PDA

View Full Version : Prayer! ! !


kundalini
06-09-2006, 03:48 AM
Hi all,

I require some thoughts and assistance on the matter of prayer. I need to know a few things and would appreciate all your thoughts on this topic. I want to know if,

1. Is prayer religious or spiritual?

2. Does prayer work?

3. If one did pray, then how long for and who to exactly?

Thanks for reading, Kundalini.

peteyzen
06-09-2006, 09:55 AM
1) Prayer is spiritual, all of the classic techniques are spiritual, even mantra. The formal religions adopted these techniques to aid advancement spirtually, because that is the original aim of ALL religions.

2) When you ask does prayer work kundalini, do you mean; do you get what you pray for, or do you mean that as a spiritual practice will it help to advance you spiritually? In the former question, sometimes depending on karma and your intent prayers are granted, you could be praying to have someone healed for instance and it may not be in their karma for that to be granted or, conversly, it may be allowed, your humility and love in asking is the beauty and also, karmically, you do yourself no harm either in fact it helps you.In the latter option, as can be seen from the last example it does help to advance you spiritually, when praying you close the gap between human and divine by making a connection. At deeper levels of prayer it becomes meditative and is a very important spiritual practice to develop.
Try this and see how it affects you kundalini. Pick something that you would like to help or a burden of somebodies that you care about that you would like to alleviate and then six or seven times a day, put you hands together and pray with every thing you have, really focus and put your heart and soul into it for about eight or nine seconds. You have to really try hard tho . Take a deep breath first and then reeally go for it. Let me know how you get on.

3) From your earlier posts it would seem that you are aware that everything is one or to put it another way, all is God, therefore when you pray, in your case , find an aspect of god that is attractive to you and direct your prayers in that direction. (You could direct your prayer direct to the divine, or to Sai baba, jesus /krishna/whoever appeals. I suggest an actual figure because some people find it hard to pray without having a pictoral target in mind. Obviously many millions of muslims do not have this problem and are able to focus their love and prayers without such a visual image.

dreamer
06-09-2006, 12:18 PM
Hey Kundalini,

Is prayer not just a different name for the law of attraction? You ask for something, believe it to be possible and give thanks when you get it.

Hi Peteyzen,

how are you getting on with the oneness thing. Isn't it amazing how you can intend something with enough focus and then it manifests, almost as though you are the dreamer and you are the dream, contained in one mind - your mind.

kundalini
06-09-2006, 01:06 PM
Thanks for your input Peteyzen and dreamer. I really required the kind of information you have given me. When I was asking does prayer work, I was looking for just a general answer really, like the one you gave me Peteyzen. Whilst I have no religious background and at the same time no wish to involve myself with any religion, I have been feeling inextricably pulled more and more to the concept of prayer and I wanted some background information on the subject. So thank you, once again, for your help. Peteyzen, I shall try out the technique you suggested. Many thanks, Kundalini.

lumas
06-09-2006, 01:20 PM
Hello all, this is what we were told about prayer at one of our meetings every loving thought you give out is like a beacon of light which is gathered and used wherever it is needed and all that you give is returned in some way (so i believe the answer to your first question is spiritual) therefore your prayers are answered, we were informed that prayer does work but recipients may not even know they have recieved it (but its the thought that counts) and if its given out by more than one person its affects are truly wonderful and it doesnt really matter for how long or to who but you can direct it to a specific person or place. Love is a powerful tool and every little bit is used...

kundalini
06-09-2006, 01:25 PM
Hello all, this is what we were told about prayer at one of our meetings every loving thought you give out is like a beacon of light which is gathered and used wherever it is needed and all that you give is returned in some way (so i believe the answer to your first question is spiritual) therefore your prayers are answered, we were informed that prayer does work but recipients may not even know they have recieved it (but its the thought that counts) and if its given out by more than one person its affects are truly wonderful and it doesnt really matter for how long or to who but you can direct it to a specific person or place. Love is a powerful tool and every little bit is used...

Ah, well, where I see prayer now as a way of talking to a higher power, it's effects seem to me to be exactly the same as the power of thought, which in a sense is what dreamer was saying, the law of attraction.

daisy
06-09-2006, 01:32 PM
religious or not we should all thank the powers that be who/whatever they are or what we believe them to be for our blessings each day ie health, the air we breathe and for every happiness along the way

lumas
06-09-2006, 01:40 PM
Kundilini my friend although it would seem as though we are talking to a higher power what is given is returned because we are a part of that higher power that God....

dreamer
06-09-2006, 02:10 PM
And knowing ourSELF to be God.........wouldn't we expect the best, and isn't the best just bliss? And if we feel bliss will we not attract our own bliss propagating manifestations...whatever they may be?

