Maya is not neutral.

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by 7luminaries

Kali Yuga...chrissake...sux for us, eh?

May I ask...could you (or Shivani or someone) enlighten us with some background on this Kali Yuga age -- characteristics, trends, when it began (roughly) and how long it might be (if that's known)?

I'm trying to mine the wisdom of the ages here...as clearly, there certainly IS a predominance of Tamas and austerity, discipline, ownership, and temperance certainly ARE (seemingly) at an all-time low, LOL...

Thank you

Peace & blessings and namaste to one and all --
7L

Namaste.

The characteristics of Kali Yuga and the Yugas in general, has been a topic of contentious debate among Hindu scholars and academics since time immemorial.

The commonly held belief according to scripture is that Kali Yuga lasts for about 400 million years and we are only about half way through it...but this just seems way too fanciful to be taken seriously by academia.

The Guru of Swami Yogananda, Sri Yukteshwar Giri has done his own Astrological research on the Yugas according to planetary data...I cannot recall all of it, but whatever it entails can be found here:

http://www.dwapara-yuga.org/

According to Sri Yukteshwar Giri and H.P Blavatsky and those mystics who calculated the Yugas at the start of the 20th Century, we are not in Kali Yuga, but are on the "upswing" from Kali Yuga and are now back in in Dwapara Yuga.

This doesn't seem to be correct either....so I take a position somewhere in between Veda Vyasa and Sri Yukteshwar Giri.

According to many Hindu Scholars, Kali Yuga began at the end of the Mahabharata War which occurred some 33,500 years ago - according to the full solar eclipse in Sagittarius which took place when Bhishma passed away after being laid to rest on a bed of arrows constructed by Arjuna.. basically marking the end of the war and the end of the previous Yuga.

Kali Yuga was said to last for one full precession of the equinox from that point, meaning that Kali Yuga ended in about 8,000 BCE but that doesn't make sense either.... unless... unless a manvantara (cycle of human civilization) occured during the interim.

Now, we all know that the last Younger Dryas Era (the melting of the polar icecaps which sank Atlantis and Lemuria) occured some 11,000 to 12,000 years BCE which marked the end of civilization on the planet at that time and propelled us headlong into a Dark Age....whoever remained on Earth after the flood, hid in caves, suffered from "catastrophobia" and underwent a massive forgetting...this would last for a whole precession of the equinox until the next major global cataclysm which would more than likely extinguish all life on the planet or even the very planet itself or even the whole universe...this is known as Pralaya.

Pralaya is what happens at the end of Kali Yuga.

So, Younger Dryas happened around 12,000 BCE...a precession lasts for about 25,700 years...so we are about smack bang in the middle of Kali Yuga with approximately 11,600 years to go until the apocalypse...until the big "crunch time" happens.

Kali Yuga characteristics....it consists of mankind as a whole forgetting their Divine nature, procreating beyond the planet's ability to sustain us all, fighting for limited resources, going to war over ideologies, polluting the environment with toxins so that lifespan will gradually decrease, forgetting the art of self sufficiency and land management, seeing themselves as separate from each other, from nature, God and the Universe, believing they are the body and mind and nothing else, living like animals according to the limbic system and not the Pineal gland, fighting and arguing over and about every little thing so that nothing can ever get done...

In fact "Kali Yuga" does NOT refer in any way, shape or form to the Goddess called Kali... MANY make that mistake!

The Goddess Kali is pronounced as Kah-lee.
Kali Yuga is pronounced as Kalli Yuga.

In this translation of the word Kali as in Kali Yuga, it means "discord".."discontent".."disagreement"..."argumen t"..."unrest"..."quarrel"....all of those words rolled into one.

....and now you all know just as much as I do about Kali Yuga.

Aum Namah Shivaya

[Jyotir]

The effects of Maya are equal for all incarnated beings, who also equally possess the effective means to transcend it.

I'd say that's a pretty good deal.


~ J

[Altair]

Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn

Good one, Altair - Is it really a malevolent force or are we the ones that make it so..

The 'world' is pretty neutral by itself, isn't it? It's us thinking creatures that are aware of our ''suffering''. Wolves and giraffes have no need for it. Sure, they can be in pain but no need to view things as malevolent for them. Something in the human stirs to call the world malevolent.

Originally Posted by LadyMay

Not all Gnosticism sees the demiurge as evil, maybe more just misguided or unenlightened and not purposely causing harm... That is also one of the thoughts of NeoPlatonism I believe which Gnosticism was originally based on.

Yeah it seems to have come from the Neoplatonists. Usually seems to refer to a 'creator' though: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demiurge


@Honza; Are you having Gnostics ideas?

