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engellstein
15-10-2015, 12:22 AM
Hey y'all!

I just made an interesting discovery about energy, which led to the question.

I notice i can tell my energy to do things and it'll do it. In general I'm not a very emotionally expressive person. So I told my energy to express itself in my body and then my body and face lit up full of joy and vitality.

During this experiment I noticed that there seemed to be two emotions battling for space - one was the spiritual energy that I commanded and the other was what I would call my natural state of emotionlessness.

So then I got an idea and I told my energy to express itself through my emotional body and I got a similar surge as before but what came out on my face and body was different. It was more like a combination of worry and unworthiness and wonder.

All of this helped me to realize that there is some kind of disconnect between my energy, emotions, and physical body. I want them to work in tandem and be expressed outwardly so I can actually feel the joy and others can sense it from me too.

That worry/unworthiness/wonder part intrigued me a bit too. If I'm right it could be part of the disconnect. It feels like there's limiting beliefs or protective mechanisms that don't permit me to express myself.

How do I circumnavigate this global-sized problem like a Ferdinand Magellan?

naturesflow
15-10-2015, 12:42 AM
Hey y'all!

I just made an interesting discovery about energy, which led to the question.

I notice i can tell my energy to do things and it'll do it. In general I'm not a very emotionally expressive person. So I told my energy to express itself in my body and then my body and face lit up full of joy and vitality.

During this experiment I noticed that there seemed to be two emotions battling for space - one was the spiritual energy that I commanded and the other was what I would call my natural state of emotionlessness.

So then I got an idea and I told my energy to express itself through my emotional body and I got a similar surge as before but what came out on my face and body was different. It was more like a combination of worry and unworthiness and wonder.

All of this helped me to realize that there is some kind of disconnect between my energy, emotions, and physical body. I want them to work in tandem and be expressed outwardly so I can actually feel the joy and others can sense it from me too.

That worry/unworthiness/wonder part intrigued me a bit too. If I'm right it could be part of the disconnect. It feels like there's limiting beliefs or protective mechanisms that don't permit me to express myself.

How do I circumnavigate this global-sized problem like a Ferdinand Magellan?

Imagine your Einstein?

engellstein
15-10-2015, 02:35 PM
Imagine your Einstein?

I see what you did there lol. I like that.

naturesflow
15-10-2015, 10:31 PM
I see what you did there lol. I like that.

So if you were Einstein... imagine? what would you do?

naturesflow
15-10-2015, 10:33 PM
I will give you a hint from my Einstein imaginings..:D

If you can speak directly to your body and manage energy, imagine what you can do in every other way of your body?

engellstein
16-10-2015, 12:37 AM
If you can speak directly to your body and manage energy, imagine what you can do in every other way of your body?

I do communicate with my body/self. The problem there is that the info I get is sometimes accurate, sometimes inaccurate. In kinesiology they say you get a 90% accuracy reading. I'd say I get between 40-50% accuracy.

And I notice too that I have to keep things very simple. If I ask for too specific of an answer it's probably going to be wrong most of the time. General questions are more accurate but not enough to warrant faith on my part.

The odd part is that while all that is going on I can sense a hand directing my life's affairs overall. And I will get insights that come from out of nowhere that are right on the money. When my body gives me some type of channeled answer however I can't rely on what it's saying.

Therefore I poke and prod and test things all over the place and see what patterns come up and what things seem to work and what things aren't getting me anywhere.

The reason for the thread's question is because I feel that this body disconnect is somehow linked to my channeling unreliability and I want that fixed. It's very frustrating having this ability to get replies back to your questions and it not mean anything. I may as well be talking to the wall.

Deepsoul
16-10-2015, 01:11 AM
Divine energy expresses itself as love and light and positivity and it is wonderful ,accessing it and staying there can be challenging because most hold limiting beliefs in degrees ,as you see your so called uncomfortable emotions let yourself be at peace with them ,after you have acknowledged it allow your self to really feel it reach out or in whichever is required and ask for understanding of how you can work with it so that it will be transformed into love and light and joy,,,usually for me I just need to love more ,summon more courage and generally have more gratitude, in fact handing it all over to God with those thoughts in mind ,is required for me then he just guides on.

Mr Interesting
16-10-2015, 01:14 AM
I find that which needs fixing isn't in need of fixing so much as an approach which allows how that which isn't broken to enlighten us as to why we might think it is broken.

I know that sounds really obtuse but it's the journey thing over the destination thing and my hat's off to you for being as precise as you are. With my own stuff it's kinda like the emotional body is just a slow learner and I actually quite like that because it simply gives me time to just let it be and that has some quite interesting side tracks into empathy and compassion... or I may be dying. But even with that the energetic thing is so fast as to almost have gone so far forward that it's now pushing from behind... who knows?

All fun and games in the Big House.

Deepsoul
16-10-2015, 01:40 AM
Massive revelation while standing in my kitchen ,in a bit of discomfort physically today from food intolerances and just then it was like Whoa ok its a bit uncomfortable but you know what its from and then bang Unworthiness I felt that when Im feeling this way I feel unworthy never saw that one before ,anyway like you say Mr interesting all fun in the big mansion lol, So I just yelled out I am not Unworthy and starting doing a song and dance with worthiness as its theme.........:toothy1: :headbang:

dryad
16-10-2015, 04:29 AM
It helps to have a framework so that you can understand how your energy and the different parts of yourself separate out and how they interact. Once you understand them then you work on putting them back together into one coherent self.

