Something wonderful, but really nothing.

[RyanWind]

I'll try this another way:

There is no enlightenment in enlightenment. You realize yourself. You don't realize something. Not in the actual experience or perception. Conceptually you can experience anything! Everything you can look at is not you. If you can perceive it, it is not you. So you know your body and thoughts and memories and concepts are not you. You are awake to what you are. You are perception of all of that, the things you have and are within.

To posses is always dual. The one who possess the thing they posses. This is all about freedom and letting go of not being touched in yourself, space between you and that...I guess you could hold onto this perception... but yea... you are holding onto yourself...if you say you are possessing yourself....that is just wrong... their is no duality in yourself if you are self realized. I think the term holding implies constant pressure... that's why that word works...I am holding onto myself... yes that is an action...a staying awake moment to moment ..watching....observing... what is.... but the word possessing yourself.... posses means you own it.... you can never own it...you become it through awakeness/energy.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by RyanWind

I'll try this another way:

There is no enlightenment in enlightenment. You realize yourself. You don't realize something. Not in the actual experience or perception. Conceptually you can experience anything! Everything you can look at is not you. If you can perceive it, it is not you. So you know your body and thoughts and memories and concepts are not you. You are awake to what you are. You are perception of all of that, the things you have and are within.

Yes I realize you are realizing yourself.

Your saying if you can perceive it is not you. Yet your saying if your awake your still the perception of all that perceiving? SO if your not perceiving then are you saying your *aware*...moving aware of you in all that?

To posses is always dual. The one who possess the thing they posses. This is all about freedom and letting go of not being touched in yourself, space between you and that...I guess you could hold onto this perception... but yea... you are holding onto yourself...if you say you are possessing yourself....that is just wrong... their is no duality in yourself if you are self realized. I think the term holding implies constant pressure... that's why that word works...I am holding onto myself... yes that is an action...a staying awake moment to moment ..watching....observing... what is.... but the word possessing yourself.... posses means you own it.... you can never own it...you become it through awakeness/energy.

I see possession as attachment, so no matter what is moving in me I can still be aware of it all and let it move through and move me as a whole host. The point of recognising I have let go deeper in this way, would signal I feel more at peace moving, aware?


I am learning to listen to my body deeper-self care matters, so its a battle between old fears of panic and the system taking charge of me, and me listening deeper ad doing what my body needs myself. And interestingly this is about going into a deeper meditative space to open this to become this naturally..in knowing and movement.

[RyanWind]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

Yes I understand it is fluid. What I take from your sharing is that when your awake perception, perceived attachment or possession no longer holds, because awareness understands the fluid nature of itself and the self no longer can hold in the feeling and knowing because it is aware of itself as emptiness.

Well I hope that makes sense to you, it does to me.

lol gotta love words...

i get what you said.... i just have an aversion to the word emptiness it is so misunderstood by many... well they understand it as something, but that thing is not my thing

the body is still there doing it's thing and the mind and memory and all of that... more or less... it does change without giving all of that energy but I would say it is the awareness I am not that...a feeling can come, a thought can come, you can still go to work and take out the trash and talk to a friend...everything continues to be there except there is the knowing none of that is you..

yes you are there seeing all of this... I guess you can say empty because none of this you hold... it comes and goes...empty tends to make people think of as a zombie or something though... you are still you 100% the same you that you have always been.... you are an entity, the one you have known since the day you were born... in this state you don't feel empty at all, you just feel like you..more you than normal...but yes you don't carry anything with you except yourself as perciever.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by RyanWind

lol gotta love words...

i get what you said.... i just have an aversion to the word emptiness it is so misunderstood by many... well they understand it as something, but that thing is not my thing

the body is still there doing it's thing and the mind and memory and all of that... more or less... it does change without giving all of that energy but I would say it is the awareness I am not that...a feeling can come, a thought can come, you can still go to work and take out the trash and talk to a friend...everything continues to be there except there is the knowing none of that is you..

yes you are there seeing all of this... I guess you can say empty because none of this you hold... it comes and goes...empty tends to make people think of as a zombie or something though... you are still you 100% the same you that you have always been.... you are an entity, the one you have known since the day you were born... in this state you don't feel empty at all, you just feel like you..more you than normal...but yes you don't carry anything with you except yourself as perciever.

I understand emptiness is me being this, experiencing myself uncluttered allowing the nature of my natural self unattached to open and be more free flowing. In this way it feels complete in me, because their is nothing holding on and cluttering me you could say. Now when I am cluttered I am aware I need to reconnect deeper to the knowing place I know in me, that is both empty and complete, to find balance again.

[RyanWind]

Gotta re-write this it's a mess.

[naturesflow]

Originally Posted by RyanWind

Gotta re-write this it's a mess.

I don't see a mess?

[RyanWind]

Originally Posted by naturesflow

I don't see a mess?

I done wrote myself into thinking consciousness. It's an internal mess. I can't write from my current state of consciousness. My ego is locked and loaded. lol.