Why is God So Mean?

[Fire7]

I was going to use a more philosophical, intellectual title to address this matter, but the bible itself says of itself that it is so simple that a fool shouldn't err. So, like a child, I'm keeping it simple, because there really is no other way to put it.

I was born and raised in the pentecostal church. I no longer claim Christianity, but in my search for knowing God, I still listen to sermons. The sermons I listen to are usually by black hellfire and brimstone preachers, because that's what I'm most familiar with. I don't know if you're familiar with a man named G Craig Lewis. But if you are, then you have an idea of the type of ministers I listen to. What I honestly have a hard time understanding is why it feels to me that God is hell-bent on sending me to hell?

You might think that I'm exaggerating when I make this statement, but I am by no means being overdramatic. I try very hard to believe that when these preachers say "God loves you but hates your sin," that they mean it. I try with everything within me to believe that these people really love me. But I have to be honest. I have never felt love coming from these preachers. I always feel that they are just saying what they have been taught to say, if they aren't just in it for the show. I do believe that some of them are genuine and sincere. But you can also be sincerely wrong.

Even all of these testimonies I have been hearing over the years of people who died and went to hell, and were brought back to tell about it. I listen closely, and what I gather is that it is very hard to make it into Heaven. And I don't undertand if God really wants people in Heaven, why He made it so hard to get in. It just doesn't seem right. It seems to me like He plays favorites. But why create people just to throw them in hell. It's almost like He enjoys it. Even many preacher talk as if they're glad there is a hell and glad you're going. It's like if you don't live up to THEIR standard (personal hidden agenda), you can't do anything right, and for that you ARE going to hell. I also don't understand why God is so hard on homosexuals when He created the very biology that made them that way. And don't tell me that they weren't born that way, because I am one.

Unless you have seen things through my eyes, of course, you cannot fully understand where I'm coming from, and most of this is just hot air to you. And this is another thing; Christians are poor listeners and bad at understanding. They just love to judge others so they can (secretly... and often unconsciously) feel better about themselves. I know this because I've spent my lifetime (29 years) around them. I've seen Christians of every kind, so I know what I'm talking about. But I would literally be here for a couple of days describing to you all of the contradictions I have observed throughout this exclusive belief system.

And as much as I want to know God and be His closest friend, I feel that He doesn't really want to get to know me, but is just out to play mind games with me. I'm not being irreverent or sacrilerious: I'm just being honest. It makes me not feel like praying, even though I want to. It makes me not want to read the bible, because it's full of contradictions (and don't tell me there aren't, when they are very blatant). God just seems, to me, to be the cruelest, most cold blooded, hard hearted, unforgiving, stone faced, dominating, ruthless, non caring, bi-polar, sadistic, spiteful, wicked terrorist of all time.

Have you seen this recent testimony of a girl, Angelica Zambrano, who claims to have gone to hell for 23 hours and saw Selena Quintanilla, Michael Jackson, and children in hell? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZFI7R4ZxKQ

[thehermit]

I just want to say that I don't agree with you lumping everyone together. coents such as X is this and X is that are misleading and generally reflect prejudice. To some extent, prejudice and grouping is normal. But it can also reflect YOUR own predjudice.


I don't think God is mean. I think *people* are mean. What the Bible teaches and what is taught within the church often differs. I believe this is because relgion and culture don't truly mix well, the truth becomes mixed with current and recent hitory as well as personal biases. That and you can use any text to justify your own beliefs...despite its orginal meaning.

The bible speaks of fire but it also has loads of symbolic meanings within it. I'm not sure about other religous texts but I have seen this in others. By my process of thought, if the bible is full of parables and symbolic imagery than there is a good chance "hell" is not a literal place but more so of a spiritual mindstate. So, the further you are from spirituality and true happiness onceyou pass this will be reflected in your spiritual state. I've had several Christian pastors an heard a few talk about this as well.

