Meat-Eating?

[norton]

Hi, I'm really looking for advice about meat-eating, I don't have anyone else to ask.
I love meat, but I love animals too. I think that animals being killed for meat is the same as eating plants; they both have a soul, and their consciousness is "asleep." They feel pain but we don't know if plants do too, so I don't think it's fair to say we can only eat plants. Either way I think if a human kills an animal humanely and intends on using all of it, it's all right to eat meat. On top of that, meat has a lot of benefits that plants don't have, and even our teeth show that we're omnivorous. As the saying goes, "life eats life," so we're eating another soul's body no matter what we eat.
The reason I'm bringing this up is because I want to know if it's okay to call yourself a Hindu, or a follower of Krishna, and lead a spiritual life, but still eat meat. I want to be a knowledgeable, spiritual person and surrender to God, but I don't think it's fair to dismiss me as sinful or ignorant just because of what I eat. I would gladly offer my meat to Krishna if He would accept it, I don't eat it because I'm selfish but because I think I will starve otherwise. I heard people saying if you eat meat you will go to hell, and you are just full of lies, and it worries me. So I want to know if I can eat meat and still attain Moksha.

Thanks and Hare Krishna.

[surrendertotheflow]

I am not Hindu, but I do enjoy the flavors of every religion, and my take on it comes from a Buddhist monk, you've probably heard of him, Thich Nhat Han. Anyway, he agrees that veggies have souls too, and it's not different. When you kill only what you need to survive with no intent of harming the animal other than nurishing yourself, then that is okay. However, these days meat is wasted, and so much of it accumulates that we are in one way or another, just killing these animals and throwing them in trash!

Which is why I agree with Thich Nhat Han. He says if you go to the supermarket to buy your meat, do not have it butchered fresh. Buy something that is already dead, as it will be thrown away if not all of it is sold. I stopped eating lobster after this, because I realized, I am going to the store and picking out a live animal to be slaughtered just to nourish me when all of these animals around me have already suffered so I could be nourished? It really made me feel bad karmic vibes to go back to the store and think about buying a lobster.

I eat meat, but I try not to eat it every night. At each meal, we recite a prayer for all the animals, plants, and minerals that underwent suffering so we could be blessed with this meal to nourish us and help us become aware of the path of peace.

I hope you find what is true to yourself, regardless of what rules the religion would intend you to follow :)

Peace, Love and Light :)

[Lovely]

Plants don't feel pain. "Pain is a feeling triggered in the nervous system. "
Plants don't have a nervous system. Animals have a brain, a nervous system and
emotions. They have families, feel pain, feel fear etc.

We are humans, we have more power than animals and abusing,killing,eating,
exploiting them is abusing our powers.

Also, I think you should read this:
http://www.celestialhealing.net/physicalveg3.htm

When it comes to Hinduism, I don't know.
I don't think you need to follow a set of rules to
join a religion.
Join what ever religion makes you happy :)

Technically, you could be a cannibal and be a Hindu.
(But please don't become a cannibal :P )

I don't think anyone is "unqualified" to be in a religion since
it is usually a personal decision.

And you won't stave if you don't eat meat! lol
I get a lot of food on a vegan diet, let alone a vegetarian one.

[aghora]

hare krishna, norton
since you are a follower of krishna allow me to share what i know about the matter. in the bhagvad gita (chapter 17 verse 7) krishna says “even the food that a person prefers falls under the three modes of nature…” satvic food “increases life span and cleanses ones existence” whereas rajsic and tamsic foods “cause grief, distress and disease” (chapter 17 verses 8-9). meat is generally considered tamsic and fruits and milk are considered satvic. (it is noteworthy that neither milk nor fruits are obtained thru violent means).

ancient rishis are known to have been vegans ‘coz in their endeavour to realize god, food was ingested for sustaining life and not for indulging the senses.

krishna further reveals to arjun (chapter 16 verse 21) “there are 3 gates that lead to hell, lust anger and greed. these should be abandoned as they corrupt the soul”. despite acknowledging that lust leads to hell, god provided regulative principles such as the institution of marriage (to gradually overcome lust) as it is very difficult for mere mortals to conquer. thus god has given us perfect knowledge in the form of his divine song (bhagvad gita) and also a discerning mind to make individual choices. krishna instructs arjun (chapter 18 verse 63) “thus i have explained to you knowledge that is most confidential. meditate on it fully and do as you wish”

it is increasingly being discovered scientifically that vegan diet is beneficial to humans and meat-eating leads to various diseases. while you would attain moksha ultimately if you surrender to krishna, the path may be long and ardous. my personal advice to you would be to give up meat eating as it is not in conformity with krishna’s message.
















