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mickiel
13-12-2015, 06:08 PM
Does our consciousness develop our spirituality, or does our spirituality develop our consciousness? Or are they too intermingled to separate? We are first conscious, but then when does spirituality come into us? I personally think consciousness is a spirit in man and woman, joined like twins that were never meant to be separate. Like having two eyes, both separate but joined to act together in life. Except in the case of conscious spirit, we cannot physically see this union, but we know its there. We may not agree on how this is explained and defined, but its real nonetheless.

Our spirit, joined to our physical bodies in a most remarkable union of life; like a hand fitting inside of a glove, it just seems to fit. We can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of; notice then how each consciousness is different in some ways, but common in others. How interesting this develops in each of us; consciousness is the battery of behavior!

Can our spirituality go as far as our consciousness can travel?

Flexi-Girl
13-12-2015, 06:58 PM
I think our consciousness is an extension of our whole spiritual selves. If our spirit is a crowded room, our consciousness is that which focuses on only one conversation in the room. In other words we use our waking consciousness to focus in and define one experience more sharply but it's still only one conversation out of many. That's my take.

Miss Hepburn
13-12-2015, 07:00 PM
Can our spirituality go as far as our consciousness can travel?
Can my spirit? That's the plan for me...so far so good ...
doing hours of meditation! :thumbsup:

mickiel
13-12-2015, 07:04 PM
I think our consciousness is an extension of our whole spiritual selves. If our spirit is a crowded room, our consciousness is that which focuses on only one conversation in the room. In other words we use our waking consciousness to focus in and define one experience more sharply but it's still only one conversation out of many. That's my take.


I agree, I think consciousness is an extension of what we really are, it extends our self awareness outward; and it is our focus on singular conversations or matters. I think we really are spiritual beings, just how deeply we understand that depends on many things we experience and come into contact with. I often wonder just how far humanity will extend?

CrystalSong
13-12-2015, 08:07 PM
The are the same essentially.
Consciousness expanded enough to self realize that it is Love creating Experience is Spirituality.

Flexi-Girl
13-12-2015, 09:40 PM
I agree, I think consciousness is an extension of what we really are, it extends our self awareness outward; and it is our focus on singular conversations or matters. I think we really are spiritual beings, just how deeply we understand that depends on many things we experience and come into contact with. I often wonder just how far humanity will extend?


Maybe humanity is a kind of school in which we experience so profoundly, that it helps us heighten our spiritual senses to create bigger and better things.

Rokon
13-12-2015, 10:11 PM
Does our consciousness develop our spirituality, or does our spirituality develop our consciousness? Or are they too intermingled to separate? We are first conscious, but then when does spirituality come into us? I personally think consciousness is a spirit in man and woman, joined like twins that were never meant to be separate. Like having two eyes, both separate but joined to act together in life. Except in the case of conscious spirit, we cannot physically see this union, but we know its there. We may not agree on how this is explained and defined, but its real nonetheless.

Our spirit, joined to our physical bodies in a most remarkable union of life; like a hand fitting inside of a glove, it just seems to fit. We can only be conscious of, those things we are conscious of; notice then how each consciousness is different in some ways, but common in others. How interesting this develops in each of us; consciousness is the battery of behavior!

Can our spirituality go as far as our consciousness can travel?
Consciousness is spirit. One and the same. Our mind is spirit/consciousness expressed through our body/brain. :smile:

Mr Interesting
13-12-2015, 10:44 PM
We do that don't we? We take things apart then think they're separate things but they never were... it's kinda like it helps us somewhat to take things apart to understand how they work, which isn't a bad thing, but it does tend to colour how we look at things even when they're still together... oh well.

An example might be the thread that started maybe last week and someone said they were deeply pining. I really like that word and maybe it's because I absolutely love the smell of pine resin and naturally enough that simple tree blood has kind of completely underpined human civilisation as one of our earliest and subsequently most widely used 'stuff'.

