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Go Back   Spiritual Forums > Spirituality & Beliefs > Spiritual Development

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  #71  
Old 27-11-2018, 04:33 AM
Shivani Devi Shivani Devi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack of Spades
I can relate to the feeling. My experience is different in the details, but I could have written a very similar post in tone as you did.

Most humans just want to be socially accepted and don't deep down care about anything else, including about the spiritual and religious practices they participate in. It's often just a way to have a social club. I am so done with that. I rather live 99,9% like a normal person and have 0,1% of some real spirituality, than participate in a performance act designed for getting to live in an illusion of being 100% enlightened. I want something that is real.
I agree with you, and maybe the term "spiritual" or "spirituality" needs to be clearly defined (if it ever CAN be) and that goes for "enlightened" and "enlightenment" too...and even "reality".

How I personally see it, is like this..

There are two "evils" involved here.

The first one, is to live like a "normal human being" ( whatever THAT is) and in the process, behave however it is society expects you to behave, ignoring your own personal needs and not "being yourself" because that is totally unacceptable and then living in abject misery because you never get to express yourself in any way you like...this can subjugate the ego as well, because you simply learn that you just don't matter... everybody ELSE does.. until the question arises, what is it that makes THEM matter and NOT you?

The second "evil" is to just be yourself and express yourself regardless, then have others totally ignore you and avoid you until you meet just ONE person who can totally relate, understand you and be on "the same page" but you're not holding your breath waiting for that to happen either and so you lose whatever humanity you had or thought you had ( if being human means being a "social creature") and now, you must become a "Borg" in the "collective".

So, I can see that you made mention of "most people" and not "everyone" because when it comes to "most people", I am always the exception to the general rule of "what it takes to be a normal human being".

However, as far as "illusion" goes...I have the choice. I can live in this 3D world, believing that's all there is to it, or I can live in the illusion that I am 100℅ enlightened...it's ALL just an illusion anyway, so I get to 'pick my poison" as it were.
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  #72  
Old 04-12-2018, 12:20 AM
LittleBird23 LittleBird23 is offline
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Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 38
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evangeline 77
Last night after a long time I went to a dance meditation group. Basically free-style dance with some instructions.
I don't know what happened but I felt I needed to laugh at the hypocrisy of these so called spiritual people (not the first time)
The dance meditation, the technique she was "teaching" was simply clubbing without alcohol. Dance and techno tracks played with the faciliator on the "mixer" like a DJ.
I understand the debiliating effects of alcohol what I don't understand that a lot of these people think they are better than others.
An average person who goes to "normal" clubs will get an amplified effect because the music is louder, there are more people around you and you'll get their happy energy too, the music will vibrate through your body. "Normal" people look for the connection and the letting go too they just found a different outlet.
(obviously not talking about the extremes!)

Same thing happens when I tell "spiritual" people that I listen heavy metal. 95 out of 100 will judge me immediately, some tells me I have to stop listening low vibrational music that's why I feel bad!!
It doesn't matter that heavy metal is played by actual musicians who are talented and skilled, the lyrics are normally like poems, yes, some of them are about destruction but that's part of life too. Death is part of life.
Also nobody!! at a metal gig will stay unhappy, people are more inclusive than everywhere else, they are more than happy to talk to you and everyone is smiling because they all accept the other person's quirks.

I used to go to group meditations and retreats but I find it more and more difficult, mainly because majority of the spiritual people are as narrow-minded as everyone else. But the bigger problem is when they think they are superior, "they are on the right path" and you are not.
I got to the point where I think everything you do in your life is good as long as you feel good about, it serves your life purpose and nobody has the right to tell you are doing it wrong. You don't have to do yoga asanas and become a vegan, if you eat meat, you are still a perfect human being. Etc

This is only a rant, everybody is free to think whatever they want, I just had to write about my experience last night because I feel like there is hardly anybody left I could talk too. For average people I am too hippy, for spiritual people I am not well developed yet (You'll get there love-so condescending!)

And the other aspect of my post is I just find it funny how my way of thinking is changing, how I am becoming more Me.

I feel that you are projecting, perhaps based on bad experiences with people in general.