Hi, I'm really looking for advice about meat-eating, I don't have anyone else to ask.
I love meat, but I love animals too. I think that animals being killed for meat is the same as eating plants; they both have a soul, and their consciousness is "asleep." They feel pain but we don't know if plants do too, so I don't think it's fair to say we can only eat plants. Either way I think if a human kills an animal humanely and intends on using all of it, it's all right to eat meat. On top of that, meat has a lot of benefits that plants don't have, and even our teeth show that we're omnivorous. As the saying goes, "life eats life," so we're eating another soul's body no matter what we eat.
The reason I'm bringing this up is because I want to know if it's okay to call yourself a Hindu, or a follower of Krishna, and lead a spiritual life, but still eat meat. I want to be a knowledgeable, spiritual person and surrender to God, but I don't think it's fair to dismiss me as sinful or ignorant just because of what I eat. I would gladly offer my meat to Krishna if He would accept it, I don't eat it because I'm selfish but because I think I will starve otherwise. I heard people saying if you eat meat you will go to hell, and you are just full of lies, and it worries me. So I want to know if I can eat meat and still attain Moksha.

Thanks and Hare Krishna.

[athribiristan]

Hi, I'm really looking for advice about meat-eating, I don't have anyone else to ask.
I love meat, but I love animals too. I think that animals being killed for meat is the same as eating plants; they both have a soul, and their consciousness is "asleep." They feel pain but we don't know if plants do too, so I don't think it's fair to say we can only eat plants. Either way I think if a human kills an animal humanely and intends on using all of it, it's all right to eat meat. On top of that, meat has a lot of benefits that plants don't have, and even our teeth show that we're omnivorous. As the saying goes, "life eats life," so we're eating another soul's body no matter what we eat.
The reason I'm bringing this up is because I want to know if it's okay to call yourself a Hindu, or a follower of Krishna, and lead a spiritual life, but still eat meat. I want to be a knowledgeable, spiritual person and surrender to God, but I don't think it's fair to dismiss me as sinful or ignorant just because of what I eat. I would gladly offer my meat to Krishna if He would accept it, I don't eat it because I'm selfish but because I think I will starve otherwise. I heard people saying if you eat meat you will go to hell, and you are just full of lies, and it worries me. So I want to know if I can eat meat and still attain Moksha.

Thanks and Hare Krishna.

I'd like to point out a concept here call the Natural Order. Before there was Hinduism and civilization in general there were just humans trying to survive. They ate whatever would sustain them be it plant or animal. Using the natural order as a model, one would assume that eating meat is fine. We can digest it, so it must be ok to eat. So in the broadest sense the idea that we shouldn't eat meat is laughable.

That's not to say that there aren't valid reasons for becoming a vegetarian.

Our modern assembly line meat factories leave ample room for moral objections. Modern agriculture however is no better, the techniques used to grow crops today is just as repulsive (to me anyway).

Animals are suffering and mistreated. Quite frankly so are the plants. And if you think plants don't feel pain, I would disagree and suggest that you read The Secret Life of Plants, to find some good evidence that they do.

The bottom line for me is to first give thanks to the universe for whetever food I do have to eat, and then to have Faith that my body will be nourished by it.

Let me just say that any vegetarian will eat meat when they get hungry enough, so how much of it is really just **.

Oh yeah, lastly, I have never found that my diet had a tremendous impact on my ability to work with energy. Maybe it is because I refuse to accept such a limiting belief.

[Spiritlite]

I'm not sure on your religion and meat eating. I do eat meat, but I buy local meat where the cows are grass fed, have no antibiotics or any other meds put into them, are treated very humanely, have room to run, and are killed humanely (whatever that means), in fact the guy I buy my meat from my husband once knew and actually saw how the cows were brought up, killed etc, and as an animal lover he told me that they were very humanely killed. I refuse to buy store bought meat. I would love to go vegetarian but for some reason just can't, my advice is if you want to eat meat it's your choice but do it humanely find a place locally if you can that does this humanely, go watch them being killed etc.
We have a friend who hunts each year for his meat, he kills them quickly and uses all of their parts so I find that humane too. Of course vegetarians will disagree with me, but I don't put my valeus on vegetarians and I don't expect to be lectured by vegetarians.
Spiritlite.

