Does it matter if i kill someone

[adamm[]]

sorry for the graphic topic but ive seen a news commerical that said 48/50 states were infected with a deadly disease, i also saw a hell of alot of other things in physical reality that were my nightmarish thoughts that were completley immpossible but yet there they were on TV, radio, etc.

So now i guess im left with nihilistic solphsism. I really think people are all just figments of my imagination after seeing all those things play out that were right out of my head.

So i really dont know what im asking because no one seems to be as depressed about spiritual awakenings as i am, knowing that everything in your life is practically fake.

So, if this is just my dream, does anything matter?

[luntrusreality]

']sorry for the graphic topic but ive seen a news commerical that said 48/50 states were infected with a deadly disease, i also saw a hell of alot of other things in physical reality that were my nightmarish thoughts that were completley immpossible but yet there they were on TV, radio, etc.

So now i guess im left with nihilistic solphsism. I really think people are all just figments of my imagination after seeing all those things play out that were right out of my head.

So i really dont know what im asking because no one seems to be as depressed about spiritual awakenings as i am, knowing that everything in your life is practically fake.

So, if this is just my dream, does anything matter?

I get where you are coming from, but you have fallen into the trap of a nihilistic approach to nonduality, which is not uncommon.
There is the possibility to misunderstand, especially contemporary advaita teaching, and confuse nonduality with solipsism.

Sometimes, when people hear Neo-Advaita teachings like
"Nothing has meaning" "There is no death" "The person is an illusion"
etc. it can get problematic if this is just taken by the person for granted without really KNOWING the truth in direct experience, not as a concept.

If you think like that and are depressed it is NOT a true spiritual awakening.
No matter what anybody tells you.
Depression and enlightenment are mutually exclusive.
Even a tiny bit of unhappiness and enlightenment are mutually exclusive.

You seem to believe in the philosophical concept of nihilistic solipsism right now, meaning -> there is only one mind (MY mind).

But nonduality and solipsism are extremely different things.

Nonduality says there is only one consciousness.
This is very different to the belief that there is only one mind.
One consciousness, many minds.

The point you are at is not unusual for people on a spiritual path, especially when following contemporary advaita teaching or guys like Jed McKenna (if you are familiar with him), whose writing style can seem to be a little nihilstic.

But now what?:
Don't focus so much on what seems to be fake.
Rather focus on that which is real.
What is really there? What can you know for certain if everything seems fake?

Not only the assumption that everything in "my life" is fake, but also the assumption that there is such a thing as "my life" in the first place is problematic.
Look at the root cause.
Explore what is REAL and don't be depressed and drift off into thoughts about how fake everything is.
It is not.
Consciousness is real.
You can question everything else if you want. You don't know if it matters if you kill someone.
But don't go off into nihilistic though experiments, these thoughts will take care of themselves if you know yourselve as the one consciousness , which is the only thing that is not "fake".

Luntrus

[Ivy]

As someone who has had someone try to kill me, whilst using this over-thought delusional escapism from the issues they couldn't be bothered to face, as self-justification, I take the view that yes it matters.

To anyone even asking this question, I would say go and get some decent therapy and stop wasting time on a spiritual mind babble that simply isn't useful to you.

[luntrusreality]

To anyone even asking this question, I would say go and get some decent therapy and stop wasting time on a spiritual mind **** that simply isn't useful to you.

Don't be too quick with suggesting therapy.
These kind of questions can be a part of the spiritual journey, when one starts to REALLY look at the big picture.
I also was at a place at one point where I didn't know why it would be wrong to kill someone. Just the morality of it wasn't clear to me anymore.
"Who really decides what is right and wrong?"

But this doesn't mean everybody who asks these questions is gonna be a serialkiller now.

[KevinO]

']sorry for the graphic topic but ive seen a news commerical that said 48/50 states were infected with a deadly disease, i also saw a hell of alot of other things in physical reality that were my nightmarish thoughts that were completley immpossible but yet there they were on TV, radio, etc.

So now i guess im left with nihilistic solphsism. I really think people are all just figments of my imagination after seeing all those things play out that were right out of my head.

So i really dont know what im asking because no one seems to be as depressed about spiritual awakenings as i am, knowing that everything in your life is practically fake.

So, if this is just my dream, does anything matter?

It is not a dream and it is not fake IMO. It is what it is. What it is can be pretty fun! Why not have fun and let the rest do what they will?

[Ivy]

Luntrus, I can play with these harmless ideas with you as much as you want in harmless and even fun conversation.

But in the end I have genuinely lived a journey in which I know the harm that these ideas can do.

This is a public forum and many many people who don't speak still read here. So yes it does matter that I can share something lived and real.

It's ok to theorise to our hearts content and be all fluffy about self expression and to share the inner realms of spirituality in a virtual world.

But when it comes to actually living all this talk in the physical reality, there are people with mental health issues who ask this question to themselves and apply it.

So end of fun theoretical conversations. Sometimes it is necessary to get real. And I don't care to know if Adamm is close enough to losing any sense of conscience in his depression or in his spiritual search. People read and when a thread is titled 'does it matter if I kill someone', then mollocks to mind gymnastics. YES it does matter if you kill someone, it is the question of someone disappearing up their own ...

[luntrusreality]

So end of fun theoretical conversations. Sometimes it is necessary to get real. .

I agree. What I suggested was not meant to be for fun or whatever you think of it, where do you get that vibe from?
He asked this question here on a spiritual forum, refering to concepts and I am well aware that these concepts can be dangerous if misunderstood. That is what I was trying to point towards.

Only because someone asks these sort of questions doesn't mean they need conventional therapy.
We can't know that. I asked a lot worse questions and they got me where I needed to go. There is no limit to the kind of questions we should be allowed to ask.
This might sound harsh but every question is fair game on the search for truth. No matter how psychopathic they may sound (especially in writing).
The hardest questions (that we take for granted in our society) are usually that which hit the real core.
Why shouldn't we be allowed to ask about the morality of killing? Just following a question like that to its core can be our "trigger" for finding truth and then all these questions won't matter anymore.
They don't apply and therefore we found the answer in our own being.
If he asks this kind of question on a psycholgy-forum , I will not be there to answer with my "mind babble" which it is absolutely not in this case.


Luntrus

[Ivy]

There is no limit to the questions - but then don't try to limit the answers that others wish to give.

You give your concepts, but don't argue about me giving a dose of real life experience.

[Ivy]

There is no limit to the questions - but then don't try to limit the answers that others wish to give.

You give your concepts, but don't argue about me giving a dose of real life experience.

[luntrusreality]

There is no limit to the questions - but then don't try to limit the answers that others wish to give.


I just see it as problematic when medical or therapeutical care for alleged mental health issues is recommended on the internet.
Just in this particular case I had to object on this "get some decent therapy" suggestion, usually all answers are just as fair game as the questions, although there are no problematic questions - but answers.



You give your concepts, but don't argue about me giving a dose of real life experience.

These are "concepts" that are based on real life experience.

[ocean breeze]

To anyone even asking this question, I would say go and get some decent therapy and stop wasting time on a spiritual mind babble that simply isn't useful to you.

exactly

I also was at a place at one point where I didn't know why it would be wrong to kill someone. Just the morality of it wasn't clear to me anymore.
"Who really decides what is right and wrong?"

But this doesn't mean everybody who asks these questions is gonna be a serialkiller now.

nope but it doesn't mean it shouldn't be taken seriously. and if your still at that place where you don't know why it would be wrong to kill someone then perhaps you should seek therapy as well.

[ocean breeze]

To anyone even asking this question, I would say go and get some decent therapy and stop wasting time on a spiritual mind babble that simply isn't useful to you.

exactly

I also was at a place at one point where I didn't know why it would be wrong to kill someone. Just the morality of it wasn't clear to me anymore.
"Who really decides what is right and wrong?"

But this doesn't mean everybody who asks these questions is gonna be a serialkiller now.

nope but it doesn't mean it shouldn't be taken seriously. and if your still at that place where you don't know why it would be wrong to kill someone then perhaps you should seek therapy as well.

[Mr Interesting]

As was said early in the thread about freedom of speech by God like.

"There is freedom of speech but there is consequence in what is said ."

And that some jihadist extremists shot the editor of a french satirical magazine is not a small matter at the moment.

[silent whisper]

']sorry for the graphic topic but ive seen a news commerical that said 48/50 states were infected with a deadly disease, i also saw a hell of alot of other things in physical reality that were my nightmarish thoughts that were completley immpossible but yet there they were on TV, radio, etc.