I do not think God is mean and I do not think he punishes. I do, however, beleive he gives us rough lessons. It is a spoiled spirit that sees these lessons as punishment or "woe is me". The ultimate goals is to be god-like towards yourself and others, to develop the fruits of the psirit etc, these lessons allow you to do so. Also, according to the bible, he does not give youthings you can not handle and has your best interest at heart. Becuase he is god (if you believe in him), therefore above our mind functioning, he will be difficult to udnerstand. Christian god or not.

As far as God loving you and hating your sin. It is possible. Think of your parents, fmaily members and friends. They love you, your soul, have your best intention at heart yet they may not ike your habit of lying, cheating, etc.

Thank you for being honest, I respect and understand you. Just keep in mind that our perceptions of situaitons develop with exprience and often true meditation. Go to others and ask how they feel God is. Ask yourself without judgement of you and others. Eventually you may find that how you feel is only temporary. Possibly. Just my $0.02

[Silver]

We human beings often say this is this way or is that way, period. They want something solid that they can count on to be 'right' or true. They often don't seem to mind selling out their very wonderful sweet humanness in the process. The reason for this is that life is so full of ups and downs and inconsistent outcomes, they get seasick and disoriented when life is full of zigs and zags. I think people don't develop their 'sea legs' very well because they are often overprotected. Part of that overprotection comes in the form of these jarring, 'solid' beliefs, you're going to hell because you do X, etc., etc. I doubt that most are willing to admit this, though.

[mattie]

The energies we call God aren’t mean. The mean God is a construct of particular religions. My parents were Southern Baptist, so I grew up w/ listening to a bumper crop of hellfire & brimstone sermons. By the age of 9 these just weren't making any sense at all. They made less sense the older I became!

There are many beliefs that you have the option of selecting. One can select from any religion or belief system what you want & decline what you don’t.

Focus on your on journey, not that of others. You say you have moved past the Christian beliefs but seem to still hold one of the more regressive images of God. Perhaps it might be useful for you to also move past their image of God & into your own empowering loving images of this energy.

Many have moved into new ideas about God that are the Universe or source or prime creator. Our being separated from the energies we call God as inferior inherently flawed beings is
passe′.

Changing Ideas About God- http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=249240#poststop

Literal Interpretation Of The Bible By Christian Scholars- http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=233061&posted=1#post233061

[theophilus]

The sermons I listen to are usually by black hellfire and brimstone preachers, because that's what I'm most familiar with.If you choose to listen to preachers like that then it isn't surprising that you only get that kind of preaching. Perhaps you should look for some different preachers. Here are two good source of Bible teaching that includes teaching about Hell but doesn't focus on it exclusively.

http://www.backtothebible.org/index.php/Today-on-Back-to-the-Bible/Today-on-Back-to-the-Bible.html (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.spiritualforums. com%25252Fvb%25252Fredir.php%25253Flink%25253Dhttp %2525253A%2525252F%2525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com %2525252Fvb%2525252Fredir.php%2525253Flink%2525253 Dhttp%252525253A%252525252F%252525252Fwww.spiritua lforums.com%252525252Fvb%252525252Fredir.php%25252 5253Flink%252525253Dhttp%25252525253A%25252525252F %25252525252Fwww.backtothebible.org%25252525252Fin dex.php%25252525252FToday-on-Back-to-the-Bible%25252525252FToday-on-Back-to-the-Bible.html)

http://www.bottradionetwork.com/ (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .spiritualforums.com%252Fvb%252Fredir.php%253Flink %253Dhttp%25253A%25252F%25252Fwww.spiritualforums. com%25252Fvb%25252Fredir.php%25253Flink%25253Dhttp %2525253A%2525252F%2525252Fwww.spiritualforums.com %2525252Fvb%2525252Fredir.php%2525253Flink%2525253 Dhttp%252525253A%252525252F%252525252Fwww.spiritua lforums.com%252525252Fvb%252525252Fredir.php%25252 5253Flink%252525253Dhttp%25252525253A%25252525252F %25252525252Fwww.bottradionetwork.com%25252525252F )

I especially recommend the first one because I became a Christian as a result of listening to radio broadcasts produced by this organization.

