[Debrah]

Originally Posted by Baile

Here's the point and the difference Debrah: I don't use the self-knowledge of my conscious and awake state to "choose battles," and "crack the whip," and "push for radical change." I use that self-knowledge to consciously shape my diet, and grow my own food, and live my life in harmony with my surroundings. But people who make a show of judging what others do? Who would have others change their way of being in the world? Yes, you had better be very careful about projecting upon others, what you know and think you know, so as not to abuse your self-knowledge and power and wisdom.

As for "how little I know" and concerning this topic specifically: I am far ahead of the average person with regards to my conscious awareness of the ecological footprint I leave on this earth. And I am proud of that. But not so proud as to have to start a thread about it. Notice how I wasn't the one who started this "hot topic" thread. And I never would. I never would start a thread with claims about "blatant injustice" and "REAL human injustice." Because I also have the self-knowledge and consciousness awareness to know where these hot-topic-type threads always lead. Or this: "Even with absolute proof..." Neither would I start a thread to announce my "absolute" truth to the world. Because I'm not here to shove my advanced awareness of these issues down others' throats. I simply apply that knowledge and awareness to my own personal world, and live it.

It's all about what you do, with what you know.

( Life has a way of showing me how little I know.) My comment was an agreement to this statement and I think that philosophy can be attributed to just about any situation don't you think?

But here's a question for you. Is it absolute truth (or not) that the whole life experience of a little pig who's destined for being eaten, is one of misery and/or pain? Or a calf or a turkey or a meat dog in China.....? The point I'm making is that there are some things where there is an obvious and unavoidable 'absolute truth'.

I've made the following comment in the past, to people who use the 'it's their culture so we can't say anything' justification, where I've asked them the following. If they saw that every day, their neighbour kicked and beat the starving dog that is tied up on the front porch, would they just smile and nod and murmur, 'well, it's his culture', or would they say something to someone like either their neighbour or animal services? By the same token, if I know the suffering that pigs experience at the hands of those who use and abuse them, does it behoove me as a decent, compassionate person, to say something to perhaps prevent or at least educate the next person in hopes of encouraging them to abstain from participating in that abuse (by being the end user)?

On a personal level, one to one with my family and friends, I like to emulate a gentle and kind lifestyle with choices that give mercy to the critters. After all, fighting over the issue will only build walls and cut off communication with those folks so that even the best example is lost because you wind up simply not talking altogether.

But in discussions online, I am more than willing to call it what it is (in the politest way of course) because yes, I would like to see everyone quit killing animals for food, experimentation, clothing and entertainment. It's unjust, it's cruel and in my opinion, those are absolute truths. It is not about me trying to push my agenda on someone else because I have no church to build, nobody keeping track of my 'converts', etc. It is about me trying to save one more pig, one more calf, one more animal from the kind of suffering that most people don't even want to think about and wouldn't do themselves, by educating and informing.........

I've spent ten years educating myself on the various industries on top of a good working knowledge of large farm animals as well as small from years of personal experience, and what is referred to as standard industry practise (torture and mutilations). I've spent hours learning about the effects on the environment (completely destructive and we're going to pay for our appetites) and the harm it does to human health. I did those things and watched those videos and read those articles and at great cost to my personal peace of mind, for the animals.

Paul Watson once remarked that he has no hesitation about the directness of his words (and sometimes harshness) and his actions, because he's working for his clients, the whales. He once sank a fleet of illegal whaling boats in Iceland or Finland (?), went back to face the music and instead was thrown out of the country with no charges and he did that for the whales. Now while I'm more of a coward and wouldn't do anything that questionable, I can still follow his example and speak up for those who need another voice to speak up for them and especially one who knows the facts that surround their lives and their deaths.

Not everyone wants to do that and I understand that we're all different. After all, I'm not a Paul Watson am I? But if it's a choice between silence to save someone's 'sensitive' feelings over who they eat, and speaking out to tell that person who they're eating and how that being suffers, I'll speak out if the opportunity presents itself. I've often wondered how the German citizens felt when they were silent in the face of the roundups and trains that took helpless families away, never to be seen again. In this situation, I cannot let myself be like those citizens who were silent and looked the other way. We're all different and if you want to judge me for that, that's your option and that judgement doesn't make me in the least uncomfortable. This is my life journey and it calls for me to be a voice for them.

And here's a thought, if the sleeping person never hears anyone speaking out, how are they to ever awaken? After all, most veg'ns start out as meat eaters and then somebody said something which provoked thought which caused an awakening. And thus our numbers are growing and fewer animals are being born to die.