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  #131  
Old 14-09-2019, 07:03 PM
Altair Altair is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigJohn
You made some valid points in your argument.

But then, there are some people now, who are Christians, that believe it was God(s)/god(s) that created evolution.

Yeah I know.. but the process requires no God. We can believe in it, or that 'God' was there at the start of life and then took a nap!
For me personally, both spirit and matter are eternal. No creation.
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  #132  
Old 14-09-2019, 10:21 PM
MAYA EL MAYA EL is offline
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Answer D .
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  #133  
Old 15-09-2019, 05:02 AM
iamthat iamthat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Altair
Yeah I know.. but the process requires no God. We can believe in it, or that 'God' was there at the start of life and then took a nap!
For me personally, both spirit and matter are eternal. No creation.

Alternatively, God is ever present and creation is continually happening in each moment.

Peace
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  #134  
Old 15-09-2019, 06:13 AM
BigJohn BigJohn is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iamthat
Alternatively, God is ever present and creation is continually happening in each moment.

Peace
I thought God was resting.

By the way, wasn't it Jesus who did the creating?

Just curious.
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  #135  
Old 15-09-2019, 10:08 AM
Busby Busby is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by neil
"In regards to this last paragraph of yours"....
.......Of course the universe does not need any supernatural additive. Because the universe that most people relate to, "is" the spiritual universe. And nothing in the "one & only spiritual universe" is of the supernatural....everthing of the magical spiritual universe is completely "natural"...& definately not supernatural.

I have many very very spot on reasons for knowing that we are not only an Earthly physical biological entity, living in a universe of only stars & planets etc, in galaxies. & that we just die out, when the physical biological body can no longer pump blood, oxygen, nutrition throughout itself etc.

One of those reasons is that i have had & seen phenomenal unexplainable experiences that not anyone on this site has yet spoken about...as i have said numerous times in the past.
& from those phenomena, I have seen beings without the flesh body, & of whom get around this planet and absolutely 100% disgustingly & unlovingly run amuck.

And I am able to see that these beings, have spiritual bodies that have deteriorated so badly that some of them are without arms & legs & or just withered completely back to the torso. facial features & heads that are caved twisted & just so disgustingly grose, & what is left of their torso, is buckled twisted deformed & so short.
& the texture & their complexion looks as though it has been bashed for the last month by Mike Tyson...not black & blue...But a combined blended mixture of bloody red dark blacks, blue etc.

& this is why they do not show themselves yet they allow themselves to be heard. & why they project different personalities through visions via our third eye...."deceptions that Earthlings have absolutely no concept of".
Because these beings prefer not to be seen as the beings that they have become, if the general public saw through their dark & discrete deception, & could see them for what they truely are, well, the general public would change their ways of being instantly.

& the reason these beings look so grose, is because they are the invisible Soul beings of which emanate a spiritual body..(emanate), & all Soul beings are all subject to the great one & only law of "reap as one sows", that has brought these beings into such a poor state of being.

This law does not work upon the emanated spiritual body, because the spiritual body is only an emanation of the quality of the "Soul'self"... "Of which we are".

Has anyone seen people of the Earth have their physical body growing so disgustingly ugly with every unloving thought....NO....& that is because we are not the Earthly biological body.

And secondly, i also know that any spiritual being can appear unseen. So how can they simply disappear, yet still be heard, as though they are still in the same location, as before being unseen. & yet still some Earthlings still hear their thoughts, but they are invisible to sight.

Well, that is because they are still there, because they are "more" than the spiritual body, they are the invisible Soul'self...they are not the spiritual body, as the spiritual body is just a non intelligent, non aware & a non conscious part of them & ourselves, just as the organic biological Earthly physical body is non conscious, non aware & non intelligent & not who we are.
Every part of us, that is not the invisible Soul, is subject to mind of Soul'self.

And, a person who has not had phenomenal experiences as such, can not fully grasp the concept of Soul, & or the severity & importance of steering well clear of unlovingness, because that great law wreaks absolute havoc on all Souls/Selves, of which we are...(& not what we have).

Believe it or not, as i TRUELY do not worry if anyone believes or not...
Also all of the above is for anyones considerations.

And ps..before you say it "Sky"...I already know that you do not believe it....And that I am also not concerned about.

It doesn't rest upon me to judge your experiences in any way, I can only judge my phenomenal (as you so fittingly called them) own experiences which have always been - if I can put it this way - a mine of information.