Even all of these testimonies I have been hearing over the years of people who died and went to hell, and were brought back to tell about it. I listen closely, and what I gather is that it is very hard to make it into Heaven.Are you familiar with the story of Lazarus and the rich man in Luke 16? Lazarus wasn't allowed to go back to warn the rich man's brothers to keep them from going to hell. Since God never changes it seems unlikely to me that he would give people such vivid pictures of hell today. Have you considered the possibility that the actual source of these visions is Satan and that he is using them to give people a false view of what God is like?

And I don't undertand if God really wants people in Heaven, why He made it so hard to get in.Getting into heaven is both the hardest and the easiest thing in the world.

It is the hardest because God is holy and won't tolerate any sin so only those without sin can enter heaven. We have all sinned and our sins create a barrier between us and God and exclude us from his presence. There is nothing we can do that will make us fit for heaven.

It is the easiest because God offers us salvation and entry into heaven as a gift which we merely have to receive. He sent Jesus Christ into the world to take the punishment for our sins by his death and resurrection. Jesus had no sins of his own so he didn't have to die. He willingly died in our place to take away our sins. If we turn from our sins and put our faith in him our sins are forgiven and in God's sight it is as if we had never sinned and we are fit to enter heaven. Here are two places you can find a more detailed explanation of this:

http://www.backtothebible.org/Indexes/index.php?option=com_mosforms&Itemid=180 (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spiritualforums.co m%2Fvb%2Fredir.php%3Flink%3Dhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .backtothebible.org%252FIndexes%252Findex.php%253F option%253Dcom_mosforms%2526amp%253BItemid%253D180 )

http://carm.org/jesus-saves (http://www.spiritualforums.com/vb/redir.php?link=http%3A%2F%2Fcarm.org%2Fjesus-saves)

I know by personal experience that it is possible to be a member of a church and involved in its work and yet not understand the way of salvation. I have always believed the facts about Jesus' death and resurrection and I got baptized and joined a church because I thought that was what I needed to do to enter heaven. The problem was that just believing the facts about Jesus isn't the kind of faith that brings salvation. It is also necessary to make a personal decision to acknowledge that he died for your sins and to receive him personally into your heart. I finally did this after I had been a church member for over two years and it was at this time that I really became a Christian.

Is it possible that you experience with church was the same as mine and you were a member of a church without having the kind of faith that brings salvation?

[Fire7]

Here is a clip of Minister G. Craig Lewis. He is famous for his thorough series of "The Truth Behind Hip Hop." His overall maessage, basically, is "Choose a side."
1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Buf9-_yW08
2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddfl6ynvTg0&feature=related

I know that you may think posting this is irrelevant. But to fully understand what I'm saying, an investigation of this man's message is a *requirement." It is not about him, the indiviual, but he is a good representation of all of the preachers and sermons I have heard, rolled up into one.

If I did not care about my eternal salvation, I would not even care to listen to this man, or any preacher, for that matter. And I wouldn't have gone through the effort to make this thread; you know that.

The reason I use G Craig Lewis as an example is because he has done a lot of research and his teachings are thorough. He is also bold and straight forward, which is attractive to me in a minister. I hate when preachers beat around the bush. So I am interested in what he has to say. And because he seems to have so much of truth--and claims to be baptised with the H-ly Spirit--which I am seeking , it concerns me all the more the method that he uses. If he is filled with the H-ly Spirit and hears from G-d as much as he claims, then I am skeptical that I can trust this God. Because this man is very very brutal in his delivery. He literally slanders just about every well kknown preacher in the nation. I cannot tell you how many times I have heard him use the term "sissy," "fa9," and other terms to describe homosexuals. He mocks the fact that AIDS is high in among homosexuals, and calls people gay just because of how they look or act.

