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slave of Allaah
12-11-2011, 01:06 PM
Salam,

I began to believe that the anti-christ is the Samiri who misleaded the children of Israel when Moses left them and went to the meeting with God to take the Torah.


What do you think?

seahorse
12-11-2011, 01:27 PM
I watched a BBC documentary once that stated it was actually the emperor Nero, the numeric values of his name if added produce 666. The book of apocalypse was in fact a coded message from a Christian (not the Apostle John) in exile to his fellow Christians written in such a way the romans wouldn't be able to understand. The beast with the seven heads represents the seven deadly sins and the 10 horns not following the 10 commandments. Now this is what was presented in that film, i'm sure there's another side of the coin...

Mathew James
12-11-2011, 01:55 PM
The false prophets for the Anti-Crist are known by their mark. They are marked by the lies that come out of their mouths. They are the false teachers that mislead many people. The first and the second parts are cut off and the third part lives. The two thirds cut off are portrayed by the number six hundred and sixty six. They are the first two thirds that get cut off. That is who the six hundred and sixty six are marking. What they do with their mark, is they buy and sell in this world. They buy into false gospels and sell them to others. Woe unto them that buy into lies and teach the lies to others. The believers purchase wisely and spend even thriftier.



mj

norseman
12-11-2011, 02:28 PM
So are you saying that the false christs are bankers and people who deal in finance. In that case, I would agree with you :smile:

slave of Allaah
12-11-2011, 04:54 PM
I watched a BBC documentary once that stated it was actually the emperor Nero, the numeric values of his name if added produce 666. The book of apocalypse was in fact a coded message from a Christian (not the Apostle John) in exile to his fellow Christians written in such a way the romans wouldn't be able to understand. The beast with the seven heads represents the seven deadly sins and the 10 horns not following the 10 commandments. Now this is what was presented in that film, i'm sure there's another side of the coin...
Thank you seahourse..
I have just read about such person whom I didn't know before this post of yours.

If what I read was true, then this person is dead now, yes?


The false prophets for the Anti-Crist are known by their mark. They are marked by the lies that come out of their mouths. They are the false teachers that mislead many people. The first and the second parts are cut off and the third part lives. The two thirds cut off are portrayed by the number six hundred and sixty six. They are the first two thirds that get cut off. That is who the six hundred and sixty six are marking. What they do with their mark, is they buy and sell in this world. They buy into false gospels and sell them to others. Woe unto them that buy into lies and teach the lies to others. The believers purchase wisely and spend even thriftier.



mj
Hi Mathew,

I hope you will explain to me the relation between two thirds cut off & 666 because I didn't understand it yet.

Mathew James
12-11-2011, 05:16 PM
So are you saying that the false christs are bankers and people who deal in finance...

There are three parts to any dragon, the head, body and tail. The head is the poilticians, the body is the money holders, and the tail is the war machine.


mj

norseman
12-11-2011, 05:18 PM
A fair analogy !

Mathew James
12-11-2011, 05:19 PM
I hope you will explain to me the relation between two thirds cut off & 666 because I didn't understand it yet.


666 is 66.6% as a percentage of the complete. Two thirds of 100% is 66.6%


mj

slave of Allaah
13-11-2011, 07:32 AM
Thanks for the clarification Mathew.


Reasons for why I believe the anti-christ is the Samiri are:

1. The Quran is supposed to mention all what muslims need to know of major things at least as a heading that the prophet details later on in Hadith.

Such dangerous man is not mentioned directly by his common name/label "Al-maseah Al-Dajjal = The flase/liar maseah", eventhough, prophet Mohammad, peace be upon him, said that "there is no prophet but he warned his people from the liar/false maseah".

But the characteristic of the anti-christ is stongly apparent in the Samiri mentioned in the Quran.


2. All jews accept that the maseah will bring them glory when they follow him, but they fought against Jesus amazingly!

Why did they fight against Jesus when they were/are waiting for the maseah to come?

Is that not a sign that there were already followers for anti christ who knew that Jesus is a danger on them who will collapse all their evil plots, and so they decided to kill him?


....

psychoslice
13-11-2011, 08:14 AM
The anti-Christ to me is anyone who cannot see the inner Christ within themselves.

Mathew James
13-11-2011, 02:29 PM
...Such dangerous man is not mentioned directly by his common name/label "Al-maseah Al-Dajjal = The flase/liar maseah", eventhough, prophet Mohammad, peace be upon him, said that "there is no prophet but he warned his people from the liar/false maseah".

But the characteristic of the anti-christ is stongly apparent in the Samiri mentioned in the Quran.

....

Thank you for your translations in your posts, my only language is english and your translations are very helpful to me.

The Samiri leads the Israelites away by making them worship a calf. They follow the lies of the Samiri and turn from God. The Jews made a calf their god becuase the Samiri "suggested" it. That was Satan wispering in their heads what to do. The Anti-Christ/Satan has the ability to "suggest" a thought into a persons mind. That is how the lies of the Liar survives. The Anti-Crist has been around a long time and has perfected all of its techniques in many ways. The lies about Jesus are often put into people's heads by the Anti-Christ. Many devout Christians will tell you that they heard a voice once in their head telling them that Jesus died for them. imo, the Anti-Christ has wisperred many things into many powerful and inventive people in the world. Many of the worst and/or great ideas in the world imo, have been Satan wispering into peoples head.

There is alot of information about the Anti-Christ in the Bible and it does explain it very well. But the Bible is corrupt and it needs to be checked agaist the Qur'an for correction. The Qur'an can guide a person through the Bible so that more truth can be found out about the Anti-Christ. The Book of Enoch also explains many things about the Anti-Christ/Satan, the fallen angels and the evil spirits. There were appointed Watchers over humanity and some of them bonded and repelled. The angel that lead the repellion is Satan.

mj

Time
13-11-2011, 03:08 PM
Salam,

I began to believe that the anti-christ is the Samiri who misleaded the children of Israel when Moses left them and went to the meeting with God to take the Torah.


What do you think?

Accoording to the bible, moses mosst trusted friend is the person who mislead the isrealites. His name escapes me ATM. He and his sons were also made high priests int he name of god... So if he was the antichrist, god made the ant christ a priest in its own name LOL

Not to mention, the word "christ" wasnt used until the NT....

slave of Allaah
13-11-2011, 06:34 PM
Accoording to the bible, moses mosst trusted friend is the person who mislead the isrealites. His name escapes me ATM. He and his sons were also made high priests int he name of god... So if he was the antichrist, god made the ant christ a priest in its own name LOL

Not to mention, the word "christ" wasnt used until the NT....
We are created to reflect some of God's Qualities in ourselves.

We are given the freedom to enjoy His Light and be grateful to Him, or to enjoy His Light and oppose Him.

So, eventhough I don't believe the bible except as Mathew said, I am inclined to believe that the anti-christ should be first a very good believer like Satan, otherwise he would not have such great power.

slave of Allaah
14-11-2011, 07:55 AM
Thank you for your translations in your posts, my only language is english and your translations are very helpful to me.
I had some problems in understanding other religions/scientific articles because of the terminologies that I am not familiar with, and so came the idea of translation in my posts to eleminate my problems from others.

Maseah is derived from the verb masah(a) = wipe, anoint, scan, survey, etc.

The Samiri leads the Israelites away by making them worship a calf. They follow the lies of the Samiri and turn from God. The Jews made a calf their god becuase the Samiri "suggested" it. That was Satan wispering in their heads what to do.
Indeed. Samiri found it a chance to be a leader by offering the children of Israel a religion according to their wish so that he would appear as a more open/kind/liberal leader than Moses who is fundamental following only the rules of God, not people's wishes.

.... We brought the Children of Israel across the sea, and they came unto a people who were given up to idols which they had. They said: O Moses! Make for us a god even as they have gods. He said: Lo! ye are a folk who know not. (138) Lo! as for these, their way will be destroyed and all that they are doing is in vain. (139) He said: Shall I seek for you a god other than Allah when He hath favoured you above the worlds? (140) [Quran:Ch.7]

So, when Moses left them more than what he promised them (30 days), it was time for the Samiri to cause the change/revolution against Haroon the brother of Moses and his khaleefah = leader after him.



There is alot of information about the Anti-Christ in the Bible and it does explain it very well. But the Bible is corrupt and it needs to be checked agaist the Qur'an for correction. The Qur'an can guide a person through the Bible so that more truth can be found out about the Anti-Christ. The Book of Enoch also explains many things about the Anti-Christ/Satan, the fallen angels and the evil spirits. There were appointed Watchers over humanity and some of them bonded and repelled. The angel that lead the repellion is Satan.

mj
I agree with you in that, but I don't think Satan was an angel.

Satan was one of the jinns (created from fire), but God raised him up with the angels (created from light) and treated him as one of them as an honor for him since he was a good believer not like his people! /jinns who were wicked and wrong doers.

After being enlightened with Power and Majesty, he wanted God to be according to his wish.

