Have you ever wondered...

[davidsun]

Originally Posted by Busby

Davidsun, hello again.
Well, you did go to a lot of trouble in your double response to my original question. Thanks a lot. Clearly your argumentation is not for me - it doesn't - so to say - satisfy me. In fact I get no satisfaction from biblical texts but do however find the beautiful prose and rhythms of the St James' version to be soul touching. Looking back that has always been the main attraction of the book for me.
I strongly believe that the yogi who once said that there is maybe one person per year who achieves enlightenment said something very true. This would, I think, rather depend upon one's understanding of the word. He also said, but not in so many words, that it takes millions of years to get to that point.
For me, in my 'philosophy' there is a not-yet-seen factor which when it becomes visible will go a long way to solving our predicament. It may well be that it's here already and always has been but we can't see it because the trees are in the way.

What's presented in in Michael Newton's Ph.D.' book, Journey of Souls and Destiny of Souls to be the most explanatory description of the process of evolution of the (human) souls (via 'reincarnation' et.) that I have come across. Newton also acknowledges that what's in the books leaves many 'questions' unanswered and just makes 'intellgent' speculations in regards 'God' etc. The stuff I have quoted from what I have written is based on my using Netwon's data to (re)interpret Jesus' saying relating to such matters. In Ch.1 of the treatuse, I relate Jesus 'view' to the 'Vedic' view (i.e. as presented in The Bhagavad Gita).

The chapter is available at http://davidsundom.weebly.com/upload..._meant-ch1.pdf shoud you 'happen' to be interested.

P.S. I appreciate your interest in and thoughfulness in relation to such matters.

[Busby]

Originally Posted by davidsun

What's presented in in Michael Newton's Ph.D.' book, Journey of Souls and Destiny of Souls to be the most explanatory description of the process of evolution of the (human) souls (via 'reincarnation' et.) that I have come across. Newton also acknowledges that what's in the books leaves many 'questions' unanswered and just makes 'intellgent' speculations in regards 'God' etc. The stuff I have quoted from what I have written is based on my using Netwon's data to (re)interpret Jesus' saying relating to such matters. In Ch.1 of the treatuse, I relate Jesus 'view' to the 'Vedic' view (i.e. as presented in The Bhagavad Gita).

The chapter is available at http://davidsundom.weebly.com/upload..._meant-ch1.pdf shoud you 'happen' to be interested.

P.S. I appreciate your interest in and thoughfulness in relation to such matters.

I have M. Talbot's 'The Holographic Universe' and was during and after reading it quite excited (may not be the right word). Thanks.

[davidsun]

Originally Posted by Busby

I have M. Talbot's 'The Holographic Universe' and was during and after reading it quite excited (may not be the right word). Thanks.

Talk about 'ducking' an issue as a phenomenon!

The idea of the universe being a 'holographic' phenomenon has nothing whatsoever (IMO) to do with any of the several strands of info which I presented and talked about, which (again, IMO) are related to the topic you presented for discussion in your OP. At least, you do not say anything at all about why and how the idea of the universe being 'holographic' is related to why we are here as 'humans'.

I am beginning to wonder if you are at all really interested in talking about and exploring ideas pertaining to the opening 'hook' line in this thread, Busby, 'wondering' as you say! you do about: "Why you/we came onto the planet Earth as a human?"

Among other things, in his book, Journey of Souls (Michael Newton draws his conclusions from real data he collected by the way), Newton states: "The essential purpose of reincarnation is self-improvement. The psychological ramifications of our development, both in and out of the spirit world, is the foundation of my work."

My perception(s) in this regard may be incorrect, but at present, it looks to me like you really don't want to engage in dialogical wondering about the matter. And that maybe your 'true' intent may be no more than just play with (use?) others' energies to engage in 'head bobbing':

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-FEavPNATvQ

[Busby]

Davidsun, my few words were really only to acknowledge the fact that I know of the author. Any mental jump you may have made lies with you.

[lemex]

A interesting consideration of the many levels of (universal/single?) consciousness. Consciousness is of course is not just human. The same consciousness is in us, in fact in every thing and form of matter.

I have always said it relates to our learning yet as pointed out we are talking about example of consciousness varied as it is. The conscious forms mentioned would not and don't learn here even though they experience. There is one idea, consciousness is simply universal and can be anything, any and every form there is, it's just that large, infinite. The illusion. Our ancestors never thought about this, how odd.

Actually though there would be no present memory or thought in existing so experience might be the answer that can only be seen in the spiritual realm of the school we are in.

[davidsun]

Originally Posted by Busby

Davidsun, my few words were really only to acknowledge the fact that I know of the author. Any mental jump you may have made lies with you.

You made said statement right after QUOTING what I had said to you. So I made the 'mental jump' as you call it that what you said was (ostensibly at least!) a 'response' to what I said.

Again, phenomenal 'ducking' (i.e. avoidance of) a relational issue.

Added P.S.: its fine with me if you want to do the head-bobbing 'duck' thing. I am just pointing out that that is what I see is going on here.

[lemex]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

our karma is to incarnate as humans to destroy the planet then reincarnate as a polar bear to experience the consequences of that.