If you don't think he's controversial, he has more lawsuits against him than he can shake a stick at, but he says to them "join the list." He insists that he will not debate anyone because he "knows he's right." He has labeled highly respected and revered men and women of God (T.D. Jakes, Juanita Bynum, Paula White, Eddie Long, Jamal Bryant, Rick Warren, etc...etc...) "heretics," "false prophets," and "Jezebels." It's as if he doesn't want anyone to listen to these people at all, but to only listen to him and his inner circle of friends/preachers; this is the feeling I get. He never says anything positive about these ministers, gospel recording artists, and Christian actors. He only talks about the negative things they do. He seem to believe that 95% of the well known actors, comedians, singers, gospel recording artists, preachers and politicians, are part of the illuminati and secret societies: most of his sermons are geared toward breaking down the different codes sings and codes that prove this.

He make$ a living (really) off of mocking, degrading, and defacing well-known people; it's how he became famous, in the name of Jesus, and backs it all up with scripture. He's a eisegetical genious and knows his bible (although he sometimes turns spiritual matters into cultural matters when it isn't called for), so it's like you can't really argue with him. But I just get a feeling about him that I can't put my finger on. He says it's the H-ly Ghost. In response to people telling him, "but you put something else on it," he says "yea I put the H-ly Ghost on it!!" It's not any right of mine to say what spirit he is of (dare I speak against the H-ly Spirit), but actions speak louder than words, and the bible says that one would be known by his fruit. When you have so may people upset and everyone is saying the same thing, that, to me, looks like some rotten fruit.

It's confusing to me because he is either loved or hated. People obviously love him for him to be as successful as he is for so long. And the people who love him really love him, and he can do no wrong to them (as in he is not held accountable). No matter how rude he is (they seem to enjoy the drama), they adamantly insist that it is the God in him. My question is the same as Christs': Can any kingdom divided against itself stand? Maybe it can, I'm just asking. Because according to Lewis, the church is supposed to be divided,a dn he gets thorough enjoyment out of being the one to do it. Just read his blog--all of it (each article) --and see how good he is at this job. Listen to as many of his sermons, webcast programs, and radio broadcast that are on youtube, as you can. This is the best way you will understand where I'm coming from. And feel free to give me your input.

Again, this is not about G. Craig Lewis. He just represents much of the divide and contradiction that I have observed in the church. But there is so much more that I can show you. I'm working on something that I have been writing for over a year. When I finish it, I will post it here. Because I am certain that you cannot fully understand where I am coming from with this (and consequently, how to proportionately address this) unless you see some things with your own eyes and hear with your own ears. The best way to convince a person is to let him see for himself.

There are three responses to truth, and three responses only. When a person is confronted and cornered by truth, he will either, one: face it--give an answer or seek into it for himself to see if these things be so, two: become defensive and try to attack (because he's overwhelmed because the truth is nt in him), or three: be indifferent--i.e. run from it, plug up his ears and shut is eyes tightly, or simply ignore it and pretend that it never existed. So then there are only three types of people. So if you are committed to the truth and nothing but the unadulterated truth, then you will do some investigating of your own to see if these things be so.

[Fire7]

I also want to say that I'm not talking about a particular church or preacher. I have listened to hundreds of them; whether it was in my local church(es), over the radio, on television, over the internet... They are all the same. And the ones who aren't definitely get atacked by those who are. There are preachers who I have listened to who are more into the grace, mercy, and love message, but I've also observed contradictions in them. And they are usually "exposed" by other ministers for being "heretics," so I really don;t know who to believe, because they all are saying something different, but they all believe so adamantly that they are the one who is right. It's just all too confusing. They all preach out of the same bible, but each of them can show you in the bible, proof that they are right in what they teach. And low and behold, they all make perfect sense. But they all cannot be right (when they messages are conflicting and contradictory of another): that goes against the laws of truth, and the laws of logic.

