When all desires and wants fall away

[naturesflow]

When all desires and wants fall away, we open deeper to a state of being, clear/unattached, to allow life to fill us, guide us, direct us in everyway, where we only have to listen deeper.

As we move through our day, we trust fully we are taken care of, supported and loved.
"there is nothing I shall want".....

As we enter into the unknown where life no longer sees us striving, seeking to attain, desire and want, we learn to trust in the process of life...Life moves me, I accept graciously all that I am and what the world gives to me to see more, deepen and experience more of life as it can be. Not as I desire it to be or want it to be, but more what life calls to me to experience.

The mind no longer controlling the will to survive, to feed us in some way, provide and take care of us in all things.Living in your own state of abundance, the true and open state connected to all life in you.

We are taken care of.

We as life are supported, because we support all life in us. Nothing is left out. It is the way of life.

Yet everything eventually falls away, to allow and open to each moment and what it brings in everyway of life...I no longer attach to outcome, need or desire... I learn to just be, to let go and allow life to move me and guide me to what I already know/don't know I need.

I trust in life. I trust in myself as that life.

I move with life as I am.

[Dwerg]

It's indeed a great pain to constantly want more, to feel the nagging need. Feeling like nothing is ever enough, what one has is not good enough. However what does one actually need to be satisfied, what would it truly take to be happy? That's the question that shed light on the truth about endless desire, there's no happiness achieved by the stressful chase for more. Rather it's giving up more and having gratitude for what one already has that brings about happiness. There's abundance because one realizes that one already has more than enough. This doesn't imply it's "wrong" or shameful to want more, only that more isn't worth it if it's at the cost of current happiness.

The wants are still there, but they don't make or break my happiness. My mind serves my heart, not the other way around. It's to work for what pleases the heart, what makes me and others feel good. Not achieve some pointless goal at the expense of my love for life.

Any goal worthy of being pursued it's purpose should be to make people including myself to feel good. I'm done with being the doormat only there for others satisfaction, but I'm also done with only seeking satisfaction selfishly only for me. It it is damn well possible to find a way that satisfies several people at once, my desire is to constantly look for or create that way.

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=Dwerg]It's indeed a great pain to constantly want more, to feel the nagging need. Feeling like nothing is ever enough, what one has is not good enough. However what does one actually need to be satisfied, what would it truly take to be happy? That's the question that shed light on the truth about endless desire, there's no happiness achieved by the stressful chase for more. Rather it's giving up more and having gratitude for what one already has that brings about happiness. There's abundance because one realizes that one already has more than enough. This doesn't imply it's "wrong" or shameful to want more, only that more isn't worth it if it's at the cost of current happiness.

Yes it is giving up more, I would agree with you entirely and living more in appreciation of what you have right now.

The realization that you are enough, allows for you to move through life more complete. Rather than feeling you need, desire or have to have something to complete you. There is only "shame" and *wrong* in the eyes and mind of the one seeing. Seeking is part of finding this realization. So everything serves to this point of understanding and deepening into acceptance.

The wants are still there, but they don't make or break my happiness. My mind serves my heart, not the other way around. It's to work for what pleases the heart, what makes me and others feel good. Not achieve some pointless goal at the expense of my love for life.

We still are engaged in life that requires us to move forward and outward into a life of creation, its unavoidable. But its is what drives you outward and in your creation that will reveal how your being driven. Yes the heart leading the mind It puts much into perspective.

Any goal worthy of being pursued it's purpose should be to make people including myself to feel good. I'm done with being the doormat only there for others satisfaction, but I'm also done with only seeking satisfaction selfishly only for me. It it is damn well possible to find a way that satisfies several people at once, my desire is to constantly look for or create that way.

Sounds like your opening deeper to the *we are all in this together* so even as we might want, sometimes the nature of the whole will call it to be shared with that in mind and heart. The true nature is self aware but inclusive of the whole, so naturally once you accept others in you as part of you in everyway they are, then what naturally arises is the driver in this way. Of course we still are able to utilize our own individuation and have our own needs taken care, but even that seems to take on greater feeling in the receiving anyway. Self orientated goals are fine, but any feeling of lack often opens the space of deepening so the feeling is a more inclusive feeling that moves itself naturally and happily, content and in joy of being.

[Rokon]

It sounds like you both are talking about obsessiveness, not desire. I think most people who have desire do not suffer from "feeling like nothing is ever enough". Desire can compel action. Desire to evolve? Desire to feel secure? Desire to be happy? Desire makes the world go round.

Natureflow, this state of being you describe as attainable, when desire falls away, sounds like someone who never desired to manifest to begin with. Do you feel that way? Like it was a mistake perhaps?

[Dwerg]

I would say it's about not being trapped by desire. Say what you need is to relax, but you think (emphasis on thinking by the mind) that you desire some specific thing. In this case the emotional signal to stop is ignored and follow the mind which is mistaken adding more stress on getting a thing that won't help.

The problem is then constructed by the mind, but it's just an obstacle to get to what is actually needed. It could just be bypassed in the first place by simply doing nothing and taking a few days off to just wind down. In this case we will have to let go of desire.

My logic is that if doing something doesn't achieve happiness then it clearly did not achieve the true goal, so then I either have to do what I truly believe will work and sometimes that's actually to do nothing.

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=Rokon]It sounds like you both are talking about obsessiveness, not desire. I think most people who have desire do not suffer from "feeling like nothing is ever enough". Desire can compel action. Desire to evolve? Desire to feel secure? Desire to be happy? Desire makes the world go round.

No I wasn't talking about obsessiveness. I was talking about what drives desire, obsession might be part of the view for some in their desire of course, but I wasn't specifically speaking about it alone. The drivers of human nature are as complex or simple as we create from, so until you undo your own patterns and see what is within the desire more clearly, you might never know until something hits home to show you what your carrying in those desires and wants. So this in part answers your next question. Undoing patterns through direct experience.

Natureflow, this state of being you describe as attainable, when desire falls away, sounds like someone who never desired to manifest to begin with. Do you feel that way? Like it was a mistake perhaps?

In your view of how this state is and you connecting your own sound to it, I would say that is not the sound I am listening too. Desire taught me how letting go of desire was, is and can be as a state of being so this is my own realization shared, so when something falls away from me, it means I held it and opened to let it go.. Realization for me is learning through the whole. I learned through desire itself. Is their another way to attain into a state of being ? So, no I don't feel the way you think it might sound. Mistakes are part of life to grow and build new awareness or not. So this mistake thing you brought up I am not sure how you relate it? Would you care to explain this further in all this seeing your seeing? Perhaps its something you expecting from me in opening to this realization? I am not sure only you would know of course.

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=Dwerg]I would say it's about not being trapped by desire. Say what you need is to relax, but you think (emphasis on thinking by the mind) that you desire some specific thing. In this case the emotional signal to stop is ignored and follow the mind which is mistaken adding more stress on getting a thing that won't help.

The mind is not entertaining desire this is true and in fact the source of your own creation when the conditioned state has realized itself in this way, you see your creation unfolding more in harmony with the law of equal balance in yourself. So your not striving as much as your walking aware of what is flowing more effortlessly. A state of openness allows for all things to fall away that strive and desire, and then walks more open to what is already created anyway through the seeds that channel the creation..

The problem is then constructed by the mind, but it's just an obstacle to get to what is actually needed. It could just be bypassed in the first place by simply doing nothing and taking a few days off to just wind down. In this case we will have to let go of desire.