Anyway for some reason I ended up watching a bunch of Indian classical music on youtube, and found the story of Radha and Krishna which is very much about Radha pining for Krishna, and went on and eventually got to Anoushka Shankra, the daughter of Ravi, and was spellbound and my favourite was of a younger Anoushka and her father where he sang and then she would play. It was so lovely... then Ravi died yesterday, news came today, and it was like I'd had an inside track. In hindsight, yes, a conscious spirituality prevailed... but I had no idea, or thought to create ideas... it was just nice.

I then had the privilege of finding this and sending it out there... here! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEJSWIftX98)

Greenslade
14-12-2015, 08:22 AM
I first noticed the Flaky Flier one stormy autumn afternoon, he was flying around having fun with the air currents and a few times flew so close to the building he almost impaled himself on it. A few times he flew so close to my head I could hear his wings beat. It looked as though he was preparing to migrate for the winter with his friends that were also flying around at the same time, but his flying was so flaky I doubted that he would make it. I wished him Safe Journey anyway.

Come spring they returned, and I recognised his movements - Flaky had made it. I caught him flying into a niche in the building then come out with a mate as if to introduce me to Mrs Flaky, then a few weeks after that Flaky Junior appeared. Flaky flying is genetic. It seemed every time I was in the vicinity he would fly close and chirp at me, yet I was never conscious of what the swallow was conscious of. Perhaps our 'relationship' only touched the Child Inside, perhaps he was ticked off at me for not being able to communicate.

I was conscious of 'Beings of Light' and places they existed in before I was conscious of Spirituality, and others have been conscious of those same beings and places. Others have been conscious of them only in their dreams and are not Spiritual - at least not by 'standard' definitions.

Perhaps the question is what are we conscious of?

mickiel
14-12-2015, 05:06 PM
To look at things spiritually is just a different look altogether. Maybe a deeper look to be conscious of.

Saiisha
14-12-2015, 11:03 PM
Maybe I'm simplistic in my thought here, but the way I understand my consciousness is that it's a spark of the Universal Consciousness - you know, like the famous analogy of a wave and the ocean. When viewed from that perspective, my spirituality becomes more of a practice to experience that consciousness. Because consciousness is already pure, what we try to do is not so much develop it, but become aware of it.

mickiel
15-12-2015, 03:26 AM
Maybe I'm simplistic in my thought here, but the way I understand my consciousness is that it's a spark of the Universal Consciousness - you know, like the famous analogy of a wave and the ocean. When viewed from that perspective, my spirituality becomes more of a practice to experience that consciousness. Because consciousness is already pure, what we try to do is not so much develop it, but become aware of it.


Would you not think that anything worth being aware of, is then worth developing?

Saiisha
15-12-2015, 05:07 AM
Yes, our spiritual practice is worth developing, certainly; but not Consciousness itself since it's already pure, present. But again, it's probably a matter of perspective :)

mickiel
15-12-2015, 04:47 PM
Explain why you view our consciousness as pure?

mickiel
15-12-2015, 05:09 PM
As knowledge increases, does also our consciousness? Does spirituality increase with knowledge? I think these things are too close to call; destined to be intwined.

Saiisha
15-12-2015, 09:55 PM
When I said Consciousness is pure, I meant universal consciousness, and the deepest part of us that's a spark of the universal consciousness. As knowledge (or rather wisdom) increases, our awareness of that consciousness increases, yes. And you're right - definitely intertwined!

Cmt12
15-12-2015, 10:34 PM
Our spirituality consists of a masculine and feminine side. When most people talk about spirituality (especially women), they usually are describing the feminine side, which represents compassion, empathy, tolerance, etc.

Consciousness is part of the masculine side which drives spiritual development including the feminine side. Imagine quicksand and buried underneath are a man and woman who are tied together. The quicksand represents the ego, the man represents the masculine, and the woman the feminine.

When we become more conscious, more self-aware, we are waking up our man and giving him an opportunity to reach up out of the quicksand to find the rope. The rope represents Intuition, or what leads us toward salvation. As our man pulls himself out with the rope he is also pulling out the woman.

As human beings, until we wake up our man, then there is just unconsciousness and ego, and we are spiritually dead as Jesus would say. Spiritual development is the process of pulling ourselves out from beneath the quicksand.

This is not a perfect analogy but I think it still works.