Mother Goose
06-09-2006, 04:35 PM
Pick something that you would like to help or a burden of somebodies that you care about that you would like to alleviate and then six or seven times a day, put you hands together and pray with every thing you have, really focus and put your heart and soul into it for about eight or nine seconds. You have to really try hard tho . Take a deep breath first and then reeally go for it. Let me know how you get on.

I may have to try this method. I do affirmations daily and say prayers from time to time throughout the day, but I only REALLY try hard & focus on it right before bed.

Is prayer not just a different name for the law of attraction? You ask for something, believe it to be possible and give thanks when you get it.
That's exactly how I see prayer. :D

dreamer
06-09-2006, 04:50 PM
Imagine the world how you would like it to be, the power of your thought will make it that way. Think global, gaia wants your help, your ideas to make things better, you are a thought in the mind of the world, if your thinking is for the common good the world will act on your thoughts, make your thoughts appealing, things that would make you feel good and the world a more enjoyable place, thoughts that you think - that would be great if that happened. We all want the same, go to town don't censure yourSELF and see what happens.

And if you doubt it, weren't you just thinking recently that you'd like someone to make a stand against George Bush on global warming, Arnold Shwarze******, the universe has a sense of humour - need I say more.

chi chi
06-09-2006, 08:12 PM
when i pray i pray to my loved ones even though i mite not always get the result i am looking for i know they listen and help in any way they can
love chi xxxxx

kundalini
06-09-2006, 08:16 PM
Kundilini my friend although it would seem as though we are talking to a higher power what is given is returned because we are a part of that higher power that God....

I have no doubts lumas, that that is true metaphysically speaking. However, it is our own thoughts that give power to the illusion of separateness that we experience whilst on Earth.

Glorymist
06-09-2006, 08:35 PM
kundalini - - I could jump in here and we could have one of our fun go-arounds - - but these people have this one down ! ! Both peteyzen and dreamer are very good in all of this and I would be just adding a few comments here and there so I'm not even going to bother. I am finding out that Ms. Goose is right in there too. There are some good people coming to the board.

About the only thing I will offer is - - you really do not have to put your "hands together" - - unless that is a symbol of "specialness" for you. You can be at work and just duck around a corner and find 30 seconds of quietness and do your thing. Or - - duck outside. Or into the bathroom. Escape for a moment - - focus - - with an open heart - - ask - - then turn it loose.

The one thing about the Law of Attraction that many people overlook is that - - it is NOT just an asking. If that were the case - - no lottery would ever go without anyone winning it / etc. The controlling rule of the Law of Attraction is - - that nothing comes to the individual without them earning it. In other words - - nothing is for "free." And - - this focus - - over and over again - - taking the time to stop and quickly go into the Silence - - and focus - - the asking of - - for the good of all concerned - - is just that "earning." It is one "kind" of earning. There are other ways it all can be earned. Some more intense. A few less intense - - and thus less reliable.

The physical world works slowly. Sometimes - - it takes a while. Sadly - - sometimes it takes into the next lifetime. Other times - - it can be quite quick. Quite quick indeed.

Just make sure you will accept ALL responsibility for all you ask. One way or the other.

Peteyzen - - Dreamer - - and you too Ms. Goose - - well done ! ! You people are growing ! ! (And probably the others too - - but I don't know enough about you to make that call.)

HeH

chadley
06-09-2006, 09:14 PM
Hey Kundalini,

Is prayer not just a different name for the law of attraction? You ask for something, believe it to be possible and give thanks when you get it.

Hi Peteyzen,

how are you getting on with the oneness thing. Isn't it amazing how you can intend something with enough focus and then it manifests, almost as though you are the dreamer and you are the dream, contained in one mind - your mind.

Everyone's suggestion are wonderful regarding prayer, but to add to it, prayer or conscious manifestation's power is increased dramatically by the level of emotion or vibration that you add to the request you are asking. I would not define it as focus. Thinking about it really hard won't give you as much success with prayer or manifestation as a highly vibrational emotion will. For example, prayer can be distructive if some one prays, "God please, please don't let me get run over by a bus tomorrow". Firstly, this is a request likely made out of fear. Secondly, in the prayer you are focusing on exactly what you do not want to happen. If you want to institute the law of attraction with this request, it would be better to pray, "I'm so happy and grateful that I am always safe and healthy". Petezen's suggestions are very good for this because you can raise your energy using these meditative techniques and thus attach higher vibration to your request making it more powerful. Another way to improve the power of prayer is keeping your request in the present. If you want to manifest something train yourself to feel as if you already have it.

kundalini
06-09-2006, 10:15 PM
Thanks for your responses Glorymist and chadley. It really does seem to me once more that prayer is just a lot like focusing the power of thought. For example chadley just mentioned do not pray focusing on the negatives as this as a basis of fear and so will draw that to you. Sound familiar?