So now i guess im left with nihilistic solphsism. I really think people are all just figments of my imagination after seeing all those things play out that were right out of my head.

So i really dont know what im asking because no one seems to be as depressed about spiritual awakenings as i am, knowing that everything in your life is practically fake.

So, if this is just my dream, does anything matter?

I have read this from you before about this deadly disease. So why are you back here again. Didn't you sort it out last time you wrote this same thing? Or are you stuck in fear and your mind once again.

Your seeing the nature of your mind creating what can be seen in various ways. Its fear that will activate you to focus in this way and it is in this way that you can use the external reality as real and do something about it or not real and let yourself understand about your mind and fears and what you fearing For REAL.

What matters is you and how you move through this if you want too.

[luntrusreality]

nope but it doesn't mean it shouldn't be taken seriously.l.

Where do you get the vibe of not taking it seriously?
one doesn't have to diagnose mental health issues to seriously answer a question that
comes up on the spiritual path and is asked on a spiritual forum.

If adam is here to really find answers to even these kind of questions, being told to get conventional therapy is not nesessarily the right adress


on the absolute level of course nothing can be wrong and everyting always unfolds as it should.
But even the asking of this question is taking place in the manifested universe of polarities where there absolutely IS right and wrong for us as human body/minds. like there is day and night we know there is right and wrong.

To come to this conclusion by being allowed to follow the biggest questions of human existence (morality of killing is one of them) to its core without being diagnosed with mental health issues is very important.

where would one be allowed to ask these sort of questions if not in a spiritual or a philosophical community?
everywhere else would be the same answer:" if you ask such a question , get therpy"
This is why some people try to find answers to what is always just taken for granted.

Why is it really wrong to kill? who decides? what does it matter? etc.
He apologized in his first sentence for the graphic content implying that there is social and emotional
intelligence and I got the sense that he is just really stuck in a spiritual dilemma, not an aspiring killer.

Luntrus

[silent whisper]

Of course this time around I am noticing that the title has changed and that is a little concerning to the last time.

In consideration of this post and the last one, seems to be someone is stuck and its getting a little out of control, so I would recommend getting some serious help to sort yourself out.

[Emmalevine]

I agree with Silent Whisper and Ivy here. I find the nature of the question very disturbing in context. We all need to be able to draw the line between exploring morality and knowing when someone needs support to ground themselves ASAP. Inflicting pain, or thinking about whether it's okay to inflict pain or take a life, should not have a place on a spiritual forum imo.

[Lucyan28]

Adam, it's wrong, you should go to therapy ASAP.

[luntrusreality]

Adam, it's wrong, you should go to therapy ASAP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVdEINfm7H4

[Mr Interesting]

I would say I'm actually on both sides here but closer to Luntrus simply because I've met quite a few therapists and can't see any of the ones I've met being even remotely able to deal with what may be the problems occurring here.

I've two old friends, brothers, who are somewhat down this path themselves with one fairly firmly in reality with the other out there quite in the big time which seems an odd word to use but it does remind me of the song... you know, Peter Gabriel, 'I'm on my way, I'm making it, Big Time!'

My way of reminding myself is 'Don't believe your own myth.' which reminds me it's all just a made up story that as one guru said about life 'Nothing is important at all, totally meaningless, but at the same time is of absolute import and profoundly meaningful'.

So the ability to make up stories and then believe them to be true is kinda what humans do, I suppose, so the odd human here and there can stand off to the side and watch and realise what's actually happening.

Indeed, I am meandering, but then how do we persuade those who don't step off early enough and end up being entirely proficient at story telling that their own superbly crafted story... is just a story?

In this respect I agree with Luntrus because it strikes at the heart of the matter and where else indeed?

The therapist thing is like they're all car mechanics, which is well and good as mostly we use cars to get about, but when you unbolt an engine from a stealth bomber and give it to a car mechanic... well, they'll definitely know it's a machine with hydrocarbons going in one end and energy coming out the other.

[wanchain]

']

So now i guess im left with nihilistic solphsism. I really think people are all just figments of my imagination after seeing all those things play out that were right out of my head.

So i really dont know what im asking because no one seems to be as depressed about spiritual awakenings as i am, knowing that everything in your life is practically fake.

So, if this is just my dream, does anything matter?

This sounds like a philosophical question. But I think I get where you're coming from.

I see this planet as a school for us to learn. So our objective is to do well, then graduate. Killing someone means we are flunking the test in school. So the question for you is, do you care if you fail or not?

Sometimes we go to school with the intention to learn, but end up dragging our butt in school, then learn less than what the school offers.

[Cmt12]

There are grieving periods you go through as you expand your awareness and illusions die away. Misinterpretation, or over-interpretation, can occur during these times just as easily as it can occur from more inspirational realizations. These are the times to quiet down and be still until things normalize. It's not the time to engage in fear-based thought streams.

[silent whisper]

ok now I see some more.


Thanks cmt12 your view suddenly made me realize something more that I missed in the conveying in the OP.

[luntrusreality]

There are grieving periods you go through as you expand your awareness and illusions die away. Misinterpretation, or over-interpretation, can occur during these times just as easily as it can occur from more inspirational realizations. These are the times to quiet down and be still until things normalize. It's not the time to engage in fear-based thought streams.

Yes, exactly!
For some, the spiritual journey might take one to "emotional extremes" or let's one at least
contemplate EVERYTHING we have taken for granted.

[adamm[]]

sorry for the redundancy but i still cant get over how i saw the things ive seen.

people say we are all living a shared dream? How? Sorry if i can only see my view point but my thoughts changed my entire reality, i cant stress that enough. so how exactly are we sharing this reality?

[luntrusreality]

']sorry for the redundancy but i still cant get over how i saw the things ive seen.

people say we are all living a shared dream? How? Sorry if i can only see my view point but my thoughts changed my entire reality, i cant stress that enough. so how exactly are we sharing this reality?

Our shared reality is consciousness.
You said you experience a lot of stuff as fake, which is a good step to
question certain believes we have about ourselves and the world.
But what is not fake?
Our shared reality is in consciousness.
We are all one. This is the one common ground that all life-forms share
and it is actually the only thing that is real:
Consciousness as the one and only reality. Shared by all.
Actually not even shared by all, but just by consciousness with itself.

If a body attacks another body self-defense will happen.
It is ingrained in how the body works.
But this is a different matter.
This is survival instinct and not murder.



Luntrus

[Ivy]

']sorry for the redundancy but i still cant get over how i saw the things ive seen.

people say we are all living a shared dream? How? Sorry if i can only see my view point but my thoughts changed my entire reality, i cant stress that enough. so how exactly are we sharing this reality?

If the whole is a swirling mass of energy, we are part of that energy. Thoughts can change our reality... and changing our thoughts or our perception, one thought at a time, can change it once again to another reality.

This suggests that we can choose the reality that we tune into, yet, it can take time and effort to change our thoughts. This is why I suggested therapy, as a means of getting into the way you think and perceive the world.

By why do you ask the question if it would matter if you kill someone. Is this because you see disease killing people and connect to the disease or something?

My other question is, would you like your vision of the world to be different?

[Gem]

']sorry for the redundancy but i still cant get over how i saw the things ive seen.

people say we are all living a shared dream? How? Sorry if i can only see my view point but my thoughts changed my entire reality, i cant stress that enough. so how exactly are we sharing this reality?

Right, the view point and thoughts changed your reality and that's knocked you about. I have no idea on the answer to your question.

[BlueSky]

']sorry for the redundancy but i still cant get over how i saw the things ive seen.

people say we are all living a shared dream? How? Sorry if i can only see my view point but my thoughts changed my entire reality, i cant stress that enough. so how exactly are we sharing this reality?
We are sharing by cause and effect. Your thoughts would be different if the causes in your life were different, if you had been born in China or had different parents or had been abused.
So what we are is conditional on everything and everyone else. So yes we are living a shared existence. Those who call it a dream may be looking for an answer to the mystery of this existence. Something to hang onto where there is none.... Because it is all so interdependent.
It makes me feel responsible and accountable for my actions more than anything else and it makes me feel like I am part of something bigger than me.

[ocean breeze]

Where do you get the vibe of not taking it seriously?


i was speaking in general not just to you in particular.



