Thoughts & Emotions

[Uday_Advaita]

Thoughts & Emotions

Thoughts, Thoughts and Thoughts……..

Where do they come from? How do they fall in to your mind. How are they generated?

If you contemplate on these questions, you will invariably conclude that some trigger from your surroundings coupled with associated memories, lead to spontaneous generation of thoughts. At times these are completely random too.

This psychosomatic organism which we call our Mind Body Apparatus (MBA), is made up of Pancha Mahabhutas (Five elements) – In modern science we understand these as SpaceTime and MassEnergy or as described in the scriptures as Purush & Prakriti. This MBA is a complex uniquely designed instrument. Operated by the non-dual Source.

Why uniquely designed? Because each person has a unique DNA / genes that defines its body structure and intellect. Even in identical twins the fingerprints are different. Each MBA is therefore endowed with a unique mix of tri-gunas (Sat, Rajas and Tamas) and six-enemies (shat-ripus – Kama, Krodh, Madh, Matsar, Moha and Lobha). To this basic design add all the life experiences of that person like demographics, education, religious upbringing, political and social surroundings. What do you get then is unique persona that is completely identified with everything that he or she is NOT.

Thoughts are peculiar to a persona and they happen without any volition.

What are EMOTIONS? How do thoughts get converted to emotions?

To understand this, it is necessary to know – how the MBA works

MBA, as mentioned above, is a uniquely programmed instrument where the ROM (Read Only Memory) is the genes and auxiliary memory is the conditioning received by the MBA during its entire span of appearance.

Body is essentially accumulated food made up of the 5 elements – Fire, water, earth, air and Aakash (SpaceTime).

What is mind?

It can only be accumulated memory (neurons & synapses) – and electronic circuitery, that acts as a CPU to process information

Mind is best understood as divided in three parts:

1. Chitta - (Brain or working mind) – Working mind, Interacts with Senses, compares inputs with memory, takes reflexive action or actions supposedly directed by the Buddhi after due thinking.
2. Manas - (Inner sub-conscious mind) – This is the center, where thoughts are falling into from all universe – generated by the Source. This is also the center for the six enemies (Shat ripus), and is in interaction with Buddhi or Chitta at any point of time, but not with both
3. Buddhi – (Intellect,) The thinking mind, apparently the false self which assumes the control of all actions and owns every decision made by the MBA. This one gets inputs from Chitta or Manas at a time and discerns and decides the course of action to be taken with complete free will and directs the Chitta (working mind) to carry out the action.

Buddhi is also known as Ahamkar or the Ego. This is the seat of a separate persona. The entityfied Self. The Ego apparently does not allow Chitta and Manas to interact with each other directly.

Present research shows that the working mind decides to act even before the directions from intellect are received.

All thoughts that fall into Manas are classified as being the handy work of the shat ripus. If the thoughts are NOT carried in horizontal time, then they drop off. However, in a normal person the intellect (thinking mind) or Buddhi jumps in to picture and carries these thoughts in horizontal time. The thinking happens. Thus the MBA starts reacting to these thoughts. This reaction of the MBA to the thoughts is what we call as EMOTIONS.

Taking thoughts attributed to one enemy (Ripu) at a time:

1. Kama (Lust): These thoughts can arise momentarily in any person regardless of gender. However, when these thoughts are carried on and on by the Buddhi, they would lead to perverse action. So, continuation of lust in horizontal time leads to perversion. Sex crimes, rape and fights are very common outcome.
2. Krodh (Anger): The momentary anger can arise in any person. Continuation of anger in horizontal time leads to Hate. The emotion of hatred is become very common now days in a politically charged society. Hurt and guilt are very common emotions resulting out of anger.
3. Madh (Pride): Pride should arise for good work done. For achievements and success in any endeavor. Continuation of pride in horizontal time will lead to Arrogance. This leads to “know all” attitude and halt in learning.
4. Matsar (Jealousy): Jealousy is a very common thought. Carrying of Jealous thoughts in longer time and constant thinking leads to Crookedness. You will have experienced crooked behavior from people around you and even near and dear ones. That is purely out of jealousy.
5. Moha (Attachment): This is one of the most important ripus (enemies) and the continuing thought of losing the object of attachment always leads to FEAR. This is a constant emotion every person carries in his daily life. It is said that every action of man originates out of fear. The most frequent fear encountered every moment is the fear of future or the fear of unknown. People go to any extent to know their future. No one likes uncertainty. To overcome this, many people get into drugs, alcohol and all forms of escapism. This one single emotion of fear is the cause of wide spread misery in the phenomenal world.
6. Lobha (Greed): The emotion of greediness leads to wicked actions to grab something out of misplaced sense of entitlement. Stealing, robbing, frauds are outcome of these thoughts carried in horizontal time.

Thus, it is clearly blamed on Buddhi or the Ego, which indulges in incessant thinking, and makes the person face consequences and misery in daily life. Whereas an MBA (wherein Ego or the sense of doership has completely subsided), acting totally based on its working mind will obviously be called as an enlightened sage.

That’s why Lord Buddha said “Enlightenment is the. ……. END OF MISERY”
Namaskar!

P.S. - This is a rather long post. The writing happened after a gap of some time. The above is my understanding. You may as well call it as - my concept
I would welcome friends to disagree with me. While doing so, please be generous to share your understanding.
After all we are all here on this forum for learning from each other.
Namaskar!

[JohnHermes]

Yes these are great but it applies to the earthly parts of our being. Those parts applying to the higher astral bodies as well. Thoughts and emotions stem from the astral realm, you can have mind without a body. The brain is just a conduit for physical experience in Malkuth aka physical realm.

