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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Death & The Afterlife

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  #41  
Old 26-11-2010, 05:56 PM
glenos
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I dunno about Scibat K. I know that you are a scholar and a gentleman and people should listen to your reasoning and reason them selves. Top post. Thank you.

G.
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  #42  
Old 04-12-2010, 07:12 PM
Scibat
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mac
"As for the rain analogy, here's mine: I live in a building with no windows, so I can't see what's going on outside. Everyone who tells me its raining never comes in wet or with an umbrella" :P Expressed brilliantly well although I wish it were otherwise for you. A friend from another website is in a similar position. His knowledge is second to few others and yet he has found no personal evidence.

You said "....but something gave them that belief or knowledge." and you are bang on. Often I've made the point that a key for the door is needed. Bereavement is often the key for others' doors and people often forget that's how their enlightenment began.

And I agree so strongly when you said "It gave it to -them- not -me- and until something comes along to change that, I can only be envious of their belief or knowledge."

From the way you've expressed yourself so well, Scibat, I realise that this doesn't help you and I confess I don't know how I could suggest for a direction that you haven't tried. I hope I haven't given you platitudes - I won't tell you how such and such may happen at some particular time. I don't know what will happen and neither do others - they're guessing based on their own experience which may have no relevance for you.

If I were to suggest one thing you might wish to consider, it might be to study the literature that has accumulated over many, many decades to see if anything has any appeal.

If you were to read what spiritually evolved teachers and guides have taught you might find a point of resonance. Maybe you'll be moved in a direction you didn't anticipate.

I can promise one thing - based on my experience, you will need to work at the task and put effort in to fully understand what you are learning. I send you my very best wishes.

Sorry for the long delay on the reply, been dealing with lots of other stuff and somehow missed this post.

Honestly anything that gave me reassurance would be welcome, but a few of my fears and concerns seem to constantly resurface and tend to drown out everything else.

Here are a few:
  1. All evidence of an afterlife appears to be anecdotal -- This goes back to the whole thing of having to experience such evidence first hand.
  2. What if belief an afterlife is just a psychological coping mechanism to deal with imminent non-existence?
  3. Am I just deluding myself into thinking anything related to an afterlife is just wishful thinking/willful delusion on my part?
---

I don't entertain the above to deliberately try and be a skeptic. They're just there as a product of the way my mind works, and I can't really dismiss them as they are valid concerns. As I said before, I am less worried about myself but my loved ones who have gone before me.

Its hard to cope with the idea they may just no longer have any continuation after their deaths, at least one of which was childhood (my brother who I mentioned previously).

In fact I have taken up ghost hunting as sort of a way to try and experience something myself. I figure if I actually see/experience a ghost, and its in such a context that it cannot be simply be an imprint of a past even just replaying itself -- Then obviously ghosts are real and represent some sort of continuation of existence beyond death. And if that is so then other forms of existence beyond death are also probable.

So far no luck on the ghost hunting thing, of course my investigation has been limited to a local historic cemetery reputed to be haunted.

Anyway, enough rambling for now. Thanks everyone for the helpful insights and ideas.
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  #43  
Old 04-12-2010, 09:54 PM
Summerkat
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scibat
Sorry for the long delay on the reply, been dealing with lots of other stuff and somehow missed this post.

Honestly anything that gave me reassurance would be welcome, but a few of my fears and concerns seem to constantly resurface and tend to drown out everything else.

Here are a few:
  1. All evidence of an afterlife appears to be anecdotal -- This goes back to the whole thing of having to experience such evidence first hand.
  2. What if belief an afterlife is just a psychological coping mechanism to deal with imminent non-existence?
  3. Am I just deluding myself into thinking anything related to an afterlife is just wishful thinking/willful delusion on my part?
---

I don't entertain the above to deliberately try and be a skeptic. They're just there as a product of the way my mind works, and I can't really dismiss them as they are valid concerns. As I said before, I am less worried about myself but my loved ones who have gone before me.

Its hard to cope with the idea they may just no longer have any continuation after their deaths, at least one of which was childhood (my brother who I mentioned previously).

In fact I have taken up ghost hunting as sort of a way to try and experience something myself. I figure if I actually see/experience a ghost, and its in such a context that it cannot be simply be an imprint of a past even just replaying itself -- Then obviously ghosts are real and represent some sort of continuation of existence beyond death. And if that is so then other forms of existence beyond death are also probable.

So far no luck on the ghost hunting thing, of course my investigation has been limited to a local historic cemetery reputed to be haunted.

Anyway, enough rambling for now. Thanks everyone for the helpful insights and ideas.


Hi Scibat :) I can understand your thoughts and why you feel the way you do. I've been there, felt the same. And you're right all the evidence of life after death is anecdotal. The answer to that problem is that when it is your own anecdote because something happened to you, you will not have a problem with that anymore. So yes, you need to experience this for yourself.

I have also wondered about if the belief is just a psychological prop to help us get through these questions and be able to cope.

But I don't think you're deluding yourself. You are questioning and genuinely desiring to KNOW.

Considering you have a bit of a scientific mind (love that :) hows this? Make yourself an experiment. Go about it in a skeptical fashion, suspend belief for the time being. But ask yourself what sign would you believe? Grab a piece of paper, make a list of who'd you'd welcome contact from and write down next to each name one or more acceptable signs they could give you that you WILL accept.

Say its an Uncle who loved baseball... maybe an acceptable sign to you is something surfaces that reminds you of a special time you shared with that Uncle revolving around baseball... and a week later you find ticket stubs in an old desk drawer from a game you attended together... or someone comes up to you, starts talking about your Uncle and reminds of a glove he bought you to play baseball. Do this with each person on your list..cause the answers of the symbol you will accept will be different for each one of them.

Another example..I hear people talk about finding feathers and that means they've had spirit contact. OK, for me, that wouldn't be a symbol. I raise small birds so feathers are an everyday thing that require vacumning, lol. They are more than common here for me and it just is my birds here, haha. We're unique..what is a symbol to one is not necessarily a symbol to another.

After you make your list...meditate on one of the people and one of the signs. And ask that person to give you a sign and suggest to them what you will accept as a sign. Maybe a song, maybe it is a feather, maybe its a rainbow, maybe its a memento from a special time. And then let it go, continue to be open to *any* sign you receive.

But I think one thing you may find if you do that exercise is that there are a lot of things you won't accept as a sign that others do. You might even find as I did a while ago, that I was on one hand asking for a sign and on the other hand ruling out most of the ones they could give, lol Thats why its important to get clear about that.

I will accept and have received songs ..you might not consider that evidence. So play with it.

Also, make sure you are recording your dreams every morning when you wake up. That is one of the most common ways that the deceased contact us.

If you will look at it more as an experiment and discover what you consider a sign, I think you're gonna be a lot closer to getting one. Be the scientist who just lets the results be the results. Try to ease up on yourself and let what happens happen.
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  #44  
Old 04-12-2010, 11:31 PM
Celeste
Posts: n/a
 
I think you are trying too hard. Just try and relax (i.e., meditate) and there's a chance you will start to see. I think it is extra hard since they died (I take it) before peace could be made.
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  #45  
Old 04-12-2010, 11:47 PM
Rumar
Posts: n/a
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by psychoslice
I'm looking for evidence of life here, Now, all I see is the walking dead lol.
Brains... *moan*
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