If adam is here to really find answers to even these kind of questions, being told to get conventional therapy is not nesessarily the right adress




i don't see why it wouldn't be. especially with a thread title asking "does it matter if i kill someone." i take those as mental warning signs that needs therapeutic help and "spirituality" would probably just confused them more. this should be left to a trained professional not random strangers on the internet. i hear of too many killing where people ignored the warning signs until it was too late.

[MIND POWER]

Sometimes the problem with some people in spirituality is that they like to make things complex, with all their philosophy and jargon.

Lets make this abundantly clear, its not ok to kill anybody! People knew this 1000's years ago, small children learn this during their child hood. Innate commonsense tells us, that it is not ok!

Its all fun and games, getting all philosophical. But when questions like this are being ask, you have to just reply with common sense.

[luntrusreality]

Lets make this abundantly clear, its not ok to kill anybody! People knew this 1000's years ago, small children learn this during their child hood. Innate commonsense tells us, that it is not ok!

.

Yes, I agree that it is wrong to kill.
But we need to question everything we believe to be true.
Even innate common sense.
We need to find out for ourselves. Not just by our social conditioning.

What is right and wrong, and who decides?
Is there such a thing even outside of the human paradigm?
What does it matter for the universe if I kill someone and what is my relation to the universe?
Is there a universe?
If it is wrong to kill, why does it happen everyday?
It can't be wrong for the universe if it already is happening, right?
etc. etc.

We ask these questions and go into stillness, because the mind can
only answer with philosphical concepts a la "Don't do something to someone
else, that you wouldn't want the other to do to you" which is not really satisfying for us on a spiritual journey.

These questions are all connected and lead to other questions.
It is part of the journey to explore the "dark side" as well.

So "getting all philosophical" about questions like this is not all fun and games. It is important.

Luntrus

[BlueSky]

Yes, I agree that it is wrong to kill.
But we need to question everything we believe to be true.
Even innate common sense.
We need to find out for ourselves. Not just by our social conditioning.

What is right and wrong, and who decides?
Is there such a thing even outside of the human paradigm?
What does it matter for the universe if I kill someone and what is my relation to the universe?
Is there a universe?
If it is wrong to kill, why does it happen everyday?
It can't be wrong for the universe if it already is happening, right?
etc. etc.

We ask these questions and go into stillness, because the mind can
only answer with philosphical concepts a la "Don't do something to someone
else, that you wouldn't want the other to do to you" which is not really satisfying for us on a spiritual journey.

These questions are all connected and lead to other questions.
It is part of the journey to explore the "dark side" as well.

So "getting all philosophical" about questions like this is not all fun and games. It is important.

Luntrus
It's important to you....

[luntrusreality]

It's important to you....

How could I speak for someone else?
All I was saying is based on my own experience, not on someone elses.

So yes: for me it was important to question ALL beliefs.
Not only the comfortable ones, those we are not attached to.
But even those regarding death (which includes the" morality of killing"), family and my own life.

And I shared that because I feel it applies here.
There might be cases in which there is obviously a mental illness, there.
I didn't get that sense from OP. More like a spiritual dilemma, not a psychopath.


Luntrus

[God-Like]

How could I speak for someone else?
All I was saying is based on my own experience, not on someone elses.


There's that reference point thingy ma jig again :D


x daz x

[luntrusreality]

There's that reference point thingy ma jig again :D


x daz x

Let's not go into it in this thread ; )

[BlueSky]

How could I speak for someone else?
All I was saying is based on my own experience, not on someone elses.

So yes: for me it was important to question ALL beliefs.
Not only the comfortable ones, those we are not attached to.
But even those regarding death (which includes the" morality of killing"), family and my own life.

And I shared that because I feel it applies here.
There might be cases in which there is obviously a mental illness, there.
I didn't get that sense from OP. More like a spiritual dilemma, not a psychopath.


Luntrus
Try using the word "I" in place of "we". You posts read as if you are speaking for everyone.

[silent whisper]

When you question yourself in this way, you bring to light the nature of the whole and how it can create ideas in our mind when we match up aspects in realization and fears awakening. When your reality starts to shift dramatically in the painbody side of things, it can be startling and confusing and it makes you question everything, even death and how it comes to be that some life is taken for granted in the hands of some. When you start to see the potential of the world as it is deeply, you open your deepest aspects of self, how you feel about pain and suffering, how you feel about fear and what it can do. Extreme matters open extreme internal relationships in you. The world doesn't way up when your eyes are opening in ways like the Op is expressing, I have been there in other ways not in this one of course. When you question it all, you question you and where you fit.

Until you clear out it all, you cannot get clear.

So that is why it is so important to not be trapped by your own fears and ideas around the fears of the world. The pieces of you become skewed and its hard to see clearly. Everything in that fear space becomes very confusing. Because everything in your reality begins to look like you.

And as you realize others in certain ways, you wonder about yourself and your own ways.

For me it opened up the nature of seeking balance in all ways of questioning.

Looking at everything for every angle and seeing myself in that reflection to sort me out and find a new one..

[silent whisper]

Try using the word "I" in place of "we". You posts read as if you are speaking for everyone.


I am always bemused when someone says this.

The reason being is that when I see another write this way or even myself, there is a natural feeling arise in me of inclusiveness in the nature of my and their connection to the state of being aware of all life as one..

So in that view I hold I don't ever really tell others what to do...in this instance.

But suggestion is fine I suppose to help make it more clear for you in that space of awareness, which is understanding your nature and what you might need.

[luntrusreality]

Try using the word "I" in place of "we". You posts read as if you are speaking for everyone.

"I" believe that questioning our beliefs is a very important part of the spiritual journey for all of us.
This is itself a belief and I know it sounds paradoxical.
But well, there we go.
You absolutely have the right to question even the belief we should question our beliefs ;)
Questioning our beliefs does not mean to try and prove them wrong.

Luntrus

[silent whisper]

"I" believe that questioning our beliefs is a very important part of the spiritual journey for all of us.
This is itself a belief and I know it sounds paradoxical.
But well, there we go.
You absolutely have the right to question even the belief we should question our beliefs ;)

Luntrus


that is a clever answer, and it makes much sense to me looking in and being curious and bemused about it all myself.

[Gem]

Yea, pronouns are very contentious. teehee.

[BlueSky]

"I" believe that questioning our beliefs is a very important part of the spiritual journey for all of us.
This is itself a belief and I know it sounds paradoxical.
But well, there we go.
You absolutely have the right to question even the belief we should question our beliefs ;)
Questioning our beliefs does not mean to try and prove them wrong.

Luntrus
That's cheating lol! You can't say "I" believe "we".....
Regardless of how you word things, your energy comes off as "this is it and this is why". I call it the " teacher syndrome"

[silent whisper]

That's cheating lol! You can't say "I" believe "we".....
Regardless of how you word things, your energy comes off as "this is it and this is why". I call it the " teacher syndrome"




In reflection teach you teach well..


At least your more direct nowdays about it!

[luntrusreality]

That's cheating lol! You can't say "I" believe "we".....
Regardless of how you word things, your energy comes off as "this is it and this is why". I call it the " teacher syndrome"

Yes, this might be so.
But why would I bother answering such questions if I didn't "know"?
This is too much of a serious question to just throw in "concepts I believe in" or recite other teachings from a book.
This is always the problem, that as soon as someone claims to know something
it comes off as a teaching-vibe. Then it is just up to whoever takes something
out of it or not.
I will not change the way I word things to "maybe" or " I think" or "for me personally it is important but not for you maybe" because that would not be congruent with how I experience.
I know these patterns from my own journey , these contradicitons and questions about "what does it all matter?" and therefore I don't see an individual with an individual unique problem.
But just the dilemma itself which is a pattern, that is the result of a person taking these concepts of nonduality for granted without experiencing them directly.

Luntrus

[silent whisper]

Yes, this might be so.
But why would I bother answering such questions if I didn't "know"?
This is too much of a serious question to just throw in "concepts I believe in" or recite other teachings from a book.
This is always the problem, that as soon as someone claims to know something
it comes off as a teaching-vibe. Then it is just up to whoever takes something
out of it or not.
I will not change the way I word things to "maybe" or " I think" or "for me personally it is important but not for you maybe" because that would not be congruent with how I experience.
I know these patterns from my own journey , these contradicitons and questions about "what does it all matter?" and therefore I don't see an individual with an individual unique problem.
But just the dilemma itself which is a pattern, that is the result of a person taking these concepts of nonduality for granted without experiencing them directly.