You can start with four levels.
Subconscious (thats were the core beliefs and unworthiness is coming from).
Etheric (emotions and energy closely linked to the physical)
Aura (same level as the etheric but expands outward to include more. This is where the levels interact. This is the spiritual energy you mention)
Higher self and Soul (can be two separate levels. Access to light, guidance and higher energies. Larger self)

The mind is only the etheric and aura. The subconscious is a strong influence but you are rarely aware of it directly. The guidance you feel comes from the higher self but it's a subtle influence. You can choose to ignore or override it's suggestions where ignoring the subconscious influence is much harder. The unreliability you experience is because you are asking the etheric. It can answer things about you and your physical and emotional state but beyond that you won't get accuracy. Try asking your higher self. There are other aspects that also influence us too but those will be enough to start looking at the way emotions and core beliefs interact with your energy. Hope it helps.

naturesflow
16-10-2015, 05:13 AM
I do communicate with my body/self. The problem there is that the info I get is sometimes accurate, sometimes inaccurate. In kinesiology they say you get a 90% accuracy reading. I'd say I get between 40-50% accuracy.


And I notice too that I have to keep things very simple. If I ask for too specific of an answer it's probably going to be wrong most of the time. General questions are more accurate but not enough to warrant faith on my part.

The odd part is that while all that is going on I can sense a hand directing my life's affairs overall. And I will get insights that come from out of nowhere that are right on the money. When my body gives me some type of channeled answer however I can't rely on what it's saying.

Therefore I poke and prod and test things all over the place and see what patterns come up and what things seem to work and what things aren't getting me anywhere.

The reason for the thread's question is because I feel that this body disconnect is somehow linked to my channeling unreliability and I want that fixed. It's very frustrating having this ability to get replies back to your questions and it not mean anything. I may as well be talking to the wall.


Well why not seek some support with another through Kiniesology to clear this out. I did a couple of years with one to help me connect deeper. It worked.
Can you afford to see one?

Sometimes playing around to much can bring more confusion, where as direct connection through the support of another who will synch up with you to help you clear in their clarity often brings you what you need..

Lorelyen
16-10-2015, 03:41 PM
How do you separate the emotional from the spiritual "body"?

(Aside)

Well why not seek some support with another through Kiniesology to clear this out
.....And you talk about me with long words??? What's that when it's about?

:smile:

...

naturesflow
16-10-2015, 05:43 PM
[QUOTE=Lorelyen]How do you separate the emotional from the spiritual "body"?

Perceived disconnection in feeling this?

(Aside)

.....And you talk about me with long words??? What's that when it's about?

What's that when it's about?

I am confused by this sentence? It either makes sense and I am missing the point or your drunk on coffee and missing the point? Or am I the point? Or you? Anyway further explanation might ease my confusion and I then, may understand what you mean in the way you mean and have conveyed this..

engellstein
16-10-2015, 10:54 PM
I find that which needs fixing isn't in need of fixing so much as an approach which allows how that which isn't broken to enlighten us as to why we might think it is broken.

I know that sounds really obtuse but it's the journey thing over the destination thing and my hat's off to you for being as precise as you are. With my own stuff it's kinda like the emotional body is just a slow learner and I actually quite like that because it simply gives me time to just let it be and that has some quite interesting side tracks into empathy and compassion... or I may be dying. But even with that the energetic thing is so fast as to almost have gone so far forward that it's now pushing from behind... who knows?

All fun and games in the Big House.

Very Interesting way of wording this. (pun intended) lol.

I agree that the journey to discovery can be quite an adventure if you let it, and I definitely agree that going through stuff can help you develop empathy. I aspire to be a teacher of this stuff eventually and a teacher can teach nothing if he can't understand the struggle or POV of his pupils.

Outside of that I see no good in any of this. What it manages to do is keep my life in a standstill. It creates obstacles on my path and hinders me from moving around them. The quicker I can learn what's going on and get past it the quicker I can evolve my understanding into something useful.

It does feel kinda like the Big House lol (jail).

engellstein
16-10-2015, 10:59 PM
It helps to have a framework so that you can understand how your energy and the different parts of yourself separate out and how they interact. Once you understand them then you work on putting them back together into one coherent self.

You can start with four levels.
Subconscious (thats were the core beliefs and unworthiness is coming from).
Etheric (emotions and energy closely linked to the physical)
Aura (same level as the etheric but expands outward to include more. This is where the levels interact. This is the spiritual energy you mention)
Higher self and Soul (can be two separate levels. Access to light, guidance and higher energies. Larger self)

The mind is only the etheric and aura. The subconscious is a strong influence but you are rarely aware of it directly. The guidance you feel comes from the higher self but it's a subtle influence. You can choose to ignore or override it's suggestions where ignoring the subconscious influence is much harder. The unreliability you experience is because you are asking the etheric. It can answer things about you and your physical and emotional state but beyond that you won't get accuracy. Try asking your higher self. There are other aspects that also influence us too but those will be enough to start looking at the way emotions and core beliefs interact with your energy. Hope it helps.

I like that breakdown, dryad. Are there any books or materials you would recommend with more info on how that works, with all the bodies working together?

I was under the impression that the aura was the energy field created by the chakras.

engellstein
16-10-2015, 11:04 PM
Well why not seek some support with another through Kiniesology to clear this out. I did a couple of years with one to help me connect deeper. It worked.
Can you afford to see one?

Sometimes playing around to much can bring more confusion, where as direct connection through the support of another who will synch up with you to help you clear in their clarity often brings you what you need..

I honestly don't know much about kinesiology. I just learned it exists a week ago. I heard the term muscle testing and that took me to applied kinesiology. I was looking at that because I was looking for alternative avenues to access higher self.