Letting go often leads itself to opening naturally. So its about opening to yourself fully, listening, letting go and just allowing life to move through you to support you as you are. So how you are (as an inclusive state) yourself will reflect that support anyway.

My logic is that if doing something doesn't achieve happiness then it clearly did not achieve the true goal, so then I either have to do what I truly believe will work and sometimes that's actually to do nothing.

Life has many ways in which it moves itself, but when the mind is still and quiet/empty of its conditioned state, the nature of its true essence supports you as a whole being. People sit in meditation to attain this desire-less state of being, but for me its living it,being it carrying it into the world as a walking state. So every movement becomes you in this way in life, participating.

Doing nothing is part of doing something. We are participating and listening. So how we move is a whole host of movements. Not one way of moving. Stillness and nothing is movement, just not in the way we THINK it is moving.

[naturesflow]

When you see what is holding desire in you, the realization at that emptying out point is one where by, desire does fall away, you then see what you were holding it in place with, giving life to it in this way..

[Rokon]

Desire taught me how letting go of desire was, is and can be as a state of being so this is my own realization shared, so when something falls away from me, it means I held it and opened to let it go.. Realization for me is learning through the whole. I learned through desire itself. Is their another way to attain into a state of being ? So, no I don't feel the way you think it might sound.
I don't believe it's possible to be in a desire-less state like you described and I just wanted to understand how you constructed it. Even choosing to be in a desireless state is fueled by desire.


Mistakes are part of life to grow and build new awareness or not. So this mistake thing you brought up I am not sure how you relate it? Would you care to explain this further in all this seeing your seeing? Perhaps its something you expecting from me in opening to this realization? I am not sure only you would know of course.
In general I am curious where the motivation comes from to divide up and separate
Again I am curious how you, and many others, create and substantiate a dividing line between human nature and source, or the "whole" as you put it. Obviously your story in the OP seemed very meaningful to you. but to me it mostly sounds like new age cotton candy and I wanted to prod a bit to see if your story could be decoded, to see where it comes from, how it came to be. :smile:

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=Rokon]I don't believe it's possible to be in a desire-less state like you described and I just wanted to understand how you constructed it. Even choosing to be in a desireless state is fueled by desire.

Ok. I guess you could say it relates back to attachment. I didn't desire to be desire-less. It was an unfolding from desire that naturally opened me to have it fall away. I don't now walk around seeking to be desire-less, I am more aware that I am not attached now with desire in me, as I walk through life. So perhaps your correct in that I still seek life in ways to sustain me, but I am not living attached at the core desiring things to complete and keep that core alive in me in some form of desire. Cutting cords at the core relating to conditioning through desire or a feeling of lack in myself naturally set up desire to fall away. There was nothing left in me to attach too. So in some ways desire became the root of my fears that attached in feeling to something outside of myself that I felt would sustain that root and keep something alive in me. Which of course sets up the feeling of need/desire and separation and lack.

Then believing that something outside of me would complete me.

If I have this it will make me feel this, which will bring to me this, help me feel this, I like this feeling, I like this thing, I desire more of this thing, I desire more of this feeling, I desire to have this to sustain something in me. Realization-I am all this, desire falls away. In process, yes I have built the awareness of the whole in feeling through this process, but then it moves me into a deeper connection where by, I know I am all this. I was desiring myself in the external, in that becoming, to BE.




In general I am curious where the motivation comes from to divide up and separate
Again I am curious how you, and many others, create and substantiate a dividing line between human nature and source, or the "whole" as you put it. Obviously your story in the OP seemed very meaningful to you. but to me it mostly sounds like new age cotton candy and I wanted to prod a bit to see if your story could be decoded, to see where it comes from, how it came to be. :smile:

There is no motivation, just what was conditioned in me that created the idea and perception of myself and my own needs. The division in myself was very real to me in feeling, so naturally the patterns and undoing showed me where I was feeling separated and holding on to aspects like desire to keep something in me alive and separate. Of course I understand it as my own perception and feeling now. I set it all up myself. But walking through it you cant see and feel any differently even when aware of how it can be, until you let go of what is holding everything in place in you.

When I speak the way I do at times I am only speaking through the breakdown that I know can be and know doesn't have to be. The whole is only an illustration of process that I choose to use in my language to articulate the process. In my completion in feeling in me now, I just am being me and feeling complete. And as for human nature, I see through my own (perceived in feeling separation) that I was aligning myself, integrating myself in ways where I can see the breakdown, even as it is all part of the process and the whole. It is just where I choose to focus when sharing something.

I don't mind you prodding. I am trying my best to explain this too you as best as I can.

Not sure if I am succeeding in your desire to decode, but we shall see.

Keep prodding,either way you will either prove its cotton candy and be quite content on that feed or something substantially filling for yourself that could have you come back for more..

Again we shall see..:tongue:

As for desire now, I don't see moving through life and living it as desiring knowing how I was before. Now I feel, like I am more just living my life and being myself. My connection complete in feeling in me, and as I move I just use my whole connection clear to guide me through life. Naturally I seek to enjoy life, participate and engage. How you see my engagement and involvement in this way is about you and how you see and operate through desire. So if you see that I cannot live without desire, that is just how your perceiving it has to be through your own view. In myself I feel unattached to desire. I just connect and move myself through each moment as it is, more open and clear and it will be what it will be. This has opened a deeper acceptance and simplicity of being in myself. Naturally I seek to feed myself, clothe myself and enjoy things in life that are there for me to participate in. It is what it is though, nothing more, nothing less.

[naturesflow]

I'm not relating to the direction of this thread.
Do you desire to be "Will-less"?
It's ok to have desire. We need direction, purpose. At least I do. Otherwise we have directional-less stagnation. Desire drives you to change. Without desire, or wanting, who'd want to change anything? Who would want to evolve without desire or wanting? Maybe you mean something else or am I just too dense=Rokon

I found this post, which shows me how your interpreting desire through your own process.

You use desire as a means of change and goals, consciously. Its part of how you perceive we live, learn and grow bring change and build new ways.

Don't forget that I too used desire, which brought me to this place in myself. But now in the realization that I no longer hold desire, means I don't hold life the way I used too hold it in the way your still in process with. I wake up each day, meet the day as it is and move myself as life moves me. Your process and how you do it and mine how I do it, have more sameness in them than differences, just your more relying more on your physical desires, I suppose you could say I rely more on my spiritual nature, to lead my physical nature.


I suppose my view aligns more with Maslow's hierarchy nowdays.
https://www.quora.com/Whats-the-difference-between-want-need-and-desire-Arent-they-the-same

[Rokon]

I found this post, which shows me how your interpreting desire through your own process.

You use desire as a means of change and goals, consciously. Its part of how you perceive we live, learn and grow bring change and build new ways.

Don't forget that I too used desire, which brought me to this place in myself. But now in the realization that I no longer hold desire, means I don't hold life the way I used too hold it in the way your still in process with. I wake up each day, meet the day as it is and move myself as life moves me. Your process and how you do it and mine how I do it, have more sameness in them than differences, just your more relying more on your physical desires, I suppose you could say I rely more on my spiritual nature, to lead my physical nature.


I suppose my view aligns more with Maslow's hierarchy nowdays.
https://www.quora.com/Whats-the-difference-between-want-need-and-desire-Arent-they-the-same
Yea I'm not into the total surrender to a higher power thing. I sincerely tried a few years back it but it is not for me. I know it suits others. And also it is not so easy for me to separate "human behavior" versus "spiritual behavior". Thanks for the thoughtful responses. :smile:

[MIND POWER]

To live is to desire! when they go..? you are dead.