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Namaste.

The characteristics of Kali Yuga and the Yugas in general, has been a topic of contentious debate among Hindu scholars and academics since time immemorial.

The commonly held belief according to scripture is that Kali Yuga lasts for about 400 million years and we are only about half way through it...but this just seems way too fanciful to be taken seriously by academia.

The Guru of Swami Yogananda, Sri Yukteshwar Giri has done his own Astrological research on the Yugas according to planetary data...I cannot recall all of it, but whatever it entails can be found here:

http://www.dwapara-yuga.org/
According to Sri Yukteshwar Giri and H.P Blavatsky and those mystics who calculated the Yugas at the start of the 20th Century, we are not in Kali Yuga, but are on the "upswing" from Kali Yuga and are now back in in Dwapara Yuga.

This doesn't seem to be correct either....so I take a position somewhere in between Veda Vyasa and Sri Yukteshwar Giri.

According to many Hindu Scholars, Kali Yuga began at the end of the Mahabharata War which occurred some 33,500 years ago - according to the full solar eclipse in Sagittarius which took place when Bhishma passed away after being laid to rest on a bed of arrows constructed by Arjuna.. basically marking the end of the war and the end of the previous Yuga.

Kali Yuga was said to last for one full precession of the equinox from that point, meaning that Kali Yuga ended in about 8,000 BCE but that doesn't make sense either.... unless... unless a manvantara (cycle of human civilization) occured during the interim.

Now, we all know that the last Younger Dryas Era (the melting of the polar icecaps which sank Atlantis and Lemuria) occured some 11,000 to 12,000 years BCE which marked the end of civilization on the planet at that time and propelled us headlong into a Dark Age....whoever remained on Earth after the flood, hid in caves, suffered from "catastrophobia" and underwent a massive forgetting...this would last for a whole precession of the equinox until the next major global cataclysm which would more than likely extinguish all life on the planet or even the very planet itself or even the whole universe...this is known as Pralaya.

Pralaya is what happens at the end of Kali Yuga.

So, Younger Dryas happened around 12,000 BCE...a precession lasts for about 25,700 years...so we are about smack bang in the middle of Kali Yuga with approximately 11,600 years to go until the apocalypse...until the big "crunch time" happens.

Kali Yuga characteristics....it consists of mankind as a whole forgetting their Divine nature, procreating beyond the planet's ability to sustain us all, fighting for limited resources, going to war over ideologies, polluting the environment with toxins so that lifespan will gradually decrease, forgetting the art of self sufficiency and land management, seeing themselves as separate from each other, from nature, God and the Universe, believing they are the body and mind and nothing else, living like animals according to the limbic system and not the Pineal gland, fighting and arguing over and about every little thing so that nothing can ever get done...

In fact "Kali Yuga" does NOT refer in any way, shape or form to the Goddess called Kali... MANY make that mistake!

The Goddess Kali is pronounced as Kah-lee.
Kali Yuga is pronounced as Kalli Yuga.

In this translation of the word Kali as in Kali Yuga, it means "discord".."discontent".."disagreement"..."argumen t"..."unrest"..."quarrel"....all of those words rolled into one.

....and now you all know just as much as I do about Kali Yuga.

Aum Namah Shivaya

Shivani, hello there and namaste

I appreciate all your background, especially on the characteristics of the Kali Yuga age. I did a very high-level scan and also found several sources that say these cycles (with Kali being the densest cycles) last around 5,000 to 6,000 years -- with there being some explanation for the discrepancy between calculating the cycles as either 400K+ years, or as 5K years.

Those that say the ages are ~5K years also say we are in a Kali Yuga age -- same traits as you describe -- and have been since Krishna died per historical records around 5,100 years ago (around 3100 BCE). By these calculations, we are ending the Kali Yuga age any day...or within the century at least. Just enough time for those deep into their Kali cups to screw the world and set it all to burn on their way out the door -- their last hurrah and middle finger to the rest of us

http://cosmicconvergence.org/?p=6028

The Indian scriptures are definitive about the beginning and conclusion of the Kali Yuga. The Puranas and Srimad Bhagavatam, in particular, make it clear that the Kali Yuga began with the death of Lord Krishna. Once that date is agreed upon, the end date can be easily extrapolated. What we do know from a variety of authoritative sources is that Lord Krishna lived and died toward the beginning of the fourth millennium B.C. Various dates have been presented by Indian historians and scriptural authorities which all seem to indicate Krishna’s day of passing from the Earth realm somewhere between 3102 and 3113 B.C.
Regardless of the exact date of Lord Krishna’s death, the preceding window of time permits us to throw a stake in the ground. If we choose 3113 B.C., then the year 2012 A.D. becomes understandable as the final day of the Mayan Long Count Calendar (LC). The December 21, 2012 date, although it now appears to be unremarkable, may very well function as the beginning of the very end of Kali Yuga. Perhaps, then, only a few years, or decades, or maybe even a century, remain until the final closing of the current age.

