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  #11  
Old 13-12-2017, 04:36 PM
Seawolf Seawolf is offline
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The brain is formed by the experience with the caregiver. If the caregiver was stressed, traumatized, isolated, etc then the child's brain is formed by that and has problems with relationships later in life, health problems, anxiety, depression, addictions to sooth, etc. The ACE study is a well known scientific study that shows this. Adverse childhood experiences lead to attachment disorders, and we need lots of good information about how to recover which is now being recognized and worked on. The public is still pretty unaware of these things and still goes by old world thinking.

Healing basically comes from being able to engage in healthy, supportive relationships. For many it takes a lot of work just to be able to get to that point.. alot of self care, self compassion, deep work with a therapist, etc. For me this has become the spiritual life, looking at myself and forming a relationship with these abandadoned parts of the mind that try to protect me through anxiety, shame and guilt. It comes down to a damaged brain, although most dont think of neglect from a caregiver as causing brain damage, but it does.
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  #12  
Old 13-12-2017, 09:19 PM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Originally Posted by Gem
Life is strange where the most sensitive is also the most indestructible...

Well human love leaves us most vulnerable, I suppose, and sometimes I wonder if love can be measured by the amount of pain we are willing to go through in making deep emotional attachments. I know we have all been hurt by love, but rather than a true life knowing, we might prefer ideals of spiritual love which is pain free, and be under the notion that attachments are a bad thing. Is it bad, or is it merely painful? Often in spirituality 'suffering' is regarded distainfully, and our ideas of being free from it are sometimes only the bondage of our aversion toward it - but that aversion is the actual suffering - not the pain of attachments...

It does and can leave us most vulnerable. Letting go of attachments through the spiritual awareness of love, was (for me) about letting go of the attachments that were unhealthy in the conditioned patterns in myself with regards to human love and connection in myself. The turnaround now in myself has become the formation of loving as healthy attachments and not being afraid to enter into love in this way as things are. When you recognise your own unhealthy versus healthy attachments with regards to self love you see yourself more clear in the space of your true self and needs in life. If anything suffering is less, but your needs are more clear in how you wish to be loved and supported in the world. (love in action)For many walking through letting go and releasing binds of unhealthy attachments it was necessary to separate to bring closure to old ways of being, to end the old patterns of separation within. The deepening aspect or reconnection to love as I have learned has shown me that those tanks when empty require reflections that support and love and fill up the tank, more consciously aware of the true nature of loving care and support, not only through our own conscious loving self care but the care of the world around us. The co creative truth as shared togetherness, opens up a multitude of reflections that begin to show more about sameness than differences in the reconnection stages. In the separation of self view both these aspects come into being to show you how to bridge both within yourself, so all becomes one whole awareness. As I am learning the reflections of you as your own spiritual union, (integration of all of you)open the doorway to co creative unions as one

Quote:
I wonder how human love could exist apart from the emotional attachment, and entailed pain. We necessarily need to be vulnerable to create meaningful human connection, without fear of that certain pain, and I think the ability to do this does arise from the depth of that spiritual love which itself is indestructible.

Yes I know your right. The catalyst of courage and grounding to manage the human aspect of love and connection, comes through the spiritual union. When you feel very connected and grounded in this way, the human aspect is managed with a deeper awareness of life and others as they are. Being more present with what is and dealing in healthy ways aware ways.
Quote:
Well so I wonder, is the spiritual philosphy on attachment really suffering, or is suffering just the aversion to the pain entailed in making such attachments?