And its our desires that have been screwed with, somewhere in our ancient history.

Take me back in time, maybe i can forget.........

Would you care..? haha.

[Mr Interesting]

There is a thread right next door to here in Spirituality about what may be the differences in 'The Law of Attraction' and Buddhist and Hindu ideals and though I didn't read through to the end to determine whether the initial 'desire' to put in my two cents worth I did start to see that the posts were heading in the direction I would have been taking so I let it go.

This then could be one indication of not necessarily desireless so much as desire in a much wider field of play than one individual wanting something and getting it through the acquisition of an object.

But the other week I had a discussion with my nephew and he's a clever fellow with some skills and he wanted both my help and my approval to regard to a idea he had and once I listened to him it was apparent to me that there were a group of people he wanted to impress and he wanted to do it in the simplest way possible and while I could see this on the level of how I understand peoples motivations there was really no way that I could, at least not without a lot of time and effort, let him too see himself the way I did without breaking down all his constructions within his mind that brought him to the point whereby he could see what he wanted to achieve in the most significant light, which is, of course, my light, as to his actual position and requirements from the point of view of the fabrication of a want.

So there is out there quite a few people who say that all desire stems from our need to be at one with God and while this is a fairly straight forward statement how do we align this with a simple need to have roast beef on a sandwich and not ham?

One then is an end and the other possibly a beginning and between is actually that vast and amazing thing called life where all is possible even that we prefer roast beef on our sandwich when the only thing available, right where we are, is ham, so we are faced with meeting the need of hunger against the value of a preference or want to satisfy that need.

Some people could then say, okay, I'll take the ham even while I'm not especially hungry I feel like I want to eat and so I will whereas others might go 'I really do want roast beef and so I'll go find another place which might offer it' and so the need to eat is put aside over the want.

And there is actually a story of a chap who went to buy food and enquired of the butcher 'what is your best meat? to which the butcher replied 'all my meat is the best possible' and in that the fellow became enlightened... just like that.

Just now as I pondered a little my own life ceding away from a need to never mind impressing others but even impressing myself how impressive life actually is. I was thinking of how I'm moving towards just being a gardener and how much I've read here and there about how many years so many of the fruit trees I plant will take before they all fruit and yet every single fruit tree I've planted bears fruit almost months after I plant them... that's impressive!

But then again maybe it goes way back to when I started drawing as a very young kid and saw how I could do squiggles on paper and impress adults and yet I wasn't impressed at all... I knew almost exactly how far from what I wanted I was and that need to fulfil some obligation within myself to attain some level that may have not even existed may have been what started it all.

I do kind of remember though a forming appreciation of wondrousness, a sense that if I really tried and really applied myself to something occasionally on the edges of what I achieved there would be all these possibilities that would open up before me and, with that, I'm kinda really glad that desire came with early lessons on application and perseverance linked intuitively to ones own efforts veering all to often into frustration and failure.

[naturesflow]

Yea I'm not into the total surrender to a higher power thing. I sincerely tried a few years back it but it is not for me. I know it suits others. And also it is not so easy for me to separate "human behavior" versus "spiritual behavior". Thanks for the thoughtful responses. :smile:


No problems.
Total surrender is really surrendering to yourself anyway, the totality of your whole self, inclusiveness in you. So even as I say I let my spirit lead me, I am in totality of being me through all aspects integrated and integrating consciously into living my life. The versus your seeing, is really what your perceiving as something separate, when in the awareness of you moving and growing into life, its not about one versus the other. Its all awakening to reveal more of you that you may not consciously be living your life in awareness of. We can know we are mind body spirit, but are we living and being the awareness of it? In my view it doesn't matter how you perceive yourself, you can live through your totality of being with emphasis on your human behaviour but if your walking a more conscious path, even human behaviour will balance into your whole self in ways you may not even be aware its taking over more so than allowing other aspects of you to balance that out. So those bigger moments of surrender were more about letting go of human behaviours that were not in alignment in some way in myself

[naturesflow]

To live is to desire! when they go..? you are dead.

And its our desires that have been screwed with, somewhere in our ancient history.

Take me back in time, maybe i can forget.........

Would you care..? haha.


To live is to desire?

Is that the truth of you?

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=Mr Interesting]There is a thread right next door to here in Spirituality about what may be the differences in 'The Law of Attraction' and Buddhist and Hindu ideals and though I didn't read through to the end to determine whether the initial 'desire' to put in my two cents worth I did start to see that the posts were heading in the direction I would have been taking so I let it go.

This then could be one indication of not necessarily desireless so much as desire in a much wider field of play than one individual wanting something and getting it through the acquisition of an object.



But the other week I had a discussion with my nephew and he's a clever fellow with some skills and he wanted both my help and my approval to regard to a idea he had and once I listened to him it was apparent to me that there were a group of people he wanted to impress and he wanted to do it in the simplest way possible and while I could see this on the level of how I understand peoples motivations there was really no way that I could, at least not without a lot of time and effort, let him too see himself the way I did without breaking down all his constructions within his mind that brought him to the point whereby he could see what he wanted to achieve in the most significant light, which is, of course, my light, as to his actual position and requirements from the point of view of the fabrication of a want.

So there is out there quite a few people who say that all desire stems from our need to be at one with God and while this is a fairly straight forward statement how do we align this with a simple need to have roast beef on a sandwich and not ham?

Maybe when you align to god/true self in relation to food choices, you might be consciously more aware of the source of food anyway? It comes into my view for myself at least. So the choice aligns to nature in ways where you eat according to what feels right in that alignment. Nothing is left out of connection as whole host in me, it becomes conscious living/ Conscious eating. To me there is a totality of connection in this way of living and being. It doesn't stop at food choices, in fact it comes into the picture of conscious living in every way.

One then is an end and the other possibly a beginning and between is actually that vast and amazing thing called life where all is possible even that we prefer roast beef on our sandwich when the only thing available, right where we are, is ham, so we are faced with meeting the need of hunger against the value of a preference or want to satisfy that need.

Perhaps we hold a screwed view of god as lacking in some form to build this view? Choices come into life as it is as a whole host of course. Sometimes we have to be ok with what is there. Its a great lesson all round. To live more present with what is and be ok with that. If you look at people who develop a strict lifestyle of eating/vegans/vegetarians or other. People who make choices and stand firm, who will not budge. If the only food left in situations where you had no choice but to say, eat meat or perish, what choice would you make? Would someone in this way die rather than eat the provision nature presents to them to live? I guess it depends on whether you see yourself as the source of food for the animal or the other way around. Maybe you would just slowly perish and die and then allow the animals to feed on you? I guess either way, one stays hungry and the other feels more satisfied, life continues in both ways, just one chooses to change form perhaps in that moment? We as humans hold values at the core as well as personal taste preferences. My taste preferences now days seems to be aligning more with natures food than human creations of food, meaning I eat what I want to eat, not what the world tells me I need to be eating. Of course if I cant find what I want, I have to find ways to support myself in this way.


Some people could then say, okay, I'll take the ham even while I'm not especially hungry I feel like I want to eat and so I will whereas others might go 'I really do want roast beef and so I'll go find another place which might offer it' and so the need to eat is put aside over the want.

I personally feel food choices are conditioned responses in what we know and don't know. What we think we like and what our bodies have related to through a whole context of intake in this world. So in this view your showing, its just another view related to where someone is at in themselves and making choices according to that space in themselves. As humans we have choices at every level of being true to self. And food choices change as we change, imo. Just some get to that point and realize what is creating the choices and some don't. For me personally quality becomes more important than quantity. Natural food has become more important than unnatural food. But that is just me. The more real I get in myself, the more real I get with what I put in there.