Glorymist
07-09-2006, 01:07 AM
kundalini - - why do you think so much negativity keeps coming into people's lives ?? One doesn't really have to stop and focus on it intently. That is obviously the more advanced approach. Just to dwell on it - - does the trick.

And most people just run problems and issues and troubles over and over and over and over and over in their mind - - all the time.

Mother Goose
07-09-2006, 02:07 AM
Everyone's suggestion are wonderful regarding prayer, but to add to it, prayer or conscious manifestation's power is increased dramatically by the level of emotion or vibration that you add to the request you are asking. I would not define it as focus. Thinking about it really hard won't give you as much success with prayer or manifestation as a highly vibrational emotion will. For example, prayer can be distructive if some one prays, "God please, please don't let me get run over by a bus tomorrow". Firstly, this is a request likely made out of fear. Secondly, in the prayer you are focusing on exactly what you do not want to happen. If you want to institute the law of attraction with this request, it would be better to pray, "I'm so happy and grateful that I am always safe and healthy". Petezen's suggestions are very good for this because you can raise your energy using these meditative techniques and thus attach higher vibration to your request making it more powerful. Another way to improve the power of prayer is keeping your request in the present. If you want to manifest something train yourself to feel as if you already have it.
Chadley, I appauld you for bringing this up! I agree whole heartedly! Praying against something focuses your thoughts on the negative which could bring you exactly what you DON'T want. I used to do that when I was younger, but have since learned better, THANK GOODNESS!

But I would also like to point out that in times of great stress, we may revert back to that type of thinking/praying. That has happened to me recently also. When 'everything' seems to be going wrong, it's hard to pray positively, but to stop the cycle we MUST. Thanks for the reminder! I really needed it! :smile:

Mother Goose
07-09-2006, 02:18 AM
About the only thing I will offer is - - you really do not have to put your "hands together" - - unless that is a symbol of "specialness" for you. You can be at work and just duck around a corner and find 30 seconds of quietness and do your thing. Or - - duck outside. Or into the bathroom. Escape for a moment - - focus - - with an open heart - - ask - - then turn it loose.
I just wanted to comment on this, because it is very rare for me to actually put my hands together when I pray. But when I was working in a Christian based child care center, we would ask the kids to put their hands together for prayer and of course they did it because that's what they've been taught to do when they pray. I see it as very effective for children because it gives them a place to focus....it keeps their hands away from everything/everyone around them so that they can concentrate on the prayer. Not that 3 & 4 yr olds can concentrate on a prayer for very long, but I liked to think that the short prayers during chapel and before our meals were laying some 'groundwork' for spiritual thoughts and connections later on down the line. :D Or maybe it's just wishful thinking. *giggles*

kundalini
07-09-2006, 11:06 AM
I just wanted to comment on this, because it is very rare for me to actually put my hands together when I pray. But when I was working in a Christian based child care center, we would ask the kids to put their hands together for prayer and of course they did it because that's what they've been taught to do when they pray. I see it as very effective for children because it gives them a place to focus....it keeps their hands away from everything/everyone around them so that they can concentrate on the prayer. Not that 3 & 4 yr olds can concentrate on a prayer for very long, but I liked to think that the short prayers during chapel and before our meals were laying some 'groundwork' for spiritual thoughts and connections later on down the line. :D Or maybe it's just wishful thinking. *giggles*

Hi Mother Goose, I am pretty sure that as the children you speak of grow older and those who start to feel a spiritual connection once again, will almost certainly remember how they used to employ the power of prayer. Why would I say something like that? Despite having no religious upbringing, I did attend a Christian school when I was a child and we used to pray everyday, hence why I am asking questions once more about the effectiveness of prayer!

I do not class that as a religious upbringing though simply because I wasn't exactly adhering to Christianity 24:7, I was just taught the ways of thinking and history of Christianity.

Glorymist, I fully agree with what you have to say about negativity. It is obvious to me that one can not only put aside 10 minutes for positive thinking in order to allow things to happen but it must be a full-time commitment in the sense that 10 minutes positive thinking does not cancel out 1000 minutes of negative thinking, therefore perhaps a balance has to be sought here?

peteyzen
07-09-2006, 11:28 AM
loive your comments daisy,we all take too much forgranted thnaks for the remider.
Mother goose, None of youraffirmations and prayers are wasted. Unlike most people instead of having your mind focused on rubbish, you are,( all be it gently,)- focused in the right direction, that is a wonderful and rare thing.
The prayer I suggested for kundalini was for a reason, some times when you try this form of prayer, you can actually feel afterwards the reaction.

