THE UNCONSCIOUS MIND.
 

THE UNCONSCIOUS MIND.

I've been doing a lot of reading and discussing about consciousness in order to try and heal my symptoms. It occurred to me this morning that I may be trying to apply a hammer to my unconscious mind. I might be trying to force it.
The internet is full of 'self-help' sites and advice. They all concentrate upon the consciousness, positive thinking etc. My insight is that I might be overloading my poor unconscious self and thus making myself ill that way.

They say that the self is 90% unconscious. I might be trying to force too much consciousness upon it. It makes me wonder how spiritual practice or religion affects the unconsciousness???

I would say "mental overload" is the modern illness problem for society in general. One can see it in the way many people approach spirituality: all thinking and intellect and conceptualizing, and no practical action and self-development work. It really is this simple: a very real walk in the woods and observing nature, is much more healing than abstract theorizing online about how to manifest (fill in the blank) in one's life.

You relate to Jesus. Feel the love that Jesus spoke of. Share that love with the world. That's all you need to do, that's healing. Past that, don't spend mental energy trying to figure out all the abstract ideas people discuss when they talk about Jesus and so forth. The mental aspect is not healing, and too much of it creates illness.

Leave the 'Unconscious ' unconscious, concentrate on the ' Now ' and like Baile recommended, spend sometime amongst nature, go and hug a tree or take a walk in the wind, it blows the cobwebs away....

The unconscious mind is rather unusual and interesting. I think my unconscious mind has picked up on my discontent with I AM and it has now made an issue of it.

In the sense that I am continually bombarded with accusations, queries and anger about I AM. Freudian psychology would make some sense of this situation. I may have suppressed my ego with all my worries about I AM.

It is a curious situation I have got myself into.

I actually clicked on your thread again because I wanted to acknowledge your first post. That's a brave thing to say, that working with "mind concepts" can cause illness. I was with a Christian cult for many years. I woke up one day, literally from one moment to the next, suddenly realizing that all that belief-intellectualizing was causing serious illness in me. It's a very real thing. Good for you to see that, that's the first step to healing.That's projection. You have started 400+ threads, posting your very vocal opinions on many subjects. You constantly attack and put down I AM followers, and new-age and Hindu philosophies. People online respond to others who loudly vocalize their critical opinions, that's the nature of social media. You are not a victim here, you are a willing participant who often starts it all off.

I don't post on many of your threads. It's only when you accuse new age and Hindu philosophy as being some sort of problem, is when I step in to "nudge" and correct you. A philosophy is never the problem; the problem is with institutions, and specific individuals who follow the philosophy, and what they do with it.

It just occurred to me that I may have misinterpreted your comment, I am continually bombarded... If you mean your mind is being bombarded with these thoughts, directed against you, then I apologize for misunderstanding.

That said, I will point out that you are the creator of those thoughts, if you don't understand that already. They do not just happen; they don't come from outside you. You create them. And you can learn to control and transform them.

You can get out of your curious situation if you choose to.


" When this is, that comes to be; with the arising of this, that arises. When this is not, that does not come to be; with the cessation of this, that ceases "

Yes that was my meaning.

The 'bombardment' comes from my unconscious mind into my conscious mind. I know I can change this. It is however a slow and delicate process.

Why are you discontented about the beliefs of others?

Btw, it wasn't Freud who invented/discovered the unconscious mind.

But you are causing this yourself, the unconscious does what the conscious demands.
Positive thoughts, and uplifting ideas can help the unconscious change it's negative pattern into positive which obviously has a big impact on your life...

personally I don't believe that is a smart choice in the long term, but that is just me..

I do wonder if it is possible to be 100% conscious (as in enlightenment) if there is an unconscious mind which accounts for about 90% of the self.

most people don't want it, because you don't only get to look at good and sweet things. You also have to consider the bad, and the ugly.

'walk in darkness'.

[quote=Honza]I do wonder if it is possible to be 100% conscious (as in enlightenment) if there is an unconscious mind which accounts for about 90% of the self.[/QUOTE



How would you explain what Enlightenment means?

Buddha was Enlightened/Awakened and he certainly considered the good/bad/ugly, although he wouldn't have used those labels.