What I found was I get the same answers from muscle testing as I get from just channeling the answer. Channeling a yes or no is a lot easier than messing with muscles. So IOW, kinesiology is no more accurate for me than direct talking.

engellstein
16-10-2015, 11:06 PM
How do you separate the emotional from the spiritual "body"?

IDK. Some people say we aren't one body but several bodies working together. So there's an energy body, an astral body, an emotion body, a physical body, a spirit body, etc.

Idk if that's accurate but it gives me a foundation to work from.

engellstein
16-10-2015, 11:22 PM
I discovered something today haha, always on the move.

I discovered several things actually. I said "express joy through my physical body" and I felt joy surge through me. I said "express joy through my emotional body" and I felt the same joy surge but it was different. it was very serene and toned down.

Then I said "express anger through my physical body" and I felt super mad and my face tightened up. Then I said "express anger through my emotional body" and, again, I felt the same thing but it was very serene again.

Later on I was walking in the park on a trail. Whenever I do that I kinda get dizzy and branches and trees are kinda spinning around and looks like double vision. I got the idea to turn my emotions off for some reason. I said "disable emotions" and all of the sudden everything around me stopped "moving" and became very still and crisp and clear. I said "enable emotions" and everything went all weird again in an instant.

Another thing I noticed doing that: I usually squint in the light of the bright sun. I always thought that the sun was too intense. But when I said "disable emotions" all the sudden I stopped squinting and I was perfectly fine. When I "enabled emotions" I instantly -needed- to squint again because the sun really hurts my eyes and I can't not squint.

This is some pretty interesting mojo. I invite everyone reading this to try this out and post anything interesting that happens. :)

Another thing that I did was talk to my high self after saying "disable emotions" and I got different responses to questions than before. I still need to verify accuracy but the conclusion that I'm drawing currently is that something about my emotions are holding me back from getting a good connection to my higher consciousness.

It seems that I haven't been aware of this because these emotions are not registering outwardly. It's like I can be feeling anger in my emotional body and be happy on the outside and not even be aware that there is anger going on inside. I don't like that. Maybe that started happening to protect myself when I was young for some reason. It's not serving me now though.

dryad
17-10-2015, 05:00 PM
I like that breakdown,are there any books or materials you would recommend with more info on how that works, with all the bodies working together?

I was under the impression that the aura was the energy field created by the chakras.
Any book on auras will do. they are mostly similar and the details are not as important because its just a framework to help you understand. It's just energy so it merges and crosses over any boundaries we set anyway.

The way i see it....The aura is the entire energy field. Chakras are concentration points within the aura and they connect the aura and etheric layers. The etheric is both part of the aura but also exists on a slightly different level which is more a change in density than an up or down level. It is closer to the physical so can be used to create physical changes. Emotions originate in the etheric and can be stored as residual energy in the aura. Chakras can open into different sections of the subconscious. Use that to find those core beliefs you want to change.

Suppressing emotions and not even being aware of what is just under the surface is easy when you choose to be a certain way but don't address the emotions themselves. I was suprised when told I had a lot of anger because I hardly ever feel it or express it because I don't want to be that way. When I looked for it though I found it and realized that everything I felt as mild annoyance or frustration was anger that was held below the surface so I didn't even feel it's full strength. When you are aware of it you can choose to let it go but you have to find it first.

Lorelyen
17-10-2015, 07:03 PM
How do you separate the emotional from the spiritual "body"?

Perceived disconnection in feeling this?
That sounds dead on - perceived. Kind of...a touch of pigeon-holing for some particular view on being? Threads often appear where posters want to address emotional issues independently of spirit.

(Aside)

.....And you talk about me with long words??? What's that when it's about?

What's that when it's about?

I am confused by this sentence? It either makes sense and I am missing the point or your drunk on coffee and missing the point? Or am I the point? Or you? Anyway further explanation might ease my confusion and I then, may understand what you mean in the way you mean and have conveyed this..
Oh dear...mind, today seems a day for point missing. I've just tried to follow a thread with a lot of deliberate point missing - to promote contention it would seem. (I think I'm on the culprit's ignore list and I'm really staving off the temptation of mischief. You know me - totally opposed to mischief. :wink:) Quite frustrating. It's enough to drive one to drink. But back to the point, I'm unsure why my point doesn't point to your point. Is it me again?

I wondered what that long word meant/was about; kinestheology or....wait a mo...(just having to wind back through the thread - it was a very complicated word.....got it...) Kiniesology. Is it safe?

I'd look it up on google but I'm getting right google-eyed with all the point missing going on....

Quick, pass the percolator...! (if you please).

:smile:

engellstein
17-10-2015, 07:37 PM
I wondered what that long word meant/was about; kinestheology or....wait a mo...(just having to wind back through the thread - it was a very complicated word.....got it...) Kiniesology. Is it safe?

It's spelled kinesiology lol. The term by itself refers to the science of body movement. There's something called Applied Kinesiology that has to do with muscle testing which is a way of talking with your subconscious.

They explain it that when you ask a question that is a no or negative anwers, or if you make a statement that is false, the energy in your body constricts and you lose a bit of power in your muscles. So if you ask a question and the answer is positive then your muscle won't move, if you ask a question and the answer is negative your muscle will give way to the pressure applied.

I don't see how it's not safe. Seems to work great for people. Maybe in my case I need another person to do it with me to get more accurate results from it. But I'd rather save the money and figure it out myself.

engellstein
17-10-2015, 07:45 PM
The way i see it....The aura is the entire energy field. Chakras are concentration points within the aura and they connect the aura and etheric layers. The etheric is both part of the aura but also exists on a slightly different level which is more a change in density than an up or down level. It is closer to the physical so can be used to create physical changes. Emotions originate in the etheric and can be stored as residual energy in the aura. Chakras can open into different sections of the subconscious. Use that to find those core beliefs you want to change.