Luntrus

Wise men tell tall tales, but for some reason in this moment you feel spiritually tall in your tales of telling..

Is that because I feel your self assured way of speaking because you do know from experience and you enjoy sharing in that way..maybe!

[luntrusreality]

Wise men tell tall tales, but for some reason in this moment you feel spiritually tall in your tales of telling..


Sorry, I don't have that many tales and clever analogies...

[silent whisper]

Sorry, I don't have that many tales and clever analogies...

Its all in good spirit! :wink:

goodnight ...:book1:

[luntrusreality]

Its all in good spirit! :wink:

goodnight ...:book1:

It's fine, I only understand half of what you're saying anyway ; )

[silent whisper]

It's fine, I only understand half of what you're saying anyway ; )

Lol

ok will be more clear tomorrow.

I am tired.

Night..

[MIND POWER]

Yes, I agree that it is wrong to kill.
But we need to question everything we believe to be true.
Even innate common sense.
We need to find out for ourselves. Not just by our social conditioning.

What is right and wrong, and who decides?
Is there such a thing even outside of the human paradigm?
What does it matter for the universe if I kill someone and what is my relation to the universe?
Is there a universe?
If it is wrong to kill, why does it happen everyday?
It can't be wrong for the universe if it already is happening, right?
etc. etc.

We ask these questions and go into stillness, because the mind can
only answer with philosphical concepts a la "Don't do something to someone
else, that you wouldn't want the other to do to you" which is not really satisfying for us on a spiritual journey.

These questions are all connected and lead to other questions.
It is part of the journey to explore the "dark side" as well.

So "getting all philosophical" about questions like this is not all fun and games. It is important.

Luntrus

It has nothing to do with social conditioning its just innate commonsense, unless you are a psychopath or lacking intelligence emotionally. Its not ok to just kill somebody, all the philosophical talk on here has been complete nonsense/jargon. It was the same the other day, when I explained the stuff about atoms and there not really being a physical world. People sprouting more complexes, a good teacher gets their information ascross without complexity.

Its not ok to kill people, its very simple.

Don't bother replying to me with some sort of spin, I have said what I wanted to say! And I have made it very clear, without complexity or complete nonsense.

Its not ok to kill people!

[luntrusreality]

People sprouting more complexes, a good teacher gets their information ascross without complexity.


Something specific that was too complex? I tried to be as clear as possible in adressing the matter.

I wouldn't be satisfied with an "it just is common sense" on my spiritual journey.

Luntrus

[Emmalevine]

It has nothing to do with social conditioning its just innate commonsense, unless you are a psychopath or lacking intelligence emotionally. Its not ok to just kill somebody, all the philosophical talk on here has been complete nonsense/jargon. It was the same the other day, when I explained the stuff about atoms and there not really being a physical world. People sprouting more complexes, a good teacher gets their information ascross without complexity.

Its not ok to kill people, its very simple.

Don't bother replying to me with some sort of spin, I have said what I wanted to say! And I have made it very clear, without complexity or complete nonsense.

Its not ok to kill people!

Yes I agree..

[wanchain]

']sorry for the redundancy but i still cant get over how i saw the things ive seen.

people say we are all living a shared dream? How? Sorry if i can only see my view point but my thoughts changed my entire reality, i cant stress that enough. so how exactly are we sharing this reality?

Adamm,

Maybe your awareness is predominantly somewhere else, so you don't share the experiences that most do here. I am wondering if you would just need to anchor your awareness back to this physical dimension that we all are in. Just a thought ...

W.

[A human Being]

Adam's thread title was clumsy and he didn't think it through very well, imo, but I'm with luntrus - it's a question that could well arise if you've been wrestling with all these spiritual and philosophical concepts, not the work of an aspiring serial killer. I guess maybe these questions arise because people (particularly men, I would speculate) are so mind-dominated, and therefore cut off from their hearts. If your heart's open, you wouldn't need an explanation as to why you shouldn't kill another.

[Gem]

I like the thread title, and to me is an ethical question. Completely hypothetical. The position that it doesn't matter is necessarily nihilistic, so no surprise there; but life aims to live and the wholesome condition is the love of life, and that's all there is to it really.

[Greenslade]

']people say we are all living a shared dream? How? Sorry if i can only see my view point but my thoughts changed my entire reality, i cant stress that enough. so how exactly are we sharing this reality?
'] i also saw a hell of alot of other things in physical reality that were my nightmarish thoughts that were completley immpossible but yet there they were on TV, radio, etc.
You've answered your own question.

Yes we are sharing the reality, the reality for some people are immersed in the reality of being a part of the experience, whether that's 'perpetrator' or 'victim' of what you have seen in your nightmarish thoughts. Others - like yourself - are observing the reality of others and being aware that this is part and parcel of this existence. They may have come 'out of your head' and you may well have thought they were impossible but they have their existence just the same, so that should tell you something. But if you feel this way then just how fake is everything in your life? If those things are fake then the feelings you have about them should be just as fake, but if your feelings are real (and they are to you) then perhaps that's your answer. This is the reality you have chosen to experience. Dreams have their own reality in the time we are dreaming them, when we wake up we have a different reality and neither is better than the other, they're simply existence in different states of consciousness.

Does anything matter? It would seem so to you, because to you they were nightmares and you're depressed. Welcome to the shared reality, that what you see as figments of your imagination is reality to those involved.

[adamm[]]

when i say my thoughts changed my reality i dont mean on little things. I had this idea that i was evolving when i was walking down the street and i had a small heart attack, i was panicing because i thought i might actually rip out of my body or shift into the 4th dimension and never be able to return as if i would just disappear and no one would know what happened to me, if i was dead or ran away and stuff, then about 200 yards down the road i came across this little car decal that said evolve. If we are sharing this dream then that car decal had to get there in a physical manner which means it had to be thrown out a car or fall off within about 5 minutes of me having that idea which is very hard to believe, because if we truley share this dream then it had to of gotten there in a physical means. Or did my thought of evolving litterly manifest that decal out of thin air?

Secondly when i was in a very fearful mode i started seeing very horrible things damn near everywhere as if my computer is psychic and knew what i was thinking about and had little advertisements pop up with all kinds of things. I was researching government corruption and somehow that lead into some kind of satanic worshiping evil shadow government that wants to just kill us all off and do rreally evil type things. So anyways when i was into that i started seeing youtube "recomended" videos with titles like "the rapture is coming" and "obama is the anti christ", "the mark of the beast to be enforced" yada yada yada, but i wasnt actually searching for any of those types of things at that time, so it wasnt my cookies that was triggering those videos, it was this damn psychic computer thats reading my thoughts.
Again, if we are sharing this dream then someone made those videos, im sure those videos do exist, made by some hard core nut case christian, but youtube shouldnt of recommened them for me.

even if computers are psychic and dont actually work the way we think they do, there is no way i could have seen that horrible tv commercial with my grandmother standing next to me, and she said "thats all i get with my bunny ears" when i asked her what she was watching. my grandmother NEVER EVER twists her words like that.

i could list 100 other weird things that REAL PEOPLE said to me that were straight out of my head, and i think outside the box, so for them to say something so outrageous is rather odd. So for these people to say something so random to me makes it very hard for me to believe that you guys are all real and that im sharing this reality with other concious people.

I dont know about anyone else but when i was in the hightened state of my all day long panic attacks i heard a commercial say "buy 10 gallons of milk, get the 11th free" I could only assume this is because i was thinking of the number 11 so much. So how did this commerical air because if we are sharing this dream/reality, then that means garelick farms milk is seeling 11 gallons of milk for the price of 10. Logically this is dumb because no one is gonna spend 39$ on milk to save 4$, so the only thing that makes any sense is LOA/dream reality.

sadly near everything LOA says about LOA makes perfect sense, the only thing i cant account for is all of you. If i exist in every possible reality so that i can focus on litterally anything (purple winged, pink skined, yellow pola dotted flying turtles) then i could merge into a reality where that exists, but if im in that reality (my conciousness) then that means a body of mine is still in ever single other reality(this reality and all others) but im not actually living it out. But if this is true then i can never be dead, but then LOA litterally says if i think of something then it will happen, so the mere fact of me thinking of war, creates war which causes people to die but then that person cant be real because if he was, then for him, he can merge into any reality he wants. But this kinda conflicts with itself because if two people have free will and the ability to go into any reality they want, then he can go into a reality where im dead and i go where hes dead. see what im trying to say.

