we actually Astral project in our sleep. So i can sort of see where your idea stems from however I don't feel like its the truth or at least it's certainly not my truth. I like my views on astral projection, I believe in different dimensions. Also I think that too many people have accidentally APed for it to be a creation of the mind. I mean I first Astrally projected when I was ten and I knew nothing about it nor had I ever heard the concept before.


Having spent a week in a sleep lab study, I learned that when they map the brain there are different parts the fire in activity in sleep and dreaming states and when one consciously did a projection out. Now with lucid dreams they are on that level of almost walking state ye can think during them and interact in them and even change them so why not project from them. When one does though I found that it triggers that fear place in us that unknown and we so want to pull back in. We are not fully understading what is going one. This is where at times one waked suddenly in a shaken state or like I do a times even now grab the bed covers.

I have never know how not to project and now having children that too freely do it I understand the comments made on the report cards starting in Grade 2 with me. They would say " Lynn seems to be in a contstant state of day dream, but when we call on her she seems to know and understand and right where the lesson is ". Its funny that similar comment came on a Son's Kindergarden one....the teacher goes he zones out like GONE out but he knows right what was said if asked. Word to word. I knew then he too naturally just separated. I have that same report from all three kids and the teachers. BUT unlike me they are MORE willing to embrace that it is simply whom they are and what they are.


Alas it doesn't matter because this will probably go ignored, which is fine because if you were to call me clueless to science or narrow-minded and tell me my views are foolish I would simply ignore you too. :)

I do not find one clueless to science as what is science but the attempt to understand and PROVE in what a "Theory" as there is always that place even in science to add but one little word to the end of it "WHY" and start the whole process of theory all over again. We all have our views or theories as I more like to put it. We all have in us that place to questiion the "WHY" at the end of any subject. How many times has something been "Proven" then someone come along and re proves it ? The Earth at one time was seen as flat til someone did not sail off the end of it....

Hope you have a nice day, please feel it in your heart to reflect some positivity. People don't respond well too negativity here because we generally like to maintain a positive atmosphere.

Bless you!

The positives and the negatives can find that place of peace in the middle ground where no one is right and no one is wrong things simply re in THEORY and maybe not proven.

We are here to appreicate the views of all those of great scentific minds and those fresh to the ideas of what all is out there. We are afer all here for the same reason....GROWTH along the spiritual plane.


Lynn

[Xanth]

Summerlander... making friends where ever he goes. >_<

Originally Posted by 12padams

If it were just a "playground" it would be a mind creation and that would be fine... However you can't treat it like that knowing that people you meet there might actually be real. E.g. If its in my mind then it's fine to get an astral person to pull me out every night as the perfect exit technique and it's simply a result of the placebo effect. If not that's slavery to that astral person because if they are real it would morally treating them wrong to do my tasks...

And that's a very valid "method" for projecting too. I feel that it's more a sense of you creating a metaphor to explore another reality. In this case, the "entity" pulling you out is your chosen metaphor for you getting free. :)

Originally Posted by Dezzymandius

But on the actual discussion, your theory is interesting because some would say that Lucid Dreaming is actually Astral Projection. There's a theory that we actually Astral project in our sleep. So i can sort of see where your idea stems from however I don't feel like its the truth or at least it's certainly not my truth. I like my views on astral projection, I believe in different dimensions. Also I think that too many people have accidentally APed for it to be a creation of the mind. I mean I first Astrally projected when I was ten and I knew nothing about it nor had I ever heard the concept before.

I'll give you my perspective on this... (although feel free to disagree with me, I won't go on a tirade about it ;) LoL)

I *kinda* agree a bit with Summerlander, but our differences is that I don't see "the phase" (as he calls it) as something of solely the mind... nor do I think that it's all just "lucid dreaming".

Here's my take:
What people call "dreams", don't really exist. A dream is simply an unconsciously aware astral projection.
To me a dream, lucid dream and astral projection are the same experience. What differs between them is how consciously aware you are during the experience. But they're all experiences in a reality that we recognize as not being this physical reality. Instead of using the tags "physical" and "non-physical" (simply because my non-physical experiences are VERY physical at the time), I use the terms "here" (this physical reality) and "there" (a reality that isn't this physical reality).

I wrote an article for my website regarding this:
http://unlimitedboundaries.ca/2010/10/04/my-new-consciousness-designations/

I was dreaming this morning and I came to a realization after I awoke. I realized that the term “Conscious awareness” just doesn’t work when using it to describe anything more than your awareness during a dream, or in any case, it makes it more confusing. I need a phrase or phrases to make it easier for new people to learn the concepts and a catch all “Conscious Awareness” just doesn’t do that, because once you pass into Lucid Dreams and even further, Astral Projections, the term begins to fail.
We dream every night of our lives, yet we don’t remember all of them, why? We have varying levels of consciousness through these dreams… everything from not remembering that a dream ever happened, to remembering bits and pieces of a dream, to remembering every last detail of the dream.


I was thinking about how we “remember” our dreams… and I realized that the dreams I remember most, are the ones in which I was most consciously aware in. Not consciously aware in that I knew I was dreaming… but consciously aware that I was experiencing the dream AS it was happening. I call this “Dream Awareness“. Basically, I’m living the dream life as if I was awake and not realizing it’s a dream. I am the actor not realizing he’s in a play. This tends to give me the best chance to remember after I wake.