CrystalSong
15-12-2015, 10:51 PM
Our spirituality consists of a masculine and feminine side. When most people talk about spirituality (especially women), they usually are describing the feminine side, which represents compassion, empathy, tolerance, etc.

Consciousness is part of the masculine side which drives spiritual development including the feminine side. Imagine quicksand and buried underneath are a man and woman who are tied together. The quicksand represents the ego, the man represents the masculine, and the woman the feminine.

When we become more conscious, more self-aware, we are waking up our man and giving him an opportunity to reach up out of the quicksand to find the rope. The rope represents Intuition, or what leads us toward salvation. As our man pulls himself out with the rope he is also pulling out the woman.

As human beings, until we wake up our man, then there is just unconsciousness and ego, and we are spiritually dead as Jesus would say. Spiritual development is the process of pulling ourselves out from beneath the quicksand.

This is not a perfect analogy but I think it still works.

right...... so I need a man to save me. Actually I need a man to save himself so he can then pull me up the rope too.


That explains it!!!

I always wondered why only about 10% of the worlds total population was awakened. Now we know!

Patriarchal cow manure :)

Cmt12
15-12-2015, 11:02 PM
Make the woman the one who pulls the rope and the man the one who represents love and compassion if it pacifies your ego. It doesn't matter; they are simply representations of aspects that are within you and within all of us, male or female.

CrystalSong
15-12-2015, 11:10 PM
Make the woman the one who pulls the rope and the man the one who represents love and compassion if it pacifies your ego. It doesn't matter; they are simply representations of aspects that are within you and within all of us, male or female

Representations if we chooses to believe we are fragmented into male and female aspects inside.

I don't,
in fact most duality constructs aren't resonating anymore.
Nor does anyone needing to 'save' me or me 'saving' anyone.

Or in fact that anything needs saved at all by anyone.

These are limiting mental constructs to me and not useful for expansion due to their limiting nature.

Cmt12
15-12-2015, 11:18 PM
If one chooses to believe we are fragmented into male and female aspects inside.

I don't,
in fact most duality constructs don't resonate with me anymore.
Nor does anyone needing to 'save' me or me 'saving' anyone.

Or in fact that anything needs saved at all by anyone.

These are limiting mental constructs to me and not useful for expansion due to their limiting nature.
This is the view of a lot of self-described spiritual people. In my view, it's what happens when ego hijacks the feminine side, so it appears spiritual in nature because there is that comforting, consoling, everything-is-perfect feminine aspect to it but it's deception.

If everything is spirit and perfect and all that, how is the problem of suffering and evil explained if nothing needs to be healed, if spiritual development is unnecessary?

Saiisha
15-12-2015, 11:37 PM
Cmt12 - I wonder if you're referring to the Vedic concept of Prakriti (the feminine energy) and Purusha (the masculine energy). The idea there is that before creation, or before the universe was born, it was all a single energy being (for lack of a better word). The universe of duality was born when that single energy being was split into two, and so you're right - everything else in the created universe seems to have both energies within. But so is CrystalSong, since our spiritual journey is about letting go of those dualities, transcending them within ourselves, as well as how we view the world around us.

Cmt12
16-12-2015, 12:13 AM
The masculine and feminine make up what can be called our true self. We come into the world in ignorance of our ts, controlled entirely by ego. As we awaken, and become more aware of ts, then we become two: ego and ts. The final goal is to rid ourselves of ego and become ts - two becoming one.

So, yes, we agree the ultimate goal is to become one but it is not as simple as deceiving ourselves that we were our true self the entire time or underestimating what it takes to achieve this and believe that it is easy as deciding for it to be so, saying "ego be gone!"

The ego, acting in self-preservation, will constantly try to avert our awareness away from it saying look I'm no longer here or I was never here, meanwhile it's still firmly in control.

The masculine aspect (consciousness, self-awareness) is the only antidote to ego; ego cannot control or deceive this part of us. Look, the feminine side controls a lot of the good stuff right - love, compassion, connection, etc - but if we focus too much on the feminine and neglect the masculine, the ego will be in control.

