Subjective vs Random.

[Gem]

Very difficult to express, for defining it rather distracts from it than gives it meaning, since subjectivity is indeed indefinable by 'definition'.

'Random' pertains to an event... and if nothing occurs then there is no random... yet something did occur, a subjective experince happens, remaining undefined, because the name is not the named.

Certainty does not occur in the universe as all material is interaction, and no material exists by vitrue of itself, and beyond intelligent perception has no validation at all.

As all is validated by subjective experience alone one can not assume 'reality' other than this experience in this moment as it pertains to 'you', yet no doubt is left that there is existence, even though it can not be founded.

Considering our validation is subjective, where do we gain this certainty?

We can but Trust.

[andrew g]

Very difficult to express, for defining it rather distracts from it than gives it meaning, since subjectivity is indeed indefinable by 'definition'.

'Random' pertains to an event... and if nothing occurs then there is no random... yet something did occur, a subjective experince happens, remaining undefined, because the name is not the named.

Certainty does not occur in the universe as all material is interaction, and no material exists by vitrue of itself, and beyond intelligent perception has no validation at all.

As all is validated by subjective experience alone one can not assume 'reality' other than this experience in this moment as it pertains to 'you', yet no doubt is left that there is existence, even though it can not be founded.

Considering our validation is subjective, where do we gain this certainty?

We can but Trust.

Like .

[mattie]

Subjectivity isn’t hard to define. It’s our ‘personal feelings, tastes, or opinions’ or ‘dependent on the mind or on an individual’s perception for its existence.‘ What is slippery is defining a subjective belief as this can vary from person to person. Antonym- objective.

Random is happening or chosen w/o a structured method. Antonym- Structured.

I’m not sure what subjective vs random means. Subjective is seeing things through our personal filter while random is unstructured. If one is going to consider this as a versus thing, even though I’m not sure how this applies to these 2 words, subjective vs structured, objective vs random, & objective vs structured also merit being reviewed.

That ‘no material exists by virtrue of itself, and beyond intelligent perception has no validation at all.’ is similar to the contention that a tree falling in the forest w/ no human around to hear it actually makes no sound. This is fallaciously human-centric because it ignores the animals that hear it as well as that the simple fact that the tree generates sound waves independently of whether anything experiences them. If an electronic recording device was there the sound would be registered w/o the appreciation of it by a living being.

Because we are individuals w/ subjective abilities of independent thought that can be random doesn’t mean that all of our experiences are subjective, therefore, subject to differing from others’ perception of them. The individual is capable of objectivity as well as structured thought.

There is allot of reality that exists beyond our experiencing the NOW. I have every confidence the sun will indeed rise in the east at daybreak & that others will see it too, independent of my experience of seeing it. Later that day it will set in the west no matter how many actually see it set or not. Others can consider the sun rising in the east or setting in the west daily on planet Earth to be subjective, but for me, this is an objective observation & experience. Our feelings about the sun are subjective & thoughts on how we see the sun’s influence on us & various things can be subjective or objective depending on the thought, but the experience of seeing the sun rise in the east & set in the west is objective for most people.

[Gem]

Subjectivity isn’t hard to define. It’s our ‘personal feelings, tastes, or opinions’ or ‘dependent on the mind or on an individual’s perception for its existence.‘ What is slippery is defining a subjective belief as this can vary from person to person. Antonym- objective.

Beliefs are objectified.... I believe in 'something'.

The more you define what subjective is the more it bcomes objective. the yin/yang riddle... up/down, inter defined, two objects. Impossible to take one

Random is happening or chosen w/o a structured method. Antonym- Structured.


I’m not sure what subjective vs random means. Subjective is seeing things through our personal filter while random is unstructured. If one is going to consider this as a versus thing, even though I’m not sure how this applies to these 2 words, subjective vs structured, objective vs random, & objective vs structured also merit being reviewed.

That ‘no material exists by virtrue of itself, and beyond intelligent perception has no validation at all.’ is similar to the contention that a tree falling in the forest w/ no human around to hear it actually makes no sound. This is fallaciously human-centric because it ignores the animals that hear it as well as that the simple fact that the tree generates sound waves independently of whether anything experiences them. If an electronic recording device was there the sound would be registered w/o the appreciation of it by a living being.

The tree in the forest is an associon you made, and a koan isn't literal like that anyway, but all I said was all things are interactive and have no existence otherwize. 'All is an interaction' Richard Feynman

(this ties in with the yin/yang example)

Because we are individuals w/ subjective abilities of independent thought that can be random doesn’t mean that all of our experiences are subjective, therefore, subject to differing from others’ perception of them. The individual is capable of objectivity as well as structured thought.

There is allot of reality that exists beyond our experiencing the NOW. I have every confidence the sun will indeed rise in the east at daybreak & that others will see it too, independent of my experience of seeing it. Later that day it will set in the west no matter how many actually see it set or not. Others can consider the sun rising in the east or setting in the west daily on planet Earth to be subjective, but for me, this is an objective observation & experience. Our feelings about the sun are subjective & thoughts on how we see the sun’s influence on us & various things can be subjective or objective depending on the thought, but the experience of seeing the sun rise in the east & set in the west is objective for most people.

The sun I have experienced and it's rising and setting is validated by my experience alone. If another had told me I may well believe it, but it is only validated through their experience.. The day I was born I had no such validation.

[Gem]

The difference which distinguishes subjective from random... is random pertains to an event. Subjective means it is impossible to ascertain it's quality, property or quantity, thus is uneventful.

Event is something that happens, but there is no happening unless it happens to something. A random event, since it has consequence... can not be random at all.

We do not know the begining of things so the first event (we know) seems random, but we only know it happened because it has effect...

Thus the begining is guessed, it might not exist at all, and if no begining so too no end.

However the begining can exist alone, without an end. (Which confounds the yin/yang riddle)

I ponder now... for primal cause is a random event only if there is no end. If there were an end we'd work backwards and solve the equasion, however it's impossible to find the last event because it did not happen to anything, and as such is not an event at all.