[7luminaries]

Originally Posted by Altair

Hey 7L..
I find this interesting. The angels are operating from a different 'dimension' but I bet they are also trying to make sense of reality.

Hey there Altair. Yes it is quite interesting, isn't it? Yes they are so, only from a much broader, deeper, more directly connected, and more informed perspective. Too, they are wholly different from us in their foundational existence and relationship to what is and What Is, and yet we can find common ground at centre.

My views on this particular topic most closely align with Buddhism and Jainism, in that the angels incarnate too. Perhaps some live in a specific form for many billions of years.

I have no views, LOL. Only experience. Those I deal with have only temporarily incarnated, i.e., as in moments, hours, or days. These are those we refer to as (I suppose) archangels. One I know has incarnated for a single human incarnation but that was a rare exception. We would say that they are energy beings not "made" for incarnation and with no need to reproduce. Nor do they require or crave physical, incarnated experience.

They were created outside of spacetime and "prior to" the creation of our individuated souls -- whatever that means, hahaha. So they certainly have been around for billions of aeons and have witnessed our souls' creation and certainly the creation of spacetime/all physical reality. They do not take a "form" for billions of years...you may have other things in mind here.

They are immensely powerful and can be our guides.

Yes and yes.

From our point of view some of these beings basically ARE gods/goddesses. They can help us and we worship and pray to them, but I don't think we can conclude that they are all-knowing, all-powerful Grand Architects of the universe..

No that is not at all my experience. You may have other things in mind here.

The transcendental guides are most clearly rooted in humility, transparency, and equanimity, despite their gifts. If we lack humility, transparency, and equanimity in seeking the highest good of all, it will be difficult to work directly with them simply due to our own dissonance. They do not resonate with worship; it is anaethema to them. They will and always have simply conducted or channelled all prayers to Source. They do not operate or fill in as a "personal God" in the common sense I believe you mean.

Now, if you read my post carefully (as I know there was a lot there), I did clearly state that they do not have the answers to the grand, unknowable questions. Frankly, no being does. Nonetheless they are absolutely tasked with oversight of the workings of the laws of the physical universe and all that lie within...ensuring the fabric holds and all that. So again you are not quite right on that point. They absolutely can explain the workings of the physical universe and much more -- and far beyond what we can grasp, if you got a taste of the mindbenders I have got in response to my question.

BUT as to Source "itself" or of That in its essence, of course, they cannot say why it is you are you and I am I. And if they could...I might actually fear them, rather than loving them as elder brothers.

There is no answer to why we exist as we do and as we are and in the specific relationship we have to those souls closest to us at our creation. And so there you go...so what of it? LOL

As for this current *universe*... it could be that the universe never had a *true* beginning but merely recreates itself, meaning there's no true 'creation', only the perception of it.. matter/form continuously changing, so to me, there is no ''creation'' as in the biblical sense. I don't believe the universe ''began'' either. It is our desire for linearity and progress that makes us believe there is creation or any beginning, imo. But 'creation' is just change, as is evolution. We put the markers on them imagining they have 'beginnings', but this reality of change and form is all about verbs..

I didn't at all say the universe had no origin. It certainly had a most "recent" origin in the Big Bang several billion years ago. What happened prior, no one knows and it is all speculation. Your reference to matter and form (and energy as it exists in this universe) are all bound by spacetime. That is, they are manifest creations contigent with (or within) the manifest physical universe and its surrounds. By its surrounds, I am including the dark energy and matter AND the antimatter.
All of these are part of what we experience as our manifest universe/spacetime and its surrounds (including dark energy/matter & antimatter). We know of no energy or matter or form outside of these bounds.

Beyond all that is where we can begin to speak of eternity, and that too is variously bounded.

What I said is that our individuated consciousness was eternal from its origin or "point" of creation. Our individuated consciousness was created outside of spacetime, and from that "point" of differentiation and individuation, it is eternal. It is not unchanging but it is persisting. The transcendentals experienced the differentiation of consciousness, or, the birth of our souls, if you will. There was a space where we did not yet exist as individuated consciousness. Then there was, and this "creation" set forth a relational mapping of souls, if you will, like stars in the sky. Some closer, some further from your particular soul.

But there was, is, and will be Consciousness in the sense of One. That, as far as we know, always was, is, and will be. And beyond that and our mystical, non-dual barest apprehension of What Is, we can say no more ;)

I didn't know that about Mandela, that people thought he was dead. Was there even a funeral? Could it have been a stunt by the white nationalists to make people think he was dead so there wouldn't be a fuss over the person Mandela..? I don't know. I've never heard about this before.

It only means that you are not aware of the massive change, mostly due to being born more recently and not having had the visceral memory of that time -- but thousands upon thousands...probably millions...do remember. Most under 30s or thereabouts will not have the visceral memory and thus may not understand the vast implications of this. Because the implications are so earth shattering that one's entire set of pat assumptions and reflexively cynical notions would be wholly upended.

Peace & blessings
7L