Good points Gem. I think any aversion to anything is a catalyst to deeper awareness of moving closer to ourselves as well as opening the doorway to moving closer to life and others. I understand my own unhealthy attachments from my past conditioned state. Now in the opening to healthy ones, I realize I had set myself up for that aversion in me through the deeper spiritual union in myself. To bring that grounded indestructible spiritual love into the picture of human love, it can shake up things to learn how to love more true to your spiritual awareness as one.
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“God’s one and only voice are Silence.” ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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  #13  
Old 15-12-2017, 08:35 PM
Mr Interesting Mr Interesting is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seawolf
The brain is formed by the experience with the caregiver. If the caregiver was stressed, traumatized, isolated, etc then the child's brain is formed by that and has problems with relationships later in life, health problems, anxiety, depression, addictions to sooth, etc. The ACE study is a well known scientific study that shows this. Adverse childhood experiences lead to attachment disorders, and we need lots of good information about how to recover which is now being recognized and worked on. The public is still pretty unaware of these things and still goes by old world thinking.

Healing basically comes from being able to engage in healthy, supportive relationships. For many it takes a lot of work just to be able to get to that point.. alot of self care, self compassion, deep work with a therapist, etc. For me this has become the spiritual life, looking at myself and forming a relationship with these abandadoned parts of the mind that try to protect me through anxiety, shame and guilt. It comes down to a damaged brain, although most dont think of neglect from a caregiver as causing brain damage, but it does.

Interestingly, Seawolf, reality is very good at conforming to our expectations. What you have written is then a truth for many, and evolving too, as a truth where the beliefs of the many begin to influence the even more and it's all good, it's progress, but for the few who are somewhat further ahead, as it were, reality is as we make it which means the truth we might wish to define becomes the reality we are... so perspective, perceptual distance, will allow people to see, if they allow themselves the quiet to do so, that these presets, these where I come from is how I go on, aren't set in concrete but are the necessary 'juxtaposition' we require to grow beyond, to be wider deeper and more understanding and therein create the energy signatures, be the vibratory constants, that are possibly that which allows progress to be progress... totally in conjunction with that which is so easy to define as non-progress, or even inhibitory.
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  #14  
Old 15-12-2017, 10:57 PM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seawolf
The brain is formed by the experience with the caregiver. If the caregiver was stressed, traumatized, isolated, etc then the child's brain is formed by that and has problems with relationships later in life, health problems, anxiety, depression, addictions to sooth, etc. The ACE study is a well known scientific study that shows this. Adverse childhood experiences lead to attachment disorders, and we need lots of good information about how to recover which is now being recognized and worked on. The public is still pretty unaware of these things and still goes by old world thinking.



That makes perfect sense. The brain has the potential to be re wired but it takes work of course. Time and patience and a willingness for those able and who can.

Quote:
Healing basically comes from being able to engage in healthy, supportive relationships. For many it takes a lot of work just to be able to get to that point.. alot of self care, self compassion, deep work with a therapist, etc. For me this has become the spiritual life, looking at myself and forming a relationship with these abandadoned parts of the mind that try to protect me through anxiety, shame and guilt. It comes down to a damaged brain, although most dont think of neglect from a caregiver as causing brain damage, but it does.

You bring to light the foundational connections that form as babies seawolf. Our main carers are our primary foundation. How we are handled, cared for, attended too, loved, acknowledged and recognised. The body grows through a loving supportive connection. If the connection from carers is not healthy in them, then naturally all that flows through to the child in its own formation in some way. We are all seeds of the whole, so some do take the brunt of much through the generational and interconnected weave and threads of life.

I think for many on the conscious spiritual path to open and reconnect to the loving self, becomes our own gift to self. There is within our world a whole other world who are not conscious and not walking a conscious healing path. I think those of us awakened to find our own reconnection, are what become the supportive roles for those in need in other ways. There are so many paths to healing, so many ways to support and open people to loving awareness. THe more clear and true that love becomes in us as a source in us, the more it can heal the world.

Jesus did show the way through the art of being love and sharing love through his true self/true nature. People believed he performed miracles beyond the norm and capacity of awareness back in his day. I believe miracles are our normal state of being, the potential of the human experience to heal and have more spontaneous shifts is within the clarity of the spiritual/human self awakened and functioning more as a true open source of loving presence. Love heals. Love shows the way.