I find it hard to believe that "95 out of 100" people are judging you for listening to metal. It's rare for people to make serious judgments based on individual music taste. Which makes me think you are reading into any comments a bit too much and assuming judgment.

I listen to a wide variety of music, including metal, so it sounds completely asinine to me to have to switch up the music that gets you going just to be "spiritual."

Hanging around militant vegans is probably not good for your spiritual development. Most spiritual people know (I hope), some people actually require meat to ground. That and their bodies need it.
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  #73  
Old 05-12-2018, 11:33 AM
Nameless Nameless is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Over the Rainbow
Posts: 2,720
 
Well, you probably don't remember, but when Elvis was first starting out, he "rocked" his hips. Parents were horrified that their youngsters were subjected to such sexuality - went he went on TV on the Ed Sullivan show, they tried only to film him from the waist up!

When the Beatles came to town, parents were horrified that their youngsters were falling in love immediately with these hoodlums with long hippee hair (that still cracks me up). If you listen to the later Beatles, they are very mystical in their lyrics.

When my son was in a band in high school, they had a Battle of the Bands. I was amused by the "headbangers". I had never seen such a thing. The long, long hair and the waving around of the heads. I seriously cracked up while they were playing. I had just never been subjected to that type of music before and it was very funny to me :). There was another group that did the, I call, RaRa music, which I think is what you call Heavy Metal. What I found fascinating was the music part of their songs was very awesome. I just couldn't understand the words because they were screamed in a very distorted version of language.

My husband loves all kinds of music. Therefore my children love all kinds of music. I don't. I never have. I love the Carpenters, especially at Christmas. I love happy music. But I have always been that way, even before I became spiritual. I have tried to expand what I like, and I have somewhat, but there is still music that just calls to me.

So, long story short, music appreciation is different for everybody. If my husband had to listen to the Carpenters for 2 hours, he would not be a happy camper.

It is a good subject to bring up, because music can be very inclusive or exclusive, and there is still that judgement about it, isn't there? But I think it's just a personal choice. Since music is a vibration, and we are all vibrating, we like different vibrations. That's about it. There is no good or bad music, it is in the eye of the beholder. I try to keep an open mind when my son shows me a band, because he loves all kinds of music like his Dad. But honestly, it's like chalk on a blackboard to me, some of it. Some of it is very musical, but I can't understand the words, and that is very frustrating to me. I want to be able to hear the words, because I like to be carried away by the music, so it is very annoying to me that I can't understand the words.

My opinion is everyone likes different music, but that is why there is so many kinds of different music, because there is so much diversity in humans.

I don't think that's an accident. How boring would it be if we were all the same?

People can change. I remember when tatoos were starting to become the thing, and I was horrified that all these young people were scarring their bodies for life. What were they thinking? And putting holes in their noses, and brows, etc. But then my son started bringing them home, and I realized it was like any other generational thing. People like to fit in with their crowd when they are young adults. It just is.

Now I see someone tatted up, with holes in their faces, and I don't bat an eye. My bosses are all tatted up, and I didn't even realize they were until they pointed out one of their tatoos and I realized he had a sleeve of tats.

Don't judge your elders too harshly. They are just coming from a different world.

Whatever music fills your soul with good vibes, that's what you should listen to, whatever the vibe is.

Oh, I forgot to mention spirituality. That's because music is spiritual for everyone, and everyone is different, and music really doesn't have anything to do with spirituality. You are correct, I think it is more about personal judgement and that is how are you vibrating? Some vibrations just can't handle certain songs (me included). Doesn't mean I am judging the artists, it just means I want to hear the words LOL.