This is an interesting explanation. Thanks :) I've read somewhere that there is an energy or higher body that is basically the physical body. Some have called it our matrix. It's like the framework the physical body is build on and it's the area you have to work on in order to get healed from illness. Is that right?

Suppressing emotions and not even being aware of what is just under the surface is easy when you choose to be a certain way but don't address the emotions themselves. I was suprised when told I had a lot of anger because I hardly ever feel it or express it because I don't want to be that way. When I looked for it though I found it and realized that everything I felt as mild annoyance or frustration was anger that was held below the surface so I didn't even feel it's full strength.

This is what I was talking about in one of those previous posts. I was surprised when I saw that I was quite angry or scared when I was feeling pretty good consciously. That's kinda weird that true emotions can be lurking under the surface and the emoter of those emotions doesn't even know it lol.

When you are aware of it you can choose to let it go but you have to find it first.

I've been letting it go by making my emotions surface and then using f-eft technique to neutralize them. I've had to do it over and over again but I suppose I've noticed a little difference. I guess I have my work cut out for me.

Lorelyen
17-10-2015, 07:46 PM
^^^ Ah. I get it. Thank you.

:smile:

dryad
18-10-2015, 06:58 AM
This is an interesting explanation. Thanks :) I've read somewhere that there is an energy or higher body that is basically the physical body. Some have called it our matrix. It's like the framework the physical body is build on and it's the area you have to work on in order to get healed from illness. Is that right?

That would be the etheric. Its like an energy copy of the body. Seen as a grey mist that follows the shape of the body. (Etheric is body shaped. Aura is egg shaped) Working on the etheric can create physical changes like accelerating the healing process of an injury or to block pain.

Illnesses might heal from changing the etheric but depends what is causing it and how far the damage spreads. Illness can start in the physical and spread to the aura (eg poisoning) or start in the aura and eventually manifest in physical symptoms. You can work on physical aspects through the etheric but you may also need to work on the aura and soul and perhaps past lives as well. I have also seen past life issues stop injuries from healing properly. Past lives manifest between etheric and aura and can affect both. For example I might see ripples in the aura caused by a past life or a shackle on the etheric ankle of someone with a past life in slavery.


I've been letting it go by making my emotions surface and then using f-eft technique to neutralize them. I've had to do it over and over again but I suppose I've noticed a little difference. I guess I have my work cut out for me.

With the amount of energy control and being able to communicate with aspects of yourself that you describe you should be able to do that a lot quicker.

Muscle tension is a clue to go looking for deeper emotions. You cant suppress negative emotions without it causing the muscles to tense up. And the opposite... if you have a muscle knot that you can't release look at which emotion is holding it that way. I can release knots that physio can't cos I release the emotion first.

So once you find the emotion extend your awareness into it. See it as a cloud. You take control of the whole cloud and you release it or purify it.

naturesflow
18-10-2015, 07:51 AM
[QUOTE=Lorelyen]That sounds dead on - perceived. Kind of...a touch of pigeon-holing for some particular view on being? Threads often appear where posters want to address emotional issues independently of spirit.


I know first hand this disconnection in feeling. And yes it very much feels like its independent from spirit, until you open more fully to the larger picture of your mind body spirit connection as a complete source of itself. Its a journey Lorelyn...it is...we cant rush these things..:wink:


Oh dear...mind, today seems a day for point missing. I've just tried to follow a thread with a lot of deliberate point missing - to promote contention it would seem. (I think I'm on the culprit's ignore list and I'm really staving off the temptation of mischief. You know me - totally opposed to mischief. :wink:) Quite frustrating. It's enough to drive one to drink. But back to the point, I'm unsure why my point doesn't point to your point. Is it me again?

Lets just leave it at point taken. As the point was needed to be taken - as not needed..As for miss chief making, be the miss or chief if you want. No skin off my nose, just don't scalp me please...

I wondered what that long word meant/was about; kinestheology or....wait a mo...(just having to wind back through the thread - it was a very complicated word.....got it...) Kiniesology. Is it safe?

I'd look it up on google but I'm getting right google-eyed with all the point missing going on....

I see you have been informed. In fact I am going to complete my kiniesology hopefully by early next year..So when I am in the zone more fully, I shall personally come and visit you and give you a free session, if you want, experience is the best teacher, so they say..:wink:

Quick, pass the percolator...! (if you please).

Seriously coffee really does solve the worlds problems, more people should drink it!


Your always smiling..:smile:

engellstein
19-10-2015, 12:34 AM
Illness can start in the physical and spread to the aura (eg poisoning) or start in the aura and eventually manifest in physical symptoms.

So if you have a candida infestation it's like the disruption in the aura from negative emotion caused the yeast to take root and proliferate, then the yeast in that unmanageable form releases toxins which effects both your physical and auric systems. So in order to get rid of it you have to address the toxin, the yeast, and the emotional dysfunction in the aura. Is that right?

With the amount of energy control and being able to communicate with aspects of yourself that you describe you should be able to do that a lot quicker.

That's the funny thing, I seem to be able to only make a change for a brief moment. For example, if I sense I'm feeling angry (perhaps because I can feel my brow tense up) I can say "cancel anger" or something like that, and the muscle tension will release and I'll feel a calmness. Perhaps less than 5 seconds later that tension will be back.

I can use the f-eft while i'm feeling it and I'll notice it goes away and it will stay away for longer but I think it finds other beliefs that allow it to resurface eventually. By eventually I mean either moments later or seconds.