As someone in my meditation opened to share the other night. We got to spread the love now. Then she added, but don't make it weird..hehe

I smiled inside because her message was spot on. Listening to the many ways to reach and support the world around us, is unique to each one. Love is part of the universal wisdom, so become that and share that. Be open to receive that and share that as one source in yourself. Complete the circle of love (all encompassing love)in you and share it in your actions and gifts as they flow into the world. It doesn't have to be weird, my friends message is right..:)
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“God’s one and only voice are Silence.” ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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  #15  
Old 16-12-2017, 12:41 AM
Seawolf Seawolf is offline
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Quote:
That makes perfect sense. The brain has the potential to be re wired but it takes work of course. Time and patience and a willingness for those able and who can.
Yes, fortunately neuroplasticity seems to be an established fact now, which I also hear is possible regardless of age. I guess there was some doubt at first in the scientific world, but now it's pretty much univerally accepted. That's pretty good news for me at least. Complex PTSD is one of the most difficult things to heal I hear, just because the brain is damaged so fundamentally in early childhood by relational trauma, it continues to be reinforced throughout life. So I continue with kundalini yoga, meditation, therapy and anything else that works and I do feel a gradual change. You're right it does take time, but to finally be on the healing path is so welcome and I'm very grateful for it.




Quote:
I think for many on the conscious spiritual path to open and reconnect to the loving self, becomes our own gift to self. There is within our world a whole other world who are not conscious and not walking a conscious healing path.

I've recently become interested in Internal Family Systems therapy, which I hesitated before because of my past in fundamentalist religion. It's about getting in touch with the 'parts' of our personality, which made me think of people living inside me and reminded me of demonic possession. Now I'm better able to accept this and look forward to listening to these parts. Basically, because of past relational traumas, parts of our personality attempt to protect us from harm and it manifests as depression, anxiety, terror, etc. What's interesting is that in the process, a 'personality' is discovered which leads the healing of all the parts.. a loving, knowledgable figure which is called the Self in IFS therapy. It's pretty exciting to me to think the Self is love and has the power to heal my troubled life.
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  #16  
Old 22-12-2017, 09:59 AM
Gem Gem is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seawolf
Yes, fortunately neuroplasticity seems to be an established fact now, which I also hear is possible regardless of age. I guess there was some doubt at first in the scientific world, but now it's pretty much univerally accepted. That's pretty good news for me at least. Complex PTSD is one of the most difficult things to heal I hear, just because the brain is damaged so fundamentally in early childhood by relational trauma, it continues to be reinforced throughout life. So I continue with kundalini yoga, meditation, therapy and anything else that works and I do feel a gradual change. You're right it does take time, but to finally be on the healing path is so welcome and I'm very grateful for it.

I don;t think there is any substantiated scientific evidence of brain damage in the case of the vast majority of psychological disorders. That's basically a myth perpetuated by psychiatry in this era where people are seen as brains. I guess some psychologists adopt that belief, and we have phds saying it, but it doesn't change the fact that medical evidence is extremely lacking in that regard.

Your healing program sounds excellent, the path is the destination, so they say, so a positive path is a positive outcome in itself, I guess.

Quote:
I've recently become interested in Internal Family Systems therapy, which I hesitated before because of my past in fundamentalist religion. It's about getting in touch with the 'parts' of our personality, which made me think of people living inside me and reminded me of demonic possession.

I had a quick read a about that, and it seems quite sensible in its own way as a therapy. Same principle as inner child therapy in that it 'integrates' segmented parts.

Quote:
Now I'm better able to accept this and look forward to listening to these parts. Basically, because of past relational traumas, parts of our personality attempt to protect us from harm and it manifests as depression, anxiety, terror, etc. What's interesting is that in the process, a 'personality' is discovered which leads the healing of all the parts.. a loving, knowledgable figure which is called the Self in IFS therapy. It's pretty exciting to me to think the Self is love and has the power to heal my troubled life.

Well, you are the loving one that heals the whole life, as you are doing, which is most commendable.
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  #17  
Old 22-12-2017, 01:44 PM
boshy b. good
Posts: n/a
 
/ / "Inspiration is an super
heroe suit." "We take that."