[surrendertotheflow]

Animals are suffering and mistreated. Quite frankly so are the plants. And if you think plants don't feel pain, I would disagree and suggest that you read The Secret Life of Plants, to find some good evidence that they do.

.


Thanks for this, I agree with you. Just because we don't see a plant's pain, doesn't mean it isn't there! :hello2:

[Spiritlite]

Also what about lions, and tigers, and panthers, and birds that eat meat? What about the lioness or the female tiger that hunts their prey, are they "bad" or negative for killing? however watch them kill and they do it fast and humanely and get the weakling of the bunch that they are killing

[Chrysaetos]

it is increasingly being discovered scientifically that vegan diet is beneficial to humans and meat-eating leads to various diseases. while you would attain moksha ultimately if you surrender to krishna, the path may be long and ardous. my personal advice to you would be to give up meat eating as it is not in conformity with krishna’s message.It all depends on what meat you eat and how much meat you eat. As with all foods..The reason I'm bringing this up is because I want to know if it's okay to call yourself a Hindu, or a follower of Krishna, and lead a spiritual life, but still eat meat. Hinduism is a generalizing term for many forms of Indian religious life. Vegetarianism became popular when asceticism became popular, so it's really a matter of how far you want to go back it time. There is no typical 'Hindu'. As for following Krishna, the Bhagavad Gita specifically says that a devotee can offer fruit or veggies to him. I think all forms of Vaishnavism clearly preach vegetarianism, but I'm not sure..

[Chrysaetos]

Thanks for this, I agree with you. Just because we don't see a plant's pain, doesn't mean it isn't there! :hello2:
And I have created you?http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff286/nfforums/NF%20smilies/6hq895.gif

[Caityaka]

Either way I think if a human kills an animal humanely and intends on using all of it, it's all right to eat meat. On top of that, meat has a lot of benefits that plants don't have, and even our teeth show that we're omnivorous. As the saying goes, "life eats life," so we're eating another soul's body no matter what we eat.

How about reversing your thought? Would it be ok if animals killed the human babies with an intent to eat it all and for survival only, just like humans eat chickens and calves? I know I would have big problems with giving up my son or daughter(I don't have any now, but if I did) and give it to an animal for food. Why should the animals think any different? Why is it that humans often are ready to eat whatever meat at the market, but would probably refuse to eat their pet? Isn't it out of compassion for our pet we won't eat it? And if so, maybe we need to gain more compassion towards all creatures? :smile:

Also, I think it's not just about what to eat, it's also about the treatment of the animal. Did you ever see the documentary Earthlings? This was one of the big factors that made me choose to go vegetarian five years ago. You can view it here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6361872964130308142#

As far as being a Krishna-devotee, all of them that I have met are vegetarians. I think if it's necessary to become a vegetarian to worship Krishna, this will grow on you and come natural to you when you are ready for it. Just be honest, loving and sincere with God at the state you are now and the next steps towards coming closer to God will come naturally. That's my experience, atleast.

Be in love...Hare Krishna! :hug3:
/C

[Scibat]

Having gone to several dietitians and nutritionists for my various health problems, all of them have told me that humans need a certain amount of animal protein for optimal health.

Most tell me lean fish or chicken is the best, you CAN get protein from plants but there are certain oils and vitamins that plant protein lacks. From a strictly health perspective, humans should eat a little meat.

As for souls and spiritual matters, all I can say is that humans have been eating meat since the stone age. Our bodies have adapted and evolved to bite, chew and digest meat -- I seriously doubt the metaphysical powers that be will damn us for eating what we are naturally and biologically designed to.

In fact the word "vegetarian" didn't even pop up until the 1800's and the word Vegan didn't appear until the mid 1940's.