So this energy control is interesting and is helping me see some stuff, but it's not lasting so far.

--
Another thing about this control is it seems some things I can control super easy and other things are impossible. For example, I've tried controlling things in my physical body like my heart beat. Yesterday I think I ate something that was making my heart race and beat kinda hard, so I told myself to slow my heart down, and it actually did to a small degree.

I wanted it to go back to normal though and so I commanded a bunch of other stuff and none of it would make the beat rate go down any. I'm assuming there was some chemical or hormone in my body that was making my heart run overtime, so I was focusing on those and still nothing would change.

So I'm seeing that I have a degree of control over energetic stuff most of all and some physical/emotional manifestations of that energy, but I don't know why some work and some don't, and why they don't stick.

Muscle tension is a clue to go looking for deeper emotions. You cant suppress negative emotions without it causing the muscles to tense up. And the opposite... if you have a muscle knot that you can't release look at which emotion is holding it that way. I can release knots that physio can't cos I release the emotion first.

So once you find the emotion extend your awareness into it. See it as a cloud. You take control of the whole cloud and you release it or purify it.

Wow. This one really works. I had a nasty kink in my neck from idk what and I closed my eyes, and turned my head slightly until the pain started to come in, and told myself to focus on the emotion there and release it, and the pain started to lift up. I kept moving my head further and further until most of it was gone.

Super cool junk!

Gem
19-10-2015, 01:17 AM
Hey y'all!

I just made an interesting discovery about energy, which led to the question.

I notice i can tell my energy to do things and it'll do it. In general I'm not a very emotionally expressive person. So I told my energy to express itself in my body and then my body and face lit up full of joy and vitality.

During this experiment I noticed that there seemed to be two emotions battling for space - one was the spiritual energy that I commanded and the other was what I would call my natural state of emotionlessness.

So then I got an idea and I told my energy to express itself through my emotional body and I got a similar surge as before but what came out on my face and body was different. It was more like a combination of worry and unworthiness and wonder.

All of this helped me to realize that there is some kind of disconnect between my energy, emotions, and physical body. I want them to work in tandem and be expressed outwardly so I can actually feel the joy and others can sense it from me too.

That worry/unworthiness/wonder part intrigued me a bit too. If I'm right it could be part of the disconnect. It feels like there's limiting beliefs or protective mechanisms that don't permit me to express myself.

How do I circumnavigate this global-sized problem like a Ferdinand Magellan?
I think fragmenting things into categorical distinctions, this body and that body, removes the actuality of how things are experienced and makes a representation of it - much like one actually experiences the landscape and its reality is then represented by a map. This map is the disconnect of actual experience into knowledge about the experience.

When it comes to the various physical emotional and energy, the actuality is this is a description of sensation alone, because all these which are defined separately on the map are all actually felt, and we don't have different things in actuality; we solely have sensation.

dryad
19-10-2015, 01:55 PM
Ok. Sounds like your shifting energy around but not actually changing it. Like pushing it away but it comes back as soon as you stop pushing. Could be the way you are giving commands from a distance instead of controlling the energy directly. Also has something to do with the autopilot systems. The aura runs itself when your not paying attention to it and even when you do take conscious control it's like controlling a river that still flows where it wants and you can just guide it here and there. Most of it is still on autopilot.

Also dont expect your subconscious to let you make changes to things that could be potentially dangerous. We are not capable of consciously controlling things like heart rate or hormone balance or digestion so the subconscious won't give us access to that. The most we can do is slight changes by pushing the overall system in directions we want but it will rebalance itself.

dryad
19-10-2015, 02:11 PM
I think fragmenting things into categorical distinctions, this body and that body, removes the actuality of how things are experienced and makes a representation of it - much like one actually experiences the landscape and its reality is then represented by a map. This map is the disconnect of actual experience into knowledge about the experience.

When it comes to the various physical emotional and energy, the actuality is this is a description of sensation alone, because all these which are defined separately on the map are all actually felt, and we don't have different things in actuality; we solely have sensation.
Well of course but we can learn things from a map that are not apparent from a limited perspective inside the experience. the map means nothing without the experience to give it substance. And thats why im suggesting a simple system where all the separate levels can cross over and interact with each other because they do. But we need a way to interpret what we see and feel to develop any kind of control. Although effective control often means surrendering that control to aspects of yourself that are better suited to it.

Lorelyen
19-10-2015, 04:04 PM
I know first hand this disconnection in feeling. And yes it very much feels like its independent from spirit, until you open more fully to the larger picture of your mind body spirit connection as a complete source of itself. Its a journey Lorelyn...it is...we cant rush these things..:wink:
It honestly seems a long time ago that I separated emotion from spirit as, to me, spirit is "being" and emotion is a veritable tangle around parts of that being. The whole person/being/entity. I put sensation in that same mix. I couldn't regard sensuality as anything separate from spirit either. Both can arise from either or both external and internal stimuli.


Lets just leave it at point taken. As the point was needed to be taken - as not needed..As for miss chief making, be the miss or chief if you want. No skin off my nose, just don't scalp me please...Wha-a-at? Never! Hair today, gone tomorrow....one shouldn't interfere with that process. It's like moments - first they're here...or hair...then they're gone. But...you can put ribbons around your hair or flowers in it which you can't with moments....unless you're nifty. Nope. Threatening someone's hair is sacrilege! :wink:

I see you have been informed. In fact I am going to complete my kiniesology hopefully by early next year..So when I am in the zone more fully, I shall personally come and visit you and give you a free session, if you want, experience is the best teacher, so they say..:wink:
Then I'll have the percolator going. It is good to experience the best teacher. Does coffee and kneesology go together....sorry, what was it again, it is such a complicated word......but if it's an ology it must be good. (It was interesting to read about though; has many applications. (meant seriously))

Um...what zone will you be in?