peteyzen
07-09-2006, 11:32 AM
Hi dreamer thanks for your question, true oneness still eludes me my firend, one day tho, one day.

peteyzen
07-09-2006, 11:40 AM
Wow some good stuff coming out here,I would like to add something tho, to consider prayer purely as the initiation of the forces of attraction , to me, is not correct. The forces of attraction are one aspect of prayer, but when praying to the divine, something is listening believe me, and even if you word your prayer incorrectly, if it is aimed at the divine, who operates at a higher levelk than pure words, your intent is read.
On a humna level, when dealing with the mind, I agree that using negative staements like asking a bus not to run over you can produce coontrary effects to those intended, but not at the divine level, intent is what counts.
Then when you refer to kundalini and glorymists converstaion about spending ten miutes thinking or praying positively being of little use against 1000`s of hours of negativity. If just forces of attraction were involved that would be true, but they are not the only effect you stimulate when in prayer to the divine, God himself (yourself ) is listening and helping hence the importance of prayer over some other methods of spiritual advancement. I thank you so much for starting this thread kundalini, you have helped me to undertsand knowledge I had already but at a deeper level.
Love and light
Peteyzen

dreamer
07-09-2006, 11:45 AM
Hey Peteyzen,

you are true oneness, maybe the recognition of it eludes you but "it" is you. Stop thinking and imagine that you already know and how that would feel, take notice and the world around you will point you to the answer. Did you know that everything you experience is you talking to yourself, see the universe as actually being yourself, not in some half ****d way like its a metaphor, actually see it as being you, you are in your own mind and your mind is talking to you. Sorry to go on, its just once you get it its really cool and i'd like you to get it.

chadley
07-09-2006, 03:15 PM
Yup yup and yup. Peteyzen, again, I agree with you (this seems to be a reoccuring theme), intention is so important as I mentioned in another thread. My bus comments, of course, were just an example of a fear based statement, but yeah, said with a positive intention and its all groovy. And prayer is also so powerful when you pray to god, universe etc.. or even angels, guides or even faries. To the general public this is "nutso" but we all know its true, huh?

And Dreamer, I share your thoughts on the universe and how it is a reflection of yourself. It's a tough lesson for some, too. Most have trouble with the idea that there are no victims. If you see a negative aspect of someone else, it may be just a reflection of that negative aspect which lies within yourself, ay. The universe really is such a wonderful teacher.

dreamer
07-09-2006, 03:30 PM
Hey Chadley,

It is just a "negative" aspect which lies within yourself, no maybe's about it and the universe is such a great teacher because it is a reflection of yourSELF, by observing yourSELF you can learn about yourSELF, which is ultimately the lesson/experience "we" are having.

Mother Goose
07-09-2006, 03:48 PM
I share your thoughts on the universe and how it is a reflection of yourself. It's a tough lesson for some, too. Most have trouble with the idea that there are no victims. If you see a negative aspect of someone else, it may be just a reflection of that negative aspect which lies within yourself, ay. The universe really is such a wonderful teacher.

For a while I kept getting guidance that all those around me were mirrors of myself...it's part of the reason I joined this board and stopped spending as much time on a different board that I belong to. I felt that concentrating on the more spiritual aspects of myself would help me deal with the other (not so pleasant) aspects of myself that certain on-line friends were 'encouraging.'

More often than not, along with prayer, we have to make a conscious choice to move toward something more positive. We have to not only hold the desired effect in our minds, but also be aware of the immediate changes we can set in motion with our human decisions.

And dreamer...yes, I believe you're right about us being here to learn about ourSELF. The journey to SELF discovery can seem rather daunting at times, but it's essential, of that I have no doubt.

dreamer
07-09-2006, 04:01 PM
I can't believe that you have any unpleasant aspects of yourself Mother Goose, other than those that have not been appreciated when they should have been or have been led to believe they are unpleasant when they are in fact beautiful.

What is "negative" anyway but a label given by one who does not appreciate the deep rooted beauty of all things?

chadley
07-09-2006, 04:03 PM
Dreamer, your preaching to the choir, I agree with you. I just said "maybe" as an attempt to soften it up. this concept can be a big bite to chew for some.

kundalini
07-09-2006, 04:10 PM
Hi all,

I have been watching this thread develop with interest and although what I am about to say may belong in a totally different thread all by itself, I feel it has some relation to how this thread has progressed recently. In relation to Universal Law of Reflection, that which we need to deal with most ourselves is reflected in those around us, I have also been working on integrating my dark side.

The thing is, I have come to believe that a lot of people, myself included spend so much time wasting energy denying they are capable of this and that behaviour when in actual fact, this is a complete fallacy.