What do you think of this perspective? Does it also make sense?
Either way, all of our recent recorded history of the last 5K+ years has been a Kali Yuga age -- which completely makes sense, IMO It would be lovely to finally see it out the door though!

Peace & blessings
7L

[Shivani Devi]

Originally Posted by 7luminaries

Shivani, hello there and namaste

I appreciate all your background, especially on the characteristics of the Kali Yuga age. I did a very high-level scan and also found several sources that say these cycles (with Kali being the densest cycles) last around 5,000 to 6,000 years -- with there being some explanation for the discrepancy between calculating the cycles as either 400K+ years, or as 5K years.

Those that say the ages are ~5K years also say we are in a Kali Yuga age -- same traits as you describe -- and have been since Krishna died per historical records around 5,100 years ago (around 3100 BCE). By these calculations, we are ending the Kali Yuga age any day...or within the century at least. Just enough time for those deep into their Kali cups to screw the world and set it all to burn on their way out the door -- their last hurrah and middle finger to the rest of us

http://cosmicconvergence.org/?p=6028


What do you think of this perspective? Does it also make sense?
Either way, all of our recent recorded history of the last 5K+ years has been a Kali Yuga age -- which completely makes sense, IMO It would be lovely to finally see it out the door though!

Peace & blessings
7L

Honestly... brutally honestly?....I have no ideas nor thoughts about any of the above, but thank you for sharing it.

All I know is that I made an error in my previous post.

A MAHA YUGA (all four Yugas together) is 432 million years with Kali Yuga being one tenth of that....the shortest yuga...so according to scripture, Kali Yuga lasts for 432,000 years.

All I know is that the information on the Yugas vary widely between different sects of Hindus.

I honestly believe that the Yugas is only a metaphor for the devolvement and degradation of human consciousness and isn't meant to be a historical timeline of any sort.

It is just like "The Age of Aquarius"...some say we entered into that in the middle of last century, some say that it was in Dec 2012 and some say it is 2125 or even 2400...there is no popular consensus really.

The Srimad Bhagavatam is a Gaudiya Vaishnava text...and I am a Kaula Shaivite which is pretty much the reason why I don't have a clue about anything to do with Krishna's comings and goings.

Here is a passage from the Linga Purana...a Shaivite text:

https://allaboutheaven.org/observati...uga-022593/221

The reason for my discrepancies...and those of many Hindu scholars, is over the definition of the word "lakh".

It is 100,000 and not 10,000.

Here is some astrological info on the Mahabharata War:
https://www.boloji.com/articles/1052/dating-mahabharata

If we are to believe the Surya Siddhanta, Kali Yuga began with the Mahabharata War and will end in 2025.

If we are to believe the Srimad Bhagavatam, Kali Yuga began 36 years after the war, with the death of Lord Krishna and will last for 432,000 years.

I take the approach of Sikhism in my understanding of this....

Kali Yuga is only a metaphor...it is the way the world was when the scriptures were codified during the "Dark Ages" around the 11th - 13th Centuries CE.

Just like now, people looked for a reason why mankind was so barbaric and ungodly... thinking that it must be a "sign of the times" but maybe, human beings have always been like that...we are glorified apes after all.

So this thing called "Kali Yuga" was invented so that mankind had a reason to rise above animal instinct and to BE the "sentient lifeforms" we were supposed to be however, this plea was made universally (where nobody would ever listen) instead of being made at an individual level.

We have all four Yugas within ourselves consisting of the three Gunas + that state which transcends the whole Trinity known as Turiya.

Aum Namah Shivaya

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Just like now, people looked for a reason why mankind was so barbaric and ungodly... thinking that it must be a "sign of the times" but maybe, human beings have always been like that...we are glorified apes after all.

More like magnificent biological machines and without consciousness or free will. Or as the material reductionists say, they are simply illusions and I now agree with them.

That's why spiritual traditions are so very important.

[Shivani Devi]

Here we go!