As for Hinduism: Hindus have to be careful about food because what they eat decides physical wellbeing and mental makeup. Eating animal meat or heavy food may lead to the strengthening of animal qualities and lethargic nature in us. One belief suggests that killing innocent and helpless animals for the purpose of satiating hunger is bad karma with harmful consequences. However, not all Hindus avoid eating meat and Hindu law books do not prohibit the eating of meat in general, but only certain types of meat. :color:

[tragblack]

The reason I'm bringing this up is because I want to know if it's okay to call yourself a Hindu, or a follower of Krishna, and lead a spiritual life, but still eat meat.

You can call yourself whatever you like, and continue to do whatever you like. You will find many differing opinions on the matter, but not a single one of them is as important as how you truly feel.

I want to be a knowledgeable, spiritual person and surrender to God, but I don't think it's fair to dismiss me as sinful or ignorant just because of what I eat.

I don't think so, either. I have had many spiritual experiences and my psychic abilities are getting stronger year-by-year. I eat meat-- not regularly or daily, but I do. What I think affects my state of mind more is when I don't eat mindfully: when I gobble down food without hardly chewing, not savoring the gift of life, but rather chomping it like an animal.

However, these days meat is wasted, and so much of it accumulates that we are in one way or another, just killing these animals and throwing them in trash!

This is my only problem with the meat industry-- it is how the animals are treated and the large amount of waste and disease.

[surrendertotheflow]

And I have created you?http://i236.photobucket.com/albums/ff286/nfforums/NF%20smilies/6hq895.gif

what??
huh???
:confused:

[athribiristan]

How about reversing your thought? Would it be ok if animals killed the human babies with an intent to eat it all and for survival only, just like humans eat chickens and calves? I know I would have big problems with giving up my son or daughter(I don't have any now, but if I did) and give it to an animal for food. Why should the animals think any different? Why is it that humans often are ready to eat whatever meat at the market, but would probably refuse to eat their pet? Isn't it out of compassion for our pet we won't eat it? And if so, maybe we need to gain more compassion towards all creatures? :smile:

Also, I think it's not just about what to eat, it's also about the treatment of the animal. Did you ever see the documentary Earthlings? This was one of the big factors that made me choose to go vegetarian five years ago. You can view it here: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6361872964130308142#

As far as being a Krishna-devotee, all of them that I have met are vegetarians. I think if it's necessary to become a vegetarian to worship Krishna, this will grow on you and come natural to you when you are ready for it. Just be honest, loving and sincere with God at the state you are now and the next steps towards coming closer to God will come naturally. That's my experience, atleast.

Be in love...Hare Krishna! :hug3:
/C

Yes it would be ok....that's the game of survival. And frankly given the chance animal WILL eat humans, baby or otherwise. On the other side of that, they run up against the fact that we humans are the undisputed masters of the game of survival (for the time being anyway) and that would never happen. Do you think cattle go willingly to the slaughter? It is forced, and there is no animal capable of forcing us into that. We win, pure and simple....and a lot of people feel guilty about that, but that's the game. Kill or be killed. We put a pretty face on it and call it civilization but the game remains unchanged.

[surrendertotheflow]

Yes it would be ok....that's the game of survival. And frankly given the chance animal WILL eat humans, baby or otherwise. On the other side of that, they run up against the fact that we humans are the undisputed masters of the game of survival (for the time being anyway) and that would never happen. Do you think cattle go willingly to the slaughter? It is forced, and there is no animal capable of forcing us into that. We win, pure and simple....and a lot of people feel guilty about that, but that's the game. Kill or be killed. We put a pretty face on it and call it civilization but the game remains unchanged.


I agree. I'm sure the wildebeest is just as upset as you would be when the lion gets her baby

[Lovely]

Yes it would be ok....that's the game of survival. And frankly given the chance animal WILL eat humans, baby or otherwise. On the other side of that, they run up against the fact that we humans are the undisputed masters of the game of survival (for the time being anyway) and that would never happen. Do you think cattle go willingly to the slaughter? It is forced, and there is no animal capable of forcing us into that. We win, pure and simple....and a lot of people feel guilty about that, but that's the game. Kill or be killed. We put a pretty face on it and call it civilization but the game remains unchanged.

Most animals we eat are herbivores, they won't eat us.
And so what if we have more power than them?
Most men are stronger than women. So that justifies
a man beating a woman. The abuser wins, if he didn't beat her
she would end up beating him. That's just the game.
(You see the flawed logic in that,right?)