And (remember) when We said to the angels;"Prostrate yourselves unto Adam." So they prostrated themselves except Iblîs (Satan). He was one of the jinn; he disobeyed the Command of his Lord. Will you then take him (Iblîs) and his offspring as protectors and helpers rather than Me while they are enemies to you? What an evil is the exchange for the wrong-doers. (50) [Quran:Ch18]

This is why I have a problem with the bible sometimes. The story is the same, but one or two peieces of the details might be man made.

Sometimes I have the same problem with some Hadithes.

Though, I am interesting to know about the anti-christ in the bible to compare it with the Hadithes that talk about him.

Peace.

Mathew James
14-11-2011, 02:39 PM
...Samiri found it a chance to be a leader...

...but I don't think Satan was an angel.

Satan was one of the jinns (created from fire), ...

...And (remember) when We said to the angels;"Prostrate yourselves unto Adam." So they prostrated themselves except Iblîs (Satan). He was one of the jinn; he disobeyed the Command of his Lord. Will you then take him (Iblîs) and his offspring as protectors and helpers rather than Me while they are enemies to you? What an evil is the exchange for the wrong-doers. (50) [Quran:Ch18]


The Samiri appears as a man and a leader, but is he a man? or an evil spirit? or somthing else? imo, the Samiri is an evil spirit that has the ability to enter into a man. A man that is not protected by God and the good angels. An unprotected person can be seduced by Satan so they do what ever Satan wants then to do.

Let me know if this makes any sense. Iblis is Satan and he is one of the jinn. Angels are created by fire and man is created from dust. The jinn are created by fire as are the angels. imo, the jinn are angels that have fallen. There are good angels and fallen angels, the fallen angels are the jinn and their offspring are the evil spirits. Iblis is the leader of the jinn. The jinn/fallen angels can enter into the human mind and suggest things into the mind of an unprotected person. Who the jinn's offspring/evil spirits are, is explained in the Book of Enoch.

The Qur'an as always, praise be to Allah, has all the information that a person needs to know to serve Allah. However, the Book of Enoch has some good info. How do you feel about Enoch? imo, he is held in a high place by Allah and the Book of Enoch is not as corrupt as the Bible.

mj

norseman
14-11-2011, 02:59 PM
Here is something on Good and Evil you might like to consider. Taken from "The Prophet", Kahlil Gibran [An Ascended Man !]

And one of the elders of the city said, "Speak to us of Good and Evil."
And he answered:
Of the good in you I can speak, but not of the evil.
For what is evil but good tortured by its own hunger and thirst?
Verily when good is hungry it seeks food even in dark caves, and when it thirsts, it drinks even of dead waters.
You are good when you are one with yourself.
Yet when you are not one with yourself you are not evil.
For a divided house is not a den of thieves; it is only a divided house.
And a ship without rudder may wander aimlessly among perilous isles yet sink not to the bottom.
You are good when you strive to give of yourself.
Yet you are not evil when you seek gain for yourself.
For when you strive for gain you are but a root that clings to the earth and sucks at her breast.
Surely the fruit cannot say to the root, "Be like me, ripe and full and ever giving of your abundance."
For to the fruit giving is a need, as receiving is a need to the root.
You are good when you are fully awake in your speech,
Yet you are not evil when you sleep while your tongue staggers without purpose.
And even stumbling speech may strengthen a weak tongue.
You are good when you walk to your goal firmly and with bold steps.
Yet you are not evil when you go thither limping.
Even those who limp go not backward.
But you who are strong and swift, see that you do not limp before the lame, deeming it kindness.
You are good in countless ways, and you are not evil when you are not good,
You are only loitering and sluggard.
Pity that the stags cannot teach swiftness to the turtles.
In your longing for your giant self lies your goodness: and that longing is in all of you.
But in some of you that longing is a torrent rushing with might to the sea, carrying the secrets of the hillsides and the songs of the forest.
And in others it is a flat stream that loses itself in angles and bends and lingers before it reaches the shore.
But let not him who longs much say to him who longs little, "Wherefore are you slow and halting?"
For the truly good ask not the naked, "Where is your garment?" nor the houseless, "What has befallen your house?"

Gracey
14-11-2011, 07:39 PM
Salam,

I began to believe that the anti-christ is the Samiri who misleaded the children of Israel when Moses left them and went to the meeting with God to take the Torah.


What do you think?

Dajjal the false messiah by imam katheer

the signs before the day of judgement by ibn kathir

these two books were given to me by a friend who is muslim. you might like them. they teach the muslim outlook on the antichrist.

Mathew James
15-11-2011, 01:09 AM
...For when you strive for gain you are but a root that clings to the earth and sucks at her breast.
Surely the fruit cannot say to the root, "Be like me, ripe and full and ever giving of your abundance."
For to the fruit giving is a need, as receiving is a need to the root...


my favorite part was the above verse. There have been many prophets sent to many nations in many times.


mj

slave of Allaah
15-11-2011, 03:21 AM
my favorite part was the above verse. There have been many prophets sent to many nations in many times.


mj
You are right Mathew, but that person is not a prophet.

He is a poet that wrote a book called "the prophet".

slave of Allaah
15-11-2011, 07:25 AM
The Samiri appears as a man and a leader, but is he a man? or an evil spirit? or somthing else? imo, the Samiri is an evil spirit that has the ability to enter into a man. A man that is not protected by God and the good angels. An unprotected person can be seduced by Satan so they do what ever Satan wants them to do.
Maybe.


Let me know if this makes any sense. Iblis is Satan and he is one of the jinn. Angels are created by fire and man is created from dust. The jinn are created by fire as are the angels. imo, the jinn are angels that have fallen. There are good angels and fallen angels, the fallen angels are the jinn and their offspring are the evil spirits. Iblis is the leader of the jinn. The jinn/fallen angels can enter into the human mind and suggest things into the mind of an unprotected person. Who the jinn's offspring/evil spirits are, is explained in the Book of Enoch.

The Qur'an as always, praise be to Allah, has all the information that a person needs to know to serve Allah. However, the Book of Enoch has some good info. How do you feel about Enoch? imo, he is held in a high place by Allah and the Book of Enoch is not as corrupt as the Bible.

mj
The angels are created from light according to the hadith mentioned in Sahih Muslim, not from fire.

The Quran says that the angels don't disobey God, and they don't eat nor drink even when they are in the form of human.

Jinns eat, drink, and die naturally as human, and can be killed when they are in the form of animals as the prophet said.

The Quran says that there are some jinns who are believers, yet they are not called angels.

This is why I chose the belief of those who think Satan was not an angel.

norseman
15-11-2011, 07:30 AM
You are right Mathew, but that person is not a prophet.

He is a poet that wrote a book called "the prophet".

This is true but in all honesty, there is more spirituality in that slim volume than in the bible and Quran put together. I read from it daily and have done for decades, and I find some new messages every day.

Link http://leb.net/~mira/

psychoslice
15-11-2011, 07:47 AM
Yes I agree also norseman, too many are blinded by the idol worship of their so called scriptures, they miss the beauty, that is found outside their idol.

slave of Allaah
15-11-2011, 07:48 AM
Dajjal the false messiah by imam katheer

the signs before the day of judgement by ibn kathir

these two books were given to me by a friend who is muslim. you might like them. they teach the muslim outlook on the antichrist.
Thank you Gracey,

Almost all schoolers talked about Dajjal. They all depends on the hadithes (speaches) of prophet Mohammad, peace be upon him.

The most trustee source for hadith is Sahih Bukhari, then Sahih Muslim.

I have heared so many schoolers talking about Dajjal, but no one of them used a verse from the Quran except 2 people.

When I listened to one of them, I found what he say is logical, and so I adopted his claim.

mattie
15-11-2011, 07:54 AM
The antichrist stuff is the old polarity thinking of the Piscean era. A construct of organized religion to scare us.

seahorse
15-11-2011, 09:25 AM
The antichrist stuff is the old polarity thinking of the Piscean era. A construct of organized religion to scare us.
There must be a wolf for the sheep to tolerate the watchdog...:wink:

slave of Allaah
15-11-2011, 09:55 AM
Yes I agree also norseman, too many are blinded by the idol worship of their so called scriptures, they miss the beauty, that is found outside their idol.
That is true.

Idol worshippers are going away and away from beauty each time till they miss it forever.

Mathew James
15-11-2011, 12:08 PM
You are right Mathew, but that person is not a prophet.

He is a poet that wrote a book called "the prophet".

That is true, he actually started out as a catholic. So much of his fundamental basis for knowing God is somewhat off. imo, while he is not a Propehet for the Word of God, he is a prophet that sends a message of peace and a message to do good to others.


mj

Mathew James
15-11-2011, 12:13 PM
The angels are created from light according to the hadith mentioned in Sahih Muslim, not from fire.

The Quran says that the angels don't disobey God, and they don't eat nor drink even when they are in the form of human.

Jinns eat, drink, and die naturally as human, and can be killed when they are in the form of animals as the prophet said.

The Quran says that there are some jinns who are believers, yet they are not called angels.