So, please explain if you can. Because if i blew up the planet, it really wouldnt matter because there are infinite -1 other realities where your still all living and such.

[luntrusreality]

']
So, please explain if you can. Because if i blew up the planet, it really wouldnt matter because there are infinite -1 other realities where your still all living and such.

If you ask a question relating to the absolute viewpoint it is impossible
to give a relative answer.
There will not be a satisfying answer on this level.


Yes, if someone blew up the earth it wouldn't matter from an absolute viewpoint.
But also it wouldn't matter if he didn't blow up the earth.


Luntrus

[KevinO]

It has nothing to do with social conditioning its just innate commonsense, unless you are a psychopath or lacking intelligence emotionally. Its not ok to just kill somebody, all the philosophical talk on here has been complete nonsense/jargon. It was the same the other day, when I explained the stuff about atoms and there not really being a physical world. People sprouting more complexes, a good teacher gets their information ascross without complexity.

Its not ok to kill people, its very simple.

Don't bother replying to me with some sort of spin, I have said what I wanted to say! And I have made it very clear, without complexity or complete nonsense.

Its not ok to kill people!

Then how can some people kill people without apparent concern, as in hit men/war/mafia/KKK, etc. If you are going to say they are all sociopaths or otherwise justified then you are defining your terms by your terms.
I would say we are here alone, not in consciousness with the greater whole except through God, or co-creator. Who apparently has no regard for life whatsoever since all life dies. Galaxies crash together, comets rip through planets, and the occasional bullet finds the occasional brain for odd reasons.

If you haven't read it, an interesting look at it is The Mysterious Stranger by Mark Twain.

[Ivy]

Some see a fun philosophical chat.

I read about somebody who experiences depression and has experienced prolonged anxiety who is seeing a power to make things materialise, and who is ruminating on nihilism.

Adamm, I don't see what you are doing with spiritual ideas as being healthy. It is only my view and you are the person who is responsible for your mind, not me. But I hope you can keep yourself healthy.

[running]

Just because life has an end doesn't mean its without meaning IMO. So I live and I will die. And perhaps I will do it again. Its pretty cool to get to live. And if I welcome death then what do I have to fear. Probably would suck to live forever.

[Gem]

Sounds irrational.

[VinceField]

Just because life has an end doesn't mean its without meaning IMO. So I live and I will die. And perhaps I will do it again. Its pretty cool to get to live. And if I welcome death then what do I have to fear. Probably would suck to live forever.

I generally agree with this view.

The significance of life is actually probably enhanced by the factor of death.

Peaceful acceptance of death is a very liberating thing and can help to eliminate many of one's fears in life.

I'd imagine living in this system of reality would get boring after a while. It would eventually become a reliving of the same types of experiences over and over again, the same themes dressed up in different clothing.

[adamm[]]

i feel like alot of you are missing the point entireley and i dont know why, maybe you think im crazy or something or dont read my posts completley.

So to get the idea, everyone is alone in their own little virtual reality, like a computer game, this game is called life. you are the only person that really matters because you start to realize that EVERYTHING around you conforms to your thoughts.

Thats what ive experienced and now im basically trying to figure out if anyone else is actually real, im also dealing with moral values because i dont fret over killing people in video games because it doesnt matter, so if i knew that if life is just a way more complex video game, then why would killing matter? why does war matter? morals are gone because you cant actually do harm to anything.

So lots of people have told me things that point me in the direction of why things matter but dont really fully explain it. Like the many minds one conciousness. What does that mean?? that really doesnt explain anything any better. I feel like nothing anyone tells me is really giving me any answers that make any sense and after this whole LOA thing has happened to me i also feel like if i come up with any kind of idea of whats beyond this physical reality, then its just another product of my own LOA, as if i could rip out of this physical reality and go into the spirit realm which is the "real" reality, where infinite other concious beings live as well as have their own little physical realities. But how would i know if that was even real.

how are you people real?

whats beyond physical reality?

what is the reality we all share?

anything along those lines.

has anyone hear lived their entire lives normally and then one day read a proclaimed factual book about alien abductions and then got scared ****less and then a week later they get abducted? If not, go read something scary about government corruption or evil aliens and then watch your entire reality go to hell and then come back and try to answer my question. Then youll be on the same level as me.

[luntrusreality]

']
Like the many minds one conciousness. What does that mean??


Exactly what it says: one consciousness that takes the appeareances of many minds. Not one mind that takes the appearance of a personal virtual reality.
You have to go one step further.
Don't try to look for a philosophical explanation here, you feel no answer makes sense, because no answer in words will be satisfactory for the mind.

You are on a spiritual forum, not on a philosophy forum.
Spirituality is not about concepts but that what the concepts point towards.
Explore in your own experience that WHICH IS REAL (Consciousness, the fact that there is knowing of experience) and not that which is fake (what your mind tells you about reality)

Just shift your focus away from trying to get an answer that can be written down or spoken in words. You can't find it there.


Might be interesting for you:
The difference between solipsism and nonduality - rupert spira
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a2anz9QKD7Y

[Ivy]

My life has never been 'normal', and I have experienced serious violence against me, including someone trying to kill me. I experienced feeling that something big was going to happen beforehand, I experienced the full depth of connection while it happened and I experienced and also watched the ripple that effected many peoples lives afterwards.

So you read something about aliens and think it's happened. Go read something about real, everyday crimes and then wait and see if it actually happens when that choice is left up to another person.

In the meantime, you've asked if it matters if you kill someone. This is something I've experienced, and yes it matters. I don't mean that it's upsetting. It really matters, not in terms of good and bad, but in terms of what you create, of cause and effect.

By the way, I don't think you're crazy. But I do listen to you speak about mental conditions such as depression and severe anxiety, whilst ruminating on a question about killing people and whether it matters. As I say, it's an experience I've had and I'm telling you about it.

[BlueSky]

']i feel like alot of you are missing the point entireley and i dont know why, maybe you think im crazy or something or dont read my posts completley.

So to get the idea, everyone is alone in their own little virtual reality, like a computer game, this game is called life. you are the only person that really matters because you start to realize that EVERYTHING around you conforms to your thoughts.

Thats what ive experienced and now im basically trying to figure out if anyone else is actually real, im also dealing with moral values because i dont fret over killing people in video games because it doesnt matter, so if i knew that if life is just a way more complex video game, then why would killing matter? why does war matter? morals are gone because you cant actually do harm to anything.

So lots of people have told me things that point me in the direction of why things matter but dont really fully explain it. Like the many minds one conciousness. What does that mean?? that really doesnt explain anything any better. I feel like nothing anyone tells me is really giving me any answers that make any sense and after this whole LOA thing has happened to me i also feel like if i come up with any kind of idea of whats beyond this physical reality, then its just another product of my own LOA, as if i could rip out of this physical reality and go into the spirit realm which is the "real" reality, where infinite other concious beings live as well as have their own little physical realities. But how would i know if that was even real.

how are you people real?

whats beyond physical reality?

what is the reality we all share?

anything along those lines.

has anyone hear lived their entire lives normally and then one day read a proclaimed factual book about alien abductions and then got scared ****less and then a week later they get abducted? If not, go read something scary about government corruption or evil aliens and then watch your entire reality go to hell and then come back and try to answer my question. Then youll be on the same level as me.
Adam, have you considered that what we make of our experiences are not necessary in line with what was experienced.
I learned long ago that you will know a tree by its fruit. What we make of our experiences could be out of balance and when that happens, we can know by the fruit of what we made of those experiences. Ungrounded ness, etc
We put too much weight on experiences IMO.
Just some things to consider based on my experience lol

[VinceField]

']how are you people real?

whats beyond physical reality?

what is the reality we all share?

anything along those lines.

I don't believe that anyone here truly knows the answers to these questions. They are essentially unknowable in an absolute sense, as they can't be proven with physical evidence and any other line of proof is subjective and unreliable at best. You are beating your head against a wall here. Perhaps a more fruitful line of questioning would be somewhere along the lines of, "What do I want in my life and how can I achieve it?"

has anyone hear lived their entire lives normally and then one day read a proclaimed factual book about alien abductions and then got scared ****less and then a week later they get abducted? If not, go read something scary about government corruption or evil aliens and then watch your entire reality go to hell and then come back and try to answer my question. Then youll be on the same level as me.

Are you claiming that you were abducted by aliens?