Jesus talks about a sword, fire, and war because getting rid of the ego is like a war and we need our warrior for that (masculine side). As we develop our warrior and win the war, then the feminine aspect will develop naturally.

CrystalSong
16-12-2015, 12:23 AM
This is the view of a lot of self-described spiritual people. In my view, it's what happens when ego hijacks the feminine side, so it appears spiritual in nature because there is that comforting, consoling, everything-is-perfect feminine aspect to it but it's deception.

If everything is spirit and perfect and all that, how is the problem of suffering and evil explained if nothing needs to be healed, if spiritual development is unnecessary?

suffering and evil -perspectives an reactions of the mind or ego as you say, to a situation or circumstance when viewed from another perspective could also be said to be an opportunity for growth and a new perspective.

Spiritual Development or is it discovering/remembering what we've always been between lives?

When you say 'self described spiritual people' and then tell me about male and female aspects I hear you telling me you are a self described spiritual person also and your point of view is the correct one and others are incorrect. Is this what you meant to imply?

Cmt12
16-12-2015, 12:45 AM
suffering and evil -perspectives an reactions of the mind or ego as you say, to a situation or circumstance when viewed from another perspective could also be said to be an opportunity for growth and a new perspective.

Spiritual Development or is it discovering/remembering what we've always been between lives?

When you say 'self described spiritual people' and then tell me about male and female aspects I hear you telling me you are a self described spiritual person also and your point of view is the correct one and others are incorrect. Is this what you meant to imply?
When you read my first post in this thread and took offense, there was suffering within you that was triggered. I can point it out and point out all the other suffering that is going on in the world, but it doesn't matter for you unless you are willing to acknowledge it.

The truth doesn't change just because we decide to change the way we view it or decide it doesn't exist. I'm just saying all the suffering that exists is so self-evident that you can't allow yourself to get sucked into that bubble of "spirituality" that appeals to that feminine-ego mindset that isn't based in reality.

Spirituality is about engagement rather than escapism. It's difficult and a struggle but it's worth it. Go for the real thing rather than the shiny thing that is empty.

mickiel
16-12-2015, 12:54 AM
In my view of things, a Spirit is neither male or female; male and female are physical gender's, a spirit is not physical, in my opinion. So then I would say consciousness is not male or female, but that spirit simply exist inside the body of a male and a female. And we just carry it around. Now I would say that a consciousness, or a spirit, is influenced differently by a male or female gender; the experience of being a certain gender can influence consciousness.

Anything can influence consciousness.

I would disagree with the notion that consciousness has gender; which would be saying that spirit is physical, when it is not. Even consciousness is not physical; there is no physical human organ that we can say is consciousness. Not the brain, which would be the first thing most would say represents consciousness. I think the brain is highly influenced by consciousness, but the brain is not the organ that we can call " A Spirit."

It just seems like our brain is conscious, because we look outward from our eyes, and behind our eyes, is the brain. But there is nothing inside of our head, except bone and tissue. Bone and tissue is NOT consciousness; consciousness is a spirit in humans, in my view. If bone and tissue was consciousness, then all parts of our body would be individually conscious.

This is why spirituality is so unique in life.

CrystalSong
16-12-2015, 01:16 AM
When you read my first post in this thread and took offense, there was suffering within you that was triggered. I can point it out and point out all the other suffering that is going on in the world, but it doesn't matter for you unless you are willing to acknowledge it.

The truth doesn't change just because we decide to change the way we view it or decide it doesn't exist. I'm just saying all the suffering that exists is so self-evident that you can't allow yourself to get sucked into that bubble of "spirituality" that appeals to that feminine-ego mindset that isn't based in reality.

Spirituality is about engagement rather than escapism. It's difficult and a struggle but it's worth it. Go for the real thing rather than the shiny thing that is empty.

Actually I was highly humored...and still am! LOL

mickiel
16-12-2015, 10:07 PM
Many humans ignore their spirituality, don't even tap into it. Its like ignoring a whole reason you exist; like living without using your arms and legs; a great space and divide. Like living with a giant hole in you.