This is why I chose the belief of those who think Satan was not an angel.


Thank you for your insight, let me look into this.



mj

norseman
15-11-2011, 12:33 PM
........... he is a prophet that sends a message of peace and a message to do good to others............ mj

Gibran transcends religions and speaks to the spirit of Mankind.

slave of Allaah
15-11-2011, 02:42 PM
The antichrist stuff is the old polarity thinking of the Piscean era. A construct of organized religion to scare us.
All trusted Hadith says that Madinah (the city of prophet Mohammad PBUH) would have 7 opened ways into it at the time of the antichrist.

Now Madinah is exactly as the prophet said 1400 years ago!


Al-Hythami narrated that hadith as well with extra information where the prophet said that Dajjal would go up the mountain of Uhud and say to his friends: "Do you see that white Palace? that is the mosque of Ahmad".

Now let us see how the prophet's Masjid appear:

http://www7.0zz0.com/2011/11/15/15/643228608.jpg (http://www.0zz0.com)

Since Al-Hythami is not as trusted as Bukhary and Muslim, I think the mountain is not Uhud, but other mountain near to Sabkha of Al-Jurf because the prophet said in the trusted Hadithes that Dajjal will be near that area as he cannot enter the sacred area of Madinah because there are angels who guard it against him.

7luminaries
17-11-2011, 06:38 PM
Gibran transcends religions and speaks to the spirit of Mankind.

...and he spoke deeply of truth and of wisdom :smile:

MMM
19-11-2011, 10:27 AM
i'm of the opinion that the 'anti-christ' mentioned in the bible and by ruth montomery and nosterdomus is a man alive today - a politician and world leader whose name is easily recognizable
ruth montomery pinpoints one characteristic of this person that is highly specific
imho

slave of Allaah
19-11-2011, 01:22 PM
i'm of the opinion that the 'anti-christ' mentioned in the bible and by ruth montomery and nosterdomus is a man alive today - a politician and world leader whose name is easily recognizable
ruth montomery pinpoints one characteristic of this person that is highly specific
imho
He is indeed a person like christ was a person.

I would like to know what the bible say about the anti-christ though.

Thank you.

Time
19-11-2011, 01:50 PM
Th eanti christ is mentioned in Revalations, which speaks of ROME, not todays world. i wouldnt be suprised if the anti christ was based on calligula or nero

Mathew James
19-11-2011, 02:10 PM
He is indeed a person like christ was a person.



The Bible says Satan is an angel of light. Satan is an angel in the Bible that disobeyed God and was cast out of heaven and down to the earth. Satan is the False Prophet, the Lier, the Anti-Christ. Satan comes with a lie that is similar to the message of the Christ. There is no Anti-Muham--d, can not even say it. The Anti-Christ mislead the Jews and the Christians. There are large periods of time that the Anti-Christ works over, how can one person do that?

Slave of Allaah, can you give the Qur'an verses that says the Anti-Christ is a person.


mj

Mathew James
19-11-2011, 02:42 PM
...I would like to know what the bible say about the anti-christ though.



1 John 2:18
“Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.”

There are many antichrists. It is not just one man.


1 John 2:22
“Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.”

The Christ is the Messiah that was sent by God. The Father is God and the Son is the Messiah.


1 John 4:3
“And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.”

The antichrist was around when the Gospel was written and is in the world today.


2 John 1:7
“For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.”

The antichrist deceives people by not believing in the Messiah, Jesus the Anointed One.


mj

slave of Allaah
19-11-2011, 05:38 PM
The Bible says Satan is an angel of light. Satan is an angel in the Bible that disobeyed God and was cast out of heaven and down to the earth. Satan is the False Prophet, the Lier, the Anti-Christ. Satan comes with a lie that is similar to the message of the Christ. There is no Anti-Muham--d, can not even say it. The Anti-Christ mislead the Jews and the Christians. There are large periods of time that the Anti-Christ works over, how can one person do that?

Slave of Allaah, can you give the Qur'an verses that says the Anti-Christ is a person.


mj
The bible for me is like the Hadith, I accept it if it goes with the Quran, but I reject it when it goes against It.

The Hadith actually is even more trusted than the bible as we know its narrators and the level of their honesty and the strength of their memory and some other details (Hence the classification of Hadith as trustee, fair, weak, fabricated, etc), but the bible is written by unknown people! and it was altered so many times by men, so it is not to be taken seriously.

The Quran doesn't mention the creation of the angels, but It mention the creation of the jinns. And It says that Iblees was one of the jinns and they were created from fire.

The trusted Hadith (Sahih Muslim) says that the angels were created from light.

The anti-christ is not mentioned in the Quran, but I am trying to analyze the saying of those who said that he is the Samiri.


Peace.

slave of Allaah
20-11-2011, 05:33 AM
1 John 2:18
“Little children, it is the last time: and as ye have heard that antichrist shall come, even now are there many antichrists; whereby we know that it is the last time.”

There are many antichrists. It is not just one man.

This is fine and can be linked with the hadith.

Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, said: "After me, There will be about 30 liars each of them claim himself to be a prophet while I am the last of the prophets. No prophet is after me".

Some schoolers says that Dajjal will be the last one of them, then he will claim himself to be God.


1 John 2:22
“Who is a liar but he that denieth that Jesus is the Christ? He is antichrist, that denieth the Father and the Son.”

The Christ is the Messiah that was sent by God. The Father is God and the Son is the Messiah.
I agree with the bold line.

But I deny the christian manipulation of words.

God told us that He did not take any son for Himself. All are His creatures. We believe God not the christians.


1 John 4:3
“And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.”

The antichrist was around when the Gospel was written and is in the world today.

2 John 1:7
“For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist.”

The antichrist deceives people by not believing in the Messiah, Jesus the Anointed One.


mj
Agreed.

Thank you for this Mathew.

I thought the bible would say what the anti christ would do, not just giving general statements like the above ones.

slave of Allaah
20-11-2011, 05:49 AM
Slave of Allaah, can you give the Qur'an verses that says the Anti-Christ is a person.


mj
The following Hadith is from (Sahih Al-Bukary) the most trusted source of Hadith:

1668 Abu Sa'id Al-Khudri reported: Allah's Messenger, peace be upon him, one day gave us a detailed account of Al-Dajjal and in that it was also included:

He would come but would not be allowed to enter the road leading to Medina. So he will alight at some of the barren tracts near Medina, and a person who will be the best of men or one from among the best of men will say to him: I bear testimony to the fact that you are Al-Dajjal about whom Allah's Messenger, peace be upon him, had informed us.

Al-Dajjal will say: What is your opinion if I kill this (person), then I bring him back to life; even then will you harbor doubt in this matter? They will say: No. He will then kill (the man) and then bring him back to life. When he brings that person to life, he (that person) will say: By Allah, I had no better proof of the fact (that you are Al-Dajjal) than at the present time (that you are actually so). Al-Dajjal will then make an attempt to kill him (again) but he will not be able to do that.
....

Scibat
20-11-2011, 08:14 AM
Salam,

I began to believe that the anti-christ is the Samiri who misleaded the children of Israel when Moses left them and went to the meeting with God to take the Torah.


What do you think?

I don't believe in the concept of the anti-Christ and if s/he did ever come into existence likely none of us would know who s/he was until they already had their talons into the world too deeply to stop. That is kind of one of the salient factors about the anti-Christ myth, s/he is supposed to be a charismatic world leader that has the power to bring about Armageddon, and I don't see anyone fitting the bill on the horizon.

Mathew James
20-11-2011, 11:38 AM
But I deny the christian manipulation of words.

God told us that He did not take any son for Himself. All are His creatures. We believe God not the christians.



yes, the Christians manipulated the word "son" and many other words in the Bible. The word "son" in the Bible for me means "servant" or "slave". Jesus the son of Mary is a servant of God.


mj

Mathew James
20-11-2011, 01:04 PM
The following Hadith is from (Sahih Al-Bukary) the most trusted source of Hadith:

1668 Abu Sa'id Al-Khudri reported: Allah's Messenger, peace be upon him, one day gave us a detailed account of Al-Dajjal and in that it was also included:

He would come but would not be allowed to enter the road leading to Medina. So he will alight at some of the barren tracts near Medina, and a person who will be the best of men or one from among the best of men will say to him: I bear testimony to the fact that you are Al-Dajjal about whom Allah's Messenger, peace be upon him, had informed us.

Al-Dajjal will say: What is your opinion if I kill this (person), then I bring him back to life; even then will you harbor doubt in this matter? They will say: No. He will then kill (the man) and then bring him back to life. When he brings that person to life, he (that person) will say: By Allah, I had no better proof of the fact (that you are Al-Dajjal) than at the present time (that you are actually so). Al-Dajjal will then make an attempt to kill him (again) but he will not be able to do that.
....