And there is actually a story of a chap who went to buy food and enquired of the butcher 'what is your best meat? to which the butcher replied 'all my meat is the best possible' and in that the fellow became enlightened... just like that.

Just now as I pondered a little my own life ceding away from a need to never mind impressing others but even impressing myself how impressive life actually is. I was thinking of how I'm moving towards just being a gardener and how much I've read here and there about how many years so many of the fruit trees I plant will take before they all fruit and yet every single fruit tree I've planted bears fruit almost months after I plant them... that's impressive!

When you give life to yourself it seems the natural way of living to me. You care about the life you plant, the seeds you plant in everyway, and life springs up unknowingly to the normal way of thinking..:wink: I hope mine I am currently preparing ground for have the same connection yours are having...woo hoo cant wait..:D

But then again maybe it goes way back to when I started drawing as a very young kid and saw how I could do squiggles on paper and impress adults and yet I wasn't impressed at all... I knew almost exactly how far from what I wanted I was and that need to fulfil some obligation within myself to attain some level that may have not even existed may have been what started it all.

You will love this video I was listening too last night. A young boy sharing his thoughts on the world. You may have seen it, but when I read this, it took me to him. Will see if I can find it and post it for you.

I do kind of remember though a forming appreciation of wondrousness, a sense that if I really tried and really applied myself to something occasionally on the edges of what I achieved there would be all these possibilities that would open up before me and, with that, I'm kinda really glad that desire came with early lessons on application and perseverance linked intuitively to ones own efforts veering all to often into frustration and failure.

I think as children we can be naturally in tune to be tenacious little explorers if our world allows it and it is nurtured in this way, especially if we have role models who are open to life in everyway. Sadly it is, what human conditioning attaches to this that gives exploration a whole new name and game that we end up playing with as a whole. But even so it all serves the undoing and doing in the end, so even as we in this moment perceive that something is no longer viable, it was once and it served the whole.

[Rokon]

...
So there is out there quite a few people who say that all desire stems from our need to be at one with God and while this is a fairly straight forward statement how do we align this with a simple need to have roast beef on a sandwich and not ham?

In contrast to this, Mr I, I propose that there are not many people who desire to be one with God as "the spiritual goal". I hope that is the case. I just did a "check disc" and found no desires in my drives that desire to go back to Oneness with God. Perhaps visit on holidays but not a goal for me. God's blessing would be nice but dammit, I want a ham sandwich.

[naturesflow]

In contrast to this, Mr I, I propose that there are not many people who desire to be one with God as "the spiritual goal". I hope that is the case. I just did a "check disc" and found no desires in my drives that desire to go back to Oneness with God. Perhaps visit on holidays but not a goal for me. God's blessing would be nice but dammit, I want a ham sandwich.



Maybe because desires don't exist in that space of seeing..:)

I read your words and ponder curiously that maybe its not in your desire to find this and see this, because oneness doesn't hold desire, more moves itself naturally towards itself.

Consciously or unconsciously.

So human checklists can sometimes only check what is there, not what is not there yet..:)

[naturesflow]

You never know even a ham sandwich can awaken things we don't know, Life is inclusive in the oneness, so I never underestimate the power of the ham sandwich..

[goodvibrations]

I learn to just be, to let go and allow life to move me and guide me to what I already know/don't know I need.


what if life guides you to the path of craving desires? will u ignore those desires or fulfill them???

[naturesflow]

what if life guides you to the path of craving desires? will u ignore those desires or fulfill them???

So are you saying the awareness and state of being as I am now wont stand me through the test of time?

Isn't awareness the guide itself?

How does life guide me to a path of craving desire? I am not sure I get the picture you have in your own mind creating this question.

Maybe you need to reveal what created this question in the first place, like an example you have in your own mind?

[naturesflow]

Here it is Mr I. The young explorers mind, very refreshing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SvMiXk2gGSk

[MIND POWER]

To live is to desire?

Is that the truth of you?

Ok lets be real...

Do you not desire to see what Tuesday is going to be like..?

Do you not desire to see what is at the and of the rainbow, or on the other side of that mountain..?

Do you not desire to test yourself?

Do you not desire to really love somebody, and let them love you..? if i ever fall in love, i desire to love them for as-long as possible.....

To desire is to LIVE, and living is just one big massive desire of creation.

Now DESIRING can get out of hand if? You are immoral (And that’s what has happened to mankind through various mechanisms of control), so that’s why it’s important to desire but still be moral! That’s what true human nature is in my intuitive opinion….

That’s why there are people who look at this world and think? Hey I desire to do my bit and make this place a better place.

To live is to desire, you are desiring something naturesflow.

Nothing in nature exist without a desire, nothing is totally STILL naturesflow! not in the world of MATTER and ENERGY. If we could zoom in upon every single object on this planet, you would not see stillness! you would see energy moving, some kind of desire.

In the world outside of matter? maybe there are no desires! and when you reach that place, that's when you know! NOW! you have become a GOD! to live without any desire, or appetite! that's real empowerment...........

:smile:

[adamm[]]

all my wants and desires have faded away and this topic is dead wrong, i want to curl up next to a big **** tree and just lay there till i rot away.

[Mr Interesting]

I find it very problematic coming to these posts these days because it seems I am unable to address things without writing a whole book and already I was here also yesterday and wrote great swathes of words which after myriads of paragraphs still weren't actually saying what I actually wanted to say.

My own approach to desire isn't about getting anywhere so much as it is about being somewhere which means that if a desire arises then I sit with it and basically wonder whether it might fulfil a need to remain occupied in way that suits me.

To these ends I was at a friends place a while ago and saw a very cherishable piece of wood and the reason I liked the bit of wood, and given I've been in this situation reasonably often, is because I felt there was an artwork already done within that piece of wood and that that artwork already done was either by myself or by someone I would give the piece of wood to. But at the same time I'm in no hurry whatsoever to do that artwork to the extent that it may in fact never get done and that this idea too is held against a carving a friend of mine put on facebook and that it seemed to require a cousin of itself made by me... which then reminded me of another instance of carving which seemed to be in the same family.

Now I could go on for ages about all the connections which seem to be mounting up as this particular piece of wood still just sits there and really, for me, this is about letting what might be desire have as much room as possible to feedback into my life it's actual requirements.

Because, again because I have been in this situation before and many times, I know that the longer and more fulfilled I become with the story that this piece of wood might have in it, which may necessarily be a form of projection, that when I do finally lay it down and start chopping into it that I have been able to have this supposed story held at a distance and can actually let the real story of what it will be unfold.

So what I think I actually do is let my will to impose myself on the world be held at as much distance as I can apply to it and in that somehow let the world impose it's ideas on me and having said that also realise that my way of saying the above is directly related to the conditions that I have come to understand as being in and of a relationship to the world as I see it.

In a sense then what I might be saying is that I'm somehow trying, within my own desires, to let those desires educate me as to what the world itself might desire of me to the extent that such is a co-operative gesture.

But then again I have also found that the world actually enables all my choices, which it very well may have always done except now I'm much more cognisant of the fact, and so this enabling, this providing as it were, almost behoves me to choose wisely and with much greater responsibility as to what and how I enable my own desires.

And this enabling the world provides seems to be very much about being conducive to the conditions as they prevail. Therein there is a paradox though and for myself a very cherishable paradox and it seems to be that the more we are able to just let the world be whatever it is and let it rest in that then the more willing the world is to let us change it, or in proprietary words, let us be the change we want to see in the world.