[Time]

Because that is how god was made to be in the bible, which the majirty of the population believes in.

Im not saying I disagree dude, but in canada, the preachers, arent anything liek that.

[jojo50]

You have SOOOO, many valid questions. And there are answers to your questions, some you may not like. My question to you is, are you willing to handle the truth? I’ve known many who claim to want the truth,but when they’re shown it, they deny it. For example. I’m a Jws. Many say we make things up,though it’s in the bible,and there’s much proof, (when one does research), that backs up what we’re trying to show others. A minister told one of our elders, the name Jehovah was ONLY in the bible we used,(making a long story short). Once the elder showed him from his kjb,( [COLOR="DarkRed"]Exo.6:3 {also see Psa.83:18} ),the name was there also. The suppose-to-be, “minister or Jesus” tore out the page and said …”not anymore”

This is a perfect example of not only one claiming to be a follower of Jesus denying the name. But he don’t even care Jesus said we should do HIS Father’s will,(Matt.12:50, Matt.7:21). I’ll respond to your questions in steps. Many ministers aren’t sent by Jehovah God,or his son Jesus. But by satan,(2Cor.-11:13-15). We’ve shown many times there IS NO hellfire. God never created one. Many don’t understand what Jesus meant at (Matt.5:29, Matt. 5:21-23). NOW Jesus and is Father is one, (John 10:30 ) ,many are taught he meant they are one in the same. That’s their teachings, NOT Jesus. Because Jesus said he do the will of HIS Father, (John 5:30). So they’re NOT the same beings, there are TWO different ones, Father and Son,(Matt.3:17). That WASN’T Jesus voice from Heaven, referring to himself!


So IF Jesus and his Father are one, (meaning they are in total agreement with each other). Then why would Jesus teach a hellfire. When he KNOWS his Father never create one. But notice something else Jesus said at Matt.25:41.”everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels“ (if hell suppose to be a place where demons reside, and wicked dead are tortured. then why would fire hurt them? Jesus means total destruction, since fire totally destroys things)! Whicked angels wasn’t kicked into a place called hell where they are said to reside. They were kicked STRAIGHT to earth. Where they resided,(Rev.12:12), this is why God’s words says “Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea”

Faithful men were sent to what they knew or callled Hell, notice….
(1).Psa.16:8-11- David ,talking about God not leaving his soul in hell, not even to see corruption, (decaying). Notice David saying… “my flesh also shall rest in hope“ (if the false teachings of hell was a place demons torture the wicked and sinners, why would David say “his flesh shall rest? Hell wouldn‘t be in a place of resting).

(2).Jonah 2:1,2- Jonah prayed unto the LORD his God out of the fish's belly, ‘and he heard me; out of the belly of hell cried I, and thou heardest my voice‘.( was Jonah being tortured by demons?, was there fire in the fish belly?…no!)

In Gen.2:17,Jehovah said the first couple would die if they eat of a certain tree. He didn’t say they will be placed in a “hellfire.” we die, even if we’re healthy, because of their sins. God also said once one dies, they had paid for their sins,(Rom.-6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. And Rom.6:7 -For he that is dead is freed from sin).

God doesn’t want any to die,this is why he wants us to obey him,(Ezek.33:11). Jesus and his MANY servants obeyed him. Who are we to believe we don’t have to? No I’ve never been a homosexual. And though I know many choose to live that life. Since I was in my 20’s I believe many felt they were born this way. When I seen this guy crying, saying he wasn’t trying to be gay. And talking about tired of being mistreated. My heart went out to him,and I believed he believed he was born that way.