Thank you, this makes sense to me. It could be that the human forms of the antichrist are people that are 100% controlled by Satan. The beast in Revelation chap. 13, describes who might be the antichrist. It has seven heads and ten horns and rises out of the sea and it receives instruction from the dragon. The horns and heads portray the antichrist being seven world leaders with ten nations over history. The dragon that the beast listens to is Satan. Then towards the latter end of time another beast with two horns rises. This beast looks like a lamb but does what the dragon wants it to do. There are several beasts over time (the antichrists) that obey one dragon (Satan).


The main purpose of the antichrist(s) are to deceive people so that they buy into the lies of the world and not the truth. The second beast (in Revelation 13:12-17) does great wonders and makes the people of the world worship the first beast that was killed. The second beast that looks like a lamb, brings the first beast back to life in front of many people, so that it speaks and then it makes the people who worship him be marked with the mark of the beast. This sounds similar to the Al-Dajjal.


mj

norseman
20-11-2011, 01:47 PM
A different take on Satan by Kahlil Gibran from his writings.


The people looked upon Father Samaan as their guide in the field of spiritual and theological matters, for he was an authority and a source of deep information on venial and mortal sins, well versed in the secrets of paradise, hell, and purgatory.
Father Samaan's mission in North Lebanon was to travel from one village to another, preaching and curing the people from the spiritual disease of sin, and saving them from the horrible trap of Satan. The Reverend Father waged constant war with Satan. The fellahin honoured and respected this clergyman, and were always anxious to buy his advice or prayers with pieces of gold and silver; and at every harvest they would present him with the finest fruits of their fields.
One evening in autumn, as Father Samaan walked his way towards a solitary village, crossing those valleys and hills, he heard a painful cry emerging from a ditch at the side of the road. He stopped and looked in the direction of the voice, and saw an unclothed man lying on the ground. Streams of blood oozed from deep wounds in his head and chest. He was moaning painfully for aid, saying, "Save me, help me. Have mercy on me, I am dying." Father Samaan looked with perplexity at the sufferer, and said within himself, "This man must be a thief. He probably tried to rob the wayfarers and failed. Someone has wounded him, and I fear that should he die I may be accused of having taken his life."
Having thus pondered the situation, he resumed his journey, whereupon the dying man stopped him, calling out, "Do not leave me! I am dying!" Then the Father meditated again, and his face became pale as he realized he was refusing to help. His lips quivered, but he spoke to himself, saying, "He must surely be one of the madmen wandering in the wilderness. The sight of his wounds brings fear into my heart; what shall I do? Surely a spiritual doctor is not capable of treating flesh-wounded bodies." Father Samaan walked ahead a few paces when the near-corpse uttered a painful plaint that melted the heart of the rock and he gasped, "Come close to me! Come, for we have been friends a long time. You are Father Samaan, the good shepherd, and I am not a thief nor a madman. Come close, and do not let me die in this deserted place. Come, and I will tell you who I am."
Father Samaan came close to the man, knelt, and stared at him; but he saw a strange face with contrasting features; he saw intelligence with slyness, ugliness with beauty, and wickedness with softness. He withdrew to his feet sharply, and exclaimed, "Who are you?"
With a fainting voice, the dying man said, "Fear me not, Father, for we have been strong friends for long. Help me to stand, and take me to the nearby streamlet and cleanse my wounds with your linens." And the Father inquired, "Tell me who you are, for I do not know you, nor even remember having seen you."
And the man replied with an agonizing voice, "You know my identity! You have seen me one thousand times and you speak of me each day. I am dearer to you than your own life." And the Father reprimanded, "You are a lying imposter! A dying man should tell the truth. I have never seen your evil face in my entire life. Tell me who you are, or I will suffer you to die, soaked in your escaping life." And the wounded man moved slowly and looked into the clergyman's eyes, and upon his lips appeared a mystic smile; and in a quiet, deep and smooth voice he said, "I am Satan."
Upon hearing the fearful word, Father Samaan uttered a terrible cry that shook the far corners of the valley; then he stared, and realized that the dying man's body, with its grotesque distortions, coincided with the likeness of Satan in a religious picture hanging on the wall of the village church. He trembled and cried out, saying, "God has shown me your hellish image and justly caused me to hate you; cursed be you for evermore! The mangled lamb must be destroyed by the shepherd lest he will infect the other lambs!"
Satan answered, "Be not in haste, Father, and lose not this fleeting time in empty talk. Come and close my wounds quickly, before life departs from my body." And the clergyman retorted, "The hands which offer a daily sacrifice to God shall not touch a body made of the secretion of hell. You must die accursed by the tongues of the ages, and the lips of humanity, for you are the enemy of humanity, and it is your avowed purpose to destroy all virtue."
Satan moved in anguish, raising himself upon one elbow, and responded, "You know not what you are saying, nor understand the crime you are committing upon yourself. Give heed, for I will relate my story. Today I walked alone in this solitary valley. When I reached this place, a group of angels descended to attack, and struck me severely; had it not been for one of them, who carried a blazing sword with two sharp edges, I would have driven them off, but I had no power against the brilliant sword." And Satan ceased talking for a moment, as he pressed a shaking hand upon a deep wound in his side. Then he continued, "The armed angel -- I believe he was Michael -- was an expert gladiator. Had I not thrown myself to the friendly ground and feigned to have been slain, he would have torn me into brutal death."
With voice of triumph, and casting his eyes heavenwards, the Father offered, "Blessed be Michael's name, who has saved humanity from this vicious enemy."
And Satan protested, "My disdain for humanity is not greater than your hatred for yourself. You are blessing Michael, who never has come to your rescue. You are cursing me in the hour of my defeat, even though I was, and still am, the source of your tranquility and happiness. You deny me your blessing, and extend not your kindness, but you live and prosper in the shadow of my being. You have adopted my existence as an excuse and weapon for your career, and you employ my name in justification for your deeds. Has not my past caused you to be in need of my present and future? Have you reached your goal in amassing the required wealth? Have you found it impossible to extract more gold and silver from your followers, using my kingdom as a threat?
"Do you not realize that you will starve to death if I were to die? What would you do tomorrow if you allowed me to die today? What vocation would you pursue if my name disappeared? For decades you have been roaming these villages and warning the people against falling into my hands. They have bought your advice with their poor dinars and with the products of their land. What would they buy from you tomorrow, if they discovered that their wicked enemy no longer existed? Your occupation would die with me, for the people would be safe from sin. As a clergyman, do you not realize that Satan's existence alone has created his enemy, the Church? That ancient conflict is the secret hand which removes the gold and silver from the faithful's pocket and deposits it forever into the pouch of the preacher and the missionary. How can you permit me to die here, when you know it will surely cause you to lose your prestige, your church, your home, and your livelihood?"