God :
ok. you are just another inspired.

Last edited by boshy b. good : 22-12-2017 at 04:22 PM.
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  #18  
Old 23-12-2017, 01:29 AM
Seawolf Seawolf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gem

Your healing program sounds excellent, the path is the destination, so they say, so a positive path is a positive outcome in itself, I guess.
Thanks for the encouragement, a healing path has been a long time coming for me. I'm thankful for the rise of good therapy, and people like Bessel Van der Kolk and their studies that raise awareness. To me brain damage is when there's been so much trauma that it's expected all the time and nothing good can be accepted due to the established pathways, yet this can be changed. An old dog can learn new tricks if the method is sound. I've come to see the physical as the most mystical and spiritual thing in life, with much left to understand about it, and as we learn more we'll see just how spiritual the brain and body are. It's the idea that we have a handle on it that causes us to seek answers elsewhere. I doubt we know even 5 percent of ourselves.
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  #19  
Old 23-12-2017, 02:12 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Seawolf
Yes, fortunately neuroplasticity seems to be an established fact now, which I also hear is possible regardless of age. I guess there was some doubt at first in the scientific world, but now it's pretty much univerally accepted. That's pretty good news for me at least. Complex PTSD is one of the most difficult things to heal I hear, just because the brain is damaged so fundamentally in early childhood by relational trauma, it continues to be reinforced throughout life. So I continue with kundalini yoga, meditation, therapy and anything else that works and I do feel a gradual change. You're right it does take time, but to finally be on the healing path is so welcome and I'm very grateful for it.

Thanks for sharing further Seawolf. I have walked through PTSD and understand the implications through the process. It took me a long time through a few processors much like your doing to really end the fragmented aspects in myself. I believe a conscious open state and willingness to walk it through can open the full potential of yourself. The reinforcement is really the undoing ongoing, like the onion unlayering affect, allowing those layers to arise and be released step by step. The body is remarkable in that it rejuvenates as we open and let go of what no longer serves us. With this gift is the voice within that speaks on what it needs to bring it back to life as one.

I often read the poster on my chiro's wall about the time frame for the body parts to rejuvenate. Its quite astounding really how the body can heal itself in everyway if we create the right environment to allow it to do its thing.

I notice of late when my internal organs are checked at the chiro at the base of the skull. He is becoming pleasantly surprised by the "no need" to support them with adjustments. I know its because I am doing the work to sustain a healthy mind body system. My body recognises these affects and does it's thing to be more in harmony with my efforts.






Quote:
I've recently become interested in Internal Family Systems therapy, which I hesitated before because of my past in fundamentalist religion. It's about getting in touch with the 'parts' of our personality, which made me think of people living inside me and reminded me of demonic possession. Now I'm better able to accept this and look forward to listening to these parts. Basically, because of past relational traumas, parts of our personality attempt to protect us from harm and it manifests as depression, anxiety, terror, etc. What's interesting is that in the process, a 'personality' is discovered which leads the healing of all the parts.. a loving, knowledgable figure which is called the Self in IFS therapy. It's pretty exciting to me to think the Self is love and has the power to heal my troubled life.

I understand. It sounds very empowering an a good tool to support you through your process. Self love is a major tool of empowerment. The deeper we go into that core of self worth and self love, the more open we become to those seeds of potential we each are within.

I am a living example of someone who has crawled through all these layers and found myself again in everyway. I continue to open my seeds and build a continued healthy mind/body system, which is very exciting..
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“God’s one and only voice are Silence.” ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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  #20  
Old 23-12-2017, 02:14 AM
naturesflow naturesflow is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boshy b. good
/ / "Inspiration is an super
heroe suit." "We take that."

God :
ok. you are just another inspired.

Neato..
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“God’s one and only voice are Silence.” ~ Herman Melville

Man has learned how to challenge both Nature and art to become the incitements to vice! His very cups he has delighted to engrave with libidinous subjects, and he takes pleasure in drinking from vessels of obscene form! Pliny the Elder
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