Now!.. this is where I said you may not like. Satan, (not saying homosexuals are bad people, evil, etc), is the cause of the lifestyle. Many Christians points the finger at gays,saying you going to hell. Well, lol…if there WAS one, many of them would be going too. Because many are fornication, and committing adultery. Which are JUST as ABOMINATING, as homosexuality. Many refuse to understand why God is against it. But God had a reason for making two sex organs,which was to create. Something he wanted humans to do. In order to populate the earth, he made for us,(Psa.115:16).

He DOES love ALL, but he won’t tolerate, ANY who continue living NOT a way pleasing to him,(Gal.6:7 -Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap). Many think ALL will die, but God’s words shows many will live up to the end. This is when we’re “reap what we sowed” even Jehovah’s servants/Jesus followers has many fights. This is why we constantly pray for forgiveness daily. But IF we want to be seen as Jesus spiritual siblings. We HAVE to try and live by God’s rules. JUST as Jesus and his followers did! We CAN’T say I’m living the way I want, then blame God for our jack-ups. God did NOT create ANY negative actions, WE DID!, with satan’s help,(2Cor.4:4).

Satan will trick us with lies,(Ephe.6:11 -Put on the whole Armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles, (tricks), of the devil). be-it through tricks of it’s ok to be gay, sex without marriage, Lie,(especially the "little white ones"),or false teachings. We have to be aware of satan’s tricks,(1Cor.2:11 Lest Satan should get an advantage of us: for we are not ignorant of his devices). and trust when i say...God DOES make sure his servants knows satan's trick. at one point we knew nothing,because we were blinded. also because many of us lives an abominating way,NOT pleasing to God. but we were willing to change,believe, and follow what Jesus said.


IF we say Jesus doesn’t know what he’s talking about. Then we’ve fell right into satan’s trap. And he would make us believe what he wants us to believe. In order to turn us against God and his people. AND.. .Get us destroyed! (Rom.1:24,25 ,(God doesn’t deal with those who does what they want, worships who they want, and make his words a lie).
1John 2:15,16, we can’t love anything in this word, that’ll cause us to turn away from God. (Rom.12:2 -we must change our ways,the way we once thought and lived. We can’t do as the world does. IF we want to be seen as God’s people.

God doesn’t have to “play mind games” he could just remove our breath. satan is the one who’s playing games. It’s satan who has many believe Jehovah God doesn’t want them, and Jesus also. Again satan wants us destroyed, because he knows he’s going down. God’s word isn’t contradictory ,you just don’t understand it. And many are explaining it falsely, which would be confusing. Another trick of satan, because God doesn’t confuse,(1Cor.14:33 For God is not the author of confusion, but of peace), he wants us to know the truth,(Rom.10:2 ).

If you want to pray,do so!, to the same God Jesus prayed to, (in Jesus name of course). You have a lot of searching to do, if you want to get close to the same God Jesus called his Father. But it’s up to you. I pray for you the right road that leads to eternal life. peace :hug3:

[mattie]

misposted.......

[psychoslice]

God seems mean because of the ignorant scribes who wrote about him, its really that simple.

[Gem]

He's a personal god with human qualities... so nothing more that a man really... and some dudes are mean.

[mattie]

I don’t have to listen to the clip of Minister Lewis. I’m from the US Bible Belt, so I know the type. His hate-filled rhetoric of using terms like ‘sissy, ‘fag,’ & mocking AIDS is repulsive & not anything that any TRUE spiritual person would do. There are no shortage of these intolerant rigid people in organized religion. One can safely reject what they say when they use prejudicial terms such as the aforementioned ones.

Of course those who are rigid & hate-filled attack the preachers who are more moderate, having a message of love. IMO any religion that teaches we are inherently flawed is VERY problematic as this is incredibly corrosive on people’s self esteem.

You can gather all the evidence you want about these types & organized religion in general, but the real question is how much more gathering evidence do you need to make the decision to:
1)stay w/ it & suffer through others’ intolerance,
2) move on to an organized religion that is welcoming of gays (There are these.), or
3) move out of organized religion into a new type of spirituality.