Satan became silent for a moment and his humility was now converted into a confident independence, and he continued, "Father, you are proud, but ignorant. I will disclose to you the history of belief, and in it you will find he truth which joins both of our beings, and ties my existence with your very conscience.
"In the first hour of the beginning of time, man stood before the face of the sun and stretched forth his arms and cried for the first time, saying, 'Behind the sky there is a great and loving and benevolent God.' The man turned his back to the great circle of light and saw his shadow upon the earth, and he hailed, 'In the depths of the earth there is a dark evil who loves wickedness.'
"And the man walked towards his cave, whispering to himself, "I am between two compelling forces, one in whom I must take refuge, and the other against whom I must struggle.' And the ages marched in procession while man existed between two powers, one that he blessed because it exalted him, and one that he cursed because it frightened him. But he never perceived the meaning of a blessing or of a curse; he was between the two, like a tree between summer, when it blooms, and winter, when it shivers.
"When a man saw the dawn of civilization, which is human understanding, the family as a unit came into being. Then came the tribes, whereupon labour was divided according to ability and inclination; one clan cultivated the land, another built shelters, others wove raiment or hunted food. Subsequently divination made its appearance upon the earth, and this was the first career adopted by man which possessed no essential urge or necessity."
Satan ceased talking for a moment. Then he laughed and his mirth shook the empty valley, but his laughter reminded him of his wounds, and he placed his hand on his side, suffering with pain. He steadied himself and continued, "Divination appeared and grew on earth in strange fashion.
"There was a man in the first tribe called La Wiss. I know not the origin of his name. He was an intelligent creature, but extremely indolent and he detested work in the cultivation of land, construction of shelters, grazing of cattle, or any pursuit requiring bodily movement or exertion. And since food, during that era, could not be obtained except by arduous toil, La Wiss slept many nights with an empty stomach.
"One summer night, as the members of that clan were gathered round the hut of their chief, talking of the outcome of their day and waiting for their slumber time, a man suddenly leaped to his feet, pointed towards the moon, and cried out, saying, 'Look at the night god! His face is dark, and his beauty has vanished, and he has turned into a black stone hanging in the dome of the sky!' The multitude gazed at the moon, shouted in awe, and shook with fear, as if the hands of darkness had clutched their hearts, for they saw the night god slowly turning into a dark ball which changed the bright countenance of the earth and caused the hills and valleys before their eyes to disappear behind a black veil.
"At that moment, La Wiss, who had seen an eclipse before, and understood its simple cause, stepped forward to make much of this opportunity. He stood in the midst of the throng, lifted his hands to the sky, and in a strong voice he addressed them, saying, 'Kneel and pray, for the evil god of obscurity is locked in struggle with the illuminating night god; if the evil god conquers him, we will all perish, but if the night god triumphs over him, we will remain alive. Pray now and worship. Cover your faces with earth. Close your eyes, and lift not your heads towards the sky, for he who witnesses the two gods wrestling will lose his sight and mind, and will remain blind and insane all his life! Bend your heads low, and with all your hearts urge the night god against his enemy, who is our mortal enemy!'
"Thus did La Wiss continue talking, using many cryptic words of his own fabrication which they had never heard. After this crafty deception, as the moon returned to its previous glory, La Wiss raised his voice louder than before and said impressively, 'Rise now, and look at the night god who has triumphed over his evil enemy. He is resuming his journey among the stars. Let it be known that through your prayers you have helped him to overcome the devil of darkness. He is well pleased now, and brighter than ever.'
"The multitude rose and gazed at the moon that was shining in full beam. Their fear became tranquility, and their confusion was now joy. They commenced dancing and singing and striking with their thick sticks upon sheets of iron, filling the valleys with their clamour and shouting.
"That night, the chief of the tribe called La Wiss and spoke to him, saying, 'You have done something that no man has ever done. You have demonstrated knowledge of a hidden secret that no other among us understands. Reflecting the will of my people, you are to be the highest ranking member, after me, in the tribe. I am the strongest man, and you are the wisest and most learned person. You are the medium between our people and the gods, whose desires and deeds you are to interpret, and you will teach us those things necessary to gain their blessings and love.'
"And La Wiss slyly assured, 'Everything the human god reveals to me in my divine dreams will be conveyed to you in awakeness, and you may be confident that I will act directly between you and him.' The chief was assured, and gave La Wiss two horses, seven calves, seventy sheep and seventy lambs; and he spoke to him, saying, 'The men of the tribe shall build for you a strong house, and we will give you at the end of each harvest season a part of the crop of the land so you may live as an honourable and respected master.'
"La Wiss rose and started to leave, but the chief stopped him, saying, 'Who and what is the one whom you call the human god? Who is this daring god who wrestles with the glorious night god? We have never pondered him before.' La Wiss rubbed his forehead and answered him, saying, 'My honourable master, in the olden time, before the creation of man, all the gods were living peacefully together in an upper world behind the vastness of the stars. The god of gods was their father, and knew what they did not know, and did what they were unable to do. He kept for himself the divine secrets that existed beyond the eternal laws. During the seventh epoch of the twelfth age, the spirit of Bahtaar, who hated the great god, revolted and stood before his father, and said, 'Why do you keep for yourself the power of great authority upon all creatures, hiding away from us the secrets and laws of the universe? Are we not your children who believe in you and share with you the great understanding and the perpetual being?'
"The god of gods became enraged and said, 'I shall preserve for myself the primary power and the great authority and the essential secrets, for I am the beginning and the end.'
"And Bahtaar answered him saying, 'Unless you share with me your might and power, I and my children and my children's children will revolt against you!' At that moment, the god of gods stood upon his throne in the deep heavens, and drew forth a sword, and grasped the sun as a shield; and with a voice that shook all corners of the eternity he shouted out, saying, 'Descend, you evil rebel, to the dismal lower world where darkness and misery exist! There you shall remain in exile, wandering until the sun turns into ashes and the stars into dispersed particles!' In that hour, Bahtaar descended from the upper world into the lower world, where all the evil spirits dwelt. Thereupon, he swore by the secret of life that he would fight his father and brothers by trapping every soul who loved them.'
"As the chief listened, his forehead wrinkled and his face turned pale. He ventured, 'Then the name of the evil god is Bahtaar?' and La Wiss responded, 'His name was Bahtaar when he was in the upper world, but when he entered into the lower world, he adopted successively the names Baalzaboul, Satanail, Balial, Zamiel, Ahriman, Mara, Abdon, Devil, and finally Satan, which is the most famous.'
"The chief repeated the word 'Satan' many times with a quivering voice that sounded like the rustling of the dry branches at the passing of the wind; then he asked, 'Why does Satan hate man as much as he hates the gods?'
"And La Wiss responded quickly, 'He hates man because man is a descendant of Satan's brothers and sisters.' The chief exclaimed, 'Then Satan is the cousin of man!' In a voice mingled with confusion and annoyance, he retorted, 'Yes, master, but he is their great enemy who fills their days with misery and their nights with horrible dreams. He is the power who directs the tempest towards their hovels, and brings famine upon their plantation, and disease upon them and their animals. He is an evil and powerful god; he is wicked, and he rejoices when we are in sorrow, and he mourns when we are joyous. We must, through my konwledge, examine him thoroughly, in order to avoid his evil; we must study his character, so we will not step upon his trap-laden path.'
"The chief leaned his head upon his thick stick and whispered, saying, 'I have learned now the inner secret of that strange power who directs the tempest towards our homes and brings the pestilence upon us and our cattle. The people shall learn all that I have comprehended now, and La Wiss will be blessed, honoured and glorified for revealing to them the mystery of their powerful enemy, and directing them away from the road of evil.'
"And La Wiss left the chief of the tribe and went to his retiring place, happy over his ingenuity, and intoxicated with the wine of his pleasure and fancy. For the first time, the chief and all the tribe, except La Wiss, spent the night slumbering in beds surrounded by horrible ghosts, fearful spectres, and disturbing dreams."

Satan ceased talking for a moment, while Father Samaan stared at him as one bewildered, and upon the Father's lips appeared the sickly laughter of death. Then Satan continued, "Thus divination came to this earth, and thus was my existence the cause for its appearance. La Wiss was the first who adopted my cruelty as a vocation. After the death of La Wiss, this occupation circulated through his children and prospered until it became a perfect and divine profession, pursued by those whose minds are ripe with knowledge, and whose souls are noble, and whose hearts are pure, and whose fancy is vast.
"In Babylon, the people bowed seven times in worshipping before a priest who fought me with his chantings. In Nineveh, they looked upon a man, who claimed to have known my inner secrets, as a golden link between God and man. In Tibet, they called the person who wrestled with me the son of the sun and moon. In Byblus, Ephesus and Antioch, they offered their children's lives in sacrifice to my opponents. In Jerusalem and Rome, they placed their lives in the hands of those who claimed they hated me and fought me with all their might.
"In every city under the sun my name was the axis of the educational circle of religion, arts, and philosophy. Had it not been for me, no temples would have been built, no towers or palaces would have been erected. I am the courage that creates resolution in man. I am the source that provokes originality of thought. I am the hand that moves man's hands. I am Satan everlasting. I am Satan whom people fight in order to keep themselves alive. If they cease struggling against me, slothfulness will deaden their minds and hearts and souls, in accordance with the weird penalties of their tremendous myth.
'I am the enraged and mute tempest who agitates the minds of man and the hearts of women. And in fear of me, they will travel to places of worship to condemn me, or to places of vice to make me happy by surrendering to my will. The monk who prays in the silence of the night to keep me away from his bed is like the prostitute who invites me to her chamber. I am Satan everlasting and eternal.
"I am the builder of convents and monasteries upon the foundation of fear. I build wine shops and wicked houses upon the foundations of lust and self-gratification. If I cease to exist, fear and enjoyment will be abolished from the world, and through their disappearance, desires and hopes will cease to exist in the human heart. Life will become empty and cold, like a harp with broken strings. I am Satan everlasting.
"I am the inspiration of falsehood, slander, treachery, deceit and mockery, and if these elements were to be removed from this world, human society would become like a deserted field in which naught would thrive but thorns of virtue. I am Satan everlasting.
"I am the father and mother of sin, and if sin were to vanish, the fighters of sin would vanish with it, along with their families and structures.
"I am the heart of all evil. Would you wish for human motion to stop through cessation of my heartbeat? Would you accept the result after destroying the cause? I am the cause! Would you allow me to die in this deserted wilderness? Do you desire to sever the bond that exists between you and me? Answer me, clergyman!"
And Satan stretched his arms and bent his head forward and gasped deeply; his face turned to grey and he resembled one of those Egyptian statues laid waste by the ages at the side of the Nile. Then he fixed his glittering eyes upon Father Samaan's face, and said, in a faltering voice, "I am tired and weak. I did wrong by using my waning strength to speak on things you already know. Now you may do as you please. You may carry me to your home and treat my wounds, or leave me in this place to die."
Father Samaan quivered and rubbed his hands nervously, and with apology in his voice he said, "I know now what I had not known an hour ago. Forgive my ignorance. I know that your existence in this world creates temptation, and temptation is a measurement by which God adjudges the value of human souls. It is a scale which Almighty God uses to weigh the spirits. I am certain that if you die, temptation will die, and with its passing, death will destroy the ideal power which elevates and alerts man.
"You must live, for if you die and the people know it, their fear of hell will vanish and they will cease worshipping, for naught would be sin. You must live, for in your life is the salvation of humanity from vice and sin.
"As to myself, I shall sacrifice my hatred for you on the altar of my love for man."
Satan uttered a laugh that rocked the ground, and he said, "What an intelligent person you are, Father! And what wonderful knowledge you possess in theological facts! You have found, through the power of your knowledge, a purpose for my existence which I had never understood, and now we realize our need for each other.
"Come close to me, my brother; darkness is submerging the plains, and half of my blood has escaped upon the sand of this valley, and naught remains of me but the remnants of a broken body which death shall soon buy unless you render aid." Father Samaan rolled the sleeves of his robe and approached, and lifted Satan to his back and walked towards his home.
In the midst of those valleys, engulfed with silence and embellished with the veil of darkness, Father Samaan walked towards the village with his back bent under his heavy burden. His black raiment and long beard were spattered with blood streaming from above him, but he struggled forward, his lips moving in fervent prayer for the life of the dying Satan.