[quote=sky123]
It always amazes me just how many people claim to be enlightened when in the Eastern philosophies attaining this status is said to take millions of years.

[quote=Busby]

Not in Buddhism Busby, different Schools, different interpretations, but It's always "this lifetime" anyway because there are past lives, ( Rebirth) and they stretch into the past beyond all counting, so you're always living the present life.

Double Post...

In 7-8 years of being here at SF, I have never read a post from anyone claiming they were 100% enlightened. Claiming they are on the enlightenment path, yes. And I have never heard a spiritual teacher speak who claimed they were enlightened.

Please list the many people you have come across, I'd like to read those claims for myself. And I'm not talking about the goofy dime-a-dozen eastern and new-age "enlightened master" sites online. I mean people you yourself have met here or elsewhere.

I have read posts from people who start "Ask Me A Question" threads, claiming they can provide answers to any spiritual question. Now, those make me shake my head in laughing amazement, just like you, sure.

You are right. No, I have not read anything from anyone who has claimed to be 100% enlightened - but plenty who have said something like 'being enlightened' or 'those who are ignorant' and thus giving or wanting to give us on this forum the understanding that there are people who live on higher 'planes'.

My understanding of what enlightenment is, as experienced by those who speak of cosmic consciousness means that the individual human mind (and this is just one example) expands in such a way that the whole meaning of the universe becomes apparent either permanently or is re-callable. There are other reports but all follow the sense of a mind opened and 'stretched' into the business of the universe.

As it is I don't personally think that there are people who can be described as 'ignorant'; each of us is 'right' within his or her own perspective and condition. We are where we are in our personal world and can be thankful if, as a friend of mine experienced, 'the heavens opened up'.

Just as an added thought - I personally don't think this has anything to do with a God as we may well conclude to be the case - but belongs to a natural order of (in its widest sense) nature.

My trouble is that I trained my unconscious mind to reject any form of "I AM" in the search for selflessness. Thus my unconscious mind is defiant of any "I" including my own. It is a bit of a trap for me which I have sprung upon myself.

What do you mean Honza in selflessness? As in not selfish or Annata (Not self).

Nothing should be a struggle. Struggle indicates you are not on the path you need to be. In all honesty, it sounds like you need to accept that this I AM notion is not for you. It is just not your path this lifetime. Instead, embrace the beliefs you feel comfortable and at home with. Renew your relationship to Christian faith maybe, that sounds like your path from the many posts you speak of it.

As in not selfish.....

I AM is difficult to avoid. I pushed myself so far in one direction so that the only choice I have now is to accept I AM.

I think you are generalising when you say "nothing should be a struggle"....My whole life has been a struggle. So what is new?

When my life has been a struggle, I've always taken that as a signal to change my life. I have walked out of dysfunctional relationships, packed my car and driven off when it felt necessary, moved 3000 miles away and started my life all over. I have never allowed life to become an unhappy struggle for too long, I have always taken the necessary steps to change it into something better and more positive. So no, I am not generalizing. I am speaking from my experience.

Others will choose to do what they choose of course. Generally though, I would say the reason people spend years struggling -- staying in unhappy relationships is very common -- is because people tend to fear change, fear uncertainty, fear insecurity. I have never really feared change much. I would choose to be alone in a new place with little money, than stay with a partner I don't like just so I'm not alone, or stay in a job I can't stand just for the paycheck.

Changing one's beliefs is much harder than changing jobs. Beliefs and patterns of thinking have been ingrained for decades. But it helps to recognize what I call examples of "negative prayer". You just made two arbitrary, negative statements, and claimed them as truth. And by doing that, you invited both statements to become your truth and belief-reality.

More than that though, these statements have no basis in any actual reality. Where is this I AM that is so difficult? Show me a example of I AM in the world. Point it out to me, tell me where it lives and resides. You can't, because I AM doesn't exist. It is nothing more than an abstract concept born of the intellect.

"Alcohol is difficult to avoid" is a real statement about a real issue. It's still a negative prayer statement, but at least you can work to change your outlook because there is something real and authentic to work with. The double problem with your comments, is you are projecting negative thoughts about something that is not in fact real. The issue doesn't exist, other than in your mind. In other words, there is nothing difficult about it, at all. Rather, the difficulty (the work) is in changing the way you process abstract concepts such as this.

