What do you think God wants?

[mickiel]

Originally Posted by sky123

Jesus was created before the world was created ????
So we have two Jesus's, one before and one after
Oh dear, so confusing.

No, they are the same, he simply was sent to earth to be born again as a human. He was sent here to die for our sins and bridge the gap between human and divine!

[sky]

Originally Posted by mickiel

No, they are the same, he simply was sent to earth to be born again as a human. He was sent here to die for our sins and bridge the gap between human and divine!

I don't think so. He didn't die for my sins, I can take responsibility for my own wrong doings, Kamma sorts it all out But it's interesting to see how you percieve these biblical teachings....

[mickiel]

Originally Posted by sky123

I don't think so. He didn't die for my sins, I can take responsibility for my own wrong doings, Kamma sorts it all out But it's interesting to see how you percieve these biblical teachings....

Well yes, its how I perceive it all; but I understand that my perception is limited and subject to faults. I myself cannot take responsibility for my destiny, because its too great for me to comprehend; we are only responsible for the things we are conscious of. I am not conscious of the incredible destiny of humanity that God has planned. I am unsure of the universe of God's existence ; it is beyond me. I have not been seduced into thinking that humans are responsible for the future of humanity. We are unable to do things like that. Life goes on how God wants it to. But its also interesting to see how you perceive this as well.

[sky]

Originally Posted by mickiel

Well yes, its how I perceive it all; but I understand that my perception is limited and subject to faults. I myself cannot take responsibility for my destiny, because its too great for me to comprehend; we are only responsible for the things we are conscious of. I am not conscious of the incredible destiny of humanity that God has planned. I am unsure of the universe of God's existence ; it is beyond me. I have not been seduced into thinking that humans are responsible for the future of humanity. We are unable to do things like that. Life goes on how God wants it to. But its also interesting to see how you perceive this as well.

' Life goes on as God wants it '..... So God wants wars, famine, diseases, tsunamis, tornados, wild fires, poverty etc: he must be very cruel don't you think ?

[mickiel]

Originally Posted by PeaceChic99

I think that God wants us to make a better world than it is now by ensuring that every man can live in peace without fear.

I think so myself; God certainly must be a being of peace, and it would be quite different to be able to never fear things that are in your living environment.

[mickiel]

Originally Posted by sky123

' Life goes on as God wants it '..... So God wants wars, famine, diseases, tsunamis, tornados, wild fires, poverty etc: he must be very cruel don't you think ?

I think he certainly can seem to be cruel, if one does not understand his ultimate goals are in stages for us, and the sufferings are a stage he did design us to go through first, yes. God does indeed want all of humanity to go through all those things, or listen- we would not IF he did not want that.

So yes God does want famine, tornados, poverty and so on; and I think we will have our full of it, but then God will eliminate all those things forever, and the suffering will be no more. Its just how it is.

[FallingLeaves]

Originally Posted by mickiel

I think he certainly can seem to be cruel, if one does not understand his ultimate goals are in stages for us, and the sufferings are a stage he did design us to go through first, yes. God does indeed want all of humanity to go through all those things, or listen- we would not IF he did not want that.

So yes God does want famine, tornados, poverty and so on; and I think we will have our full of it, but then God will eliminate all those things forever, and the suffering will be no more. Its just how it is.

that is one of the storylines anyway... I'm not in a position to discern how physics is going to work in the future so I can't comment on the relative merits of the story lines. But I do assume things will get 'easier' for lack of a better word. Because to deal with the 'problem' a lot of difficulties had to be introduced. genesis talks of the 'curses' in response to a&e's bad behavior and it seems reasonable to assume that when the time of mystery is done they will be lifted. We will all breathe easier after that.

But this was said:

'you shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free'.

Personally, I think that 'freedom' is at the heart of what needs to be and so statements like this are close to the heart of things. But it wouldn't necessarily be 'freedom' the way MEN define the word. Takes more discernment I guess...

