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-   -   When the Ego hinders the spirit (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=111452)

HealerW 06-03-2017 06:00 AM

When the Ego hinders the spirit
 
First let's talk about thoughts. For simplicity, let's define thoughts as strings of words from your native tongue spoken silently in your head.

The Ego is a specific thought: "I", "me". Whenever you use the word I, you're introducing your ego.

I like pizza. The Ego likes pizza. Your Ego is separate and individual from everything else. BUT, it identifies with your body and thoughts. The Ego calls the body and thoughts "I".

The Ego is in a war with the Self, which is the real substance of who you are.

The Self resides in the background of awareness. This background of awareness is seamless and continual through your life. He reason you think the Self ends when you sleep and begins when you wake up, is because you look at the world from the outside. So then of course the background of awareness seems to stop and start.

Try this: when you wake up, ask yourself who is there first. The awakened presence is the Self. But the moment thoughts start going through your head, the Ego is at his dirty business.

shoni7510 06-03-2017 09:06 AM

My understanding of the Ego and the Self from your narrative makes me think that the Ego is the Mind while the Self is the Consciouness/soul/spirit according to my understanding. I don't think the Ego is at war with the Self, they both use the body as their "own" and the three of them together makes "you". You see a human being is a tri-une being made of the body, mind and consciousness or soul or spirit. When the body is awake the other two goes to the background. At night when the body and conscious mind "sleeps" the subconscious mind and the soul comes to the fore. This is the time when they also connect with the superconscious mind (Higher Self) and you dream which is just communication with your super conscious mind the subconscious mind and the sleeping conscious mind. They work is harmony taking turns and there is no fighting.

sky123 06-03-2017 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HealerW
First let's talk about thoughts. For simplicity, let's define thoughts as strings of words from your native tongue spoken silently in your head.

The Ego is a specific thought: "I", "me". Whenever you use the word I, you're introducing your ego.

I like pizza. The Ego likes pizza. Your Ego is separate and individual from everything else. BUT, it identifies with your body and thoughts. The Ego calls the body and thoughts "I".

The Ego is in a war with the Self, which is the real substance of who you are.

The Self resides in the background of awareness. This background of awareness is seamless and continual through your life. He reason you think the Self ends when you sleep and begins when you wake up, is because you look at the world from the outside. So then of course the background of awareness seems to stop and start.

Try this: when you wake up, ask yourself who is there first. The awakened presence is the Self. But the moment thoughts start going through your head, the Ego is at his dirty business.



Use your ego wisely, don't let it use you. There comes a time when you can excel ego, go beyond it and reveal the ' True self '

peteyzen 06-03-2017 09:54 AM

The problem with spirituality is this; the real aim is to overcome the ego, which will reveal / allow us to realise our true self. But the tool we are using is the mind, the mind is a projection of the brain and is totally linked to the ego. So the tool we are using to overcome our biggest opponent, is our biggest opponent.
This is why practices such as meditation and mantra, which stop the mind `thinking`, are the way. The other massive aid to realising the self is getting aid directly from the divine (our true self), this comes from worship, (lowering the ego by getting it to appreciate there is something bigger which is also us. Other practices that help control the ego are ones that are based around humility, kindness to others and plain old love.

Miss Hepburn 06-03-2017 01:43 PM

HealerW,
I really enjoyed your post...well said. And welcome here! :smile:

Quote:

peteyzen:The problem with spirituality is this; the real aim is to overcome the ego, which will reveal / allow us to realise our true self.
But the tool we are using is the mind, the mind is a projection of the brain and is totally linked to the ego.
So the tool we are using to overcome our biggest opponent, is our biggest opponent. LOL! :thumbsup:
This is why practices such as meditation and mantra, which stop the mind `thinking`, are the way.
The other massive aid to realising the self is getting aid directly from the divine (our true self), this comes from worship, (lowering the ego by getting it to appreciate there is something bigger which is also us.
Other practices that help control the ego are ones that are based around humility, kindness to others and plain old love.
Excellent! Ha! :smile:
Worship is lowering the ego...this is a gem of a post.

We meditators seem to have the same perspective...and we all know who we are here...LOL! :hug:

HealerW 06-03-2017 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by shoni7510
My understanding of the Ego and the Self from your narrative makes me think that the Ego is the Mind while the Self is the Consciouness/soul/spirit according to my understanding. I don't think the Ego is at war with the Self, they both use the body as their "own" and the three of them together makes "you". You see a human being is a tri-une being made of the body, mind and consciousness or soul or spirit. When the body is awake the other two goes to the background. At night when the body and conscious mind "sleeps" the subconscious mind and the soul comes to the fore. This is the time when they also connect with the superconscious mind (Higher Self) and you dream which is just communication with your super conscious mind the subconscious mind and the sleeping conscious mind. They work is harmony taking turns and there is no fighting.


In my paradigm, I think the mind is the link between the Ego and personality. The personality encompasses all things relating to the body and desires, whereas the ego encompasses thought.