Light Seeker
16-12-2015, 10:23 PM
Hello mickiel,

I was about to add and as you quietly correctly verified. A lot of spirituality, particularly the meat and bones of it would seem to me to take it's centre stage subconsciously.. That is to say ... You are with it more in the dreams than in waking life... That might be just me though.

You will have been through all that maccrocosm , miccrocosm stuff, but it really seems at many times that you can only ever go outwards by going inwards. This is of course only my experience of the matter though.

mickiel
17-12-2015, 09:09 PM
Hello mickiel,

I was about to add and as you quietly correctly verified. A lot of spirituality, particularly the meat and bones of it would seem to me to take it's centre stage subconsciously.. That is to say ... You are with it more in the dreams than in waking life... That might be just me though.

You will have been through all that maccrocosm , miccrocosm stuff, but it really seems at many times that you can only ever go outwards by going inwards. This is of course only my experience of the matter though.

I agree we go outwards by going inward, that is true. Its deeply true, according to how deep one goes. I think consciousness is a center stage, a main focus so to speak. And I do think we have sub consciousness, dreams are a part of consciousness for sure.

mickiel
18-12-2015, 08:07 PM
Consciousness is the motor of behavior ; it dictates what we do. It is the governor of behavior. Look at all the troubled spots in this world and we can see how consciousness is exerting itself in those areas. A neighborhood is just a family grown big; a city is an extension of that; a nation takes it root from that.

We can then trace the consciousness of humanity in this manner.

mickiel
20-12-2015, 05:22 PM
I think the future of humanity is based on conscious spirituality; this is just how important it is.

Cmt12
21-12-2015, 01:22 AM
Reading over my posts, I sometimes push too hard on this forum which is why I try to stay away. Sorry for that.

mickiel
21-12-2015, 01:31 AM
Reading over my posts, I sometimes push too hard on this forum which is why I try to stay away. Sorry for that.


A hard push is good sometimes; often its the only way to impress and get through. I used to push harder than I do now; those were the days! I remember them well. I was a lot more aggressive and unyielding. I used to go head hunting. But that was another time.

I hope you post more and mature in your approach in time. Give your views and don't hold back. Peace.

7luminaries
21-12-2015, 03:12 PM
I think the future of humanity is based on conscious spirituality; this is just how important it is.

I haven't read the whole thread, but I agree completely with this statement. Full stop. Conscious and engaged spirituality.

Peace & blessings,
7L

mickiel
21-12-2015, 05:13 PM
I haven't read the whole thread, but I agree completely with this statement. Full stop. Conscious and engaged spirituality.

Peace & blessings,
7L


Oh yes, conscious and " Engaged Spirituality"; because many don't engage their spirituality. They don't use it. Its a horrible thing to neglect your spirituality, its like removing your eyes from your body and deciding to live blind; you handicap yourself. Oh you can live without them, but you limit your sight.

Consciousness was not meant to be limited, it was designed to flourish and expand. And I do believe it was designed. I think our conscious ability was deliberately done, I don't subscribe to the group who feel it developed itself from nothing. If you walk down a street and see a dime on the ground, you think not much of it. You walk further and see 3 dimes on the ground, you may begin to suspect something, maybe they were accidently dropped. Then you go further and see 100 dimes on the ground, each in rows of ten and standing perfectly balanced on their edges; now you can KNOW that this was " Deliberate"; deliberately done.

I view human conscious spirit as deliberate; definite patterns of uncanny real power to reason.

mickiel
22-12-2015, 09:09 PM
The Spirit is much like a ghost inside of us, but the ghost is you! Its your consciousness ; your inner being. You can have a conversation with it; talk with yourself, because it is your self. The ghost in you.

Curious-one
22-12-2015, 09:35 PM
Excellent question.
How can we not have a spiritual moment if we are unconscious? We have to be conscious to have a spiritual happening. I had one today and it was wonderful fantastic great. I was a calm and peace within my self all day. Curious-One :smile:

mickiel
25-12-2015, 04:47 PM
Excellent question.
How can we not have a spiritual moment if we are unconscious? We have to be conscious to have a spiritual happening. I had one today and it was wonderful fantastic great. I was a calm and peace within my self all day. Curious-One :smile:


I think we live in times where these kind's of experiences are magnifying and happening more often. Proof that human consciousness is indeed evolving, in my view. The consciousness was designed to evolve; to move and have being.

mickiel
27-12-2015, 05:26 PM
You don't want to take away the Spirit , its the key to conscious success.

