Be Strong and Healthy

[Altair]

Originally Posted by JustBe

He holds some interesting views (he eats everything)which tends to tie into why many of our older generation who physically worked hard and often ate everything, lived a more healthy active life.

That's a deeply generalizing statement. I know that the older people in my family, who also ate/eat a standard diet and were/are physically active, developed a number of issues because of it. Eating meat your entire life for instance can/will lead to specific issues, it has an acidifying effect and can lead to cardiovascular disease. Being very physically active throughout your life, unless you do it in a controlled environment where you correct your movements, will also create all sorts of issues. Go and ask or observe people that worked in construction, or have done gardening day in day out for many years.

Please lets not romanticize older generations. They're also the generations that gave the green light for mass production of unhealthy food. The ''Green Revolution'' (not 'green' at all!) in agribusiness (1960s/70s) is their invention. The trope of ''If it's old it means it's wise or good'' is a myth.

[JustBe]

Originally Posted by Altair

That's a deeply generalizing statement. I know that the older people in my family, who also ate/eat a standard diet and were/are physically active, developed a number of issues because of it. Eating meat your entire life for instance can/will lead to specific issues, it has an acidifying effect and can lead to cardiovascular disease. Being very physically active throughout your life, unless you do it in a controlled environment where you correct your movements, will also create all sorts of issues. Go and ask or observe people that worked in construction, or have done gardening day in day out for many years.

Please lets not romanticize older generations. They're also the generations that gave the green light for mass production of unhealthy food. The ''Green Revolution'' (not 'green' at all!) in agribusiness (1960s/70s) is their invention. The trope of ''If it's old it means it's wise or good'' is a myth.

Your right. It was a rather deeply generalised statement. I just couldn’t be bothered writing s book in that moment of my response. When your unwell and typing in a small screen like this phone of mine, I struggle a little, so I can see why it came across that way. Regarding your last comment. “If it’s old, it means it’s wise and good” that wasn’t in my awareness at the time of typing. I don’t buy into that myself. Not entirely. Although some one who has lived a long life and lived to a good old age, regardless of how you see them and what they suffer with, might show you more about suffering than just food and exercise.

Anyway I am glad your curious about what I wrote, rather than being dogmatic in your approach. Hehe

[Gem]

Originally Posted by JustBe

We are definitely, what we eat and how we move. There is a guy online who runs a great program. It makes sense in me that you can incorporate a lifestyle of activity through every day living. He holds some interesting views (he eats everything)which tends to tie into why many of our older generation who physically worked hard and often ate everything, lived a more healthy active life. I’ll find the video and post it..

From my perspective, which is a sports performance perspective, there are ways to balance nutrients to optimise physical functioning. If a person takes an 'eat everything' approach, they will be able to lose weight, gain weight or maintain a constant weight just through their calorie balance, but will not be able to achieve a nutrient profile that meets their needs.



I don't want to sound too clinical because the body produces cravings for the nutrients it needs, and the most important thing of all is to be sensitive to the bodies hunger cues. The problem for most people is their cravings are overly skewed because they have been exposed to a food environment designed by marketers who only want to people to eat what they sell, and eat it again and again and again, like an addict. For example, energy drinks and cola include caffeine to induce craving, and coupled with high simple sugar content, that is a perfect recipe for inducing a 'food addiction'. The cravings for the 'drug' become much stronger than the body's craving for nutrients. As a result, in the modern food environment, what people crave is different to what they are hungry for, which is why 'eat everything' is different to 'eat anything'.


It is easy to tell a person what to eat to meet their personal goal of losing weight, getting strong, increasing endurance etc, but it is very hard to re-establish a connection with the body's actual hunger for individuals who have 'become addicted' to food. Re-sensitising a person to actual hunger is very tricky because you can't really tell an 'addict craving' from a 'hunger craving', but people can re-connect with their body and develop a good sense for what it wants the most, and then eat intuitively. The body will start to crave colours. It won't crave any sort of food, but start to crave a colour, green, red, orange, white, or a texture like crunchy, juicy, slimy, or what have you, and as long as you get such sensations from whole unprocessed food, like a crunchy nuts rather than a bag of doritos, for example, as the body will crave after food with high nutrient contents to get what it needs the most. That's more like intuitive eating - not the same as 'eating whatever you want'.