Lorelyen 06-03-2017 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HealerW
First let's talk about thoughts. For simplicity, let's define thoughts as strings of words from your native tongue spoken silently in your head.

I'd posit that that is an oversimplification. It could also be expressed as a flow of ideas, their logical (or intellectual) process on a canvas of time. Insights don't always involve strings of words but they may act on your ego (like in a case of solving a problem of some kind). Words are symbols for ideas/concepts.
Emotions are just as much a product of ego.

Quote:

The Ego is a specific thought: "I", "me". Whenever you use the word I, you're introducing your ego.
Like it or not you need it to be able to negotiate your way among other people and society. Without it you'd have no meaningful identity. It develops as your experiences are assimilated and you attempt to intellectualise their relevance.

Quote:

I like pizza. The Ego likes pizza. Your Ego is separate and individual from everything else. BUT, it identifies with your body and thoughts. The Ego calls the body and thoughts "I".
And...

Quote:

The Ego is in a war with the Self, which is the real substance of who you are.

Not necessarily, not at all. I can be very close to my Self but that wouldn't get me through a working day. It doesn't mean my ego is at war with Self. Quite the opposite. They are in harmony. What you're saying, if you'll pardon an analogy is that a core business ethos is at war with the procedures that allow it to function....could be the case but probably isn't. Ego derives from Self via a plethora of censoring mechanisms that bring your down-to-earth situations into focus. And it's initially through the ego that you receive the stimuli that become experiences.


Quote:

The Self resides in the background of awareness. This background of awareness is seamless and continual through your life. He reason you think the Self ends when you sleep and begins when you wake up, is because you look at the world from the outside. So then of course the background of awareness seems to stop and start.

Try this: when you wake up, ask yourself who is there first. The awakened presence is the Self. But the moment thoughts start going through your head, the Ego is at his dirty business.

But does it matter? It may do to some. It's good to ask these questions but in the final analysis you'll never get rid of ego unless you withdraw from society, like, for example, Abramelin when he did his retreat as a deliberate act to discover his Self.

Ego gets far too much bad press on this site.

...

HealerW 06-03-2017 09:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorelyen
I'd posit that that is an oversimplification. It could also be expressed as a flow of ideas, their logical (or intellectual) process on a canvas of time. Insights don't always involve strings of words but they may act on your ego (like in a case of solving a problem of some kind). Words are symbols for ideas/concepts.
Emotions are just as much a product of ego.


Like it or not you need it to be able to negotiate your way among other people and society. Without it you'd have no meaningful identity. It develops as your experiences are assimilated and you attempt to intellectualise their relevance.


And...


Not necessarily, not at all. I can be very close to my Self but that wouldn't get me through a working day. It doesn't mean my ego is at war with Self. Quite the opposite. They are in harmony. What you're saying, if you'll pardon an analogy is that a core business ethos is at war with the procedures that allow it to function....could be the case but probably isn't. Ego derives from Self via a plethora of censoring mechanisms that bring your down-to-earth situations into focus. And it's initially through the ego that you receive the stimuli that become experiences.




But does it matter? It may do to some. It's good to ask these questions but in the final analysis you'll never get rid of ego unless you withdraw from society, like, for example, Abramelin when he did his retreat as a deliberate act to discover his Self.

Ego gets far too much bad press on this site.

...


You'll have to forgive me for the oversimplification of these definitions. It's unfair to expect you to read my mind. As I agree with the whole of your comments, I realized I omitted the context of my musings.

As all concepts have their shades of meaning, I agree that Ego is both good and necessary in the most practical context. I had read several posts from practitioners of meditation who were having trouble. I hardly finished what I really wanted to say, so I'll try to elaborate.

When the aim is for the bliss state we intrinsically feel to be our rightful and eternal home, we must chart a definite course. The first thing that I would instruct anyone wanting to go deeper in meditation is to put thoughts and ego into context.

Thoughts are the buggers we fight against during this practice. And further, thoughts about the individual self cannot be of any benefit when the aim is to join with the Self, the All.

Yes, the ego is absolutely necessary to move about in this world, or as you say, negotiate yourself around. But in meditation, neither thought nor Ego plays a role. "I sit here focused on my breathing" may be true, but the utterance of it (silent or spoken) defeats the reason you are focusing on your breath.

The background of awareness, in short, is the only realization that matters. As a wise man once said (I paraphrase)... "The only good work one can really do is ask the redundant question, 'Who am I?'"

You are in Truth the background of awareness, or the man behind the curtain, if you will.

Miss Hepburn 06-03-2017 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HealerW
You are in Truth; the background of awareness, or the man behind the curtain, if you will.

Oh my....that is perfect!!!!
:thumbsup:
The Man behind the curtain! He made me aware of Him at 5 yrs old...
I mean 'Me'....looking out thru my eyes! Ha! :glasses9:

Cherrish 07-03-2017 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorelyen
...

Ego gets far too much bad press on this site.

...


It does indeed - not that one needs to cultivate ego. IMO, the real problem is when the ego thinks it is in charge. That, to me, is what the OP is really about.

Things really begin to click when ego is put in service of Spirit, IME.


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