I came to discover that one should integrate their own dark side by being accepting of it and not running away from it. When you accept an aspect of your mind that you have purposely held back for so long, you come to the realisation that you are aiding yourself to become more whole.

Also, once you have realised that you are integrating your own dark side, you become spiritually fearless simply because once you have brought light to your own dark side, there is nothing to hide from or run away from anymore. This acceptance then creates flow in your energy, instead of the flow of energy that you get with fear which seems to me to swing back and forth depending on the mood you can be in as the fear starts to take hold. So, what do you think of this concept?

daisy
07-09-2006, 04:10 PM
loive your comments daisy,we all take too much forgranted thnaks for the remider.
Mother goose, None of youraffirmations and prayers are wasted. Unlike most people instead of having your mind focused on rubbish, you are,( all be it gently,)- focused in the right direction, that is a wonderful and rare thing.
The prayer I suggested for kundalini was for a reason, some times when you try this form of prayer, you can actually feel afterwards the reaction.

:kermit: thanks peteyzen

dreamer
07-09-2006, 04:13 PM
Hey chadley,

no offence intended, I have enjoyed reading all your posts and am sorry to have appeared abrupt. As an aspect of yourself "I" would say that you may want to be less hard on yourself and be strong in the conviction that you are right about that which you know yourself to be right about.

chadley
07-09-2006, 04:35 PM
Oh I didnt take offense, I encourage your comments on my posts. I was just clarifying. If you knew me in person, you would understand that I have little difficulty in speaking my mind with great conviction. However, I find that sometimes a gentle approach can be helpful to those who have resistance to my views.

As a side note, I really have enjoyed reading all of the posts on these threads as I wouldn't bother to even post if I didn't think those participating wouldnt have wonderful insight or perspective on my words.

dreamer
07-09-2006, 04:37 PM
Coolio and the gangstas.

kundalini
07-09-2006, 04:47 PM
I posted this earlier in the thread but I think it got ignored as as I posted it, daisy posted straight after and that was included on the next page. So here it is again. I am determined to post it as I believe it raises some valid points:

Hi all,

I have been watching this thread develop with interest and although what I am about to say may belong in a totally different thread all by itself, I feel it has some relation to how this thread has progressed recently. In relation to Universal Law of Reflection, that which we need to deal with most ourselves is reflected in those around us, I have also been working on integrating my dark side.

The thing is, I have come to believe that a lot of people, myself included spend so much time wasting energy denying they are capable of this and that behaviour when in actual fact, this is a complete fallacy.

I came to discover that one should integrate their own dark side by being accepting of it and not running away from it. When you accept an aspect of your mind that you have purposely held back for so long, you come to the realisation that you are aiding yourself to become more whole.

Also, once you have realised that you are integrating your own dark side, you become spiritually fearless simply because once you have brought light to your own dark side, there is nothing to hide from or run away from anymore. This acceptance then creates flow in your energy, instead of the flow of energy that you get with fear which seems to me to swing back and forth depending on the mood you can be in as the fear starts to take hold. So, what do you think of this concept?

Thanks for reading, Kundalini.

chadley
07-09-2006, 05:07 PM
Kundalini, what you are saying is similar to what we have posted in many ways. When we speak of reflection of so called negative or "dark" truths, from a spiritual perspective, we are using those mirrors to identify that parts of ourselves that are of the lower self. The process of identifying these characteristics and then removing them or rising above them is something many people do consciously to further themselves down their spiritual path.

kundalini
07-09-2006, 05:37 PM
Kundalini, what you are saying is similar to what we have posted in many ways. When we speak of reflection of so called negative or "dark" truths, from a spiritual perspective, we are using those mirrors to identify that parts of ourselves that are of the lower self. The process of identifying these characteristics and then removing them or rising above them is something many people do consciously to further themselves down their spiritual path.

Hi chadley,

Yes, I knew it was similar to what other members have posted. However, what was not made clear in those posts, unconsciously or not, was the fact that we should accept and integrate our dark sides, not observe and then judge them.

Additionally, something many other people also may not have realised, is that we should also accept and integrate our light side. These are the things inside us such as compassion, joy, love and truth that because of the fear of the consequences as appearing to be that way ( for example, when among those people who are primarily judgmental and narrow-minded in their actions and words ) we may at one time or another, not speak our truth.

Should we consciously integrate and accept those parts within us, then this only adds to who we are.

Thanks for reading, Kundalini.

daisy
07-09-2006, 05:55 PM
I posted this earlier in the thread but I think it got ignored as as I posted it, daisy posted straight after and that was included on the next page. So here it is again. I am determined to post it as I believe it raises some valid points:

Hi all,

I have been watching this thread develop with interest and although what I am about to say may belong in a totally different thread all by itself, I feel it has some relation to how this thread has progressed recently. In relation to Universal Law of Reflection, that which we need to deal with most ourselves is reflected in those around us, I have also been working on integrating my dark side.