I just found something VERY interesting during one of MY "high-level scans" which is to be found on Graham Hancock's website...it is an article by Bibhu Dev Mishra:

https://grahamhancock.com/dmisrab6/

According to this, Kali Yuga officially ends in 2025, with a major cataclysm, then a transitional period of 300 years:

Whatever the case, I don't believe that any of us will see a "golden age" within our lifetimes, so that any speculation on when Kali Yuga will be ending going beyond the next 50 years will be totally irrelevant to any of us anyway.

This is the reason why I don't have much interest in it, because any ending of Kali Yuga on a global level will happen after I exit the planet which then becomes "none of my business".

So, they say that more people are waking up...

At the moment, there are not enough of the "ascended ones" to make any real difference to the planet apart from the way we view our own version of reality.

When about half of the species "wakes up" then we may see a difference because those who are in ignorance will no longer be in the majority...which is the defence they hide behind.

I also remember making a post a few years back saying that Kali Yuga was ending in 2025 and it was rubbished by all and sundry...They said that nobody knows when Kali Yuga will end, so I dropped it like a hot potato.. never mentioning it again until now.

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/sh...d.php?t=110299

What I found most amazing was that my investigations today led me back to the very SAME article that I referenced two years ago.... totally unbeknownst to me until just now.

The reason why I gave an estimate of 11,000 years until the end is because I was hedging my bets that nobody would be left alive at that time to read this... because every single "doomsday prophecy" since the dawn of humanity has failed to eventuate.

With that being said, I am off to check the orbit of Nibiru/Kalki.

Namaste

[ajay00]

Originally Posted by 7luminaries

Kali Yuga...chrissake...sux for us, eh?

May I ask...could you (or Shivani or someone) enlighten us with some background on this Kali Yuga age -- characteristics, trends, when it began (roughly) and how long it might be (if that's known)?

I'm trying to mine the wisdom of the ages here...as clearly, there certainly IS a predominance of Tamas and austerity, discipline, ownership, and temperance certainly ARE (seemingly) at an all-time low, LOL...

Thank you

Peace & blessings and namaste to one and all --
7L

The Kali Yuga is the time where the guna or element of Tamas is at its peak. Tamas is considered a negative guna ( compared to the neutral rajas and positive sattva) and is accompanied by delusion, dullness,addiction,depression, helplesness, inactivity, apathy, brutality, ignorance,greed, confusion, attachment, heaviness.


https://www.yogabasics.com/learn/the-3-gunas-of-nature/


With increase in tamas, there is bound to be increase in destructiveness and conflicts. Natural disasters are also bound to increase as nature is uncomfortable with increasing tamas while it is neutral to rajas and favorable to sattva.


Increase in sattva through spiritual practices can bring about a harmonious environment reducing natural disasters and even crime rates as well.

According to the Prajapita Brahmakumaris, each Yuga or worldy cycle consists of five ages in a single cycle of 5000 years. In this cycle, the Sat Yuga or Golden Age emerges as the very first yuga and lasts for a period of 1250 years. The same goes for the other Yugas such as Treta Yuga, Dvapar Yuga, Kali Yuga. The fifth Age is the present Confluence Age which lasts for a hundred years and is considered to be a transition period between the Kali Yuga and Satya Yuga.


https://www.brahmakumaris.org/wisdom/wheel-of-life

With the changing of seasons and the integrity of matter, the external form of the earth changes over time. The driving force behind this devolution is the human mind. The higher, pure consciousness manifests in a robust, verdant planet, while the lowest, impure consciousness produces a polluted, corroded state of existence. ~ Prajapita Brahmakumaris

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Honestly... brutally honestly?....I have no ideas nor thoughts about any of the above, but thank you for sharing it.

All I know is that I made an error in my previous post.

A MAHA YUGA (all four Yugas together) is 432 million years with Kali Yuga being one tenth of that....the shortest yuga...so according to scripture, Kali Yuga lasts for 432,000 years.

All I know is that the information on the Yugas vary widely between different sects of Hindus.

I honestly believe that the Yugas is only a metaphor for the devolvement and degradation of human consciousness and isn't meant to be a historical timeline of any sort.

Hello Shivani and thank you for sharing. This is wonderful info, just the sort I was looking for. Generally, I do tend to agree with the main them that these ages are symbolic of the cycles of and [we all hope] capacity for the progress of humanity and the growth in human consciousness.

It is just like "The Age of Aquarius"...some say we entered into that in the middle of last century, some say that it was in Dec 2012 and some say it is 2125 or even 2400...there is no popular consensus really.

The Srimad Bhagavatam is a Gaudiya Vaishnava text...and I am a Kaula Shaivite which is pretty much the reason why I don't have a clue about anything to do with Krishna's comings and goings.

