[Moonglow]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

Hi Moonglow

A few years ago someone asked me on this forum, "Is it not enough to simply exist?" Animals do. And prior to Adam and Eve being hoofed out of the Garden of Eden they did the same - they simply existed. Intellectualising is what brought us here in the first place, so perhaps we have it badly wrong. And they tend to live more completely in The Now.

As you know I've had a couple of near misses that could have led to me being put in a box by now, because becoming biodegradable is illegal. It takes so little to end it all, driving a car one moment then literally moments later a miracle means walking away from it. Or trapped wind puts so much pressure on the heart that it becomes life-threatening. That is a sign of my frailty but there are others who are much more frail than I. Yet after that and a few more traumas here I am still, which is testimony to my resilience. What we don't do sometimes is express ourselves in ways that express and acknowledge of our experiences of Life and how we move through it, we'd much rather flit around the subject and allude to ideologies and theologies rather than our own experiences and emotions. After all, emotions are demons, aren't they?

Everything is interconnected - our emotions, our humanity, our divinity..... What is human and what is Spirit but perhaps the most telling of all is what are the reasons it's either 'this' or 'that'? It is because of the relationships that Source/Spirit can understand itself more fully, because in a dimension of form it can see itself as being this and not being that. I believe this, you believe that and all the while Spirit sits there and thinks "OK, that's interesting" because all consciousness is consciousness just the same. It doesn't need brining down to earth because it's here already.

If we are going to evolve and develop then perhaps realising what is emergent is our own Spirit firstly as humans, the human Spirit that endures somehow and doesn't succumb to the "slings and arrows of outrageous fortune." Being the epitome of ideologies is fine in Spirit because that's all there is, but when 'real Life' has to be endured and that Spirit comes at often great cost, what then? In Spirituality this is what's forgotten about, we've forgotten that we have endured and come through this, and we are still here to tell the take. Perhaps instead of telling each other about ideologies we could acknowledge who and what we are for s change instead of avoiding it.

What is the Spirituality beyond Spirituality? Beyond the ideologies and theologies, what lies there? Many years ago there would have been Spirituality of some description because the inner Spirituality that became religion came from humans, not God. It wasn't until people came together as a group that the human influences steered inner Spirituality towards a religious and ritualistic Spirituality. While some would say that Spirituality comes from religion and religious practices, if it wasn't there in the first place it couldn't have been emergent. If you don't have Spirituality in the first place it can't suddenly appear from nowhere. If that's the case, what does that mean?

Religion is outdated because ritualistic practices don't fit into today's Lifestyles any more but Spiritual development and evolution do take place. What people find in Spirituality - and I don't mean the ideologies and theologies - can be just as easily elsewhere. And without all the layers that Spirituality dresses itself in. What has becomee outdated is the mindset that Spiritual people cling to.

Hi Greenslade,

Lol, emotions are not demons. We are emotional beings. If recent studies are accurate it seems we are not the only beings with emotions. As reflected in other creatures. They feel pain, loss, anger, happiness, and the like.

Emotions, for me, are indicators how things are going or how I may be perceiving the "vibe" of another or myself. Without emotions, would think we would be just void of feeling anything.

Emotions can change and fluctuate. Which may be what gets pointed at not only in some spiritual circles, but in some psychological circles as well. To find ways to cope an move on with life.

Religion was formed by humans to express and share similar beliefs, ceremonies, and rituals to bring a connection with the divine and in some ways nature (our own inner nature and what influence us outside).

When preferences were made in regards what should be whorship, who said what the best, how one should live, and God/Gods, then it comes off it gets a little screwy. Has this mind set changed much?

I think Spirtuality was there in some form long before religion. May have not formed notions about it, but honored and respected nature and may have had inklings of something being in connection to us and we of it.

So can agree religion arose from someplace in relationship to human developing a sense of awareness of ourselves and of our surroundings.

Things change. The religions in many ways have changed and splintered off each other. Even the main ones have altered. Sure some still cling to tradition, while others have broken away from the main power structure. But, they still hold onto the basic teachings of the faith and follow the basic rituals and prayers.

Global societies, in general, have changed. Information is more widely shared. With this comes wider ideas forming into new religions/spiritual teachings and practices. They stil, at thier foundations play off of what has been established through prior ideas and theologies. Seems the nature of the beast when formed into an institution or practice.

What is Spirituality at its very core? If being aware of our connection with Spirit and Spirit being the life with in, then it comes off that in this way it holds no boundaries. It is as one lives life and what comes forms it in a way that can be realized and related while living this life, IMO.

What gets outdated is when certain practices and mindset no longer work and/or serve. The people no longer tolerate it. So, uprise to change it.

But, fanatics still persist, divisions still remain, people get mocked and persecuted for believing what they will. The whole live and let live does not hold true for all. Just human nature? Preservation of the institutions? Pride and fear of admitting we actually don't know?

I can't say for sure, because I don't know for sure for the whole lot.

Perhaps it is not Spirituality that dresses itself up. For if it be life unfolding before us and Spirit doing what it will, then doesn't this indicate that perhaps in some ways we only fool ourselves? Which seem to go on and on.