What you said sounds very close to the way Hitler thought.
“He who does not possess power loses the right to life,”
-Adolf Hitler

[BlueSky]

Hi, I'm really looking for advice about meat-eating, I don't have anyone else to ask.
I love meat, but I love animals too. I think that animals being killed for meat is the same as eating plants; they both have a soul, and their consciousness is "asleep." They feel pain but we don't know if plants do too, so I don't think it's fair to say we can only eat plants. Either way I think if a human kills an animal humanely and intends on using all of it, it's all right to eat meat. On top of that, meat has a lot of benefits that plants don't have, and even our teeth show that we're omnivorous. As the saying goes, "life eats life," so we're eating another soul's body no matter what we eat.
The reason I'm bringing this up is because I want to know if it's okay to call yourself a Hindu, or a follower of Krishna, and lead a spiritual life, but still eat meat. I want to be a knowledgeable, spiritual person and surrender to God, but I don't think it's fair to dismiss me as sinful or ignorant just because of what I eat. I would gladly offer my meat to Krishna if He would accept it, I don't eat it because I'm selfish but because I think I will starve otherwise. I heard people saying if you eat meat you will go to hell, and you are just full of lies, and it worries me. So I want to know if I can eat meat and still attain Moksha.

Thanks and Hare Krishna.

Be true to yourself norton and surrender to change when and if it comes along.
Blessings, James

[Chrysaetos]

I agree. I'm sure the wildebeest is just as upset as you would be when the lion gets her babyI doubt it. The wildebeest may lose its young but just a while later it is horny again.
This really varies with the species.. some mourn a lot, others a little, some not at all.
As for souls and spiritual matters, all I can say is that humans have been eating meat since the stone age. Our bodies have adapted and evolved to bite, chew and digest meat -- I seriously doubt the metaphysical powers that be will damn us for eating what we are naturally and biologically designed to.My thoughts exactly.

[Caityaka]

Do you think cattle go willingly to the slaughter? It is forced, and there is no animal capable of forcing us into that. No, I don't think they do. This was actually more what I was aiming for with my first post(but, I didn't put it very clear, rather messed up and un-clear :rolleyes: ), the un-necessary violent behaviour towards animals, just for the sake of meat.

So let's re-write the question:

Would humans feel ok about being forced to slaughter for the sake of being food for animals?
I don't think so, and I don't assume the animals would think any different, so thus I believe this will need to change in order to have a more balanced world. :smile:


I've been eating beans and lenses etc. as protein-source for the last 4 years or so since I became a vegetarian, and it works all well for me!


In love...
/C

[athribiristan]

I doubt it. The wildebeest may lose its young but just a while later it is horny again.
This really varies with the species.. some mourn a lot, others a little, some not at all.
My thoughts exactly.

The same can be said of humans. We lose children and we are horny again. We have more children. That is the urge toward survival as species and is universal to all life.

[athribiristan]

Most animals we eat are herbivores, they won't eat us.
And so what if we have more power than them?
Most men are stronger than women. So that justifies
a man beating a woman. The abuser wins, if he didn't beat her
she would end up beating him. That's just the game.
(You see the flawed logic in that,right?)

What you said sounds very close to the way Hitler thought.
“He who does not possess power loses the right to life,”
-Adolf Hitler

I'm not saying that I personally live my life by that motto, but I accept it as fundamentally true. Strip away civilization and it is nothing more than victory by brute force. Hitler may have been a monster but he was also extremely intelligent.

[Scibat]

I'm not saying that I personally live my life by that motto, but I accept it as fundamentally true. Strip away civilization and it is nothing more than victory by brute force. Hitler may have been a monster but he was also extremely intelligent.
It still is really, just that the brute force is now called money and its a lot more subtle. But sadly the strong still dominate the weak, be it physically or with money/power. Not that I agree with it, but there it is. :color:

[unus supra]

What i can say with certainty is you can attain Moksha regardless of what you eat.

[AnuChandra]

Im a vegan personally but dont judge people that eat meat.

However, while it is a valid thought that plants may suffer also, until we are able to give up eating altogether as we become pure light beings, we do need to nourish the body with something solid. One major reason I will not eat meat is the way they are grown. Animals are tortured their entire lives, they are in tiny cages, sometimes never see the Sun, eat unnatural things fed to them, and walk over their dead family members or friends because there is no where else to go. This is not food, this is the concentration camp of animals.