[mickiel]

Originally Posted by FallingLeaves

that is one of the storylines anyway... I'm not in a position to discern how physics is going to work in the future so I can't comment on the relative merits of the story lines. But I do assume things will get 'easier' for lack of a better word. Because to deal with the 'problem' a lot of difficulties had to be introduced. genesis talks of the 'curses' in response to a&e's bad behavior and it seems reasonable to assume that when the time of mystery is done they will be lifted. We will all breathe easier after that.

But this was said:

'you shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free'.

Personally, I think that 'freedom' is at the heart of what needs to be and so statements like this are close to the heart of things. But it wouldn't necessarily be 'freedom' the way MEN define the word. Takes more discernment I guess...

Very well written Fallingleaves, so very true! We do all need to be free of so much influence and confusion we are exposed to on all levels of our consciousness. As you so well put it, " Not the freedom of men, the way we define it and are conscious of it", there exist a truth that will set us all free.

And I believe we are all destined to know it!

And it is going to require more discernment.

I am so inspired by what you wrote here.

[sky]

Originally Posted by mickiel

I think he certainly can seem to be cruel, if one does not understand his ultimate goals are in stages for us, and the sufferings are a stage he did design us to go through first, yes. God does indeed want all of humanity to go through all those things, or listen- we would not IF he did not want that.

So yes God does want famine, tornados, poverty and so on; and I think we will have our full of it, but then God will eliminate all those things forever, and the suffering will be no more. Its just how it is.

I am so grateful that my God is not the same as yours

[Ab Origine]

Hi Folks..

Sky;

I am so grateful that my God is not the same as yours

Yes I agree totally !! Who would want to associate, bow down and "worship" an entity like THAT one in the bible... No wonder at all this world is in the calamitous state it is in right now, all BECAUSE of that god and that religion !! And look the religion THINKs it "knows this god" - thinks it has Christ truth - but actually just as He warned, that god of the bible is an imposter - not the truth of Divinity at all.....

Compare everything the bible says about their god - and lay it out next to everything CHRIST says about OUR FATHER the true Divine - we soon see that the bible god is not what He is revealing....HERE, is the description CHRIST gives about the true Divine.. From the ORIGINAL gospel of the disciple John :

The One rules all. Nothing has authority over it. It is the God.
It is Father of everything, Holy One The invisible one over everything.
It is uncontaminated Pure light no eye can bear to look within.

The One is the Invisible Spirit. It is not right to think of it as a God or as like God. It is more than just God. Nothing is above it. Nothing rules it. Since everything exists within it it does not exist within anything.
Since it is not dependent on anything It is eternal.

It is absolutely complete and so needs nothing. It is utterly perfect Light.
The One is without boundaries Nothing exists outside of it to border it
The One cannot be investigated Nothing exists apart from it to investigate it
The One cannot be measured Nothing exists external to it to measure it

The One cannot be seen For no one can envision it
The One is eternal For it exists forever
The One is inconceivable For no one can comprehend it
The One is indescribable For no one can put any words to it.

The One is infinite light Purity Holiness Stainless, The One is incomprehensible Perfectly free from corruption.
Not “perfect” Not “blessed” Not “divine”
But superior to such concepts.
Neither physical nor unphysical Neither immense nor infinitesimal
It is impossible to specify in quantity or quality For it is beyond the learning of knowledge.

The One is not a being among other beings It is vastly superior
But it is not “superior.” It is outside of realms of being and time
For whatever is within realms of being was created And whatever is within time had time allotted to it
The One receives nothing from anything.
It simply apprehends itself in its own perfect light

The One is majestic. The One is measureless majesty Chief of all Realms
Producing all realms Light Producing light Life Producing life Blessedness
Producing blessedness Knowledge Producing knowledge Good Producing goodness Mercy Producing mercy Generous Producing generosity

It does not “possess” these things. It gives forth light beyond measure, beyond comprehension. What can I say?