It could be then that desires followed blindly recreate the world as it is whereas desires given space and expansiveness whereby they just become potential then the world does actually become more about the impossible than the possible.

I am though just a novice. And somehow this idea of not having ambition aligns with the idea of being a novice. That as an apprentice it is not at all about what one might do after the apprenticeship is over and one is a master of ones destiny but being right within the environment of learning and actually learning.

So can desire actually dissolve completely? That's not a question I see as even worth answering. I'm, myself, more interested in the how of desire than I ever was of the what is desire. Actually for me desire is like water and that possibly for most of the world it's a frozen thing, a glacial thing that moves slowly and erodes the landscape... but then again snow crystals are quite beautiful and everyone different.

[naturesflow]

MIND POWER]Ok lets be real...

Yes lets see you being real here then. Seeing you want to get real. So where are you going to show yourself in all these questions....lets see.

Do you not desire to see what Tuesday is going to be like..?

Tuesdays coming whether I desire or it or not.

Do you not desire to see what is at the and of the rainbow, or on the other side of that mountain..?

I immerse myself in the rainbow the mountain as it is, where it leads me is just where it leads me.

Do you not desire to test yourself?

The desires of others who like holding desire love to test me that is enough of itself.
Do you not desire to really love somebody, and let them love you..? if i ever fall in love, i desire to love them for as-long as possible.....

I am love. I love. I am loved as I am. When you know yourself as love why would you need to fall or desire another for long time. All we have is this moment. I don't choose comings and goings/endings and new beginnings. I just stay present with what is. Being myself. Share with what is present with me in that shared space.

To desire is to LIVE, and living is just one big massive desire of creation.

Life brought me to life. Creation knows itself well enough to enjoy life as it is. Living is how I move myself in this world and life. I move. I stay still. I dance. I listen. I care. I support. I know myself. I don't desire any of these things. I am all this.

Now DESIRING can get out of hand if? You are immoral (And that’s what has happened to mankind through various mechanisms of control), so that’s why it’s important to desire but still be moral! That’s what true human nature is in my intuitive opinion….

And as you now show your own conflict around desire I see why you question me not yourself...hehehe

That’s why there are people who look at this world and think? Hey I desire to do my bit and make this place a better place.

I listen and move myself. Desire is all about you in relation to this post, but I don't mind. I know myself.

To live is to desire, you are desiring something naturesflow.

Am I? I love how you interpret life/creation as desire and mine too. Are you desiring to make me hold onto life as one big desire in your view. It seems you have found reason to keep your own alive.

Such is some lives.

Nothing in nature exist without a desire, nothing is totally STILL naturesflow! not in the world of MATTER and ENERGY. If we could zoom in upon every single object on this planet, you would not see stillness! you would see energy moving, some kind of desire.

Movement is movement, as it is. I know you love applying your own ideas to what movement is doing and why. But then I can see you quite clearly showing your own measures of desires in this post. Which doesn't concern me. Its about you.

In the world outside of matter? maybe there are no desires! and when you reach that place, that's when you know! NOW! you have become a GOD! to live without any desire, or appetite! that's real empowerment...........

So in all that you have stated as being so, here you show a maybe. Gosh maybe I do know myself after all, in this moment of NOW. God is a term applied to much as you show what you apply it too. Empowerment comes in many ways. I don't hold god to be anything really. I just listen and know myself.




Be still and know thyself.

[naturesflow]

']all my wants and desires have faded away and this topic is dead wrong, i want to curl up next to a big **** tree and just lay there till i rot away.

As you show in your other threads. You cant let go until you know the whys and how's and when forth art thou coming. A person deep in their thinking mind often does this. Sometimes you just don't know, you know, even when your mind is made up and likes to view things a certain way as right and even dead wrong. So it doesn't surprise me that you would say this. For you the perception of this feels like a no through road, major ending, (which in some ways it is like a death of sorts) where you eventually curl up and rot away, but don't be trapped by your own vision in process that changes in everyway when you let go fully in this way. The mind loves to entertain itself as it only knows, not what is not known.


Perceptions of ending my life in this way of letting go, shows me how and why people like yourself cant let go and why it was hard for me to let go in this way. This is good understanding for me to walk through all this personally, to build an awareness of how difficult it was for me. How hard and long a process it became at the core of this space in myself. Because it shows me that I only need to hold you and others in compassion as I know myself to be now and allow your view and be ok with it because this is how you see things in letting go to this depth.

If you see letting go in this way as rotting away and I see myself curling up completely immersed, thriving one with that big old tree,
well what can is say to your view....

Such is life.

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=Mr Interesting]I find it very problematic coming to these posts these days because it seems I am unable to address things without writing a whole book and already I was here also yesterday and wrote great swathes of words which after myriads of paragraphs still weren't actually saying what I actually wanted to say.

Never mind, it always comes as needed doesn't it?

My own approach to desire isn't about getting anywhere so much as it is about being somewhere which means that if a desire arises then I sit with it and basically wonder whether it might fulfil a need to remain occupied in way that suits me.

Cool.
To these ends I was at a friends place a while ago and saw a very cherishable piece of wood and the reason I liked the bit of wood, and given I've been in this situation reasonably often, is because I felt there was an artwork already done within that piece of wood and that that artwork already done was either by myself or by someone I would give the piece of wood to. But at the same time I'm in no hurry whatsoever to do that artwork to the extent that it may in fact never get done and that this idea too is held against a carving a friend of mine put on facebook and that it seemed to require a cousin of itself made by me... which then reminded me of another instance of carving which seemed to be in the same family.

yes, it is amazing what connections can awaken in the whole source of this world being one big connected playground. But then you would have to understand the nature of connections I suppose to a greater degree in yourself to understand how this works and see how one can apply their life in this way. I remember in my deeper awakening space, seeing it all before my eyes in this way. It did my head in during that phase because it was all so new. I kept thinking, my goodness, life is not like I think it has to be or is. This is an incredibly new way of seeing all these connections in the world connecting me. I was afraid of it back then though. Now I don't fear it. More embrace it as a way of life.

[QUOTE]Now I could go on for ages about all the connections which seem to be mounting up as this particular piece of wood still just sits there and really, for me, this is about letting what might be desire have as much room as possible to feedback into my life it's actual requirements.

Because, again because I have been in this situation before and many times, I know that the longer and more fulfilled I become with the story that this piece of wood might have in it, which may necessarily be a form of projection, that when I do finally lay it down and start chopping into it that I have been able to have this supposed story held at a distance and can actually let the real story of what it will be unfold.

The real story speaks. If we allow it too yes it will.

So what I think I actually do is let my will to impose myself on the world be held at as much distance as I can apply to it and in that somehow let the world impose it's ideas on me and having said that also realise that my way of saying the above is directly related to the conditions that I have come to understand as being in and of a relationship to the world as I see it.

It all fits in the whole, but I guess it comes back to how much of my whole am I holding fixed even as I choose focus, or how much of my whole is open allowing it to show me more that my focus might not want to see. :wink:

In a sense then what I might be saying is that I'm somehow trying, within my own desires, to let those desires educate me as to what the world itself might desire of me to the extent that such is a co-operative gesture.

I suppose what you showing me here is that your someone who is showing how to work with desires more openly rather than fixed as a focus of themselves, this works too. There is a bigger picture within our personal desires but until you allow that to flow in to your own, and let go and allow more, often the picture remains as it is. Co-operation is a great word when applied to allowing.