But it's time I checked another thread to see if I got an answer. I'm pretty ok with bullometry...measuring bull and I think someone was trying to share some. :D

à tout à l’heure

Tanemon
19-10-2015, 04:54 PM
Very valuable discussion. Thanks for starting it, engellstein.

Dryad, how do you see the 'seeds' from past lives interacting with any of the four levels you described? A child is born with a mother and possibly a family, a certain genetic inheritance, a certain physical condition at birth, an initial social environment, etc.

I could guess these things involve fundamental subconscious elements, and also the etheric (emotional life) and aura. How do you view it?

Rokon
19-10-2015, 04:56 PM
How to sync emotional and spiritual bodies
Hey y'all...
How do I circumnavigate this global-sized problem like a Ferdinand Magellan?

That is likely the biggest problem for manifested creation. And its a massive problem. I think the diminishing of Heart is a direct result of this imbalance. I'm not really into the Hindu tradition but look at what Shiva/Shakti represent. When Shiva and Shakti combine, creation arises. And without balance we lose heart and man, heartlessness abounds.

Molearner
19-10-2015, 05:10 PM
It's spelled kinesiology lol. The term by itself refers to the science of body movement. There's something called Applied Kinesiology that has to do with muscle testing which is a way of talking with your subconscious.

They explain it that when you ask a question that is a no or negative anwers, or if you make a statement that is false, the energy in your body constricts and you lose a bit of power in your muscles. So if you ask a question and the answer is positive then your muscle won't move, if you ask a question and the answer is negative your muscle will give way to the pressure applied.

I don't see how it's not safe. Seems to work great for people. Maybe in my case I need another person to do it with me to get more accurate results from it. But I'd rather save the money and figure it out myself.

engellstein,

If you speak of this you are probably familiar with David R. Hawkines.....author of _Power vs. Force_ and many other books(which are in my library). I was very intrigued with these books at one time but came to a certain amount of skepticism over the efficacy of his methods. I was not able to replicate his results in any meaningful and consistent manner. I still refer to them from time to time allowing that much of what he says has validity but continue to be cautious about endorsing him wholeheartedly.

engellstein
20-10-2015, 04:26 AM
I think fragmenting things into categorical distinctions, this body and that body, removes the actuality of how things are experienced and makes a representation of it - much like one actually experiences the landscape and its reality is then represented by a map. This map is the disconnect of actual experience into knowledge about the experience.

When it comes to the various physical emotional and energy, the actuality is this is a description of sensation alone, because all these which are defined separately on the map are all actually felt, and we don't have different things in actuality; we solely have sensation.

I'm kinda seeing it like those "bodies" are different macro-organs, or whatever you want to call big organs lol.

Think of your physical body. What's it made of? A collection of organs.

In reality, that's not true. There is not body outside of the collection of organs. The body is the sum total of all the organs working together.

Likewise if you accept that there are other higher bodies working with the physical body, that's really a misnomer. Really, all those bodies - as a sum total - are the Body, Us, Who We Are.

The word "body" is like the word "nation". A nation is just a label of a collection of people. Without the people there is no nation.

engellstein
20-10-2015, 04:29 AM
engellstein,

If you speak of this you are probably familiar with David R. Hawkines.....author of _Power vs. Force_ and many other books(which are in my library). I was very intrigued with these books at one time but came to a certain amount of skepticism over the efficacy of his methods. I was not able to replicate his results in any meaningful and consistent manner. I still refer to them from time to time allowing that much of what he says has validity but continue to be cautious about endorsing him wholeheartedly.

I've just recently heard of that book. Haven't read it yet. I'm finding that emotions/vibration can determine how well that works. But that seems to be the case for me. I'm really curious why so many others can be in the dumps and seem to get accurate info from subconscious or higher sources.

engellstein
20-10-2015, 04:33 AM
How to sync emotional and spiritual bodies


That is likely the biggest problem for manifested creation. And its a massive problem. I think the diminishing of Heart is a direct result of this imbalance. I'm not really into the Hindu tradition but look at what Shiva/Shakti represent. When Shiva and Shakti combine, creation arises. And without balance we lose heart and man, heartlessness abounds.

That's an interesting observation. Something I've noticed is that since becoming aware of spiritual energy and stuff I've had a ring-shaped pain around my heart. I know it's not a physical heart problem. It's like too much energy is passing through my heart chakra but it's meeting up with too much blockage and that perhaps is the pain I feel.

I've been working a lot on higher emotion lately and have noticed since I started doing that the heart pain has been easing up. It's a world of difference right now.

I was thinking, like you say, that that could be a source of my issues here on this topic. It does seem to relate.

engellstein
20-10-2015, 04:40 AM
Ok. Sounds like your shifting energy around but not actually changing it. Like pushing it away but it comes back as soon as you stop pushing. Could be the way you are giving commands from a distance instead of controlling the energy directly. Also has something to do with the autopilot systems. The aura runs itself when your not paying attention to it and even when you do take conscious control it's like controlling a river that still flows where it wants and you can just guide it here and there. Most of it is still on autopilot.

Also dont expect your subconscious to let you make changes to things that could be potentially dangerous. We are not capable of consciously controlling things like heart rate or hormone balance or digestion so the subconscious won't give us access to that. The most we can do is slight changes by pushing the overall system in directions we want but it will rebalance itself.