The cow and pig farms attract sadistic workers who enjoy torturing animals but cant do that legally anywhere else. Its illegal to torture a dog but you can do anything to a pig at a farm, no one cares if you kick a pig extra hard when it doesn't walk fast enough. A pig is as smart as a human child. Pigs even have known to have creative talents and can paint!

I don't understand the experience of being a plant and I love them dearly, however, until I learn through world science or somehow from the Universe that they truly suffer from being my food, I will keep gratefully eating my avocado and broccoli.

Also, someone mentioned tigers and lions...They cant be compared since they catch their food and eat what they need. They don't have hundreds of animals in holocaust environment waiting to be slaughtered and then half of them will be left to rotten because no one ate it and the meat got bad.

I completely respect and agree the Native American way of eating meat. Asking for the food, hunting the food they need, and then showing gratitude.
This is a humane way in eating meat and according to laws of nature.

So, its not the meat eating that's the bad thing, its the fact that they are so hurt emotionally and physically. This, makes the meat toxic also. As the animals are scared they release all kind of toxic hormones. People eat the cortisol stress hormone and become more stressed out, and adrenaline that makes people more aggressive for example. Not to mention all the cholesterol you get from eating meat.

So, while eating meat may work for some people, it is not my personal choice.

[Spiritlite]

Interesting topic

[de.spin]

I am vegan and I judge people eating meat and fish.

Especially people who define themselves spiritual or religious.

All the things said about the suffering of plants, lions and the like, are pure excuses.

I don't believe in any god, but I certainly see God in the eyes of animals.

Plants are wonderful. It is possible to eat vegetables without killing the plant (fructarianism). Just the fruit of the plant. Many vegans are going in this direction.

It's strange to pray a god or to meditate, and then to eat angels...

[moksh]

my take on this is simple, eating meat has nothing to do with moksha, for eg, ramakrishna ate fish and he attained moksha and aghori they eat human flesh and they reach moksha. from a deeper point of understanding meat is composed of pancha mahabhoot i.e sky,earth,water, fire and air like other eatable things, but meat is considered to be tamasik and while u are following astanga yoga there is yama and nimaya where u habe to praktise non biolence and commiting urself for a good cause for inner purity and i think meat eating is illogiacal at this phase as u are supporting biolence in the name of animal slaughter. well gita does say we are soul and not the body eben though by killing animals we kant kill there souls but taking someones life from the body is an act of biolence so we should stop eating meat for inner purity and not because hinduism says so

[Kamal]

Animals kill each other for survival or if they feel threatened. It less choice then it is instinct. They cannot contemplate the meaning of death and life so they are not aware of the consequences of there actions. However you are a human. You are aware of the cruelty that occurs in this world towards animals. You have the choice to stop, you have the choice to contemplate your actions. That is why animals killing animals is completely different then humans killing animals.
Hinduism and Buddhism require that you do not harm any beings. If you buy meat or dairy, you don't harm them directly but you do indirectly. For you are supporting and condoning animal cruelty when you purchase and support the companies that started this in the first place.
Yes it's unfortunate that we cannot exclude all living things in our diets however eating plants, unlike meat or dairy is necessary to live. Unless your willing to give up your life for plants and animals then it would be best to try to exclude as many living beings as you can as your diet instead of giving up because you're unable to do it 100 percent. The fact that plants feel pain isin't a justification to keep consuming animals and condoning animal abuse.


Think of it this way
Is it spiritual to dine on the flesh of the dead?

[moksh]

i think human being should only eat fruits that the trees shed, no killing no harm no risk to try lol

[avenger]

I don't think a Yogi will recognize the difference between eating an animal that had it's throat slit and was kept in close quarters and eating a free-range, grass-fed, compassionately-killed animal.

For Hindus, particularly Yogis and ascetics, the act of killing any sentient being is wrong. Making the killing process less painful doesn't take away from the fact that life is still being taken for your appetite and desire.

When practicing Dharma, it's really either meat or no meat. Not "organic, humane, free-range meat" or "blood bath, ravaged, inhumane" meat. Death is death. Your appetite and craving (which you're working to eliminate in order to achieve moksha) is driving those gears too.