:smile:

Mathew James
04-02-2012, 07:00 PM
slave of Allaah, what you said now makes sense to me. You said...Satan was one of the jinns (created from fire), but God raised him up with the angels (created from light) and treated him as one of them as an honor for him since he was a good believer not like his people! /jinns who were wicked and wrong doers...

imo, the jinn are the watchers in the book of Enoch. My previous understanding was that the watchers were angels, but after reviewing the book of Enoch much closer, the watchers are different then the angels. Satan was one of the watchers/jinn. Not an angel.


mj

Mathew James
04-04-2012, 02:09 PM
The antichrist false prophet is Moses and Muhammad.

Why would the term anti "christ " be used with either Moses or Muhammad??? The term is used directly to the corruption of what the Messiah ("the christ") taught.

mj

Gracey
04-04-2012, 02:38 PM
yes, the Christians manipulated the word "son" and many other words in the Bible. The word "son" in the Bible for me means "servant" or "slave". Jesus the son of Mary is a servant of God.


mj

then what about the virgin birth?

Mathew James
04-04-2012, 04:53 PM
then what about the virgin birth?

imo, the seed that came down from heaven was delivered by an angel.

mj

Gracey
04-04-2012, 06:46 PM
imo, the seed that came down from heaven was delivered by an angel.

mj

hmmm....never thought of it that way.

Mathew James
04-04-2012, 07:10 PM
Hi Gracey, the story is written in the stars. The constellation Virgo is called ‘Bethulah’ in the Hebrew language, ‘Addarah’ in the Arabic language, and ‘Parthenos’ in the Greek language. All three translate Virgo to the same word, which is ‘virgin’. Virgo is holding a corn of wheat in her left hand and an olive branch in her right hand. The star called Spica portrays the corn of wheat being held in the virgin’s left hand. In the Hebrew language this star is called ‘Tsemech’. In the Arabic language the star is called ‘Al Zimach’. Both of these names have the same meaning and that is ‘Branch’.

But there are several words in Hebrew that can be translated into branch. The word Tsemech was also used to portray a Messaih that was prophesied to come. The corn of wheat, Spica. portrays the heavenly seed that will be planted in the earth. It is a heavenly seed that must be planted in the earth in order for God’s plan to unfold. In the Book of John chapter 12, verse 24 it reads; ‘Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit’.

The first Deacon for Virgo is Coma. It is a star picture of a young woman lifting up her new born baby. In the Egyptian Zodiac, Coma is a picture of the child standing on the tail of Leo. The word Coma means ‘the desired’. In the bible there is a prophet named Haggai who speaks about the coming of a Messiah as being the desire of all nations. In chapter 2 verse 7 of the Book of Haggai it states ‘And I will shake all nations, and The Desire of all nations shall come: and I will fill this house with glory.’


mj

Gracey
04-04-2012, 08:31 PM
Hi Gracey, the story is written in the stars. The constellation Virgo is called ‘Bethulah’ in the Hebrew language, ‘Addarah’ in the Arabic language, and ‘Parthenos’ in the Greek language. All three translate Virgo to the same word, which is ‘virgin’. Virgo is holding a corn of wheat in her left hand and an olive branch in her right hand. The star called Spica portrays the corn of wheat being held in the virgin’s left hand. In the Hebrew language this star is called ‘Tsemech’. In the Arabic language the star is called ‘Al Zimach’. Both of these names have the same meaning and that is ‘Branch’.

But there are several words in Hebrew that can be translated into branch. The word Tsemech was also used to portray a Messaih that was prophesied to come. The corn of wheat, Spica. portrays the heavenly seed that will be planted in the earth. It is a heavenly seed that must be planted in the earth in order for God’s plan to unfold. In the Book of John chapter 12, verse 24 it reads; ‘Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit’.

The first Deacon for Virgo is Coma. It is a star picture of a young woman lifting up her new born baby. In the Egyptian Zodiac, Coma is a picture of the child standing on the tail of Leo. The word Coma means ‘the desired’. In the bible there is a prophet named Haggai who speaks about the coming of a Messiah as being the desire of all nations. In chapter 2 verse 7 of the Book of Haggai it states ‘And I will shake all nations, and The Desire of all nations shall come: and I will fill this house with glory.’


mj

hey mj!

that is really cool connections. if you ever want to share more, please do. i am studying the history of language right now and i find it fascinating how the order of things come to pass.

Mathew James
04-04-2012, 08:59 PM
hey mj!

that is really cool connections. if you ever want to share more, please do. i am studying the history of language right now and i find it fascinating how the order of things come to pass.

If you want to check out all the ancient names of the stars and their meanings check out the hub below;

http://mathewjames.hubpages.com/hub/mazzarite

Some background if you are interested, there were Jewish tribes who remained in Babylonia, after the other tribes went back to Jerusalem in the days of Cyrus. The Jewish tribes that remained mixed in with the Arabic tribes known as the Magism (wise men). The Magi originated from the older Sabba or Sabe'e tribes. They are identified with the birth roots of Zoroasterism and with Mani, the founder of Manichaeism. It was the ancient Sabba tribes who understood the meaning of the stars. They were also the first physicians, astrologers, philosophers, and poets of the world. They were the true observer of the stars and the constellations. They passed down the ancient secret knowledge from priest to priest, and that is what is presented in the above hub. fyi, the uncle of the prophet Muhummad was Sabba (Sabian) and Muhummad was taught the Sabian ways in his childhood, but the Sabba divided among themselfs. They divided between believers and non-believers and that is when all of the "white magic" was taken away from them.

mj

Gracey
05-04-2012, 12:30 AM
If you want to check out all the ancient names of the stars and their meanings check out the hub below;

http://mathewjames.hubpages.com/hub/mazzarite (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fmathewjames.hubpages.c om%2Fhub%2Fmazzarite)

Some background if you are interested, there were Jewish tribes who remained in Babylonia, after the other tribes went back to Jerusalem in the days of Cyrus. The Jewish tribes that remained mixed in with the Arabic tribes known as the Magism (wise men). The Magi originated from the older Sabba or Sabe'e tribes. They are identified with the birth roots of Zoroasterism and with Mani, the founder of Manichaeism. It was the ancient Sabba tribes who understood the meaning of the stars. They were also the first physicians, astrologers, philosophers, and poets of the world. They were the true observer of the stars and the constellations. They passed down the ancient secret knowledge from priest to priest, and that is what is presented in the above hub. fyi, the uncle of the prophet Muhummad was Sabba (Sabian) and Muhummad was taught the Sabian ways in his childhood, but the Sabba divided among themselfs. They divided between believers and non-believers and that is when all of the "white magic" was taken away from them.

mj

holy camolie,

what a great source of information you have. i appreciate the research you have done and thank you for sharing it.

Morpheus
05-04-2012, 11:20 PM
2. All jews accept that the maseah will bring them glory when they follow him, but they fought against Jesus amazingly!

Why did they fight against Jesus when they were/are waiting for the maseah to come?


The scriptures clearly express that the common people accepted and believed upon Christ. That, having to do with "Control", the leaders were the ones who fought against Him,and sent Him to the cross.
Which of course God was well aware of ahead of time and planned for, regarding His atonement, and salvation as the,
"Lamb of God Who takes away the sins of the world."

This situation on the part of the leaders of course involves Ego, to be equated with sin, satan, and the serpent.
Involving also the, "Survival Instinct", of the illusory material, and, evolved physical aspect.

Which all are afflicted with, and, because of... God saves.

For, there is no remission of sin, apart from the sacrifice which Christ wrought for humanity, and, the reception thereof of the individual, according to God's good plan..

Mathew James
06-04-2012, 01:22 PM
... Moses's antichrist laws targets anyone who even resembles Christ. Muhammad lies about Jesus not being the son of God...

imo, Mosses and Muhammad did not teach the Gospel and neither of them promoted the teachings of the Gospel. Jesus taught the Gospel and that is what the anitchrist replaces. The antichrist attacks the Gospel by replacing the Gospel truth with lies that are followed by the christian churches. The antichrist's attack on the christian churches has been very successful. And the lie that the antichrist teaches is taught in every christian church. Get out of her while you can!

mj

hasbean
06-04-2012, 02:58 PM
Very interesting!
But I still think the ***** of Babylon is an economic entity, because of the buying and selling nature of the Mark of the beast. However, the big lie I see in the "Christian" church that directly contradicts the Gospel that Jesus taught, is that you can work for money, love money, and use your life to worship money and that's ok. When Jesus clearly says you cannot serve both God and Money. When the Mark of the Beast is introduced, the churches will be the first in line to get it!