The thing is, I have come to believe that a lot of people, myself included spend so much time wasting energy denying they are capable of this and that behaviour when in actual fact, this is a complete fallacy.

I came to discover that one should integrate their own dark side by being accepting of it and not running away from it. When you accept an aspect of your mind that you have purposely held back for so long, you come to the realisation that you are aiding yourself to become more whole.

Also, once you have realised that you are integrating your own dark side, you become spiritually fearless simply because once you have brought light to your own dark side, there is nothing to hide from or run away from anymore. This acceptance then creates flow in your energy, instead of the flow of energy that you get with fear which seems to me to swing back and forth depending on the mood you can be in as the fear starts to take hold. So, what do you think of this concept?

Thanks for reading, Kundalini.

acceptance being the key word there kundalini, wise words there:wink:

kundalini
07-09-2006, 06:23 PM
acceptance being the key word there kundalini, wise words there:wink:

Yes, thanks for your understanding. Acceptance is the Keyword.

chadley
07-09-2006, 06:48 PM
Kundalini, that is a very interesting way of stating it. I think you have twisted my words a bit, though. For example, I said, "Identifying and removing" dark aspects, and it seems you interpreted that to mean, "observe and judge". These are two totally different sets of things. There is no need to integrate your dark and light sides. They are already a part of you whether you are conscious of them or not. To become conscious of them and identify them is to "not run away from them". Once you identify these dark characteristics and you understand the important lesson that they give and the reason they exist within yourself, there is no longer a need for them to be a part of you. This is done not with fear, but with love for the process of understanding its purpose. In one's highest essence, there is only light. As a healer, I use this process on all levels so that the one receiving the healing can be aware of the aspects of their life that are causing dis-ease or preventing prosperity in what ever way is specific to their needs. It may be a thought form as simple as, "The way is hard" that so many have been taught in religion. Or it may express itself in lower vibrational energy in the person's energy field, or by a distructive pattern of behavior in their life or poverty or obesity and so on and so on. The original wound or route cause of these less desirable characteristics is how I define our "dark side". Most walk around completely uncounscious of the true reasons they suffer or as you say they run away from these truths because they are painful. So you are right to say that one should not fear their dark side and be at one and exept who they are with all the good and the bad. Perhaps you have a different definition of one's darkside and I've misunderstood or perhaps you disagree all together. I look forward to your comments

kundalini
07-09-2006, 08:59 PM
Kundalini, that is a very interesting way of stating it. I think you have twisted my words a bit, though. For example, I said, "Identifying and removing" dark aspects, and it seems you interpreted that to mean, "observe and judge". These are two totally different sets of things. There is no need to integrate your dark and light sides. They are already a part of you whether you are conscious of them or not. To become conscious of them and identify them is to "not run away from them". Once you identify these dark characteristics and you understand the important lesson that they give and the reason they exist within yourself, there is no longer a need for them to be a part of you. This is done not with fear, but with love for the process of understanding its purpose. In one's highest essence, there is only light. As a healer, I use this process on all levels so that the one receiving the healing can be aware of the aspects of their life that are causing dis-ease or preventing prosperity in what ever way is specific to their needs. It may be a thought form as simple as, "The way is hard" that so many have been taught in religion. Or it may express itself in lower vibrational energy in the person's energy field, or by a distructive pattern of behavior in their life or poverty or obesity and so on and so on. The original wound or route cause of these less desirable characteristics is how I define our "dark side". Most walk around completely uncounscious of the true reasons they suffer or as you say they run away from these truths because they are painful. So you are right to say that one should not fear their dark side and be at one and exept who they are with all the good and the bad. Perhaps you have a different definition of one's darkside and I've misunderstood or perhaps you disagree all together. I look forward to your comments

Hi chadley,

No, I have not twisted your words, I simply misinterpreted them. I have a full understanding of what you say but it is always better on forums such as these to do what we ( me, you, dreamer, any member for that matter ) do and get it down to the last detail. It seems to me that this helps all who partake in the thread then for many truths can be reached on certain levels by going over and over different topics.

So, you are a healer? I find that very interesting.

I admire that you help people by destroying the thought forms that tie them down.