Then there is chaos thrown in about 'toxins', 'acidifying', and 'cleansing' and 'detoxifiction'. There are no dietitians who talk about 'detoxing, cleansing' and so on (if you find one who does, thay are probably selling supplements). And really, that sort of thing is mainly practiced by vegans who already supposedly have a perfect diet. It is, at best, an insignificant aside which distracts people from what is important, and thus does more harm that good.


So Grandma didn't know anything about nutrition except what to feed the feed the family so they grow healthy and strong. She didn't know a protein from a carbohydrate or what a calorie is. My Gram could barely read. Her husband had to read things to her. She just knew, give them a bit of meat, some colourful fruit and veg and a treat. When I learned about sports nutrition, it's the same as gram's food. I only learned why Gram was right all along.


On the acidification issue: The food we eat is metabolised and that creates 'metabolic waste', which is filtered by the kidneys the peed out, mainly. The waste can be acidic, alkaline or neutral, but it all equally 'metabolic waste'. If you eat 'alkaline foods', your urine will contain alkaline waste, and if you eat 'acidic foods', acidic waste - but it's all waste that the bidy has worked to filter out.


An alkaline diet is the same as a plant based diet, so when they say the 'alkaline diet' is better, it is, but that's because whole plant food is healthier, more nutritious, than the processed/packaged junk which is is 'acidic food'. Hence the 'alkaline diet' is a myth, but it's a healthy diet. I suggest eating more 'alkaline food', not because it generates alkaline waste products, but because 'alkaline food' is healthy fruit and veg.

[JustBe]

Originally Posted by Gem

From my perspective, which is a sports performance perspective, there are ways to balance nutrients to optimise physical functioning. If a person takes an 'eat everything' approach, they will be able to lose weight, gain weight or maintain a constant weight just through their calorie balance, but will not be able to achieve a nutrient profile that meets their needs.



I don't want to sound too clinical because the body produces cravings for the nutrients it needs, and the most important thing of all is to be sensitive to the bodies hunger cues. The problem for most people is their cravings are overly skewed because they have been exposed to a food environment designed by marketers who only want to people to eat what they sell, and eat it again and again and again, like an addict. For example, energy drinks and cola include caffeine to induce craving, and coupled with high simple sugar content, that is a perfect recipe for inducing a 'food addiction'. The cravings for the 'drug' become much stronger than the body's craving for nutrients. As a result, in the modern food environment, what people crave is different to what they are hungry for, which is why 'eat everything' is different to 'eat anything'.


It is easy to tell a person what to eat to meet their personal goal of losing weight, getting strong, increasing endurance etc, but it is very hard to re-establish a connection with the body's actual hunger for individuals who have 'become addicted' to food. Re-sensitising a person to actual hunger is very tricky because you can't really tell an 'addict craving' from a 'hunger craving', but people can re-connect with their body and develop a good sense for what it wants the most, and then eat intuitively. The body will start to crave colours. It won't crave any sort of food, but start to crave a colour, green, red, orange, white, or a texture like crunchy, juicy, slimy, or what have you, and as long as you get such sensations from whole unprocessed food, like a crunchy nuts rather than a bag of doritos, for example, as the body will crave after food with high nutrient contents to get what it needs the most. That's more like intuitive eating - not the same as 'eating whatever you want'.





Then there is chaos thrown in about 'toxins', 'acidifying', and 'cleansing' and 'detoxifiction'. There are no dietitians who talk about 'detoxing, cleansing' and so on (if you find one who does, thay are probably selling supplements). And really, that sort of thing is mainly practiced by vegans who already supposedly have a perfect diet. It is, at best, an insignificant aside which distracts people from what is important, and thus does more harm that good.