But then again I have also found that the world actually enables all my choices, which it very well may have always done except now I'm much more cognisant of the fact, and so this enabling, this providing as it were, almost behoves me to choose wisely and with much greater responsibility as to what and how I enable my own desires.

Makes sense.

And this enabling the world provides seems to be very much about being conducive to the conditions as they prevail. Therein there is a paradox though and for myself a very cherishable paradox and it seems to be that the more we are able to just let the world be whatever it is and let it rest in that then the more willing the world is to let us change it, or in proprietary words, let us be the change we want to see in the world.


Yes. Be the change.

It could be then that desires followed blindly recreate the world as it is whereas desires given space and expansiveness whereby they just become potential then the world does actually become more about the impossible than the possible.

uhuh. :)

I am though just a novice. And somehow this idea of not having ambition aligns with the idea of being a novice. That as an apprentice it is not at all about what one might do after the apprenticeship is over and one is a master of ones destiny but being right within the environment of learning and actually learning.

Great insight.

So can desire actually dissolve completely? That's not a question I see as even worth answering. I'm, myself, more interested in the how of desire than I ever was of the what is desire. Actually for me desire is like water and that possibly for most of the world it's a frozen thing, a glacial thing that moves slowly and erodes the landscape... but then again snow crystals are quite beautiful and everyone different.

I like how you relate things..:)

[MIND POWER]

Yes lets see you being real here then. Seeing you want to get real. So where are you going to show yourself in all these questions....lets see.



Tuesdays coming whether I desire or it or not.



I immerse myself in the rainbow the mountain as it is, where it leads me is just where it leads me.



The desires of others who like holding desire love to test me that is enough of itself.


I am love. I love. I am loved as I am. When you know yourself as love why would you need to fall or desire another for long time. All we have is this moment. I don't choose comings and goings/endings and new beginnings. I just stay present with what is. Being myself. Share with what is present with me in that shared space.


Life brought me to life. Creation knows itself well enough to enjoy life as it is. Living is how I move myself in this world and life. I move. I stay still. I dance. I listen. I care. I support. I know myself. I don't desire any of these things. I am all this.



And as you now show your own conflict around desire I see why you question me not yourself...hehehe



I listen and move myself. Desire is all about you in relation to this post, but I don't mind. I know myself.



Am I? I love how you interpret life/creation as desire and mine too. Are you desiring to make me hold onto life as one big desire in your view. It seems you have found reason to keep your own alive.

Such is some lives.



Movement is movement, as it is. I know you love applying your own ideas to what movement is doing and why. But then I can see you quite clearly showing your own measures of desires in this post. Which doesn't concern me. Its about you.


So in all that you have stated as being so, here you show a maybe. Gosh maybe I do know myself after all, in this moment of NOW. God is a term applied to much as you show what you apply it too. Empowerment comes in many ways. I don't hold god to be anything really. I just listen and know myself.




Be still and know thyself.

Fair play Natures Flow, i was just thinking along the lines that? it is our desires that keep us going, it is our desires that free us! liberate or suppress. A world or a universe without desires is maybe a universe/world without creativity, which from my observation you like to be.

But of course we are living in a world in my opinion that has distorted our desires, i have been laying in bed! thinking about this, just right now!

Maybe we came here with true desires, and that is apart of the challenge in life is about remembering them.

Or maybe we are just Jive Talking.

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=MIND POWER]Fair play Natures Flow, i was just thinking along the lines that? it is are desires that keep us going, it is our desires that free us! liberate or suppress. A world or a universe without desires is maybe a universe/world without creativity, which from my observation you like to be.


Creativity and desire are two separate things in my view. Creation and creating are naturally derived in me through a flow, so I am not so much desiring but more allowing it to open naturally in me and through me. I am not out there desiring to paint and write, call a friend for a catch up. I just listen, tune in and decide yes or not for me. Of course old desires brought me to this place, chasing and needing, desiring and thinking I needed things to make me complete. They served to support me to let go and open deeper so I am not saying they are something we don't need. In fact learning through desire and wants helps to clear out unnecessary baggage, holding us from being more in feeling and knowing we are complete. When I stopped chasing/desiring and started being more present in the now, things more fall into place and I meet that place by moving myself closer to it. Open true state of creating doesn't house attachments in the reasons why, but more trusts in the opening to share and be that creation as it is, as it offers itself and as I land and be myself.

But of course we are living in a world in my opinion that has distorted our desires, i have been lying in bed! thinking about this, just right now!

We are distorted in feelings through conditioning and perceived separation in all that.

Maybe we came here with true desires, and that is apart of the challenge in life is about remembering them.

Perhaps this true self without desire simply just is. Remembering who you are at the core often reflects itself so its more about being true to that awareness naturally of course.

Or maybe we are just Jive Talking.

[Baile]

I trust in life. I trust in myself as that life.
I don't now walk around seeking to be desire-less, I am more aware that I am not attached now with desire in meThis in essence is everything that spirituality is about: self-understanding and acceptance.
We could do away with every forum and every topic on this site and simply discuss this, everything else is just a diversion from this loving self-realization work.
I so appreciate individuals who have tapped into the incredible, benevolent beauty of life and existence.

[Rokon]

Originally Posted by naturesflow
"I trust in life. I trust in myself as that life.
I don't now walk around seeking to be desire-less, I am more aware that I am not attached now with desire in me"

This in essence is everything that spirituality is about: self-understanding and acceptance.
We could do away with every forum and every topic on this site and simply discuss this, everything else is just a diversion from this loving self-realization work.
I so appreciate individuals who have tapped into the incredible, benevolent beauty of life and existence.
This is getting pretty philosophical to me but what the heck. I'm wondering if this notion that one can trust life to take care of you, nurture you or whatever. It sounds very odd, that there is a thing called "life" that has it's own volition, it's own consciousness that doesn't need "your" volition and desire. "Don't get involved, remove your-self and we'll do the driving"

It's like a fairy tale to me, this desire to reduce your own sentience, and will. And I see connections form this story to the Christian story. "God's Will, not your own as man is sin."

[MIND POWER]

[QUOTE]
Creativity and desire are two separate things in my view. Creation and creating are naturally derived in me through a flow, so I am not so much desiring but more allowing it to open naturally in me and through me. I am not out there desiring to paint and write, call a friend for a catch up. I just listen, tune in and decide yes or not for me. Of course old desires brought me to this place, chasing and needing, desiring and thinking I needed things to make me complete. They served to support me to let go and open deeper so I am not saying they are something we don't need. In fact learning through desire and wants helps to clear out unnecessary baggage, holding us from being more in feeling and knowing we are complete. When I stopped chasing/desiring and started being more present in the now, things more fall into place and I meet that place by moving myself closer to it. Open true state of creating doesn't house attachments in the reasons why, but more trusts in the opening to share and be that creation as it is, as it offers itself and as I land and be myself.


Its a great song that by the bee's gee's isn't it..? that's my song for the day.

I guess not desiring is like not giving a toss, but in wise way. Being passive? which is also a feminine trait. I guess being passive with wisdom can be liberating at times, and calming! induces a state of being which improves CREATIVITY!

Maybe even you natures flow are being passive to your desire, this is what i sense......

But as i have been laying about on-top of my bed today, and i thought about my morning post i made here! i was like....

You stop desiring when you figure out, that YOU are the desire! instead of something else! goal, person, ambition.

And i was just laying there with my hands behind my head thinking about this state of being....

Maybe you have reached this state of being! well done if that's the case entirely.

Myself personally i have not reached that stage! for a moment on top of my bed i envisioned that state of being though....