[avenger]

I'll take the cynical approach, as I do to most religious topics, and say that nobody makes choices for their lifestyle based on arguments and logic. Our behavior is ultimately determined only by drives, instincts and will. So why sit around and debate? Our arguments for vegetarianism or whatever else are probably only formulated to convince OTHER people. Not ourselves. We follow our "heart" when he want reasons to do something for ourselves, we devise rhetoric and arguments for others.

Making demarcations why one should eat only this or that (vegans who only eat fruits and vegetables no stems and roots, vegetarians, lacto-ovo vegetarians, whatever), loses sight of the compassion element. Arguments won't make a man compassionate towards animals. If he ain't got compassion, he ain't got it. That's really it.

I personally just don't care. I eat meat. Not particularly concerned about animal welfare other than the welfare of my own family pets, and I'm okay with it all. Doesn't matter.

[alive8]

to me eating meat is a luxury unless you are surviving. if you want to overpower another being and consume its body, well go for it. most people just go to the market and open a pretty little package and have no idea where the meat comes from or how it was treated. at this point it is an industry exposing life as nothing but a profit margin.

[alhakika]

Hi Norton,

First lets see why meat eating was not allowed for seekers. Mainly because it is tasty and difficult for the senses to let go. The senses are control the mind and vice versa. As seekers need to learn to observe their thots and get control over their mind to understand the absolute truth, it was not advised for them. It was also that once you become insensitive to pain not only in animals by eating meat but also in men as you tend to become more self centred, and seeking is all about letting go of the self. It was due to all this that meat eating was not advised. But having said that enlightenment or understanding the divine truth can happen irrespective of eating meat. I am a meat eater and after nearly 15 years of quest today my questions have been answered. So I personally think it is only the person who can decide for himself. Any further questions dont hesitate to mail me at [email protected]

Take care,

[Krishna-prem]

From the Vaishnava point of view meat is in the mode of passion (rajasic guna). That means it's fitting for certain classes of people, mainly those who's dharma is within the rajasic realm. If one is pursuing moksha however they must move from rajasic to a sattvic mentality. The foods we eat impact the ways in which we think so those on the spiritual path should eat foods that are conducive to sattvic living.

Also many of us (vaishnavs) consider food to be incomplete unless it is has been offered to Sri Hari first. Only sattvic foods are appropriate to offer Sri Vishnu so by default this becomes the diet.

Ultimately this has to be a personal decision and I'd encourage you to consider the reasons why you are eating meat. Is it for health? Or is it because you enjoy the taste? If it's the latter then please ask yourself if your sense enjoyment is more important than another being's life?

Aum Hari Aum!

[Thinker108]

Vaishnava point of view

what is the point of view of a human

[Derpdidurp]

From the Vaishnava point of view meat is in the mode of passion (rajasic guna). That means it's fitting for certain classes of people, mainly those who's dharma is within the rajasic realm. If one is pursuing moksha however they must move from rajasic to a sattvic mentality. The foods we eat impact the ways in which we think so those on the spiritual path should eat foods that are conducive to sattvic living.

Also many of us (vaishnavs) consider food to be incomplete unless it is has been offered to Sri Hari first. Only sattvic foods are appropriate to offer Sri Vishnu so by default this becomes the diet.

Ultimately this has to be a personal decision and I'd encourage you to consider the reasons why you are eating meat. Is it for health? Or is it because you enjoy the taste? If it's the latter then please ask yourself if your sense enjoyment is more important than another being's life?

Aum Hari Aum!


What if you lose your self by eating the meat?

Killing this being is not the end. We are all stuck in this cycle of sansara.

Why is it okay for Arjuna to lose himself in the killing of his kinsmen, but not okay to slaughter an animal?

[Krishna-prem]

What if you lose your self by eating the meat?

Killing this being is not the end. We are all stuck in this cycle of sansara.

Why is it okay for Arjuna to lose himself in the killing of his kinsmen, but not okay to slaughter an animal?

It was ok for Arjuna because firstly it was his prescribed dharma. He was kshaitriya and that was his duty. Further more the battle at Kurukshetra was between good and evil, meaning that if the Kauravas won, the balance between dharma and adharma would have been destroyed.

Secondly both the Pandavas and Kauravas willingly went into battle. The Pandavas did not put the Kauravas into factory farms and then slaughter them as they stood helpless.