One more thing: many beliefs cannot be "proven". I can't tell you who or what Jesus is, or where he resides, for example. The difference is that healthy, constructive beliefs don't need to be analyzed and challenged. If one's beliefs are positive and life-affirming, that is all that matters.

Whereas negative beliefs and thoughts that create illness, confusion and chaos, do need to be challenged. And eradicated. There is no logical reason to continue to hold onto unprovable ideas and belief-tenets that do nothing other than create illness and chaos in one's life. To continue to freely choose to embrace concepts, beliefs and patterns of thinking that are damaging to one's health and life, is willful self-abuse at best and schizophrenia at worst.

I don't see anything wrong a little challenge, it makes people think about what there really doing or believing. Like do you believe something just because someone wants you too. Or do you believe in something from the heart? There's a good chance if you believe something just because of a fad or because someone tells you too. Your not going to be ready for the challenge or question. True, beliefs cannot be proven. But if you can defend your beliefs that's proof enough they exist for you

There is nothing wrong about conscious selfishness. Well intentioned selfishness has to be a good thing, how can you help others if you can't help yourself, putting yourself first in some situations gives you strength that can be used positively.

When you say you want to be less selfish are you doing this for yourself, to fulfill your own ' Want's ' ?

Any path has its challenges, so there is nothing wrong with "challenges". But again, there are healthy and unhealthy challenges. I quit smoking because my belief-path. That is an example of a healthy (and health-creating) challenge. Past that, I don't understand what you are saying here about "a little challenge". You will have to post an example of what you mean by that.

I was mostly talking about the nature of personal beliefs. A belief is something you choose, of your own free will, to believe. I said, if one's beliefs are constructive and healthy, then there is no problem.

But if one's CHOSEN beliefs are causing illness and chaos in one's life, then the question is why continue to FREELY CHOOSE to believe in such things? Why would someone freely choose to believe things that are hurting them? It is an act willful self-abuse as I said.

People are limited in their ability to act and choose freely. The ability to do so is something that needs to be hard won. People vary from very sophisticated and evolved to very basic and primitive.

if they hurt anyone there not good. There's countless beliefs that are set up for the gain of one person or a small group. Even some of the most popular ones are set up that way. I choose not follow them. It's a very sensitive subject as you know. Some people it's completely useless to even talk to about it. I am sure there's a lot of people who don't like my views on it. If they feel the need to question me on my beliefs, that's fine I won't get upset. At the same time I went back and forth with people thinking I was nothing but right but realizing after I was just dumb. It happens, I make mistakes, I am only human. That's how people learn. I guess what I was really meaning is there's a lot of people who talk this and that but they don't know what there saying ,maybe they need to listen and learn what there really talking about. With a world of different beliefs and backrounds, and if the person truly believes in something I just can't bring myself to say your wrong and I am right. It's not my place to judge someone else's beliefs.

Right, I see now.

Yes, that's not my position when it comes to beliefs that are damaging, destructive and harmful. I believe when it has reached that point, it needs to be pointed out. Negative beliefs can cause psychosis in people. I was part of a cult-like group for many years, and I have met many people who I would classify as mentally ill. They were ill because their ugly, negative, fear-driven beliefs had poisoned their mind and soul.

This is what happens in cults, and it is a real danger for people on the spiritual path. Negative, fear-driven beliefs can and do cause mental illness, period. And people who are ill like that, cannot see they are ill; that's part of the illness. And that's when others must point these things out. It's not judgment, it's trying to help someone escape the damaging and dangerous belief-mindtrap they've created for themselves.

how did you see what was going on was a negative thing?

Honza made it clear these ideas and beliefs are "overloading my poor unconscious self" and "making myself ill" as he put it. I would call that negative, and time to do something about it.

that's great to hear.:hug3:

rier New"][Ya know how sometimes you can't remember a work no matter how hard you try to recollect it? Then you start thinking about something else like, you're out of underware and need to do the wash, or why is your cat not eating her favorite food....and Voila! The word comes to you.

Your'e trying too hard, just relax your mind and try to think of northing, or focus on a simple shape in your mind.

You'd be suprised at how much progress you make and the speedy rate that you make it[/font]

Do you believe in the collective unconscious?