[Baile]

It sounds very odd, that there is a thing called "life" that has it's own volition, it's own consciousness that doesn't need "your" volition and desire. "Don't get involved, remove your-self and we'll do the driving"I would suggest it's maybe the opposite of that. Life is what we are and what we do. And self-development and self-realization is all about getting 100% involved in taking conscious control of one's self and life. I read something many years ago that rings true for me: every step on the spiritual knowledge path requires three steps on the personal development path. As for your comment regarding life having its own volition, certainly spirit does. Spirit was, is and always will be, just as we are eternal beings. Life is spirit and we are spirit, it's all inseparable. Spirit "is" and life goes on regardless of our conscious input. But I don't see that as contradictory to the notion of self-realization work, of letting aspects of our lower self fall away as we learn and grow.

[Rokon]

I would suggest it's maybe the opposite of that. Life is what we are and what we do. And self-development and self-realization is all about getting 100% involved in taking conscious control of one's self and life. I read something many years ago that rings true for me: every step on the spiritual knowledge path requires three steps on the personal development path. As for your comment regarding life having its own volition, certainly spirit does. Spirit was, is and always will be, just as we are eternal beings. Life is spirit and we are spirit, it's all inseparable. Spirit "is" and life goes on regardless of our conscious input. But I don't see that as contradictory to the notion of self-realization work, of letting aspects of our lower self fall away as we learn and grow.
There's a whole bunch of contradictions that I see but I'll not delve into them right now, here on this thread about dumping desire. A bigger problem, perhaps a contradiction, it that the story you are describing cannot be actualized. To me it is entirely a psychological shift. This suggested state of realization may be psychosomatic and there is nothing that can be demonstrated to make it any different than the Christian story of "the fall of man" and born into sin.

For example, the life of a "non-realized" person looks precisely like the life of a "self-realized" person. Both exist in a so-called dualistic reality. Both have survival and health issues. both will leave their physical body about the same time. Both deal with the same "human" issues.

What is different? A self realized person has created a psychological script. He uses it when he communicates. He "talks" about it with others. That's the only thing that can be "actualized" as far as I can see. Its like suggestive dark magic that religion has used for so long. Its hypnotic suggestion. If one is suggestive enough they will take the suggestion and run with it, that is the only actualization I can see. A Jedi mind trick.

Anyway I did not want to bash anyone here. I just got into a ranty feel here thanks for reading.

[naturesflow]

[QUOTE=Rokon]There's a whole bunch of contradictions that I see but I'll not delve into them right now, here on this thread about dumping desire. A bigger problem, perhaps a contradiction, it that the story you are describing cannot be actualized. To me it is entirely a psychological shift. This suggested state of realization may be psychosomatic and there is nothing that can be demonstrated to make it any different than the Christian story of "the fall of man" and born into sin.

Interesting perception of it all. Even as you use the term dumping desire, when I see it as it naturally falling away of itself through a conscious walk and letting go process, to actually become what you let go of, it shows me that you on some level of yourself believe that you offload the desire mentally and that's it. But in the conscious walk the real begins to emerge in every way you have let go and becomes the walk beyond the unreal you have released from within in every way. The story falls away in you in every way. How else can you live this into being/becoming it fully? It becomes a way of living and your life one with what you become.

For example, the life of a "non-realized" person looks precisely like the life of a "self-realized" person. Both exist in a so-called dualistic reality. Both have survival and health issues. both will leave their physical body about the same time. Both deal with the same "human" issues.

Which is why life goes on for either person as the world is. Both exist within the same dualistic reality, but as individuals we create our reality reflected through the whole and that whole is in us. So my part or your part will reflect exactly what your choosing and are aware of in yourself more complete and exactly what your choosing to actualize in the walk of you awake and aware of yourself realized as you are. Actualized is about being and walking it as a state of being. When you way it up against what we all walk through, the more actualized you make the realizations you have opened too, the more you will walk and live in harmony with your own life and others, because your conscious of yourself and the world in ways where you walk with that. *Walk your talk"....So listening is more in tune with health and survival at a more open state of alignment with true self. Where as a non realized person may be open and listening inclusive of where he is not realized bringing that into realization. Ending desire doesn't end actualization and realizations, as long as we live we are realizing and actualizing through life itself as it is, but there is a definite point in me that feels complete to get on with life without seeking to be more than I am. Its more now about bringing me to life in life in this new way.In that shift from feeling separate to feeling complete, I actualize it into a lifestyle and live this. Life goes on. It becomes a way of life. Creating your life through realizations and not living attached allows the walk and actualization to be less in the chaos and more in the harmony and flow as I stated. Your listening to yourself deeper, you listening to life deeper so your more in tune with it all. Your not seeking to make it, it makes itself as you walk and listen to yourself. When you resist or force, push up against, desire your going to get what you need anyway, but without all this, it becomes more effortless and mindful of much in self, creating itself outwardly.

What is different? A self realized person has created a psychological script. He uses it when he communicates. He "talks" about it with others. That's the only thing that can be "actualized" as far as I can see. Its like suggestive dark magic that religion has used for so long. Its hypnotic suggestion. If one is suggestive enough they will take the suggestion and run with it, that is the only actualization I can see. A Jedi mind trick.

The script is the new in everyway so don't be deceived by your own mind. Just talking without walking this stuff means you possibly haven't fully realized to being it into being.The mind when it is empty of conditioning and old stories, opens up and allows a more expanded awareness of itself to be. Your mind is trying to make known to you what it feels like through your mind, to walk and be this, but while your in your mind it wont work for you to see, because it is about emptying the mind, of all that you think you are. It is the allowing beyond what you know to allow in what you don't know, but while you hold the mind trying to see you will only see this through what your mind tells you. It is a conscious walk and process of itself to build a new conscious walk of itself. That is realization and actualization. The whole self is inclusive of you in everyway of you being you.

Anyway I did not want to bash anyone here. I just got into a ranty feel here thanks for reading.

Rant away.. its not harming anyone. :)

[Mr Interesting]

I found this on facebook and it makes me hopeful.
"Making makes you present, it's were the light is," Cathy Cooper

Okay, there's a spelling mistake, well, a grammatical error which might even be a fruedian slip of sorts... 'where' the light is.

I quite like stuff like this as the mere leaving out of an h could be a story in itself, me merely amusing myself filling moments with my own inconsequential meandering between ideas of myself as understanding, light hearted seriousness wagging it's tail and at the same time scratching at still clinging fleas...

The 'h' is the eighth letter, the bound or twisted zero of infinity, the illustration of the point between heaven and earth and the qualifier of the holy spirit between the father and the sun. Opps, son.

The supposed to be 'where' becomes the past tense as were, present becoming past.

And bless her heart this woman who posted such as I was somewhat of a consternating presence the last time we met and our hugs timid and awkward as I appeared in her world of hierarchies, with my own in tow of course, and was completely audacious in having gone beyond her own place and being on a mountain top uninvited simply because I saw no mountains worth climbing, it was indeed awkward but I do enjoy awkward, especially my own when braveness instils such, and made it all all the more awkward.

And she is obviously of the soul group that I too inhabit as a consequential earth thing and in her use of making makes us present I can see another member playing a much softer card over possibly as long an interlude and at a much closer interlude I met her neighbour in that far away idyllic valley that might actually be my next journey out into the hinterland. She has, by all accounts, a wonderful setup with all manner of lovely things and I would somehow enjoy seeing her settling and hope too that me being there would find, as has happened before, a time where we both settle without any held acrimonies needing to rise to be seen in 'that' light.

We are entirely useful to each other and she is a sweetie!