Thirdly there was no material motivation for this war. The Pandavas were no longer fighting for the parts of the kingdom stolen from them. They had let that go after 13 years of exile. Meat eaters though have the material motivation of sense enjoyment driving them to eating meat. There is no surrender to God (as is taught in the Gita) when one is surrendering to a sense activity that leads to the death and other creatures.

And you're right killing this or that being is not their end, however, that does not mean that you do not still incur the karma for such activities.

Aum Hari Aum!

[Derpdidurp]

And you're right killing this or that being is not their end, however, that does not mean that you do not still incur the karma for such activities.


I don't understand what you mean by "incur the karma"? Are you refering to the law code?

[Krishna-prem]

I don't understand what you mean by "incur the karma"? Are you refering to the law code?

Not a law code, karma, action and result. If a being willingly and consciously contributes to the suffering of another being then that being will in turn have the causes and conditions to suffer in the future.

Aum Hari Aum!

[Skins_Princess]

I'm not Hindu but from what I understand, most Hindus aren't strictly vegetarian or vegan, they simply don't believe in eating beef (cattle meat) because they view the cow as sacred and a provider, so they might eat chicken, lamb, etc and even the dairy that comes from a cow just not the beef. But in general, it's a good idea to eat more fruits and vegetables than overdoing it with meats and dairy. Balance is the key.

[Beaucheminhibe]

being vegetarian is good for health and mind too because what you eat its effect your mental thinking as well as got violence wives ......

[missou]

not all hindu people are vegetarian... not all indian people. it's mainly their caste that prescribe them to or not to. the higher castes (which are supposed to be more pure) are forbidden to eat-meat because their body is more pure, and meat is an intoxicant (kind of) so it will totally pollute their body.
this is what I learnt in india, that the "purer" you become, the less inclined to eat meat, drink alcohol or seek worldly pleasures you are.
but it is not the kind of change to happen overnight. it's a work one has to do on him/herself.

people eat meat because it tastes damn good, and well most people do so why feel bad?
It's because we don't fully measure the consequences of the act of eating meat. Maybe we are aware that life was destroyed for our enjoyment but that's it. We don't go further because then it doesn't feel nice to think about the pain these animals go through, but especially, the fact that we unknowingly decided that such or such life should be terminated.
If we were the one to be killed to be eaten, all our back hair would stand in terror and protest, cause we wouldn't like that to happen to us. So why impose it on other living beings?

it's a little bit about seeing things through a veil. If everybody just imagined the pain the animals feel, or even saw the animal before it was killed and cooked, not many people would still eat meat.

Sometimes i wonder, who are we to destroy life? those animals and vegetables are also on their path to God no? But then life on earth is a cycle. Everything is recycled. Food is meant to be eaten until we grow spiritually and learn to feed ourselves on pure energy. I think we still have time :D

Until then, enjoy your steak fries, but be grateful to nature, the plants and animals who gave their life and suffered so that you could eat, sustain your body and carry on your path to God. :)

So at the end of the day, it's all about how you feel about it. If you feel like eating meat, first ask yourself if it's gluttony, or a real need of your body. Then you act accordingly.
But I have to say that the more you ask yourself that question, the more you will tend to feel like you don't really need meat. And gradually you will eat less and less of it.

One good thing about it? When i go to the grocery store, my bill is now only 40% of what i used to pay when i was a big meat-eater :D

now about vegetables, well yes they have a life too. But the meaning to their life, their purpose in this vegetable body/incarnation is to be eaten. If it's not by animals, it will be humans, or bugs or worms or whatever.
A vegetable is alive, yes, but it's purpose is to be eaten, otherwise why would God put it down here. It's a kind of "inferior" entity, in the sense that the only thing a vegetable can do is grow, ripe and die. Maybe during its life it can ponder upon what's up after death and why am I a vegetable, but it cannot change its life, its behavior according to the lessons it learned in its life. I think vegetables they have a soul (somehow), but their soul somehow knows what their purpose on earth is, ie to be eaten.

it's not the same with animals and humans. We have higher purposes i think.
That's why to me vegetables are a "lower" form of incarnation, form of life, thus ok to be eaten, and animals are "higher", though i don't like to put hierarchy at all, i just don't know how to put it in words.
When i say lower, its not hierarchical, it is just to say that the level of spiritual interaction they can have in this vegetable life is very low, compared to us, who can go on and on about spirituality, and adjust our behavior according to the spiritual lessons we learn from life.

I hope i make sense :D