The next step up from that would be “Lucid Awareness“. This is the point where you know you’re dreaming and you know that what is around you is a dreamscape. You don’t have much more awareness than that though.
After that, I’d call it “Astral Awareness“. At this point, you are as wide awake and aware as if you were awake in the physical reality… except you’re in the nonphysical.


Also, I believe that the line between Lucid Awareness and Astral Awareness can be very blurred. Your awareness can float between that range at any one time during the experience. You’ll start off with Lucid Awareness, then muster up Astral Awareness… after some time, you might lose focus and concentration and drop back down to Lucid Awareness. You could shift back into Dream Awareness too.


For myself, I start off with Dream Awareness, then I’ll shift into Lucid Awareness… after that I’ll do my conversion to bring forth my Astral Awareness. Generally what happens after some time in Astral Awareness is that I’ll just wake up.


So yeah, these are my new “States of Mind”. Hopefully they’ll assist me in helping new members on the Pulse and other forums I frequent.
I guess you could say that this is the first thing I now disagree with Frank on!

The simple fact here, and one that Summerlander absolutely REFUSES to incorporate is that Raduga's information, along with all the other information on astral projection (and "the phase" and even my Phasing) are nothing but theories. Nobody has any proof regarding them... there is a lot of great evidence, but no real firm proof.

Raduga's ideas: THEORIES, nothing more. You can be as pragmatic towards those theories as you want, but they're still just theories. This is a concept that SL simply can't grasp... and I've given up over the years trying to help him understand it. He now goes from forum to forum, harassing anyone who disagrees with him which ends up with him getting banned. This forum would be the fourth I know in which he'll be banned from.

Alas it doesn't matter because this will probably go ignored, which is fine because if you were to call me clueless to science or narrow-minded and tell me my views are foolish I would simply ignore you too. :) Negativity is not my style and this means I'm ignorant so be it! I shall happily wear a crown of ignorance upon my head and declare myself the Queen of ignorance, because I stand by my views as you respectively stand by yours.

I won't ignore you!!
You're making some very excellent observations in regards to consciousness and other realities! :)

[Blue Tiger]

Right off the bat, I know that this post is a crock because most of my 'astral projection' occurs while awake. Lucid dreaming is a sleep phenomenon.

But if thinking he's solved one of the great mysteries of life makes him feel good, why bother arguing with him?

I say pity him, and walk away... quickly.

Originally Posted by Chrysaetos

And your views on AP are fact, you mean?

This is a good thread, being a skeptical person myself I applaud Summerlander for his efforts. Consciousness develops and unfortunately there has been no proof so far that is exists after death.
''Skeptics'' can very much experience the things you do, but they may come to different conclusions or not conclude anything whatsoever. So yeah, keeping an open mind doesn't just apply to ''skeptics'' :)

I must have missed this! This is spot on. I can't believe how threatened the majority of members here feel. It's unbelievable. First I was selling. Now I want to be famous. Then the words are not mine (which they are ). And another rumour: apparently me and 12padams are the same person! LOL! They have really given me a good and accurate impression of how they think.

I guess some people just make up their minds and stick to that - usually the ones who don't really care to find out about things and just stick to what makes them feel comfortable.

I didn't expect to find a like-minded and sane individual such as yourself after this New Age noisy kerfuffle, Chrysaetos! LOL!

I thought I could open this community's eyes and get then to realise and question their bias. Instead, they felt threatened somehow...

Feel free to aid our research at OBE4u - we certainly value minds like yours. We emphasise the utmost importance of practice and the secondary role of theory there. Raduga's SOBT includes everything that can be verified by anyone who practices the phase state.

Right off the bat, I know that this post is a crock because most of my 'astral projection' occurs while awake. Lucid dreaming is a sleep phenomenon.

But if thinking he's solved one of the great mysteries of life makes him feel good, why bother arguing with him?

I say pity him, and walk away... quickly.

Erm... did you know that certain areas of the brain related to wakefulness can often become more active when a person lucid dreams? This is another example of ignorance. When you are lucid dreaming, you will feel awake but the reality is that you are awake in the dream world. Meanwhile, your body is mostly paralysed and in sleep mode. This is a scientific fact, my dear.

What you call astral projection is only a WILD.

[Blue Tiger]

Sorry, but that is not true.

I hope you're clear on what lucid dreaming and astral projection are, as you seem to not grasp the very definite differences.

In lucid dreaming you are in fact asleep, realize you're dreaming, and take control of that dream.

In astral projection, you are not asleep. You mindfully and with intent project your consciousness to another location. You do not just happen to become aware of your dream state. You have control from the beginning.

And yes, I am fully aware that various parts of the brain can become more active at one time or another. However, the point of activity does not define what you're thinking at that time. That's like saying that because you achieve alpha brain waves you must be thinking of baseball.

Oh, btw when lucid dreaming I do NOT feel awake. I am completely aware than I'm both asleep and that I'm dreaming. That is in fact one of the definitions of lucid dreaming.

[Podshell]

I may confuse things further here as I believe the astral body can also sleep and dream, why not?