I've read my fair share of alien and conspiracy literature. After various periods of intense fascination and absorption in the subjects, I've come to realize that the acquisition of knowledge and contemplation of these topics do not improve the quality of one's life in any way. They only serve to generate fear and distraction from one's immediate reality.

It seems you need a change of focus if you want to see any improvements in your state of mind.

[BlueSky]

I don't believe that anyone here truly knows the answers to these questions. They are essentially unknowable in an absolute sense, as they can't be proven with physical evidence and any other line of proof is subjective and unreliable at best. You are beating your head against a wall here. Perhaps a more fruitful line of questioning would be somewhere along the lines of, "What do I want in my life and how can I achieve it?"



Are you claiming that you were abducted by aliens?

I've read my fair share of alien and conspiracy literature. After various periods of intense fascination and absorption in the subjects, I've come to realize that the acquisition of knowledge and contemplation of these topics do not improve the quality of one's life in any way. They only serve to generate fear and distraction from one's immediate reality.

It seems you need a change of focus if you want to see any improvements in your state of mind.
That's kinda what I was saying above. You saw the fruit of what you made of your experiences or studies and had the strength to move on based on that fruit.

[Gem]

The bloke who says the wisest thing about fruit is not wise enough to drink the fruit juice and not think about it. (hehehehe, looks like I'm that bloke).

[BlueSky]

The bloke who says the wisest thing about fruit is not wise enough to drink the fruit juice and not thing about it. (hehehehe, looks like I'm that bloke).
Don't drink the koolaid!

[AstralProjectee]

I think I know what your going through Adamm. One time I was going through a very hard time. I was getting psychophrenic. And was experiencing derealization and depersonalization disorder. I felt like I was a robot. I would do things and I felt like it wasn’t even me, but only my robotic body. I felt like nothing even mattered on a certain level. I think you either have depersonalization or derealization disorder. I was also experiencing what your experiencing with getting all caught up with depressing beliefs about the world and myself. I had a ton of anxiety and I am sure you got quite a bit of that. For me I was thinking that I was going to hell and all kinds of stuff. My mind would just go on and on about negative things. You may seem like your experiencing something spiritually real. But I assure you that it’s the wrong type of realization. You need medical help. This may seem like it's spiritual but it's not. You need to get medical help. I take psychiatric medicine to this day to help me. And it has helped a LOT. Luckily I don’t experience psychophrenia, derealization, or depersonalization anymore.

In the end ask yourself does any of all this worrying actually help you? I am guessing the ultimate answer is no. You can’t prevent aliens from abducting you and you can’t change the goverment (not much). Your worrying too much. See a psychiatrist and get some help. There are often organizations and government agencies that can help.

People have meditated torward depersonalization and derealization and have had to go back. Be careful with meditation.

BTW for the sake of truth I will say that have strong beliefs that there is only one physical dimension, and so if what you say is true that if you blow the this world it wouldn't even matter, then that isn't true at all. Since we are needed for the future generations. Since it's the future generations that will be able to help other people in other physical worlds in the universe end their suffering. That is my theory and I don't get anxiety about it.

I’ve been on the edge myself just like you. I wish you the best adamm.

[baro-san]

']sorry for the graphic topic but ive seen a news commerical that said 48/50 states were infected with a deadly disease, i also saw a hell of alot of other things in physical reality that were my nightmarish thoughts that were completley immpossible but yet there they were on TV, radio, etc.

So now i guess im left with nihilistic solphsism. I really think people are all just figments of my imagination after seeing all those things play out that were right out of my head.

So i really dont know what im asking because no one seems to be as depressed about spiritual awakenings as i am, knowing that everything in your life is practically fake.

So, if this is just my dream, does anything matter?This is an older thread, and I hope you're better already.

I believe that we are elementals of conscience that are born into this physical life like going to school to learn something. Those who don't learn enough reincarnate, go to school again, and again, until they learn it, and graduate.

What do we have to learn?

It came to me in an astral projection: we have to learn to be awake, and stay awake after we return into non-physical, through death.

In the non-physical, each of us as, as elemental of conscience, is in a state of non-awareness, pretty much as when we sleep. We get born into physical, where we become awake through education and objective interaction with the physical world, but that doesn't stick to us easily. Every time when we fall asleep we lose our awareness, and when we die we lose it too, remaining in a dream like status in which we continue to go from a dream to another, as during our physical lives, until we're born again into physical.

The goal of successive reincarnations is to become aware and remain aware in non-physical. Only when this eventually happens we can proceed to the next level of development of conscience.

When one elemental of conscience succeeds in being awake in afterlife he then helps other elementals of conscience become awake too, so that a whole cluster of elementals will graduate to the next step. These elementals are the same ones with which we developed affinities through our successive reincarnations.

This is the same process that repeats itself on each elemental from its primordial creation going through the successive realms: mineral, vegetal, animal, human, and further.

So, this is what we have to learn and accomplish in this physical life. How we do it? Don't waste your life! Educated yourself, learn as much and as thorough as you can, feel awake, have an inquiring critical mind, learn to keep awareness when you go to sleep, and try to keep it when you die too!

Good luck!

[adamm[]]

what question do i have to ask to get the answer im looking for, i feel like im in that movie I-robot.

i hate to say scary things because of the fear mongering stuff, but sadly thats how i noticed my thoughts coming into my life and thats where i am now. I go all involved in government corruption which basicaly led to this weird stuff to where we dont see whats "really" going on in the world. there are these sings that say "eat" "obey" "stay asleep" "buy stuff". to me, its just fear tactics to get people scared of basicly being human. But anyways i watched this movie called doom generation and there was a sing in the background clear as day that says "obey".

Who would use scare tactics to scare people about being themselves? unless life is truly just my own personal dream and all the things in the world that i see as corupt, are just my own personal fears of what i think corupt people would do. I guess i saw those types of fearful things because my fear level was litterally that high.


how can my thoughts make dunkin donuts server hashbrowns with their menu, i litterally wanted hashbrowns one day and knew DD didnt server them but McD was too far away, then magically DD has them on their menu, how is that possible? it takes more than 4 days for an executive decision to be made, food ordered, etc etc. So how is that a shared dream, i must have litteraly jumped realities, or DD just magically changed when i wasnt looking.

i have like 100 other odd LOA stories like that, so please explain how this works while you are still real. i havnt morphed into some blood sucking slime monster because a mental patient thought i was. BUT, my friends and family morphed to my thoughts.

[AstralProjectee]

adamm I use to be the same way, thinking that reality was being directly influenced by my thoughts. Almost instantly so. But that isn't how it works. Only later did I realize upon more reflection that most of the time it was just coincidences. Only in the astral do we get instant gratification with our thoughts and subconious desires. But even in the astral that isn't always the case. And it's not the real effect we are looking for. WIth people creating hollow heavens and hollow hells in the astral. It's not even the effect we truly desire. How much more longer does it take for us to get gratification by our thoughts here in the physical, where we are bogged down by a heavy body and time. Truth is, true gratification from our thoughts takes much more than just deluded thoughts here and there. I can go over many things that happened in my life that I thought and swore up and down were supernatural, only to find out later that it's wasn't the case. Or it was just coincidence, and not synchronicity.

Everyone experiences things that are just coincidence. My brother when he was a kid prayed that if there was a God that it would rain. And it did rain almost instantly with even thunder. But I also did the same thing and it didn’t work. Coincidences do happen to all of us.

[baro-san]

']...
1. When striking "coincidences" like yours happen to me I think at two possibilities, beyond the slim probability that they're just coincidences.

- either I influenced the chain of events
- or I intuitively tapped into a source of information about that chain of events.

I usually lean toward this second possibility

2. Regarding the worrisome thoughts you describe: I know it's difficult, and you might need to take a mixed chemical-psychological-spiritual-... approach. You're too reactive to the environmental stimuli. You put too much stock in what others, like media outlets, say.

You shouldn't worry about things you have no control on. Accept that!

Try to always do what you think is right, without expecting immediate proportional results, and trust that on average you'll get what you deserve! Sometimes you'll be in error and not pay for it, other times you'll pay more than you should. Sometimes you'll get rewarded less than you deserve, other times more.

The point is for you to do your best, and not worry about consequences. Anyway we can't always know what's best because of our limited access to information, and because of our limited capability to compile it.

Rely on your intuition! Make your mistakes, not others'!