So Grandma didn't know anything about nutrition except what to feed the feed the family so they grow healthy and strong. She didn't know a protein from a carbohydrate or what a calorie is. My Gram could barely read. Her husband had to read things to her. She just knew, give them a bit of meat, some colourful fruit and veg and a treat. When I learned about sports nutrition, it's the same as gram's food. I only learned why Gram was right all along.


On the acidification issue: The food we eat is metabolised and that creates 'metabolic waste', which is filtered by the kidneys the peed out, mainly. The waste can be acidic, alkaline or neutral, but it all equally 'metabolic waste'. If you eat 'alkaline foods', your urine will contain alkaline waste, and if you eat 'acidic foods', acidic waste - but it's all waste that the bidy has worked to filter out.


An alkaline diet is the same as a plant based diet, so when they say the 'alkaline diet' is better, it is, but that's because whole plant food is healthier, more nutritious, than the processed/packaged junk which is is 'acidic food'. Hence the 'alkaline diet' is a myth, but it's a healthy diet. I suggest eating more 'alkaline food', not because it generates alkaline waste products, but because 'alkaline food' is healthy fruit and veg.

Thankyou for the lengthy reply.

I wrote quite a lengthy response, in return, but my phone went flat and I lost it. Little annoying..

I agree with most of what your sharing.

I mostly have an open mind, intuitive listening approach to my bodies needs. Food fits into that as well. I consider things like animal welfare and how things are grown. I also prefer seasonal produce if it’s available. I’m more interested in the quality and nutritional value, according to my bodies needs where I am in my own age/stage lifestyle.

I’m currently eating vegetarian. I haven’t had meat in months but my body feels ok right now in relation to the balance and movements it’s doing. I’m educated in how to eat more consciously aware of complete proteins, when eating like this, so my diets inclusive of lots of nuts, legumes, fruit and veg.

As I mentioned, I’m concerned about clean, nutrient dense, alive foods. I just feel they feed my body with more nutrients and energy, as well as keeping my physical machine in good working order.

I’ve been curious of late about ISO whey products. Do you know about them? I’m looking at supportive foods to support my hormonal/collagen changes in this stage of my life. I’ve read that bone broth maybe the way to go for this. I’m looking more closely at my bones and skin right now, through both of these changes. If you have any good advice I’m interested to hear thanks Gem.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by JustBe

Thankyou for the lengthy reply.

I wrote quite a lengthy response, in return, but my phone went flat and I lost it. Little annoying..

I agree with most of what your sharing.

I mostly have an open mind, intuitive listening approach to my bodies needs. Food fits into that as well. I consider things like animal welfare and how things are grown. I also prefer seasonal produce if it’s available. I’m more interested in the quality and nutritional value, according to my bodies needs where I am in my own age/stage lifestyle.

I’m currently eating vegetarian. I haven’t had meat in months but my body feels ok right now in relation to the balance and movements it’s doing. I’m educated in how to eat more consciously aware of complete proteins, when eating like this, so my diets inclusive of lots of nuts, legumes, fruit and veg.

As I mentioned, I’m concerned about clean, nutrient dense, alive foods. I just feel they feed my body with more nutrients and energy, as well as keeping my physical machine in good working order.

I’ve been curious of late about ISO whey products. Do you know about them? I’m looking at supportive foods to support my hormonal/collagen changes in this stage of my life. I’ve read that bone broth maybe the way to go for this. I’m looking more closely at my bones and skin right now, through both of these changes. If you have any good advice I’m interested to hear thanks Gem.

Hi.


Whey ISO, I think means whey protein isolate. Because it is an 'isolate' (which basically means the lactose and fat is removed by additional processing) it is absorbed very quickly into the body, which suits lactose intolerant strength athletes who need a boost from heavy training. I take a whey protein concentrate, which is slightly slower absorbing than an isolate, but basically the same thing - top quality protein with a complete amino acid profile. You don't need an isolate (unless you are lactose intolerant) and whey concentrate is cheaper.