Chrysaetos
06-04-2012, 03:31 PM
I watched a BBC documentary once that stated it was actually the emperor Nero, the numeric values of his name if added produce 666. The book of apocalypse was in fact a coded message from a Christian (not the Apostle John) in exile to his fellow Christians written in such a way the romans wouldn't be able to understand. The beast with the seven heads represents the seven deadly sins and the 10 horns not following the 10 commandments. Now this is what was presented in that film, i'm sure there's another side of the coin...Nero being the Antichrist is the most plausible explanation..
People had to pay with coins that had Nero's head on it
Temple was destroyed in 54BC
Nero was injured, fled, and came back to Rome
Rome was burning during his time
There's much more.. can't recall it all right nowThe chap who wrote down Revelations was writing down what happened during that time..

Mathew James
06-04-2012, 04:24 PM
Very interesting!
But I still think the ***** of Babylon is an economic entity, because of the buying and selling nature of the Mark of the beast.

There are three parts to the dragon (Beast); head, body and tail. The head has the mouth and it speaks though the politicians. The body has the heart and the blood life of the beast is funded/fueled by money. The tail has the stinger and it wages war with its armies. The tail is controlled by the head, which is given power by the body (money). Politics, Finance, and the War Machine are the three parts of the Beast.

However, the Beast and the False Prophet are both cast alive into the Lake of Fire. The Beast controls the world as an 'economic' entity. And the False Prophet deceives the world by creating lies about the Word of God. There are many people who buy into false gospels. When you believe a lie, you are buying into the lie. And when you teach the lie to others, you are selling lies.

mj

ciel_perdu
07-04-2012, 04:13 PM
Very interesting!
But I still think the ***** of Babylon is an economic entity, because of the buying and selling nature of the Mark of the beast. However, the big lie I see in the "Christian" church that directly contradicts the Gospel that Jesus taught, is that you can work for money, love money, and use your life to worship money and that's ok. When Jesus clearly says you cannot serve both God and Money. When the Mark of the Beast is introduced, the churches will be the first in line to get it!


it's nice to read someone talking about Jesus' teachings on not working for money and the relation to that and the mark of the beast. I agree that the big lie in the christian church world is that you can love money and still serve God (though Jesus says that you can't).

Hopefully everyone who has faith in God will listen to God speaking to them in their hearts, and reject the mark of the beast, choosing to live by faith in God and love.

Morpheus
10-04-2012, 02:37 PM
Concerning the return of the Messiah:

"2 (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fbible.cc%2F2_thessalon ians%2F2-2.htm) That ye be not soon shaken in mind, or be troubled, neither by spirit, nor by word, nor by letter as from us, as that the day of Christ is at hand.

3 (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fbible.cc%2F2_thessalon ians%2F2-3.htm) Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
4 (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fbible.cc%2F2_thessalon ians%2F2-4.htm) Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God."

2 Thessalonians
http://kingjbible.com/2_thessalonians/2.htm (http://kingjbible.com/2_thessalonians/2.htm)

Occultist
10-04-2012, 07:08 PM
So are you saying that the false christs are bankers and people who deal in finance. In that case, I would agree with you :smile:

and you wonder why I love ya? :hug: LOL

hasbean
31-05-2012, 11:03 AM
There are three parts to the dragon (Beast); head, body and tail. The head has the mouth and it speaks though the politicians. The body has the heart and the blood life of the beast is funded/fueled by money. The tail has the stinger and it wages war with its armies. The tail is controlled by the head, which is given power by the body (money). Politics, Finance, and the War Machine are the three parts of the Beast.

However, the Beast and the False Prophet are both cast alive into the Lake of Fire. The Beast controls the world as an 'economic' entity. And the False Prophet deceives the world by creating lies about the Word of God. There are many people who buy into false gospels. When you believe a lie, you are buying into the lie. And when you teach the lie to others, you are selling lies.

mj


Hi MJ I have been away for a while, but I'm just wondering if you have any scriptual support for your theories? You seem to be spouting them very confidently, as if they are facts, but they sound more they your personal theories, which is fine, if you state it that way.

The reason I keep harping back to the Mark of the beast being about literal buying and selling is because that it what the Bible says in Revelation 13:17.

According to Revelation 12:7, the Dragon represents the Devil (Satan). Where did you get your information about the "three parts of the Dragon"?
It sounds like a reasonable theory about society in general, but we already have three main evil entities in Revelation. The Dragon, The Beast and the W_h_o_r_e, which could fit nicely into your theory. The Dragon speaking through the false prophet to deceive the masses (Rev 13:11-14), The Beast (or Antichrist) who makes war against the Saints (Daniel 7:21, Rev 13:4), and the W_h_o_r_e of Babylon who rules over the Nations, but is corrupt and decadent (Rev 17:15-18). The W_h_o_r_e of Babylon is decribed as a Nation or a city that rules over the World and dominates world trade (Can you think of any candidates?). Personally I think this passage is talking about Capitalism in general and the U.S.A in particular.
That's my theory. And my advice is "come out of her my people" (Rev 18.4)

Peace. Beans

Mathew James
31-05-2012, 03:08 PM
Peace onto you hasbeen, imo we see it very much the same way. The buying and selling is certainly about greed and money. I agree that the USA and its push for world capitalism is the dragons w-h-o-r-e babylon. It is the love of money that grows evil and from that many lies begin to take hold. The lies are just one of many things that can be purchased and sold.

There are references in the bible about the dragon’s belly (body) that consumes, there are references to the lies that come out of its mouth (head). The horns on its head are described as the power of ??? "nations" maybe, not sure. The dragon makes war with its tail. It uses its tail to cast a third of the stars to earth when it tried to devour the woman’s child in Rev.12:4. My reference to the three main parts of the dragon is a way to describe these concepts, as you know there is much more to this dragon then just three parts.

mj

Morpheus
10-06-2012, 04:52 PM
Slave of Allah:
I watched a BBC documentary once that stated it was actually the emperor Nero, the numeric values of his name if added produce 666. The book of apocalypse was in fact a coded message from a Christian (not the Apostle John) in exile to his fellow Christians written in such a way the romans wouldn't be able to understand. The beast with the seven heads represents the seven deadly sins and the 10 horns not following the 10 commandments. Now this is what was presented in that film, i'm sure there's another side of the coin... Thre are multiple occurances, and meanings involving prophecy.
666 pertains to several things. "6" of course is the number of imperfect man, "7" representing deity, and God, and perfection.
We should start out with the knowledge that everything concerning the symbolic prophecies in the Book of Revelation, in the Bible, is substantiated and supported by text in the book itself... or, in other places in the Bible.
So, symbologies can be interpreted by this confirmation, and substantiation..

One example, concerning chapter 12 in Revelation concerning the, "woman", with the Sun, Moon, and twelve stars over her head, relates all the way back to Genesis, concerning Joseph's dream in chapter 37,
Regarding the patriarchs of the Hebrew nation, and relating to the nation itself.
http://www.essortment.com/genesis-37-50-story-joseph-64808.html (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.spiritualforums. com%25252Fvb%25252Fredir.php%25253Flink%25253Dhttp %2525253A%2525252F%2525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com %2525252Fvb%2525252Fredir.php%2525253Flink%2525253 Dhttp%252525253A%252525252F%252525252Fwww.spiritua lforums.com%252525252Fvb%252525252Fredir.php%25252 5253Flink%252525253Dhttp%25252525253A%25252525252F %25252525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com%25252525252Fv b%25252525252Fredir.php%25252525253Flink%252525252 53Dhttp%2525252525253A%2525252525252F%252525252525 2Fwww.spiritualforums.com%2525252525252Fvb%2525252 525252Fredir.php%2525252525253Flink%2525252525253D http%252525252525253A%252525252525252F%25252525252 5252Fwww.spiritualforums.com%252525252525252Fvb%25 2525252525252Fredir.php%252525252525253Flink%25252 5252525253Dhttp%25252525252525253A%252525252525252 52F%25252525252525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com%2525 2525252525252Fvb%25252525252525252Fredir.php%25252 525252525253Flink%25252525252525253Dhttp%252525252 5252525253A%2525252525252525252F%25252525252525252 52Fwww.spiritualforums.com%2525252525252525252Fvb% 2525252525252525252Fredir.php%2525252525252525253F link%2525252525252525253Dhttp%25252525252525252525 3A%252525252525252525252F%252525252525252525252Fww w.spiritualforums.com%252525252525252525252Fvb%252 525252525252525252Fredir.php%252525252525252525253 Flink%252525252525252525253Dhttp%25252525252525252 525253A%25252525252525252525252F%25252525252525252 525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com%2525252525252525252 5252Fvb%25252525252525252525252Fredir.php%25252525 252525252525253Flink%25252525252525252525253Dhttp% 2525252525252525252525253A%25252525252525252525252 52F%2525252525252525252525252Fwww.spiritualforums. com%2525252525252525252525252Fvb%25252525252525252 52525252Fredir.php%2525252525252525252525253Flink% 2525252525252525252525253Dhttp%2525252525252525252 52525253A%252525252525252525252525252F%25252525252 5252525252525252Fwww.essortment.com%25252525252525 2525252525252Fgenesis-37-50-story-joseph-64808.html)

Now, it will be substantiated in researching the various texts, that the, "beast", with seven heads and ten horns represents the continents, and ruling nations of the world.
The "Beast" then is the political/economic/religious world of the time prophesied about, and the, "antichrist", is a ruler thereof.
Also called, "The son of perdition".

www.bible.cc/2_thessalonians/2-3.htm (http://www.bible.cc/2_thessalonians/2-3.htm)
"let no man beguile you in any wise: for it will not be, except the falling away come first, and the man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition."