[luntrusreality]

']what question do i have to ask to get the answer im looking for, i feel like im in that movie I-robot.

i hate to say scary things because of the fear mongering stuff, but sadly thats how i noticed my thoughts coming into my life and thats where i am now. I go all involved in government corruption which basicaly led to this weird stuff to where we dont see whats "really" going on in the world. there are these sings that say "eat" "obey" "stay asleep" "buy stuff". to me, its just fear tactics to get people scared of basicly being human. But anyways i watched this movie called doom generation and there was a sing in the background clear as day that says "obey".

Who would use scare tactics to scare people about being themselves? unless life is truly just my own personal dream and all the things in the world that i see as corupt, are just my own personal fears of what i think corupt people would do. I guess i saw those types of fearful things because my fear level was litterally that high.


how can my thoughts make dunkin donuts server hashbrowns with their menu, i litterally wanted hashbrowns one day and knew DD didnt server them but McD was too far away, then magically DD has them on their menu, how is that possible? it takes more than 4 days for an executive decision to be made, food ordered, etc etc. So how is that a shared dream, i must have litteraly jumped realities, or DD just magically changed when i wasnt looking.

i have like 100 other odd LOA stories like that, so please explain how this works while you are still real. i havnt morphed into some blood sucking slime monster because a mental patient thought i was. BUT, my friends and family morphed to my thoughts.

All these government stories are completely irrelevant.

What answer are you looking for?
Ask the question again please, I thought it was:
"Does it matter if I kill someone?"

You have a lot of different suggestions from exploring nonduality to getting therapy. A lot of stuff on here.

You seem to already know an answer you want and just seek confirmation of some kind, otherwise you wouldn't be so dismissive of everything that is being said.

Try to work with whats already there.

Luntrus

[Ivy]

It seems that you can't manifest the answer you want.

That will be because we are real people and you have no influence over our will.

[adamm[]]

@luntrus
the answer i have doesnt really make things matter because if my body exists in infinte realities, but my conciousness only exists in one, that means it is highly unlikley that there is any other actualy concious human being walking around in this same reality. This is the only idea i have came up with that makes any sense.

if there is only one reality then government conspiracys do matter, at least the ones you have actualy evidence for, subliminal messages in movies, In the movie Zhumba the trees shadow clearly spells the word sex.In the song S&M by rihanna, near the end it says "rihana princess of the illuminati" "***** cant sing". All this makes me wonder if there are more, but i dont bother looking into that for the sake of LOA. but if LOA is wrong then i should know just how sadisticly evil the government is.

@baro-san
i would love to believe that i tapped into the quantum web of infomation but a few things that were just too off happened. Firstly that news cast i saw. My roomate even said he saw something similair but instead of a disease, he said he saw america destroyed by nukes. The other semi odd thing was my sister telling me a friend of mine tried to kill herself and had to get her stomach pumped, only to see her 2 days later in the liquor store. im not positive but im pretty sure with suicide attempts, you have to be hospitolized. so there are things that just didnt make any sense.

@ivy
yea i know. but im hoping that if i ask the right question then ill get the right answer, the squeky tires gets the grease, right. So if i complain long enough then il get what i want.



i have come up with a tempalte of how reality works that makes sense based on what i know, but if people really have spirit guides and pleadians and arcturians are really projecting themselves back in time, and people like bashar are real and accurate, then all these people would have the answer already, and the entire spirituality community would be on the same track. It doesnt seem to feel like that.


i still feel like something is off.

[Ninjajms]

Adam,

you asked if it was wrong to kill someone-my response is this-think of it in this way-For example, let's say you have a child, a parent, a niece, a dog, etc-someone that you love very very much and they are killed-how would that make you feel?

My bottom line question is why would you want to cause that kind of pain too someone-

I am seriously concerned about your well being-this is not the first time you have asked a question of this nature-You matter-you count-you are important-you owe it to yourself and the people on this earth to find your worth-prove me wrong that you don't matter-wondering if its wrong to kill someone or yourself is a cry for help-Please please reach out to someone like a teacher, priest, pASTOR, A SPIRITUAL ADVISOR, A FRIEND, YOUR PARENTS SIBLINGS-you matter you are loved

[revolver]

No it doesn't matter if you kill someone, but does it matter if someone kills you ?.

[Ivy]

']@luntrus
the answer i have doesnt really make things matter because if my body exists in infinte realities, but my conciousness only exists in one, that means it is highly unlikley that there is any other actualy concious human being walking around in this same reality. This is the only idea i have came up with that makes any sense.

if there is only one reality then government conspiracys do matter, at least the ones you have actualy evidence for, subliminal messages in movies, In the movie Zhumba the trees shadow clearly spells the word sex.In the song S&M by rihanna, near the end it says "rihana princess of the illuminati" "***** cant sing". All this makes me wonder if there are more, but i dont bother looking into that for the sake of LOA. but if LOA is wrong then i should know just how sadisticly evil the government is.

@baro-san
i would love to believe that i tapped into the quantum web of infomation but a few things that were just too off happened. Firstly that news cast i saw. My roomate even said he saw something similair but instead of a disease, he said he saw america destroyed by nukes. The other semi odd thing was my sister telling me a friend of mine tried to kill herself and had to get her stomach pumped, only to see her 2 days later in the liquor store. im not positive but im pretty sure with suicide attempts, you have to be hospitolized. so there are things that just didnt make any sense.

@ivy
yea i know. but im hoping that if i ask the right question then ill get the right answer, the squeky tires gets the grease, right. So if i complain long enough then il get what i want.



i have come up with a tempalte of how reality works that makes sense based on what i know, but if people really have spirit guides and pleadians and arcturians are really projecting themselves back in time, and people like bashar are real and accurate, then all these people would have the answer already, and the entire spirituality community would be on the same track. It doesnt seem to feel like that.


i still feel like something is off.

You say you know that we are real, with our own will, yet to those who will entertain your mind, you continue down the road of trying to make your beliefs into something that is true.

To believe in the conspiracy theories you do, you had to read about conspiracy theories. If you hadn't read about them, then your mind would be in a different place.

So who actually is in control of your mind? Where do your thoughts come from? You had to read loads to come up with these theories, you didn't find them by yourself.

But who is responsible for your thoughts? This IS you. And if all you're going to do is write threads and ignore everything that doesn't fit with what you want to hear - you're not using LOA or any such thing, you're just closing your eyes to any other possibilities and deluding yourself that they don't exist. By doing so, By doing so you just stay in the delusion you want.

[silent whisper]

']what question do i have to ask to get the answer im looking for, i feel like im in that movie I-robot.

i hate to say scary things because of the fear mongering stuff, but sadly thats how i noticed my thoughts coming into my life and thats where i am now. I go all involved in government corruption which basicaly led to this weird stuff to where we dont see whats "really" going on in the world. there are these sings that say "eat" "obey" "stay asleep" "buy stuff". to me, its just fear tactics to get people scared of basicly being human. But anyways i watched this movie called doom generation and there was a sing in the background clear as day that says "obey".

Who would use scare tactics to scare people about being themselves? unless life is truly just my own personal dream and all the things in the world that i see as corupt, are just my own personal fears of what i think corupt people would do. I guess i saw those types of fearful things because my fear level was litterally that high.

Yes heightened fear does this..when your fear door is blown wide open, rather than fearing fear, suddenly fear is faced in this way to see how skewed your fears are and how much fear is in the world playing out.


how can my thoughts make dunkin donuts server hashbrowns with their menu, i literally wanted hashbrowns one day and knew DD didnt server them but McD was too far away, then magically DD has them on their menu, how is that possible? it takes more than 4 days for an executive decision to be made, food ordered, etc etc. So how is that a shared dream, i must have litteraly jumped realities, or DD just magically changed when i wasnt looking.

You arrived to meet something that was in synch with your thoughts. It makes you notice things aligning, this is the side of coming into alignment with getting your needs met, the other realm of fear opens up meeting those too..

i have like 100 other odd LOA stories like that, so please explain how this works while you are still real. i havnet morphed into some blood sucking slime monster because a mental patient thought i was. BUT, my friends and family morphed to my thoughts.

When your heightened in this way in feelings and alignments your going to see the external reality as you are in you. Same goes with seeing yourself receive what you need. Its all there, your seeing the nature of the whole as it is created on many levels. The point of focus allows you to open and let go of any threads *holding* you locked into the reality that forms one with your focus and where you are right now in yourself.

You are here in this moment because you need to be, you obviously have some serious integration work going on in you right now. Blowing your reality apart, to open up any closed minded stuff locked in you. The key is not to get caught up in the shifting, just more noticing and not getting tied to it so profoundly, otherwise your mind will not be able to fathom the extreme nature of what your dealing with.