Thanks for reading, Kundalini.

chi chi
07-09-2006, 10:09 PM
hi chadlet sorry for intruding but if you can help by destroying thoughts i think nickmellor could do with a little help from you
love chi xxxx

BLAIR2BE
07-09-2006, 10:25 PM
Wow, I Wish I Could Have Gotten To This Thread Sooner. The First Couple Of Pages Of This Thread Pretty Much Sums Up My Opinion. One Addition Though, It Seems With Some, Prayer Has Become So "traditional" And Routine That The Prayer No Longer Seems "sincere". Speaking Words Aloud (or Not) (eyes Closed Or Open) Doesnt Constitute A Prayer To Me. A Spiritual "connection" Must Be Made. And A Prayer Is Nothing If One Doesn't "mean" It.
Also In My Humble Opinion Using A Prayer To "ask" For Something (somthing Physical), Seems A Bit Like Carrying Around A Wish List And Hoping Your Wishes Will Come True. I Believe Prayer Sure Be Exclusively Spiritual (even If You Pray For Someone Else's Spirituality). I do Contradict Myself On This Though- I Do Pray For The physical Safety Of My Daughter And Girlfriend. (i Suppose On My Last Point Im Not totally Decided) Until Now I Have Given Prayer Very Minimal Thought:>/

lumas
07-09-2006, 10:50 PM
Hi all when i was younger i used to kill birds for fun, now i could not harm a living thing, i used to smoke but now i could never do such a thing to my body my vehicle on this journey, i have reflected on harsh words that have been spoken and felt the down feeling from the consiquence of those words as if they were spoken to me so to use some of chadleys words Once you identify these dark characteristics and you understand the important lesson that they give and the reason they exist within yourself, there is no longer a need for them to be a part of you. This is done not with fear, but with love for the process of understanding its purpose this is true spiritual growth....

Mother Goose
08-09-2006, 02:19 AM
wow...first of all, this thread really got going while I was away this afternoon!
I can't believe that you have any unpleasant aspects of yourself Mother Goose, other than those that have not been appreciated when they should have been or have been led to believe they are unpleasant when they are in fact beautiful.

What is "negative" anyway but a label given by one who does not appreciate the deep rooted beauty of all things?
Okay...see that? I'm not there yet. *sigh* I made a conscious decision to NOT use the word 'negative,' but I definitely have aspects of myself that I have yet to learn to love. Hmmmmmm....chadley, sounds like I need to pay you a visit. :wink:

It Seems With Some, Prayer Has Become So "traditional" And Routine That The Prayer No Longer Seems "sincere". Speaking Words Aloud (or Not) (eyes Closed Or Open) Doesnt Constitute A Prayer To Me. A Spiritual "connection" Must Be Made. And A Prayer Is Nothing If One Doesn't "mean" It.
I agree with this 100%. The only time I pray is when I feel the need to pray and I have no 'set' prayer. When I pray I use the words that accurately describe how I'm feeling in that very moment. As you said BLAIRE2BE...it really should be sincere.

As for carrying around a 'wishlist'....I don't see the harm in having a wishlist. From that wishlist you can set goals & devise plans. In regards to praying for things that are 'physical'....I normally don't pray for a specific THING...what I pray for is that "the good I know I deserve comes to me in the most appropriate and timely way." My higher self knows what I NEED and given 'free reign' can truly bring the necessities of life to me.

Anyone listen to country music? Garth Brooks' Unanswered Prayers is one of my all time favorite songs. So often we want things, pray for things that our higher selves know is not what's best for us....and therefore do not manifest them for us. I applied for a job recently that I thought I wanted, but when someone else was selected I was able to smile. That job just wasn't what was best for me...something more suitable is coming. So I continue to pray for the best possible situation for my family.

BLAIR2BE
08-09-2006, 02:46 AM
Mothergoose,
No, Nothing Is Wrong With Having A "wishlist". If It Is Helpful For One To Devise Plans A Set Goals, Then A Wishlist Is Viable. I Just Dont Believe Prayer Should Be Used To Fulfill Physical Wants. I Agree With You Mothergoose...the Higher Self Does Know What Is Best For One In The Spiritual Realm and In Physical Manifestations. I Believe That Prayer Should Focus On The Spiritual Realm And A "wishlist" Should Focus On The Physical (new Job, Longterm Life Goals, Buying That New Car, ETC.) As Long As Goals Are Indeed Set, And They Are Not Merley Wishes Or Hopes. Prayer Is In Fact To God (you All Know What I Mean By God!).
-stay Positive And Love Your Life

dreamer
08-09-2006, 12:12 PM
The universe wants you to be happy, work out what you want in order to be happy and focus on that whether it is "physical" or "spiritual" it does not matter, once you have enough physical comfort you will be drawn towards more spiritual aspects as a matter of course....the universe will give you whatever you focus your thoughts on and you can make as many mistakes as you want, you are the mood of the universe, the universe wants you to be happy as much as you want to be happy yourself. Have faith in the universe as a provider, by having faith in the universe have faith in yourSELF because in truth the Universe and yourSELF are one and the same. Learn to love yourSELF by loving everything in the universe for they are one and the same. When you realise this it becomes futile to do anything but love.