As always, if you can get enough protein from whole food, look into that first before considering a protein supplement, and in all cases, without exception, most of your protein needs should come from whole food. The problem with vege protein is, most veges do not contain a complete amino acid profile, and the protein they do contain is not absorbed by the body as well as animal product protein is. Hence, protein supplementation could be a good idea for many vegetarians.


Bone broth contains collagen, however, the body manufactures collagen from proteins. Even if you eat collagen, the collagen protein chain is broken into amino acids in the digestive system so the body can absorb them, and the body would 'rebuild' collagen according to its needs. The issue then becomes, nutrition and metabolism is a synergy - no one nutrient works in isolation - all the nutrients work together to make the metabolism work. For example, the body struggles to produce adequate collagen when it's low on vitamins - so take bone broth in a vege soup (how healthy and comforting is that), but there is absolutely no point in taking a collagen supplement, and there is no point taking any supplements unless your real food diet is well balanced first. In short - drinking bone broth does not 'increase collagen' (but that soup does sound darn good).


For hormone balance it is important to eat enough fat including omega 3, and the research I have read says vege fat from olive oil, nuts, avocado etc are all very good. Omega 3 is tricky for vegetarians... basically the body doesn't process plant ALA omegas well at all. Fat is also needed for good skin and healthy bones... Indeed, fat is essential for the entire nutrient/metabolic process (yet another reason why frugarianism is plain wrong!).


This is my opinion based on what you have said. Keep the 'eat everything' philosophy and don't restrict to an a rule like (... "but I am a vegetarian"). It is only my opinion, and it is not a recommendation or even a suggestion, because the most important thing is, you are the boss of you! The reason I say this is because you raised protein, hormones, skin health and hair, and bone health. I think it is good to reduce or even eliminate heavy red meat and go for the vege nutrition in a big way, but I also feel that including a fillet of salmon into the mix would be a lighter way to give you a boost in quality protein and healthy fat along with high calcium too address the issues you have raised, reduce the need you may have for protein supplement, and getting higher protein along with a complete vitamin and mineral profile will enable the body to produce enough collagen.


On the bone broth this article: https://nutritionstudies.org/drinkin...or-just-a-fad/

[Altair]

When there's a will there's a way, Gem. And it depends on why one is a vegetarian as well. For example, suppose someone is eating meat ''just because'' of a fitness goal, whilst said person at the same time experiences cognitive dissonance between eating habits and personal values is, for the sake of mental health, just not a good way to go. JustBe already mentioned she knows where to get her protein from. Hundreds of millions of people throughout history have been vegetarian. It's fine, and we are capable of achieving old age in good health.

Eating salmon is not an environmentally friendly solution. That too, should be taken into account, considering the widespread loss of biodiversity and overfishing. Sustainable fishing is pretty much a myth, and there's plenty of issues with farmed salmon as well.

[JustBe]

Originally Posted by Gem

Hi.


Whey ISO, I think means whey protein isolate. Because it is an 'isolate' (which basically means the lactose and fat is removed by additional processing) it is absorbed very quickly into the body, which suits lactose intolerant strength athletes who need a boost from heavy training. I take a whey protein concentrate, which is slightly slower absorbing than an isolate, but basically the same thing - top quality protein with a complete amino acid profile. You don't need an isolate (unless you are lactose intolerant) and whey concentrate is cheaper.



As always, if you can get enough protein from whole food, look into that first before considering a protein supplement, and in all cases, without exception, most of your protein needs should come from whole food. The problem with vege protein is, most veges do not contain a complete amino acid profile, and the protein they do contain is not absorbed by the body as well as animal product protein is. Hence, protein supplementation could be a good idea for many vegetarians.


