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RabbiO 21-02-2011 02:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nventr
What is the correct translation?


Without going into a long explanation of verb tenses in Biblical Hebrew, especially in regard to the verb "to be" suffice it for me to quote the Chief Rabbi of Great Britain that anyone who knows Hebrew knows that the declaration is future tense - "I will be that which I will be."


בשלום
Peter

Perspective 22-02-2011 12:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RabbiO
"I will be that which I will be."

Interesting. Thanks for sharing, Peter. Metaphysics (& the dimensions beyond what we're most used to) deals with "possibilities." I have heard God being defined as infinite possibilities.
What do you think?

Zenith 01-03-2011 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RabbiO
Without going into a long explanation of verb tenses in Biblical Hebrew, especially in regard to the verb "to be" suffice it for me to quote the Chief Rabbi of Great Britain that anyone who knows Hebrew knows that the declaration is future tense - "I will be that which I will be."


בשלום
Peter


The word אהיה is imperfect in its tense. Although this can be used to signify an action in the future, it can also be used of an on-going action. It can have a variety of translations.

The Septuagint translates εγο ειμι ο ων, lit. 'I am the one who is existing.' I think this is probably also the intent behind אהיה אשר אהיה. The phrase 'I am' in English can also relate to an on-going action, and if it were to be used with the verb 'to be', it would be rendered 'I am being that which I am being', or more simply 'I am that which I am' (which signifies on-going action into the future).

YHWH is the God who is from age to age.

Shim 01-03-2011 10:13 PM

There's a clip from a commentary on the Torah that I'm quoting:

Exodus 3:14 I am who I am (or: " I shall be who I shall be." The imperfect verb here is not limited to present or future time.) This answer to Moses' second response is the first formal presentation of the divine name, revealed first in the first person, 'HYH, and thereafter in the third person, YHWH.

Exodus 3:15 YHWH. The name of God is now revealed. It is a verb. It is third person. It is singular. And it is masculine. Its root meaning is "to be." It is generally understood to be a causative form. Its tense is the imperfect, and it cannot be limited to a past, present, or future time. Its nearest translation would be: He Causes To be.

Regarding its masculine gender, we must acknowledge that all the signs indicate the biblical Israel conceived of God as male. The terms for the deity are all masculine words. The word that became most associated with a feminine aspect of deity in later Judaism, "Shechinah," does not occur in the Tanak.

RabbiO 02-03-2011 01:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shim
There's a clip from a commentary on the Torah that I'm quoting:

Exodus 3:14 I am who I am (or: " I shall be who I shall be." The imperfect verb here is not limited to present or future time.) This answer to Moses' second response is the first formal presentation of the divine name, revealed first in the first person, 'HYH, and thereafter in the third person, YHWH.

Exodus 3:15 YHWH. The name of God is now revealed. It is a verb. It is third person. It is singular. And it is masculine. Its root meaning is "to be." It is generally understood to be a causative form. Its tense is the imperfect, and it cannot be limited to a past, present, or future time. Its nearest translation would be: He Causes To be.

Regarding its masculine gender, we must acknowledge that all the signs indicate the biblical Israel conceived of God as male. The terms for the deity are all masculine words. The word that became most associated with a feminine aspect of deity in later Judaism, "Shechinah," does not occur in the Tanak.


Shim,

Your are correct that the word "shechinah" does not appear in the Tanakh. And it is probably true that the Israelites on some level conceived of G-d in some manner as male. It is important to understand, however, that Hebrew has no neutral gender. Inanimate objects, like books and chairs and rocks, all have gender pronouns.

As for אהיה, while Zenith is correct that biblical Hebrew verse tenses are basically defined as either perfect or imperfect, and while it is also so that some debate still lingers on how to translate the text, the occurrences of the word directly before and after Exodus 3:14 are definitely future tense - as are almost uses of the word in Jewish scripture.

The other important point is that neither in modern Hebrew nor in biblical Hebrew is there a word for "is".

בשלום
Peter

athribiristan 02-03-2011 05:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perspective
Hi SeaZen,
Thanks for your encouragement.
I bought & started reading Eckhart Tolle's book, "The Power of Now" - & it's good, but I haven't finished it yet... I keep getting distracted with other good books.

One thing he wrote that created a perspective change is his explanation of "I am"... It really hit me when I was preparing to teach about how Jesus taught "I am the truth, the way, the light"... & I thought, yeah, "I am!" Not to be self-righteous, but going along with what Jesus said about the kingdom of God being within.
If you remember or think of any new ways of resonating, please share.