This all came from creating and desire aren't the same. I don't have an answer as such but I don't seem to have a question either.

[naturesflow]

This in essence is everything that spirituality is about: self-understanding and acceptance.
We could do away with every forum and every topic on this site and simply discuss this, everything else is just a diversion from this loving self-realization work.
I so appreciate individuals who have tapped into the incredible, benevolent beauty of life and existence.

Yes.

Its simple yet we make it complex for ourselves and often end up with so much chaos because of this. Then we create in chaos and end up with more chaos..:wink:

[naturesflow]

I found this on facebook and it makes me hopeful.
"Making makes you present, it's were the light is," Cathy Cooper

Okay, there's a spelling mistake, well, a grammatical error which might even be a fruedian slip of sorts... 'where' the light is.

I quite like stuff like this as the mere leaving out of an h could be a story in itself, me merely amusing myself filling moments with my own inconsequential meandering between ideas of myself as understanding, light hearted seriousness wagging it's tail and at the same time scratching at still clinging fleas...

The 'h' is the eighth letter, the bound or twisted zero of infinity, the illustration of the point between heaven and earth and the qualifier of the holy spirit between the father and the sun. Opps, son.

The supposed to be 'where' becomes the past tense as were, present becoming past.

And bless her heart this woman who posted such as I was somewhat of a consternating presence the last time we met and our hugs timid and awkward as I appeared in her world of hierarchies, with my own in tow of course, and was completely audacious in having gone beyond her own place and being on a mountain top uninvited simply because I saw no mountains worth climbing, it was indeed awkward but I do enjoy awkward, especially my own when braveness instils such, and made it all all the more awkward.

And she is obviously of the soul group that I too inhabit as a consequential earth thing and in her use of making makes us present I can see another member playing a much softer card over possibly as long an interlude and at a much closer interlude I met her neighbour in that far away idyllic valley that might actually be my next journey out into the hinterland. She has, by all accounts, a wonderful setup with all manner of lovely things and I would somehow enjoy seeing her settling and hope too that me being there would find, as has happened before, a time where we both settle without any held acrimonies needing to rise to be seen in 'that' light.

We are entirely useful to each other and she is a sweetie!

This all came from creating and desire aren't the same. I don't have an answer as such but I don't seem to have a question either.

When you merge the differences into sameness in you, something wonderful arises, all differences and sameness become one. And then if you remember the old view where it wasn't one, you kind of get to see yourself as the were, where and right here and now. So that is kind of fun in the whole view and expression of awareness. Of course in time it tends to integrate and fall into just being yourself normal. The reminders help us to see where we consciously can go deeper in the moment and be more present, so it all supports.

[Mr Interesting]

And an adventure ensued... as they do.

I looked up Cathy Cooper and she's a bit famous and laughs easily and she says she prefers kinda floppy and loose, and I'm watching but listening too and the little voice says 'she'll be proud to wear the King coat' and so I find her some more and send her an email offering her the King Coat.

I'm a simple fellow, I need some cash to support my laziness, and there's a kind of intrigue worth getting through where I see a friend 'cause most anyone who laughs easy is a friend somehow, someways maybe I need or don't... whatever. So I write this letter asking for cash but I'm also kinda walking through a minefield which is kinda challenging 'cause I'm Mr Nobody as often as I can be and she's a Mrs Somebody if we laying down lawns of conventional, which are always there even if the trees of verdant opulence are yet to be placed, Because spirit has said 'go there'. I don't really know, either, where 'there' is but spirit says go there, and the tinge, that smooth set of edges on the edge of edges is obviously the widening of adventures even if I stumble the effort is and will ever be moved or construed to where ever it might prove.

Oh golly.

[naturesflow]

And an adventure ensued... as they do.

I looked up Cathy Cooper and she's a bit famous and laughs easily and she says she prefers kinda floppy and loose, and I'm watching but listening too and the little voice says 'she'll be proud to wear the King coat' and so I find her some more and send her an email offering her the King Coat.

I'm a simple fellow, I need some cash to support my laziness, and there's a kind of intrigue worth getting through where I see a friend 'cause most anyone who laughs easy is a friend somehow, someways maybe I need or don't... whatever. So I write this letter asking for cash but I'm also kinda walking through a minefield which is kinda challenging 'cause I'm Mr Nobody as often as I can be and she's a Mrs Somebody if we laying down lawns of conventional, which are always there even if the trees of verdant opulence are yet to be placed, Because spirit has said 'go there'. I don't really know, either, where 'there' is but spirit says go there, and the tinge, that smooth set of edges on the edge of edges is obviously the widening of adventures even if I stumble the effort is and will ever be moved or construed to where ever it might prove.

Oh golly.

Life is an adventure, be the adventure. Venturing is part of that so is advent come to think of it.

What does that mean again?

[naturesflow]

Oh here it be...thanks wiki.."the arrival of a notable person or thing"

that's one meaning.

[naturesflow]

Or this meaning..."the first season of the Church year, leading up to Christmas and including the four preceding Sundays"

are we past that yet?

[naturesflow]

No this sunday is the last one, so go for it..lol

[Jyotir]

Excellent OP naturesflow, imo one of your best ever.

~ J

[naturesflow]

Excellent OP naturesflow, imo one of your best ever.

~ J

Thankyou.

And thankyou for sharing how it feels for you J.

What arose in you to connect in this way of *it being my best ever* Jyotir?

I am interested for you to share further if you want too.

[ocean breeze]

I am a man filled with so much desire
Mixing dreams with reality knowing that i'm playing with fire
So much to experience, so much to explore, before i expire
Trapped in a young body, with a young mind, slowly seeing the person i most admire


A poem written by me and no i'm not a liar

[Elli24]

For the past few months, I've been trying to completely let go of all desires and have faith that God will provide for all of my needs. I always knew to do that, but only recently have I truly done it. It seems like as soon as I gave up the reins, I was provided for.

Like for example, I really needed a new backpack because my old one had holes in it, and I needed a new water bottle because my old one melted in the dish washer. I just gave up and thought I could do without them. Well, right when the new semester started, someone made me put my name in a raffle for a few different prizes, and I ended up winning a backpack and water bottle! Later I needed some new pants because I had like 2 pairs that I wore, then my mom randomly gave me a pair that she had bought for herself but didn't like (and they fit even though she's way shorter than me).

A few other things like that have happened since then. Also, I have given up my desire for more important things, like a relationship for example, knowing that I will be provided for in the future.

The best part is that even if I am not provided for immediately, the fact that I have released my desires has already made me content. Then when I actually get what I need, it's just a great bonus :)

[Mr Interesting]

I am a man filled with so much desire
Mixing dreams with reality knowing that i'm playing with fire
So much to experience, so much to explore, before i expire
Trapped in a young body, with a young mind, slowly seeing the person i most admire


A poem written by me and no i'm not a liar

Keep going on that one I reckon. I read through it and it seems to have a brilliance to it but at the same time doesn't quite fall as it might, there's some knobbly bits.

"So much to experience, so much to explore, and even all that other stuff, how could I ignore?

Trapped in a young body, my mind a dulling child, slowly, but slightly that which I don't despise.

These hands then are singed as this heart catches alight, now where is that cliff so I can see if I can fly?

But it's really good bro, I have in my vicinity quite often those who would see themselves as poets and it's always almost embarrassing to see within their work thse small sparks of the zing that it can be but that it always has to swim amongst so much determination to actually be good at it and so it all just seems so much dictionary browsing whereas what you have seems to be the spark, it's there glowing, and more than anything it's unhindered... maybe, what's your story of it?