There is symbology of a "harlot", riding a Beast representing the major religious institution of the time. (In purple and scarlet robes, and adornment.)
"17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns.
17:4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:
17:5 And upon her forehead was a name written a mystery: BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
(King James Version; the New International Version uses "prostitutes" instead of "harlots"). (Revelation 17)

In the Book of Daniel the antichrist is represented by the symbology of a, "little horn", who is boastful and full of arrogance, and worships the previously unknown god of armament.
www.bible.cc/daniel/8-9.htm (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.spiritualforums. com%25252Fvb%25252Fredir.php%25253Flink%25253Dhttp %2525253A%2525252F%2525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com %2525252Fvb%2525252Fredir.php%2525253Flink%2525253 Dhttp%252525253A%252525252F%252525252Fwww.spiritua lforums.com%252525252Fvb%252525252Fredir.php%25252 5253Flink%252525253Dhttp%25252525253A%25252525252F %25252525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com%25252525252Fv b%25252525252Fredir.php%25252525253Flink%252525252 53Dhttp%2525252525253A%2525252525252F%252525252525 2Fwww.spiritualforums.com%2525252525252Fvb%2525252 525252Fredir.php%2525252525253Flink%2525252525253D http%252525252525253A%252525252525252F%25252525252 5252Fwww.spiritualforums.com%252525252525252Fvb%25 2525252525252Fredir.php%252525252525253Flink%25252 5252525253Dhttp%25252525252525253A%252525252525252 52F%25252525252525252Fwww.bible.cc%252525252525252 52Fdaniel%25252525252525252F8-9.htm) 8 Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven.
9 And out of one of them came forth a little horn, which waxed exceeding great, toward the south, and toward the east, and toward the pleasant land. 10 And it waxed great, even to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and of the stars to the ground, and stamped upon them. 11 Yea, he magnified himself even to the prince of the host, and by him the daily sacrifice was taken away, and the place of his sanctuary was cast down. 12 And an host was given him against the daily sacrifice by reason of transgression, and it cast down the truth to the ground; and it practised, and prospered. 13 Then I heard one saint speaking, and another saint said unto that certain saint which spake, How long shall be the vision concerning the daily sacrifice, and the transgression of desolation, to give both the sanctuary and the host to be trodden under foot? 14 And he said unto me, Unto two thousand and three hundred days; then shall the sanctuary be cleansed.

One should note in the above cited chapter, there is also mention of "Media", and "Persia".
Present day Iran and Iraq?

There is reference to this, concerning Gabriel's visit to Daniel also, elswhere, where Gabriel says he departed to Daniel as soon s he begun to pray, but, that he was detained by the, "Prince of Persia", wherein the Angel Michael had to assist him.
Not only this, but, upon leaving Daniel, he had to go and return to contend with this "Prince of Persia", again, modern day Iraq and Iran."But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia."(Daniel 10)http://bible.cc/daniel/10-13.htm (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.spiritualforums. com%25252Fvb%25252Fredir.php%25253Flink%25253Dhttp %2525253A%2525252F%2525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com %2525252Fvb%2525252Fredir.php%2525253Flink%2525253 Dhttp%252525253A%252525252F%252525252Fwww.spiritua lforums.com%252525252Fvb%252525252Fredir.php%25252 5253Flink%252525253Dhttp%25252525253A%25252525252F %25252525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com%25252525252Fv b%25252525252Fredir.php%25252525253Flink%252525252 53Dhttp%2525252525253A%2525252525252F%252525252525 2Fbible.cc%2525252525252Fdaniel%2525252525252F10-13.htm)
(Now, the angels and spiritual things are not confined within a construct of "space/time".)

Again modern day Iraq and Iran.
All of this pertains to, as is stated by Gabriel, the prophecies concerning the last, or latter days.

All the nations of the world look to a man, a human, to rule, and preside over them, instead of God.
In this modern age wherein a, "Global Community", now exists, one will rise and preside over all, in the world.
He will be favored, and seem to have the answers regarding peace among the nations.
Apparently, an assasination attempt will occur, which he will recover from. Perhaps pertaining to an, "NDE" situation, wherein it is written the devil will posess him. He will become the incarnation thereof then, in a converse mirror image to the Messiah.

But, it is clear in scripture that he will institute a false peace which will collapse midway during what is called "the tribulation period", (7 years), culminating in an, "Apocalypse".
Which will be curtailed by God before the destruction of the whole earth occurs, and God will intervene, setting up His reign on Earth, through the appearance of the Messiah. A reunion of Heaven and Earth will take place, which Jesus described in the parable of the Bridegroom, returning for His Bride.
As well as described in other parables.

A Psalm of David, father to King Solomon...
"The earth is the Lord's and the fullness thereof..the world, and all that dwell therein."
http://scripturetext.com/psalms/24-1.htm (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fscripturetext.com%25 252Fpsalms%25252F24-1.htm)

Morpheus
10-06-2012, 06:46 PM
Mathew:Peace onto you hasbeen, imo we see it very much the same way. The buying and selling is certainly about greed and money.

A number of valid interpretation can come out of the symbologies in prophecy. They will not conflict with each other.

Regarding Revelation 13, and, the "mark" pertaining to buying and selling.

"The Universal Product Code (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fen.wikipedia.org%252 52Fwiki%25252FUniversal_Product_Code) has bit patterns at the beginning, middle and end of the barcode called "guard bars". Laurer is often asked about the resemblance of these guard bars to the coding of the numeral 6.
Some people see the three sets of guard bars as encoding the number 666 (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fen.wikipedia.org%252 52Fwiki%25252FNumber_of_the_Beast_%252528numerolog y%252529), which some fundamentalist Christians see as a sign of evil."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_J._Laurer (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fen. wikipedia.org%252Fwiki%252FGeorge_J._Laurer)

Also?
"Chapter 13 of the biblical Book of Revelation is a very revealing text. It refers to the number 666 as being the mark of ‘the beast’.
But, in the Periodic Table of the Elements, the atomic number for the Carbon element is six.
Carbon is necessary to form all DNA and RNA, the chemical code of life as it currently exists.
And the Carbon atom has six electrons, six neutrons and six protons."
http://hiddenlighthouse.wordpress.com/category/the-beast/ (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fhiddenlighthouse.wordp ress.com%2Fcategory%2Fthe-beast%2F)

Equally, one may consider the, "Reptilian Brain", in human anatomy, with respect to the terms of serpent and dragon, in scripture.
http://www.myshrink.com/counseling-theory.php?t_id=86

Mathew James
10-06-2012, 09:57 PM
...Equally, one may consider the, "Reptilian Brain", in human anatomy, with respect to the terms of serpent and dragon, in scripture.
http://www.myshrink.com/counseling-theory.php?t_id=86

Thanks Morpheus, that is an interesting link. Recent discoveries of the brain support the concept of the "Reptilian Brain". The right side of the brain is the side that pure behavior is from. It is always in a present state and without any ego. The left side contains the ego and is concerned with what happens in our future. There are ways of thinking that strenthen the fiborous network on the right side of the brain, verses, having most of our thoughts in the left side, which is open to many ego interpretations of reality.

mj

Mind's Eye
10-06-2012, 10:04 PM
I think the Anti-Christ is anyone who claims to follow God and love others, and then lives a life of hatred, lies and violence. To go against all that the Christ Spirit is; that is the Anti-Christ.

Morpheus
11-06-2012, 08:08 AM
I think the Anti-Christ is anyone who claims to follow God and love others, and then lives a life of hatred, lies and violence. To go against all that the Christ Spirit is; that is the Anti-Christ.

You are referring, for one, to hypocrisy of a claimed believer.

Regarding this, Paul had stated that the spirit of antichrist had been in the world already. But the term also refers to a coming false messiah, and influental world leader. Which same decieves the world through, "all lying wonders".

dark1979
11-06-2012, 04:51 PM
I know what I think...