YES!!! I am the Light.....and so are you. God is in every one of us. We ARE God.

I am you are God is me.

DivineLove 02-03-2011 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by athribiristan
YES!!! I am the Light.....and so are you. God is in every one of us. We ARE God.

I am you are God is me.


Arthribiristan,

I mean this most gently, and with some humor.

When you say that you and me, we are God. How many Universes are you and me sustaining?

If you are God, which Universes have you created, or are sustaining?

(Amilius, sorry for the plagiarism, but that post you left, was pure GOLD. I've gotta "borrow" a portion, in order to illustrate this point! :hug:)

I would agree with you, that our consciousness, our souls, are from the same common Source, created by God. I would go so far, as to agree with you, that we are a part of God, little tiny divine sparks, of divine potential.

But being a part of God, and BEING God, I believe those to be 2 different things entirely.

Perspective 04-03-2011 06:01 PM

Athrisbistan,
Thanks for your comment.

DivineLove,
The way I see it is... the kingdom of God is within (according to Jesus & in most people's experience). So the way to experience God is within us...
Yes, there is part of us that is temporal, carnal & egotistical...
But the eternal part is made of God stuff.

= =
I mentioned a book, "Putting on the Mind of Christ" (by Jim Marion)...
& have been looking through it for different ways to interpret scriptures...
I'll share some from it, but with my own input as well.
Quote:

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth & the life: no man cometh unto teh Father, but by me" - John 14:6
The way to the kingdom of God within (Higher conciousness) is Jesus' example - what he did physically, we do spiritually!
Quote:

And be not conformed to this world; but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, tha tye may prove what is that good, & acceptable, & perfect, will of God. - Romans 12:2
Overall, I'm grateful for many high standards I was taught religiously, (despite depressing shame) - because it was a good foundation - until I learned more...
The values that are of God should not be thrown out just because i have a more open mind of "good" & "evil."
Putting on the mind of CHrist is realizing the higher law (the spirit within not just external rituals/appearance) - living in harmony with reason & intuition to do our best in doing God's will.
Quote:

"Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God." - 1 Cor 2:12
"But the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned." - 1Cor 2:14
"Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus." - Phil 2:5

Christ Consciousness is the goal of the Christian spiritual path.

thewordofgod 06-03-2011 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perspective
Occasionally, I'll read a scripture & discover a new meaning (new to me :wink: ).
Like John 3:5...

I've always interpreted this to refer to baptism & the spirit & I can see the symbolism & possible related resonance/feeling associated with baptism. Yet, just now, I thought about how our bodies are mostly made of water & how we are nurtured & born of our mother's water or amniotic fluid.

Also considering the many who never are baptized (& yes there is the argument about lds temple work)... Everyone in a sense is "born of water"... then it's up to us to be born of the Spirit...

Now what does that mean?

Anyway... I would like to know if you have or come across any new interpretations of scripture. I realize there are countless perspectives, so it's fun to learn new ways of seeing things.


It's not up to man to be born of the spirit. How can any man know what a spirit is? Do you know what a spirit is? So then how can you be born of the spirit by your own will? Go back and read the rest of that teaching and you will see that that spirit goes by the will of God, not by men. If he doesn't come to you, then you weren't a chosen one.

Ephesians 1:
3: Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places,
4: even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him.
5: He destined us in love to be his sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will,

Romans 8:
28: We know that in everything God works for good with those who love him, who are called according to his purpose
29: For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the first-born among many brethren.
30: And those whom he predestined he also called and those whom he called; he also justified; and those whom he justified; he also glorified.

I Corinthians 1:
25: For the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26: For consider your call, brethren; not many of you were wise according to worldly standards, not many were powerful, not many were of noble birth;
27: but God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise, God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong,
28: God chose what is low and despised in the world, even things that are not, to bring to nothing things that are
,

29: so that no human being might boast in the presence of God.

Royalite 07-03-2011 12:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thewordofgod
It's not up to man to be born of the spirit. How can any man know what a spirit is? Do you know what a spirit is? So then how can you be born of the spirit by your own will? Go back and read the rest of that teaching and you will see that that spirit goes by the will of God, not by men. If he doesn't come to you, then you weren't a chosen one.



Your words remind me of a certain sect of Christianity that I read about called the Cathars. They believed that some people were born good and others bad. Some were destined for heaven and others not.



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