"all is one" and logic
 

Hello all.
If "all is one" is a reality generated by logic, then logic also generates the conclusion that this is not a reality which can be experienced as an objective reality--since to do so requires the observer to be separate from the observed(?)
So the logic of the statement also means that the reality of the statement cannot be experienced by separation but can be experienced upon inclusion.
Suggestion that inclusion IS the experience.

Bit like the difference between knowing all there is to know about a rail network and actually riding the rails.
petex

Logic does not seem to be the basis of the idea "All is One". In fact the idea flies in the face of our actual experience of things as very convincingly separate. A sort of madness really, probably made up by someone who was fed up with practise and wanted an easy way out:)

Hello all.

Reference to the suggestion in opening post that inclusion is the experience, further suggestion that inclusion "itself" needs to have a basis in reality for that experience to become evident. That is to say that inclusion needs to be demonstrable, demonstrably harmonious with wholeness. A yet further suggestion is that what is not harmonious with wholeness is rather like "sin".--indicating that inclusion has been abandoned, at least temporarily until such time as inclusion is once more made demonstrable. petex

Who, one can ask, made the suggestion that 'all is one' is a reality generated by logic?

Obviously by someone who has never experienced submergence into oneness.

If there is anything I do know it is that 'all is one'.

This knowledge or understanding, of oneness, once experienced is overwhelming. This moment, experienced by me at the age of 20, out of the blue and together with two other 'mystically imparted' pieces of information (I can think of no other words to use) changed my life forever and I still live that moment today.

Hello all.

My hand is up Busby. The thought came to my mind, I do not know for sure but think very probably not exclusively to my mind for I imagine many may have thought similarly that the statement "all is one" seems a logically self sufficient--for want of a better way of expression--statement which indicates "all is one" as reality.--perhaps "indicates" would have been a better word to use than "generates"as I used in the first post.--that's hindsight for you. I live and learn.

I cannot say if I have experienced the oneness as you describe yourself as having experienced. With respect, whilst not doubting that you experienced something, neither do I know if the oneness you describe as having experienced is actually oneness.

For my part I am content to be guided by what seems to me to be logic and to try to keep riding the rails.
petex

Once again I have made the same mistake by 'opening up'. This experience (one of a number) of which I speak doesn't go down favourably with most people. I usually avoid talking about my experiences unless I'm in the company of those who are in the same position as myself and know what I'm talking about - and there are such people - collected over 60 years or so who also understand that this thing we call 'spiritual' has nothing to do with any religion but is part of a completely normal universal environment.

i don't see how you've made a mistake Busby.
your "conclusion" seems to agree with that of weareunity,
you've merely approached the realization somewhat differently.

Agree with H:O:R:A:C:E fwiw

Hello Busby.
I am truly sorry that I have put together my reply to your post--4 I think--in such a way that it has upset you. Certainly I was trying to convey my thoughts candidly and clearly--but with respect.

We each and all have experiences which have shaped our lives and which are important to us--and about which we rarely speak because it is often not easy to find supportive and sympathetic situations in which to do so.

Again, my apologies if my reply has put you off doing so when actually I would be interested to be told of your experience. petex

Weareunity, hello: I'm not upset, no need to apologise for what you see. I was/am merely defending my experience. I don't want to go into details as I quickly learned, all those years ago, that the wrong picture is created in the minds of people who haven't had the fortune of transcending moments. Nor could I answer any questions simply because there are not the words to describe these few or many seconds of understanding.
This moment has, fortunately for me, been confirmed in other unusual and incredible ways. I've written them all down so that my children and grandchildren have an opportunity to ponder upon the wonder and strangeness of being alive.