Bone broth contains collagen, however, the body manufactures collagen from proteins. Even if you eat collagen, the collagen protein chain is broken into amino acids in the digestive system so the body can absorb them, and the body would 'rebuild' collagen according to its needs. The issue then becomes, nutrition and metabolism is a synergy - no one nutrient works in isolation - all the nutrients work together to make the metabolism work. For example, the body struggles to produce adequate collagen when it's low on vitamins - so take bone broth in a vege soup (how healthy and comforting is that), but there is absolutely no point in taking a collagen supplement, and there is no point taking any supplements unless your real food diet is well balanced first. In short - drinking bone broth does not 'increase collagen' (but that soup does sound darn good).


For hormone balance it is important to eat enough fat including omega 3, and the research I have read says vege fat from olive oil, nuts, avocado etc are all very good. Omega 3 is tricky for vegetarians... basically the body doesn't process plant ALA omegas well at all. Fat is also needed for good skin and healthy bones... Indeed, fat is essential for the entire nutrient/metabolic process (yet another reason why frugarianism is plain wrong!).


This is my opinion based on what you have said. Keep the 'eat everything' philosophy and don't restrict to an a rule like (... "but I am a vegetarian"). It is only my opinion, and it is not a recommendation or even a suggestion, because the most important thing is, you are the boss of you! The reason I say this is because you raised protein, hormones, skin health and hair, and bone health. I think it is good to reduce or even eliminate heavy red meat and go for the vege nutrition in a big way, but I also feel that including a fillet of salmon into the mix would be a lighter way to give you a boost in quality protein and healthy fat along with high calcium too address the issues you have raised, reduce the need you may have for protein supplement, and getting higher protein along with a complete vitamin and mineral profile will enable the body to produce enough collagen.


On the bone broth this article: https://nutritionstudies.org/drinkin...or-just-a-fad/

Thankyou. It was insightful and helpful reading this.
I have some new subtle aspects of nutrition I was overlooking, so it’s made my awareness build a few more pieces to this stage of my life food and health awareness.

I am conscious of fat. I try to include nuts, avocado and olive oil daily. As well as flaxseeds and linseeds. A few weeks ago while in Tasmania I had a strong craving for lots of fish, so I ate lots. Maybe your suggestion about salmon included more regularly, could have been why I had strong craving to eat it every meal while there. My body was screaming for it. Anyway it was the perfect place to source and eat it. I do wonder about farmed salmon. It doesn’t seem to be the ideal source. Mainly because so many are crammed together in those tanks. I wonder about the “safe and clean” Concerns in me.

I’m going to look more into complete amino acids. I did 17kms on my first bike ride today. My body felt good. Not much fatigue or pain. I always look at myself when exercising as to how my body feels. It can signal some of your less noticeable nutrient needs. I’ll give you a picture of my diet see what you think

Waking -2glasses of water
Breakfast-smoothie ,usually almond milk,almonds, dates, blueberries, banana, mango. I add cinnamon, maca powder, green superfood powder, Vitamin c powder. Linseeds or flaxseeds. Sometimes chia seeds. I alternate that with a cocunut water avacado banana spinach smoothie with same seeds and powders. I’ll have some kind of good protein cereal like teff grain cooked with soy yoghurt. A little fruit added. Sometimes muesli or oats.
Lunch could be two eggs with salad olive oil lemon juice, or any left over legumes (mung beans, lentils, rice, chick peas),with veggies. I might stir fry veggies with tofu, tempah or brown or lack rice. I eat tahini on rice cakes for snacks. Or honey if I can source it from my local man here. I eat a little dark chocolate mainly organic with high cacao content. I drink lots of water. One coffee every two days. Herbal tea. If I go out I eat similar. I cook with onions, garlic, spices, a little sea salt. I might eat hummus with rice crackers with some meals.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by JustBe

Thankyou. It was insightful and helpful reading this.
I have some new subtle aspects of nutrition I was overlooking, so it’s made my awareness build a few more pieces to this stage of my life food and health awareness.