Light Seeker
27-12-2015, 11:33 PM
I think the future of humanity is based on conscious spirituality; this is just how important it is.

I don't know... I rather feel that the future of Humanity is very much aligned to the mass migration of consciousness both individual and collectively to a different plain of existence.

I say this because I cannot rightly see in all clarity this good Earths ability to continue sustain our ever growing(population) physical demands. I have not even factored in pestilence, famine, weather, earthquake, meteor strike or eruption and war (all of which are possible agents of our ascension).

I am no doom mongerer, but realistic . Which I why I say look to that which carries on without need for physical sustenance. The discarnate aspects of yourself ...the sub conscious.

mickiel
28-12-2015, 02:50 AM
I don't know... I rather feel that the future of Humanity is very much aligned to the mass migration of consciousness both individual and collectively to a different plain of existence.

I say this because I cannot rightly see in all clarity this good Earths ability to continue sustain our ever growing(population) physical demands. I have not even factored in pestilence, famine, weather, earthquake, meteor strike or eruption and war (all of which are possible agents of our ascension).

I am no doom mongerer, but realistic . Which I why I say look to that which carries on without need for physical sustenance. The discarnate aspects of yourself ...the sub conscious.


Well I certainly agree, I think we are collectively headed for a different plane of existence.

7luminaries
30-12-2015, 04:56 PM
Oh yes, conscious and " Engaged Spirituality"; because many don't engage their spirituality. They don't use it. Its a horrible thing to neglect your spirituality, its like removing your eyes from your body and deciding to live blind; you handicap yourself. Oh you can live without them, but you limit your sight.

Consciousness was not meant to be limited, it was designed to flourish and expand. And I do believe it was designed. I think our conscious ability was deliberately done, I don't subscribe to the group who feel it developed itself from nothing. If you walk down a street and see a dime on the ground, you think not much of it. You walk further and see 3 dimes on the ground, you may begin to suspect something, maybe they were accidently dropped. Then you go further and see 100 dimes on the ground, each in rows of ten and standing perfectly balanced on their edges; now you can KNOW that this was " Deliberate"; deliberately done.

I view human conscious spirit as deliberate; definite patterns of uncanny real power to reason.

Agreed - I can't think of anything more uncomfortable than living the unexamined life, except perhaps self-reflecting but then consciously not living in alignment with my centre.

That is perhaps the hardest of all to understand...once on the path of awareness, why it is that some (many) consciously turn away from that which would more fully bring them into the fullness of their being.

Peace & blessings,
7L

mickiel
30-12-2015, 08:03 PM
Agreed - I can't think of anything more uncomfortable than living the unexamined life, except perhaps self-reflecting but then consciously not living in alignment with my centre.

That is perhaps the hardest of all to understand...once on the path of awareness, why it is that some (many) consciously turn away from that which would more fully bring them into the fullness of their being.

Peace & blessings,
7L


It may well be that there are many dangerous detours that life just brings which knock many off of the path and they get unaligned. Even a car needs alignment from time to time , or it will steer crooked. People are allowing too many things outside of themselves to drive them.

mickiel
01-01-2016, 09:38 PM
I think our consciousness is a receipt of our future!

Shinsoo
02-01-2016, 12:15 AM
Consciousness for me is just another term for awareness, it is deeply entwined with the concept of love, and as such, it can expand infinitely--there are no limits.

I do think it might be easier to expand it through meditation and a direct connection, however.

mickiel
02-01-2016, 07:37 PM
Consciousness for me is just another term for awareness, it is deeply entwined with the concept of love, and as such, it can expand infinitely--there are no limits.

I do think it might be easier to expand it through meditation and a direct connection, however.


I think consciousness can expand, and love should be entwined with it. I often examine some examples of human consciousness and am left wondering, " Where is the Love?"

mickiel
04-01-2016, 08:52 PM
Where is the love going to be expressed in 2016?