Ha. Yeah, I figured my subconscious would be better at regulating my molecules than me lol. It's just weird how I can change an emotion or energy in an instant with a word, yet not effect any change at all elsewhere. The physical must be the end-manifestation of all the rest that goes on under the surface, and we have more control over those inner layers than the outer ones. It's like we're in control of the quantum soup and the universe takes care of the manifestation.

engellstein
20-10-2015, 05:01 AM
Very valuable discussion. Thanks for starting it, engellstein

Your welcome. I was hoping people would test this stuff out themselves to see if it works for them and post their results. Either no one is having success or no one wants to comment about it. :(

Gem
20-10-2015, 07:05 AM
YI'm kinda seeing it like those "bodies" are different macro-organs, or whatever you want to call big organs lol.

Think of your physical body. What's it made of? A collection of organs.

In reality, that's not true. There is not body outside of the collection of organs. The body is the sum total of all the organs working together.

Likewise if you accept that there are other higher bodies working with the physical body, that's really a misnomer. Really, all those bodies - as a sum total - are the Body, Us, Who We Are.

The word "body" is like the word "nation". A nation is just a label of a collection of people. Without the people there is no nation.

I think the notion of 'bodies' is great to define a thing we talk about, but it isn't the actuality of experience. The actuality is more the awareness of sensation prior to defining the bodies. I claim sensation is the sync.

engellstein
20-10-2015, 07:38 AM
I think the notion of 'bodies' is great to define a thing we talk about, but it isn't the actuality of experience. The actuality is more the awareness of sensation prior to defining the bodies. I claim sensation is the sync.

Can you expound on this? I don't really get what you're saying.

Gem
20-10-2015, 09:26 AM
Can you expound on this? I don't really get what you're saying.


The way we reference bodies is the description of the sensation of which we actually aware, and I claim that that the physical, emotional and energy bodies are synced by that awareness of sensation.

dryad
20-10-2015, 01:56 PM
Ha. Yeah, I figured my subconscious would be better at regulating my molecules than me lol. It's just weird how I can change an energy in an instant with a word, yet not effect any change at all elsewhere. The physical must be the end-manifestation of all the rest that goes on under the surface, and we have more control over those inner layers than the outer ones. It's like we're in control of the quantum soup and the universe takes care of the manifestation.
Exactly. Actually to manifest physical change is an ability in itself and it requires both control and strength to do so. it will also be limited by the soul in terms of when one is ready to be trusted with such abilities and limited by the subconscious so that you dont go killing yourself by accident. Imagine if you rerouted a few arteries to bypass a major organ. you have to work within the natural patterns. Accelerating the healing process is a good way to make changes but ensure your not doing anything dangerous or unnatural.

It is a lot easier to direct energy and emotion because they dont have a physical presence. But you still need to work with not against its nature. Moving it around is a lot easier than actually changing the nature of the energy itself but that is also possible. Negative emotional energy blocks can be transmuted into positive energy. The frequencies and signatures of energy can be shifted. Its actually essential to developing strength. Otherwise you end up overcharged and unstable.

engellstein
20-10-2015, 10:50 PM
Exactly. Actually to manifest physical change is an ability in itself and it requires both control and strength to do so. it will also be limited by the soul in terms of when one is ready to be trusted with such abilities and limited by the subconscious so that you dont go killing yourself by accident. Imagine if you rerouted a few arteries to bypass a major organ. you have to work within the natural patterns. Accelerating the healing process is a good way to make changes but ensure your not doing anything dangerous or unnatural.

It is a lot easier to direct energy and emotion because they dont have a physical presence. But you still need to work with not against its nature. Moving it around is a lot easier than actually changing the nature of the energy itself but that is also possible. Negative emotional energy blocks can be transmuted into positive energy. The frequencies and signatures of energy can be shifted. Its actually essential to developing strength. Otherwise you end up overcharged and unstable.

Hmm. So I guess I'm off to transmute stuff. If I'm not back in 5 minutes, just wait longer! lol

engellstein
20-10-2015, 10:52 PM
The way we reference bodies is the description of the sensation of which we actually aware, and I claim that that the physical, emotional and energy bodies are synced by that awareness of sensation.

Hmm...I still don't get it lol. What is the sensation that you're referring to? Are you talking holographic universe kinda stuff?

Gem
21-10-2015, 06:52 AM
Hmm...I still don't get it lol. What is the sensation that you're referring to? Are you talking holographic universe kinda stuff?
No, not holographic or anything theoretical or mystical. I simply mean sensation in the everyday meaning of that word. I'm saying that the actuality of experience is one feels sensation, and "physical" "emotional" "spiritual" "energetic" etc merely refer to solid and/or subtle sensations.

dryad
22-10-2015, 08:10 AM
Very valuable discussion. Thanks for starting It, engellstein.

Dryad, how do you see the 'seeds' from past. ives interacting with any of the four levels you described? A child is born with a mother and possibly a family, a certain genetic inheritance, a certain physical condition at birth, an initial social environment, etc.

I could guess these things involve fundamental subconscious elements, and also the etheric (emotional life) and aura. How do you view it?

Hi Tanemon. Well that's where it starts to get complicated. I don't see those things as relating to past lives actually. The past life influences I see come in two kinds. Limiting or beneficial. The limiting ones show up in the aura or etheric field depending on whether they affect us mentally or physically. They often are the reason we make the same mistakes repeatedly and cant seem to move on cos they keep us focused on their own problematic emotions. The major chakra blocks are sometimes past life issues too. They can be released by identifying and addressing their primary issue.

The beneficial ones are either accessed as past life knowledge through the soul level or they may act as guides linking through chakras in the aura level.

