[davidsun]

Originally Posted by Greenslade

I have no real answers for you, David. I could babble on about Karmic Obligations and learning the lessons but that would only be the booby prize. Somewhere inside I have to come to terms with feeling as though I want to nail someone to the wall and finding a way for my beliefs and ideals to actually have any real meaning and substance. And regardless of what any of us may want to believe or not, there was a Soul that had that experience. The atrocities have been happening since the dawn of civilisation but it's a past that's soon forgotten about, and they are as much a part of our collective legacy as all the Spiritual teachings.

In my final analyis, I have come to think/see/believe that the whole idea of 'forgiveness' is an ego-derived boondoggle - thinking that someone owes a 'debt' - to us personally, to society, or the 'God'.

In my view, 'Life' is 'free' - expecting/wishing/wanting it to e otherwise makes not real difference - no one really 'owes' anyone anything - the only thing that is real is response-ability (insofar as anyone is 'capable' in some regard).

We (some?) can/may choose to simply move on because they see that as being the 'better' (for themselves and/or for Life). I remember choosing to stop 'blaming', being 'angry' at, 'hating' etc. my ex-wife because I saw, i.e. understood, that such e-motions would only serve to tear her 'down' and I wanted her to be the best mother she could be to our daughter (because I loved and wanted our daughter to have the 'best' mother possible for her sake). I supposed I would have eventually (thought not as quickly maybe) stopped 'blaming', being 'anger', 'hating', etc. her because I wanted to 'free' myself from such horrible feelings n' e-motions and engage in more positive ones so that I would have a 'better' quality of life - because I 'loved' myself enough to 'give' myself that.

This is quite a different thing than 'lovingly' accepting a pedophile priest's 'confession' or a bishop's going easy on him (after he 'confessed') for 'the sake of' 'Jesus', 'the Church', 'the Body of Christ', or whatever.

Anyone who doesn't do what that he or she can to be 'corrective' in relation to (as opposed to simply 'allow') anti-Life acts - even if the most he or she can 'afford' to do (given his or her other life-commitments) is to make e-motional 'prayers' and send 'wishes' in whatever he/she thinks would be a 'corrective' directions - is remiss in 'simply' being accepting (forgiving :smile) etc. IMO. 'Armchair' 'lovers' and 'forgivers' of 'evil' doers do not have my 'acceptance' (forgiveness ) etc. at least - whether these be 'bishops' or holy folks of 'lesser' status, such as 'priests', 'renunciates', 'devotees' of 'love' or 'loving kindness', etc., etc., etc.

Sometimes wishing certain kinds of peeps (who operate in ways that are 'unsalutry') 'off' the earth as soon as possible may be a 'very good' 'deed', in my book albeit I would suggest wishing that they learn 'better' before they 'go' if at all possible (not making this a 'necessary' condition for the former wish to be executed) might be a worthwhile addition.