Could this need to stay immersed in this intolerant version of organized religion when there are organized religions that are publicly welcoming to gays have something to do w/ your mother, the minister’s disapproval about your being gay? Is there some need to catalogue her religion’s faults for some reason? Is this nourishing for you or keeping you immersed in the same old regressive intolerant energy?????

[River Morrison]

I was going to use a more philosophical, intellectual title to address this matter, but the bible itself says of itself that it is so simple that a fool shouldn't err. So, like a child, I'm keeping it simple, because there really is no other way to put it.

I was born and raised in the pentecostal church. I no longer claim Christianity, but in my search for knowing God, I still listen to sermons. The sermons I listen to are usually by black hellfire and brimstone preachers, because that's what I'm most familiar with. I don't know if you're familiar with a man named G Craig Lewis. But if you are, then you have an idea of the type of ministers I listen to. What I honestly have a hard time understanding is why it feels to me that God is hell-bent on sending me to hell?

You might think that I'm exaggerating when I make this statement, but I am by no means being overdramatic. I try very hard to believe that when these preachers say "God loves you but hates your sin," that they mean it. I try with everything within me to believe that these people really love me. But I have to be honest. I have never felt love coming from these preachers. I always feel that they are just saying what they have been taught to say, if they aren't just in it for the show. I do believe that some of them are genuine and sincere. But you can also be sincerely wrong.

Even all of these testimonies I have been hearing over the years of people who died and went to hell, and were brought back to tell about it. I listen closely, and what I gather is that it is very hard to make it into Heaven. And I don't undertand if God really wants people in Heaven, why He made it so hard to get in. It just doesn't seem right. It seems to me like He plays favorites. But why create people just to throw them in hell. It's almost like He enjoys it. Even many preacher talk as if they're glad there is a hell and glad you're going. It's like if you don't live up to THEIR standard (personal hidden agenda), you can't do anything right, and for that you ARE going to hell. I also don't understand why God is so hard on homosexuals when He created the very biology that made them that way. And don't tell me that they weren't born that way, because I am one.

Unless you have seen things through my eyes, of course, you cannot fully understand where I'm coming from, and most of this is just hot air to you. And this is another thing; Christians are poor listeners and bad at understanding. They just love to judge others so they can (secretly... and often unconsciously) feel better about themselves. I know this because I've spent my lifetime (29 years) around them. I've seen Christians of every kind, so I know what I'm talking about. But I would literally be here for a couple of days describing to you all of the contradictions I have observed throughout this exclusive belief system.

And as much as I want to know God and be His closest friend, I feel that He doesn't really want to get to know me, but is just out to play mind games with me. I'm not being irreverent or sacrilerious: I'm just being honest. It makes me not feel like praying, even though I want to. It makes me not want to read the bible, because it's full of contradictions (and don't tell me there aren't, when they are very blatant). God just seems, to me, to be the cruelest, most cold blooded, hard hearted, unforgiving, stone faced, dominating, ruthless, non caring, bi-polar, sadistic, spiteful, wicked terrorist of all time.

Have you seen this recent testimony of a girl, Angelica Zambrano, who claims to have gone to hell for 23 hours and saw Selena Quintanilla, Michael Jackson, and children in hell? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pZFI7R4ZxKQ

Excellent post Fire. You hit the nail right on the head. I myself, am an ex christian, and shed the faith for many of the same reasons you are describing here. If the God christanity purposes is actually the God of the universe, it means he is a sadistic and abusive.

Christians answer for God's behavior is that "he can do whatever he wants because he is God." But that excuse does not work for him, any more than it would work for an abusive parent who believes they can do whatever they want because they brought their child into the world.

Christanity is illogical, untenable, not supposed by any historical evidence, refuted by science. My advice to you my friend....stop listening to those black hellfire preachers, or anyone who is pushing this absurd iron-age mythology.