Remove "darkness" by focusing on "light" it's that simple/difficult.

chadley
08-09-2006, 02:37 PM
Sorry if this is wordy, it just kept flowing...I agree with dreamer on this as well. Though it is unwise to rely on physical things for happiness, there is nothing wrong with wanting, having or requesting material things. Remember that the physical is just the crystalization of the spirit, they are not separate but rather the same thing in different form. Again, speaking from a healer's perspective, everything that occurs on the body already exists in spirit. If you are physically ill, this can be the result of something that is not harmonious in your energy field, for example. This translates in the material world. Truly, you are the architect of everything you see in this physical world as it is your own creation. That is why it is a contradiction to believe that life on earth has to be difficult to be righteous. A difficult life on earth is in contradiction to the blissful and peaceful one that is natural and desired in spirit. With this said, does it not make sense to have things in this physical world that make you happy? It is absolutely ok to be abundant in all things. Discord only occurs when you use physical things to attempt to create spiritual happiness or fix spiritual unhappiness. This is a backwards approach. Because spirit is of a higher vibration and time has no significance, It always exists in spirit first. Addressing everything you feel is wrong with your physical world by seeking a spiritual resolution is always your most perminent fix. Again, think of illness as an example. If you have a aching back and you go to the chiropracter and gives you a quick fix, pops you back into place and you feel great everything is great right? What if the reason for these physical symptons is just a transmutation of what exists in the meridians of your body, or in one of the many layers of your aura? Does it represent a burden on your shoulder's in life, like debt for example? If so, Guess what, next week your back gives you a reality check and says, "I'm back" (pun inteneded). The pain returns because the chiropracter only addressed the "physical" level. Now apply this way of thinking to your wants and desires for material things. Do you want a million bucks to fix how ****** you feel when you get a bill in the mail, or so that you don't have to go to your ****** job? Guess what, we are back to the law of attraction again. You are attaching emotion to debt or working, so the universe gives you more of it. After all, having a job that does not bring happiness to you is only a sign that you are not fully expressing the creativity of your highest purpose. Abundance is a spiritual thing, baby. Attach high vibrational emotions to money consistantly and see what happens. Think of how great it will feel to be able to give money to those in need or how you can now afford to quite your job and persue what really want to do. Not only will you get the money you want, but you will be fricken happy about it!

incidently, I have nothing against chiropracters. I've have one I go to myself and often refer people I have worked on because I am not a body worker, I'm an energy worker.

dreamer
08-09-2006, 06:27 PM
Great post chadley...... not sure about the word fricken though??

chadley
08-09-2006, 07:14 PM
Wow some good stuff coming out here,I would like to add something tho, to consider prayer purely as the initiation of the forces of attraction , to me, is not correct. The forces of attraction are one aspect of prayer, but when praying to the divine, something is listening believe me, and even if you word your prayer incorrectly, if it is aimed at the divine, who operates at a higher levelk than pure words, your intent is read.
On a humna level, when dealing with the mind, I agree that using negative staements like asking a bus not to run over you can produce coontrary effects to those intended, but not at the divine level, intent is what counts.
Then when you refer to kundalini and glorymists converstaion about spending ten miutes thinking or praying positively being of little use against 1000`s of hours of negativity. If just forces of attraction were involved that would be true, but they are not the only effect you stimulate when in prayer to the divine, God himself (yourself ) is listening and helping hence the importance of prayer over some other methods of spiritual advancement. I thank you so much for starting this thread kundalini, you have helped me to undertsand knowledge I had already but at a deeper level.
Love and light
Peteyzen

Dreamer, I quoting Peteyzen here because he makes a great point about how words spoken are not as important as intent. The devine reads intent. Some of the most hurtful things ever spoken were done without using supposed "Swear words". I can honestly say to you that I hope everyone is fricken happier than hell every day with the best intentions and a positive emotion attached. Did I just spin this thread on a new tangent? Sorry :)

dreamer
11-09-2006, 09:56 AM
Hey Chadley,

I take your positive emotion and intention, you are a dude.....the word fricken makes me laugh, not at you...it's just a funny fricken word.

Mother Goose
11-09-2006, 03:29 PM
I hope everyone is fricken happier than hell every day
I second this!!! :D And dreamer, it makes me laugh too....but isn't that part of the point? :smile:

chadley
11-09-2006, 04:28 PM
Ha! I thought you might be joking. There is no doubt, I am a dude, dude.

dreamer
12-09-2006, 02:00 PM
Of course you are, we are in truth all played by the one big dude and thus it follows we are all dudes.