I have never heard of dance spirituality. I would choose a group that is more suited to your tastes.
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  #74  
Old 13-12-2018, 10:16 AM
zabrianne zabrianne is offline
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Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 24
 
I don't think youre really suppose to mix 'spiritual' in a 'social' setting
theres a fine line between being enlightened and egotistical
but sharing ideas doesnt require so much critical judgment
id say
If you want to get spiritual with someone then do some sports or play some instruments together or just have a cooperative conversation
other than that theres really nothing other than the connection you guys have that becomes spiritual in a social setting
and just because someone is 'spiritual' doesnt mean they are on a ritcheous path

oh and one of my favorite metal bands 'Death' has a song 'spirit crusher'
good song
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  #75  
Old 13-12-2018, 09:32 PM
ketzer ketzer is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 190
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Evangeline 77
Last night after a long time I went to a dance meditation group. Basically free-style dance with some instructions.
I don't know what happened but I felt I needed to laugh at the hypocrisy of these so called spiritual people (not the first time)
The dance meditation, the technique she was "teaching" was simply clubbing without alcohol. Dance and techno tracks played with the faciliator on the "mixer" like a DJ.
I understand the debiliating effects of alcohol what I don't understand that a lot of these people think they are better than others.
An average person who goes to "normal" clubs will get an amplified effect because the music is louder, there are more people around you and you'll get their happy energy too, the music will vibrate through your body. "Normal" people look for the connection and the letting go too they just found a different outlet.
(obviously not talking about the extremes!)

Same thing happens when I tell "spiritual" people that I listen heavy metal. 95 out of 100 will judge me immediately, some tells me I have to stop listening low vibrational music that's why I feel bad!!
It doesn't matter that heavy metal is played by actual musicians who are talented and skilled, the lyrics are normally like poems, yes, some of them are about destruction but that's part of life too. Death is part of life.
Also nobody!! at a metal gig will stay unhappy, people are more inclusive than everywhere else, they are more than happy to talk to you and everyone is smiling because they all accept the other person's quirks.

I used to go to group meditations and retreats but I find it more and more difficult, mainly because majority of the spiritual people are as narrow-minded as everyone else. But the bigger problem is when they think they are superior, "they are on the right path" and you are not.
I got to the point where I think everything you do in your life is good as long as you feel good about, it serves your life purpose and nobody has the right to tell you are doing it wrong. You don't have to do yoga asanas and become a vegan, if you eat meat, you are still a perfect human being. Etc

This is only a rant, everybody is free to think whatever they want, I just had to write about my experience last night because I feel like there is hardly anybody left I could talk too. For average people I am too hippy, for spiritual people I am not well developed yet (You'll get there love-so condescending!)

And the other aspect of my post is I just find it funny how my way of thinking is changing, how I am becoming more Me.

I wonder if this doesn't have something to do with human evolution. Like wolves, and lions, we are apex predators and social animals. Like wolves and lions we have a tendency to divide up into packs and prides and compete with each other for territory. Religions tend to divide themselves up into sects, and often end up hating the other sects more then individuals from whole other religions. "Spiritual people" are in the end human as well. They seek out the company of other "spiritual people" (by, among other ways, signing up for forums, ;) . We humans like to spend time with others like us, as it reassures us we are right. But for there to be an us, there must be a them, who are "not us". We have to have some kind of definition as to what in means to be us. Once we have the definition, we can identify those who are not us but are instead them, and chase them out of our territory. After all, it is all of those thems who keep screwing everything up, not us. We would all be better off without them. Wouldn't you agree? Or, are you one of them?
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  #76  
Old 13-12-2018, 10:09 PM
Bubbles235 Bubbles235 is offline
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Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 193
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Hi Evangeline. I feel you when you talk about some spiritual people not following what they preach. I too have found these types of people...remember that it is important not what people say or what they claim to be, but how they treat others. If these people make you uncomfortable or less than, then you should always walk another way.

Sometimes, it helps just to talk to normal, everyday people who may or may not be interested in spirituality at all. Sometimes they are even kinder and on the right path than those who claim to "know it all". ;)
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  #77  
Old 16-12-2018, 07:35 PM
marcel marcel is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 27
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ketzer
After all, it is all of those thems who keep screwing everything up, not us. We would all be better off without them. Wouldn't you agree? Or, are you one of them?
Nice nickname :)
I think it's very human to desire being part of a group with the main purpose to belong to an exlusive club and to elevate us above those who are not part of it. It doesn't really matter if we follow a football team, listen to a certain kind of music or belong to some kind of religion or spiritual belief. People want to belong somewhere and if it offers the opportunity to look down on others it making us feel better about ourselves.
Only if we come to terms with who we are, we will be able to understand who "they" are. And only then we can start to evolve as one, leaving our egos behind.
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