The other things you mentioned can affect any of the levels. Genetic patterns manifest through the etheric as physical capabilities and qualities but also affect the aura in which bloodline groups we can tap into and which patterns of the collective unconscious we mirror.

Parents and social environments shape our experiences and what we become to create many of the beliefs and patterns in the subconscious but the initial personality is an imprint of the soul. the soul level often has very little connection to the aura beyond that initial imprint. Part of the awakening process is to increase the connection and energy flow between aura and soul.

Tanemon
22-10-2015, 06:36 PM
Hi Tanemon. Well that's where it starts to get complicated. I don't see those things as relating to past lives actually. The past life influences I see come in two kinds. Limiting or beneficial. The limiting ones show up in the aura or etheric field depending on whether they affect us mentally or physically. They often are the reason we make the same mistakes repeatedly and cant seem to move on cos they keep us focused on their own problematic emotions. The major chakra blocks are sometimes past life issues too. They can be released by identifying and addressing their primary issue.

The beneficial ones are either accessed as past life knowledge through the soul level or they may act as guides linking through chakras in the aura level.

The other things you mentioned can affect any of the levels. Genetic patterns manifest through the etheric as physical capabilities and qualities but also affect the aura in which bloodline groups we can tap into and which patterns of the collective unconscious we mirror.

Parents and social environments shape our experiences and what we become to create many of the beliefs and patterns in the subconscious but the initial personality is an imprint of the soul. the soul level often has very little connection to the aura beyond that initial imprint. Part of the awakening process is to increase the connection and energy flow between aura and soul.
I want to ask you another question, but I also hope the question won't "generalize" away from engellstein's OP (I don't want to hijack the thread). Here goes, tho...

Dryad, could you comment on this... I recently read something purporting to be a channeled message about a deficiency in the personal sense of self-worth among spiritually aware people (and people who naturally seek spiritual awakening early in their lives). The teaching was: the spiritual-type person deals with a subconscious sense of defeat, since in past eras strong individual spirituality has never been able to completely stabilize the human social world. Life after life, the spiritual people haven't had the experience of being reliably able to end turmoil, persecution, and physical threat. Hence, people are still born on Earth with the paradoxical situation of being spiritually aware but feeling ineffectual!

engellstein
22-10-2015, 09:43 PM
I want to ask you another question, but I also hope the question won't "generalize" away from engellstein's OP (I don't want to hijack the thread). Here goes, tho...

Thanks lol, but I think I've got enough from this thread to last me for weeks. I've been making some pretty cool changes. But if I talk of them it'll be in another thread.

Thanks to all the contributors!

dryad
23-10-2015, 09:33 AM
I want to ask you another question, but I also hope the question won't "generalize" away from engellstein's OP (I dont want to hijack the thread). Here goes, tho...

Dryad, could you comment on this... I recently read something purporting to be a channeled message about a deficiency in the personal sense of self-worth among spiritually aware people (and people who naturally seek spiritual awakening early in their lives). The teaching was: the spiritual-type person deals with a subconscious sense of defeat, since in past eras strong individual spirituality has never been able to completely stabilize the human social world. Life after life, the spiritual people haven't had the experience of being reliably able to end turmoil, persecution, and physical threat. Hence, people are still born on Earth with the paradoxical situation of being spiritually aware but feeling ineffectual!

I don't agree with calling it defeat. There is a definite sense of persecution because many past lives have featured that for example through the christian era vs nature based religions but also in more generalised racial and cultural persecution. And not just christian persecution either. Every two thousand years there is a processional change and the dominant god along with their religions on earth shift. We just had one in 2007. Even in the last 20 years there was a witch hunt across America where psychics were hunted and killed. I know of refugees that escaped it but many were killed. Those that have real higher self knowledge don't broadcast it cos we know how dangerous it is. Even on this forum I am careful what i say.

But back to defeat. If you have past life experience of persecution then likely you also have experience of the times between the shifts when the religions were stable and effective. There were thousands of years when druids kept order across Celtic lands. The temples of Egypt and Sumeria were central to their societies too. Vestal virgins were second only to the emperor in Rome.

These are successful religions but the problem is that religions begin the spititual process but they all reach a point where true growth has to move beyond the restrictions that religions need to be viable social constructs. Sometimes it can be accepted and incorporated into the religious patterns sometimes it can't. But when you get to that point you know how powerful you can be so lack of self worth is not a problem anymore. It's a subconscious pattern that manifests through the chakras that sometimes gets activated by childhood experiences or possibly past lives but connection to the higher levels gives you the opportunity to repair and change all those limiting unhelpful beliefs. How easy that is depends on whether you have alternatives to switch to. For example if you never felt loved unconditionally by family growing up it is difficult to change those patterns cos you literally don't know what the alternative is. You will never trust someone that does love you cos you always expect ulterior motives. With access to the soul level you can use past life experiences of unconditional love to replace those beliefs. Or download unconditional love from source or even from the collective unconscious.

Another problem I see is that spiritual development results in innate ethics where you no longer follow the law because it's the law or from fear of punishment but just because it's the right thing to do. But that doesn't work for the general population that aren't there yet so religions and all social structures need ways to control the masses while still trying to encourage progression to the higher states. Trying to introduce spiritual standards to the wider community will never work until everyone is at a certain minimum level needed for that. Unfortunately the control required for the wider community is in direct opposition to what is needed by individuals to encourage spiritual awakening. The power experienced by those in control can be an issue too because those that want it are never the ones that should have it.

So maybe the sense of defeat they talk about is just recognition that real spiritual awakening is a one by one kind of thing and we can't expect everyone to shift at once so we need options that work for everyone at all stages.