Here is a passage from the Linga Purana...a Shaivite text:

https://allaboutheaven.org/observati...uga-022593/221

The reason for my discrepancies...and those of many Hindu scholars, is over the definition of the word "lakh".

It is 100,000 and not 10,000.

Here is some astrological info on the Mahabharata War:
https://www.boloji.com/articles/1052/dating-mahabharata

If we are to believe the Surya Siddhanta, Kali Yuga began with the Mahabharata War and will end in 2025.

Clearly, this is the more hopeful interpretation of when the Kali Yuga age will end but I get what you are saying...per usual even here there is no firm consensus about what that means for humanity, as there is always fudge room and transitional periods, yada yada. Either way, we will have to take ownership at all levels and get a move on if the slow slog toward progress is to commence

If we are to believe the Srimad Bhagavatam, Kali Yuga began 36 years after the war, with the death of Lord Krishna and will last for 432,000 years.LOL...well, I have to say, this time horizon for getting our @&!% together is probably far more realistic, if we last that long Hahaha....!!!

I take the approach of Sikhism in my understanding of this....

Kali Yuga is only a metaphor...it is the way the world was when the scriptures were codified during the "Dark Ages" around the 11th - 13th Centuries CE.

Just like now, people looked for a reason why mankind was so barbaric and ungodly... thinking that it must be a "sign of the times" but maybe, human beings have always been like that...we are glorified apes after all.

So this thing called "Kali Yuga" was invented so that mankind had a reason to rise above animal instinct and to BE the "sentient lifeforms" we were supposed to be however, this plea was made universally (where nobody would ever listen) instead of being made at an individual level.

We have all four Yugas within ourselves consisting of the three Gunas + that state which transcends the whole Trinity known as Turiya.

Aum Namah Shivaya

That last I bolded was a very wise and insightful observation. I agree, full stop. AND I would also agree that most of our spiritual and religious traditions have more or less failed in that area to provide the sort of proscriptive, detailed moral and ethical guidance for the individual (which we are always free to take or leave) in his or her day-to-day, real-world contexts.

Certainly this is the case broadly in the modern era, where many open-ended freedoms and few to no true forms (as opposed to legalistic forms) moral and ethical guidance pertain.

Peace & blessings
7L

[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by Shivani Devi

Here we go!

I just found something VERY interesting during one of MY "high-level scans" which is to be found on Graham Hancock's website...it is an article by Bibhu Dev Mishra:

https://grahamhancock.com/dmisrab6/

According to this, Kali Yuga officially ends in 2025, with a major cataclysm, then a transitional period of 300 years:

LOL!!! Bloody @!%$ hell...always the major cataclysm...
Well that's no good then, hahaha!!! But yes, very interesting and certainly not at all out of the realm of probability given where we're at in 2020.

Whatever the case, I don't believe that any of us will see a "golden age" within our lifetimes, so that any speculation on when Kali Yuga will be ending going beyond the next 50 years will be totally irrelevant to any of us anyway.

This is the reason why I don't have much interest in it, because any ending of Kali Yuga on a global level will happen after I exit the planet which then becomes "none of my business".

I do see your point. The end of the Kali Yuga and the start of the age of Aquarius may be immanent but either way, it seems humanity are in for a bumpy ride and quite a long, hard slog, if we make it through the worst.

So, they say that more people are waking up...

At the moment, there are not enough of the "ascended ones" to make any real difference to the planet apart from the way we view our own version of reality.

When about half of the species "wakes up" then we may see a difference because those who are in ignorance will no longer be in the majority...which is the defence they hide behind.

I also remember making a post a few years back saying that Kali Yuga was ending in 2025 and it was rubbished by all and sundry...They said that nobody knows when Kali Yuga will end, so I dropped it like a hot potato.. never mentioning it again until now.

http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/sh...d.php?t=110299

Many thanks for sharing all this again...and it is interesting isn't it? I don't see anyone these days just casting your thoughts on this aside. Perhaps we have opened our minds a bit more all round, particularly in the face of so much reactionary rubbish from many of our so-called fearless leaders round the globe.

What I found most amazing was that my investigations today led me back to the very SAME article that I referenced two years ago.... totally unbeknownst to me until just now.

The reason why I gave an estimate of 11,000 years until the end is because I was hedging my bets that nobody would be left alive at that time to read this... because every single "doomsday prophecy" since the dawn of humanity has failed to eventuate.

With that being said, I am off to check the orbit of Nibiru/Kalki.

Namaste

Namaste to you as well! And hey it never hurts to be prepared !!! :)
Peace & blessings
7L