I am conscious of fat. I try to include nuts, avocado and olive oil daily. As well as flaxseeds and linseeds. A few weeks ago while in Tasmania I had a strong craving for lots of fish, so I ate lots. Maybe your suggestion about salmon included more regularly, could have been why I had strong craving to eat it every meal while there. My body was screaming for it. Anyway it was the perfect place to source and eat it. I do wonder about farmed salmon. It doesn’t seem to be the ideal source. Mainly because so many are crammed together in those tanks. I wonder about the “safe and clean” Concerns in me.

That's ok. If you don't think the salmon is right, then don't. Flax, linseed, chia is good enough. The body converts about 5% their ALA omega to th omega we need.

I’m going to look more into complete amino acids. I did 17kms on my first bike ride today. My body felt good. Not much fatigue or pain. I always look at myself when exercising as to how my body feels. It can signal some of your less noticeable nutrient needs. I’ll give you a picture of my diet see what you think

True. You will notice what your body needs much more when you are active. It gets a little bit complicated looking into amino acids, but there are essential amino acids we have to get from food. Veges just need to eat a range of nuts, seeds, legumes, lentils, chickpeas - and tofu and quinoa contain all the essential amino acids.

Waking -2glasses of water
Breakfast-smoothie ,usually almond milk,almonds, dates, blueberries, banana, mango. I add cinnamon, maca powder, green superfood powder, Vitamin c powder. Linseeds or flaxseeds. Sometimes chia seeds. I alternate that with a cocunut water avacado banana spinach smoothie with same seeds and powders. I’ll have some kind of good protein cereal like teff grain cooked with soy yoghurt. A little fruit added. Sometimes muesli or oats.

That's about the healthiest breakfast I've seen. I see some supplements in there which is fine as a 'top up', but not as a replacement for real food.

Lunch could be two eggs with salad olive oil lemon juice, or any left over legumes (mung beans, lentils, rice, chick peas),with veggies. I might stir fry veggies with tofu, tempah or brown or lack rice. I eat tahini on rice cakes for snacks. Or honey if I can source it from my local man here. I eat a little dark chocolate mainly organic with high cacao content. I drink lots of water. One coffee every two days. Herbal tea. If I go out I eat similar. I cook with onions, garlic, spices, a little sea salt. I might eat hummus with rice crackers with some meals.

It all sounds extraordinarily good. Just needs more coffee and lots more wine.

[Gem]

Originally Posted by Altair

When there's a will there's a way, Gem. And it depends on why one is a vegetarian as well. For example, suppose someone is eating meat ''just because'' of a fitness goal, whilst said person at the same time experiences cognitive dissonance between eating habits and personal values is, for the sake of mental health, just not a good way to go. JustBe already mentioned she knows where to get her protein from. Hundreds of millions of people throughout history have been vegetarian. It's fine, and we are capable of achieving old age in good health.

Eating salmon is not an environmentally friendly solution. That too, should be taken into account, considering the widespread loss of biodiversity and overfishing. Sustainable fishing is pretty much a myth, and there's plenty of issues with farmed salmon as well.

If people want to be vegetarian, that's fine. I don't recommend it, but I don't recommend any kind of 'special diet'.



In my case, just about everything I eat is to fuel a fitness goal and sometimes that is dissonant with other values, like eating veges is dissonant with forest clearing, soil degradation, river degeneration and the gamut of agricultural destruction, but ethics has the nature not of simplistic right and wrong, but of the dilemmas that arise between a rock and a hard place.

[Altair]

No it isn’t. The vegetables people eat usually come from lands cleared many centuries ago, and cause(d) far less harm than what any meat production does to the environment and to biodiversity loss. Raising animals means additional forests have to be cleared as the animals need to eat and drink too. It is woefully unsustainable, even more so in today's world and with today's population.

I find that pretty shocking to support all of that, just for some fitness goal and looking nice. You still eat plants as well, as do the animals you eat, so the large food chain you need to be sustained is much more impactful than any veg diet. And even if you were to hunt, it would be a niche market, and not sustainable practice for larger populations. Not to mention, that has other issues, ethical ones, by itself. This isn’t 20000 bc any more, we’re living in a highly populated civilized world and you and your choices exist within the context of the latter.