One of them, just to indicate my seriousness about this, was when I saw my wife standing in 'ethereal' form about ten weeks after her death, so clearly letting me know that she was 'still' here. Whatever…

I think we live in a universe which invokes a continual sort of feed-back. When I look out of the window now at the sunshine-filled landscape the mass of information I (and all of us) have to absorb, convert and return is is so immense that we have no time to consider just what we are actually doing in our minds.

I don't see the need for any sort of underlying and/or supernatural powers, if nature can fill the universe with two trillion galaxies then a little bit of ghost hunting can be looked upon as a tickle in the little toe.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyu7v7nWzfo
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  #136  
Old 15-09-2019, 01:31 PM
EdmundJohnstone EdmundJohnstone is offline
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NDE (Near death experience) should be the gateway to the afterlife, correct? But some people don't experience anything. Such as they were just completely unaware(i.e:nothing happened while they were dead before being brought back to life" saying that those who experienced something were just hallucinating, or contradicting one another. How does someone explain that?
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  #137  
Old 15-09-2019, 02:44 PM
Greenslade Greenslade is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdmundJohnstone
NDE (Near death experience) should be the gateway to the afterlife, correct? But some people don't experience anything. Such as they were just completely unaware(i.e:nothing happened while they were dead before being brought back to life" saying that those who experienced something were just hallucinating, or contradicting one another. How does someone explain that?
The understanding here is consciousness. An NDE is where the person is conscious and is perhaps not so much of a gateway as a window, it gives the person a glimpse of how an AfterLife may be perceived as Spirit. It could also be that their astral bodies have 'detached' and they are seeing from an astral projection perspective. If people don't experience anything, it only means that their consciousness has 'stalled' for want of a better expression. Consciousness is outside of time, as the phrase "time flies when you're enjoying yourself" comes from.

While someone is unconscious the physical body is still processing signals to the brain and the brain will 'register' them, but that doesn't mean that we become conscious of it.

There is consciousness and what we are conscious of, and they are two very different beasties. In both cases consciousness remains because after they 'come back', they are still conscious. The difference is what they were conscious of at the time. It has nothing to do with an AfterLife and any sceptics who want to use unconsciousness as proof of the non-existence of an AfterLife should look to their egos first and foremost. If they were that clever they'd do their homework.
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  #138  
Old 15-09-2019, 03:13 PM
Altair Altair is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EdmundJohnstone
NDE (Near death experience) should be the gateway to the afterlife, correct? But some people don't experience anything. Such as they were just completely unaware(i.e:nothing happened while they were dead before being brought back to life" saying that those who experienced something were just hallucinating, or contradicting one another. How does someone explain that?

It's a really good question why one person experiences this and another does not. Most spiritual people will claim it's either karma or faith..
I think both can be insensitive explanations, and may rely on victim blaming..

I also think there are 'real' hallucinations, but also genuine experiences, and OOBEs/NDEs. The key question is how do we discern (?).
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  #139  
Old 15-09-2019, 05:49 PM
Siemens Siemens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Altair
Your reasoning that ''it isn't proven'' because it does not incorporate some 'supernatural power' is flawed. To put it simply, with the principle of parsimony we go with the simplest explanations that requires the least assumptions, and avoid unnecessary concepts.
According your own logic, do you support the following sentence:
“We do not have any reason to believe that there are other causes of cancer than those known today (smoking, sunburn,...). Therefore the likelihood for further causes is about zero.”?

Not my sentence: “It isn't proven that natural selection is the only force that leads to evolution” is flawed (the sentence is 100% correct), but rather your assumption that the parsimony of a given theory is reason enough to say that the probabilities of competing less parsimonious theories are about zero.

So again, would you say it is senseful to say: “The probability of further causes of cancer beside those known today is about zero because this position is more parsimonious than a position that would consider further causes”?
If not, why do you think it's reasonable to say: “The probability that there are further influences on evolution beside natural selection is about zero because this position is more parsimonious than a position that would consider further causes”?

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There are further problems with the atheists’ (and your) view. It is not even the cases that atheism is the most parsimonious theory to explain evolution – but I will come to this later.

Last edited by Siemens : 16-09-2019 at 03:09 PM.
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  #140  
Old 16-09-2019, 02:44 AM
lemex lemex is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Altair
For me personally, both spirit and matter are eternal. No creation.
If universe is enteral and as that which is enteral would mean it's all been here a very long time. If this were the case I'd expect we'd be far more advanced then we are, consciously, scientifically, technologically, culturally, personally, spiritually, and as a society. Even physically. We can look back and see how primitive we were, such a short time ago, which I would think we wouldn't be able to.

Last edited by lemex : 16-09-2019 at 04:23 AM.
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