At some level yep! It is not known until one returns to spirit (soul consciousness) though, the problem here is the person first lived 70-80 years, then became another life, live out that particular life, then born again trying to put it together, probably resisting, and usually all have to go through several other cycles being led toward understanding and easily mean a delay of a few hundred years to learn through putting together experiences acquired. Inefficient as it is. If we return many times so may the universe and this planet even the universe is part of karma to. Personally, I am still in awe how new humans seem to be and have advanced.

Originally Posted by lemex

At some level yep! It is not known until one returns to spirit (soul consciousness) though, the problem here is the person first lived 70-80 years, then became another life, live out that particular life, then born again trying to put it together, probably resisting, and usually all have to go through several other cycles being led toward understanding and easily mean a delay of a few hundred years to learn through putting together experiences acquired. Inefficient as it is. If we return many times so may the universe and this planet even the universe is part of karma to. Personally, I am still in awe how new humans seem to be and have advanced.

Matter is emergent of consciousness, consciousness is not emergent of matter and that's the distinction that leads to the understanding. We don't come here to become more conscious we come here because we are already conscious so as Spirit we have it all figured out, while the humans are still trying to figure it out. What the humans haven't figured out is that they don't have to figure it out.


Are humans so advanced? Much of the esoteric knowledge in circulation today is the same knowledge that's been around for a few thousand years so really there's not much that is new. Christ consciousness still seems elusive. Other than that many of the issues that have been around since the dawn of civilisation are still here in one form or another. The question is though, what do you call advanced? While there is some amazing technology available so much of the world's population is without even clean water. In Roman times they fed Christians to the lions for sport, while in China today they persecute Falun Gong practitioners and harvest them for their organs.


History may well not be what the mainstream says it is and there's evidence to push the dates of human civilisation back a few million years at least. There is any amount of evidence that mankind is so much older than history says it is, so mankind is not so new neither. What's also ignored is how advanced people have influenced humankind for thousands of years, starting with the Sumerians and pretty much every major civilisation on the planet, and again that's ignored. Most likely, had it not been for the Sumerians and the genetic manipulations of the Annunaki (take a look at the second gene, it looks as though it's been grafted on) giving us the frontal lobe we might still be prey for lions and tigers and bears, oh my.

[davidsun]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

Christ consciousness still seems elusive. Other than that many of the issues that have been around since the dawn of civilisation are still here in one form or another. The question is though, what do you call advanced?

The stuff I am now writing (as part of a treatise explicating what Jesus Meant - IMO, that is ) touches on the issues you raise, Greenslade (or so I think ):

Now, speaking of the kinds of post‑incarnational ways in which ‘ascended’ (i.e. fully 'advanced' ) souls may continue to engage in the process of optimizing and augmenting the experience and expression of Love and Joy in the Flow of Life which I mentioned I would touch on, there are undoubtedly more as well as more fantastic ones than we who are still embodied can possibly imagine. As stated by the apostle Paul: “For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.” (I Corinthians 13:12) However, just on the basis of personal experiences and, even if one isn’t aware of having had any such oneself, based on the reports of cognizant others, one may reasonably conclude that some souls go on to function as ‘Guardian Angels’ and ‘Spirit Guides’ who support and facilitate the Love and Joy actualizations and ongoing developmental journey of still incarnating associates (albeit orthodox materialists, of course, won’t ‘reason’ so because they are bound by their belief-sets to dismiss any and all evidence in said regards as just being a function of hallucinatory constructions which unrealistically co‑relate inherently meaningless co‑incidences).

Another Love and Joy experiencing and expressing ‘career’ which souls which have an aptitude to so do may post-incarnationally embark on is that of being a mind-over-matter Master of Design, which kind of engagement I personally didn’t appreciate the full importance of until I read accounts relating to such ‘specialization’ in the Chapter 8 of Michael Newton’s book, Destiny of Souls, titled The Advancing Soul. Such beings cooperatively help to mind-over-matter ‘engineer’ planetary environments as well as specifics relating to the physical constellations of cell-based lifeforms which populate them so they (conjointly) become systemically capable of sustaining living bodies which can physically register and communally share, and so effectively host the psychospiritual growth of, Love and Joy experiencing and expressing souls such as ours. One might say, they help establish ‘rookeries’ for the ‘hatching’ and ‘fledging’ of Cosmic Consciousness (a/k/a Christ Consciousness), for souls to develop to the point where they consciously apprehend their Cosmic ‘I’dentity, their self’s Kinship and Oneness with (all!) Life and so fully devote themselves to the maximal actualization of The Flow of Love and Joy in conjunction with others, as spoken of in this chapter.

[r6r6]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

What the humans haven't figured out is that they don't have to figure it out.

Beyond what other animals do, humans exist to 'figure it out' i.e. humans are problem solvers via there access to metaphysical-1, mind//intellect/concepts.



1} objectively harvest information { bits },


2} sort information into catagorys/sets,


3} discover patterns and principles,


4} apply those patterns and principles in support of humanity and integrity of Universe. Thank Bucky Fuller


Humans are the only creature we know of that has ability to have a concept of a God, external to our conceptually finite, occupied space Universe, as if this conceptual God, were holding the Universe in its conceptual hands.