Even now on this side of my shift through something similar, I see so many connections playing out in the whole in this way. I have learned to not let my mind drift in and out of reality when it happens, or get caught up in my head about it all, but more allow myself to immerse in it without attaching to any of it.. In this way I don't get entangled in certain points of it playing out, but rather flow more with it all and move along more freely in the nature of reality as it is.

And you have a choice in each moment, change the channel, that much your have control over..

Don't get caught up in the reality hits, more just notice, change channel, go for a walk in nature...tune into nature it helps.

One has to be careful they don't saboutage themselves in this space, where by they see no escape and stay locked in.....your own freedom is teaching you where you can choose to be even as it is all playing out...

[luntrusreality]

Start from scratch.
You have a lot of ideas about things and they are not helping.

for example : You say your body exists in infinite realities, your consciosness only in one.

is that your direct experience or something you believe in? Something you read?
Have you ever experienced another reality than this one?

you need to make it way more simple.

really try to put everything you seem to know aside and start from the beginning.

Who is this 'I' that you base all the other stuff you talk about on?

[adamm[]]

To anyone who replies that it matters if i kill someone, im not implying it in the every day normal reality, sadly im delusional and believe in an odd multiverse as state below. most of you prolly just reply to the topic so you wont read this far :( oh well, youll save more time by just replying than if you read 7 pages anyways.

@ivy
i only believe you are real in the sense that in what ill call an oversoul plays out all realities in the multiverse for the sake of other conciousnesses. Yet you are only concious of one universe, so in theory i just died 2 minutes ago, but i didnt experience it because it happened in a universe that i wasnt concious of. So, did that version of me experience death? Or did a body just die.

As for thoughts not being mine as they are an outside influence, i get that. But what does that really mean. Isnt everything a thought, even the thoughts that spirituality has put in my head, are still just thoughts. So whats to say that my paranoid delusion is any more valid that the spiritual delusion? If i am aware that i am a highly developed spiritual being, isnt that just awareness

Are you saying that if i dont read about how the government poisons are water that it wont effect me?? So is that water poisoned or not? or does that water not get poisoned until i drink it because its my own personal thought about it?? you never denied that the conspiracies were fake, so are you subtly implying LOA ??

i kinda understand what your saying about thoughts at the same time that i dont. I know im in control of what i think and feel, but what is the implication of that?



@ lunstrusreality
yes, i noticed what people call LOA/multiverse not by researching it and trying to use it, but by seeing my thoughts come to life and by seeing completley contradictory events.

I had this roomate who would complain about his GF and how she was forced to leave him by her stepfather, or an abusive BF, or how her friends had scared her away etc etc. he kept mentioning it for months and i kept correcting him saying "you said this last week, now your changing the story" anyways one day i was kinda fed up with it so i was a little harsh on him pointing out all his discrepancies. So he says "Oh well i never said it happened that way, thats just one way it could have happened" yet he was talking about past events. So this another one of my personal experiences which i feel like the universe was using him to describe to me the multiverse on a much more close up unignorable level. So im sorry if im having trouble

@silent whisper
what do you mean change the channel, just look at other things that are happening in the world? So if no one paid atention to hitler, would he have just game up his world conquest. sorry if this seems like a joke of a question, but its not. Because if i pay attention to only the good in the world, it kinda impies that there will be no bad things.

what do you mean i have a choice in each moment? to do what?

[Molearner]

Time for a reality check. What makes you think you are so important that your life is the only one that matters in this world? You think this has something to do with spiritual development? This is simply narcissism in the nth degree. You think there is some great philosophic answer for this? That anyone in their right mind would encourage you? Your best choice is to find another forum that aligns more closely with your thinking. Jihadists maybe?

[Astral Jane]

adamm - JMO you should do a little study on why you live in a culture that wants to feed you fear. And check out what theologians-to-gurus-to spiritualists say about killing and soul lessons and reincarnating.
Sometimes this crud just needs to come to the surface when you are ready to deal with it , face it without fear.

[baro-san]

']... i would love to believe that i tapped into the quantum web of infomation ...Yesterday I was watching with my wife a show on tv, "Castle", recorded almost 3 evenings earlier. Toward the end of it Becket tells Castle that she has a present for him, and immediately I said "a hat". The next scene confirmed that the present was a Sherlock Holmes' like hat.

We stopped the recording and discussed for a few moments. I retraced how I got to say "hat". It firstly came to my mind something like "you can keep your hat on", which immediately I associated with the song sang by Joe Cocker in the "7 1/2 weeks", and the image of Kim Basinger stripping for her boyfriend on that tune (unforgettable). Then an image of a hat crossed my mind, a hat like the one Sherlock Holmes wears in most dramatisations, a little more greyish and flatter than the one in "Castle", but otherwise the same.

Next we resumed watching and, in less than a minute, as Becket and Castle are heading toward their bedroom for a romantic encounter Becket says insinuatingly in his ear: "you keep your hat on" (!).

Coming back to your dilemma if some events were caused by your thoughts, or your thoughts were caused by events already in motion, it's clear that I tuned into something that already happened, something that I just didn't know yet.

It is also interesting to follow the chain of connections that swiftly crossed my mind, so widely unrelated as a Sherlock Holmes hat and the words of that song.

This kind of things happen more often, without us realizing it. I could, and did, retrace my thought process just because it happened in the presence of somebody else, and it was so much more impressive that I told my wife the phrase "you can leave your hat on" before the character said it on the screen, and in apparent no connection with a Sherlock Holmes hat.

[athribiristan]

']sorry for the graphic topic but ive seen a news commerical that said 48/50 states were infected with a deadly disease, i also saw a hell of alot of other things in physical reality that were my nightmarish thoughts that were completley immpossible but yet there they were on TV, radio, etc.

So now i guess im left with nihilistic solphsism. I really think people are all just figments of my imagination after seeing all those things play out that were right out of my head.

So i really dont know what im asking because no one seems to be as depressed about spiritual awakenings as i am, knowing that everything in your life is practically fake.

So, if this is just my dream, does anything matter?

Life has no value but that which we give it. If you decide life is a dream then it will be so, if you decide a thing matters then it does. Is it ok if you kill someone? You tell me........why would that be ok? If they are indeed a figment of your imagination would you not be killing a part of yourself?

Spiritual awakenings can often lead to similar feelings. You have learned the true nature of free will, it is now up to you to assign value to your existence.

[Ivy]

@ivy
i only believe you are real in the sense that in what ill call an oversoul plays out all realities in the multiverse for the sake of other conciousnesses. Yet you are only concious of one universe, so in theory i just died 2 minutes ago, but i didnt experience it because it happened in a universe that i wasnt concious of. So, did that version of me experience death? Or did a body just die.

As for thoughts not being mine as they are an outside influence, i get that. But what does that really mean. Isnt everything a thought, even the thoughts that spirituality has put in my head, are still just thoughts. So whats to say that my paranoid delusion is any more valid that the spiritual delusion? If i am aware that i am a highly developed spiritual being, isnt that just awareness

Are you saying that if i dont read about how the government poisons are water that it wont effect me?? So is that water poisoned or not? or does that water not get poisoned until i drink it because its my own personal thought about it?? you never denied that the conspiracies were fake, so are you subtly implying LOA ??

i kinda understand what your saying about thoughts at the same time that i dont. I know im in control of what i think and feel, but what is the implication of that?


I'm not getting drawn into your delusions. But the implication of you being in control of your own thoughts, is that your thought of.. "does it matter if I kill someone" is something that you have deliberately chosen to think.

It is a thought that is completely about you. The question of whether killing someone matters to you, is down to whether you have any ability to feel empathy or are able to care or value anyone but yourself.

Having somebody else killing you is a horrific experience. It is noticed on every level. That is real life.

Your thoughts are just from books.

[BlueSky]

Life has no value but that which we give it. If you decide life is a dream then it will be so, if you decide a thing matters then it does. Is it ok if you kill someone? You tell me........why would that be ok? If they are indeed a figment of your imagination would you not be killing a part of yourself?

Spiritual awakenings can often lead to similar feelings. You have learned the true nature of free will, it is now up to you to assign value to your existence.
It certainly seems that life has no value apart from that which we give it, and yet it keeps on life-ing regardless of what value we give it and even before we were around to give it value.
So yes I agree that we give our life value but I wouldn't say that apart from that, it has no value.