His realm is eternal, peaceful, silent, resting, before everything.
He is the head of every realm sustaining each of them through the goodness of His Will.

As we see, the god of the bible is NOT this Great Invisible Spirit that Christ alone reveals....Proof..?...Right there above Folks !!

Check out the bit Christ says that our Father is NOT a "being among other beings but is vastly superior" - then realise the BIBLE god, does actually exist it tells us clearly, in its "heaven" SURROUNDED BY ANGELS that constatntly sing it s praises !!

So obviously that one Yhvh does NOT fit this descrpition above where our Father exists in a realm ALONE and is NOT among any other Beings at all...

Check out the bit where Christ says my Father exists OUTSIDE of space and time - and then realise that the god of the bible exist WITHIN space and time -just read all those PROHECIES it gave to see clearly this bible god is tied intricately to time and space HERE and has set in motion a process that REQUIRES this time line to unfold !!

Again, we see clearly this is TWO ENTIRELY SEPERATE ENTITIES !!

Check out the bit Christ says do NOT think of it as being "like your god" for it is MORE than just a god, beyond your mortal ability to perceive !! Check out the bit where He says that words and descriptions are USELESS here as my Father is VASTLY SUPERIOR and the direct CAUSE of all that we discuss, making it indeed far beyond such words and descriptions !!

Check out the bit where Christ says that EVERYTHING that actually exists WITHIN space and time, does so because it was CREATED to be that way !!

Realise then that Yhvh DOES EXIST WITHIN SPACE AND TIME, and therefore we know that Yhvh MUST BE A CREATED ENTITY same as You and I are, and is NOT this SOURCE of creation that Christ describes above !!

Check out the bit - apropriate to this thread - where Christ says our Father receives NOTHING from anything - where He says our Father is ABSOLUTELY COMPLETE and requires nothing at all as it lacks nothing at all, as it IS the SOURCE OF ALL CREATION itself - and therefore it "wants" NOTHING AT ALL - it is FULLNESS in every respect, totally beyond such mortal notions...

And lastly Folks - check out THIS bit again and let It sink in very deep - Christ says that ATCUALLY, our Father

is impossible to specify in quantity or quality For it is beyond the learning of knowledge.

My Father is BEYOND the LEARNING OF KNOWLDGE - you can NOT come to my Fathers truth through these vain discussions - no words of man can ever lead you to His truth - no priest can ever give you this truth - no RELIGION can EVER give you this truth - He just told you (all) - our Father is truly BEYOND any such ACADEMIC LEARNING - you do not finds His truth written in religious books - you do not gain His truth listening to men speak their Sunday sermons in church - you do not gain His truth by never ending debates and arguments about religious confusion !!!

You gain this truth ONLY by following Christ as He advised - and that my friends means you must first come right away from all these PRECONCEPTIONS of "spiritual truth" taught to you in error by a religion that has no actual truth to give you !!

My Father is not that religious Jewish god - my Father is something far far FAR beyond ANYTHING you can comprehend with this broken mortal mind... It is BEYOND ACADEMIC KNOWLDGE - nobody can "teach" you the truth of my Father...To grasp this legitimate Divine truth that Christ alone reveals, is a process of SELF DISCOVERY - we must follow His teaching - NOT the religion, that clearly does NOT HAVE A CLUE about this truth and which WILL lead you off track He clearly warned - but follow CHRIST - do as He advised, turn from the religion and its enforced errors and false "truth", and start the process to actually BECOME HIM, just as He actually taught us to do...

Our Father is not that religious god of the bible - just read the description above - note the points mentioned - see for sure the two are separate entirely different entities - my Father exists in a unique realm OUTSIDE of space and time and is the direct cause and CREATOR of all that will come to Be within tie and space - the one we call Yhvh of the bible though, does indeed, exist WITHIN space and time and always has done and that is because it is not the source of creation at all, but merely a CREATURE exactly like You and I are !!