[Shivani Devi]

Namaste.

Tonight I am going to be lazy and just post the whole Shvetashvatara Upanishad.. The answer to all of your questions are in there and it should only take about 15-20 minutes to read it:

http://sivanandaonline.org/public_html/?cmd=displaysection&section_id=590

I could not have said it any better myself!

I could totally live on the Shvetashvatara Upanishad, the Ribu Gita and the Vigyan Bhairav Tantra and not want to read another single thing in my life.

Tat Tvam Asi.

[neil]

Yes these are great but it applies to the earthly parts of our being. Those parts applying to the higher astral bodies as well. Thoughts and emotions stem from the astral realm, you can have mind without a body. The brain is just a conduit for physical experience in Malkuth aka physical realm.

DITTO...

The body is a non sentient, non conscious, non aware sensory unit & the brain is a non sentient, non conscious, non aware processing unit.
We the Soulself however, is the sentient, conscious, & aware entity that is connected to the flesh via the energetic silver cord interface, & enmeshed within the flesh.

All information from the surroundings of the flesh is sent to the brain & the brain processes it & effectively transforms the information into a content that we the Soulself can utilize when it is sent to us via the energetic silver cord.

We have a response & our response is sent back via the cord & the brain transforms our response into a content that the flesh can operate accordingly with, to fulfill our desires.

& on it goes at insane speeds moment by moment.

[Uday_Advaita]

Namaste.

Tonight I am going to be lazy and just post the whole Shvetashvatara Upanishad.. The answer to all of your questions are in there and it should only take about 15-20 minutes to read it:

http://sivanandaonline.org/public_html/?cmd=displaysection&section_id=590

I could not have said it any better myself!

I could totally live on the Shvetashvatara Upanishad, the Ribu Gita and the Vigyan Bhairav Tantra and not want to read another single thing in my life.

Tat Tvam Asi.

Namaskar
Thanks for introducing me to Shvetashvatara Upanishad. I have gone through it. It will need serious effort on my part to understand it in a manner where I can apply the knowledge to seek answers.
Long back I was quite dazzled by Avadhoot Gita. I am sure you have read it. I am putting a link for the benefit of all friends.
https://www.inner-quest.org/Avadhuta.htm

Regards

[lomax]

Great thread.Thanks for all these infos

[Aethera]

Very interesting post, thank you for sharing~

[lomax]

If i can add something to all this,is the the ''thinker'' behind the thoughts.
The real you and me.

""Who am i ?'' is a thought,and you are the one who thinks of the question.

[Uday_Advaita]

If i can add something to all this,is the the ''thinker'' behind the thoughts.
The real you and me.

""Who am i ?'' is a thought,and you are the one who thinks of the question.

Hello

Well! A very interesting thought.
The teachings of non-duality does not allow to qualify anything / anyone. Even to the question “Who am I”, the answers is - Not this, Not that – neti, neti…..
You are NOT the … Thinker, Doer, Questioner, Answerer, Seeker,…….and what not.
The principal statement of non-duality is “Consciousness is all there is”. If there is nothing other than Consciousness then …. Thinking, Doing, Questioning, Speaking….. are all “Happenings” in the totality of the functioning of the Source (Consciousness)

Hence after denying all that you are not, what remains??.... is something THAT no one can deny…

The impersonal awareness of being present in the moment…
Namaskar

[lomax]

Hello

Well! A very interesting thought.
The teachings of non-duality does not allow to qualify anything / anyone. Even to the question “Who am I”, the answers is - Not this, Not that – neti, neti…..
You are NOT the … Thinker, Doer, Questioner, Answerer, Seeker,…….and what not.
The principal statement of non-duality is “Consciousness is all there is”. If there is nothing other than Consciousness then …. Thinking, Doing, Questioning, Speaking….. are all “Happenings” in the totality of the functioning of the Source (Consciousness)

Hence after denying all that you are not, what remains??.... is something THAT no one can deny…

The impersonal awareness of being present in the moment…
Namaskar
My bad english betrayed me once again:smile:
I think i wanted to say that from the words thinker,doer,questioner,etc,
you are the ''er'' (last syllable).

I agree with the rest of your post.

[Uday_Advaita]

My bad english betrayed me once again:smile:
I think i wanted to say that from the words thinker,doer,questioner,etc,
you are the ''er'' (last syllable).

I agree with the rest of your post.

you are the ''er'' (last syllable).

Well said
Namaskar

[Unseeking Seeker]

***

Thanks for the links Shivani & Uday :smile:

***

[zorkchop]

To All . . .

I heartily agree that it is wise to consider and be familiar with the facets or parts of the mind and the various “passions” the mind loves to indulge in.

neil is the closest to a basic grasp of it all. He is to be commended . . . altho there will always be refinements.

What one can quickly understand . . . that the mind can conjure up an answer to most anything . . . whether it makes any sense or not . . . and demand that all accept that as an “answer.” Take the statements by Uday Advaita . . . the teachings he proposes do not allow for an answer . . . ( the mind cannot come up with one so just dismiss any questioning ) ( which is true . . . the mind cannot go beyond itself to understand itself ) ( one cannot use mind to understand mind ) . . . and so . . . one can perpetually walk around in a semi-zombie mode and enjoy the present . . . and one has to pretty much rule the emotions with an iron grip to live and continue in this state.

I would like to ask . . .

1) . . . do you believe that ANY-one on this planet has the answer to all of this . . . such as where do thoughts come from . . . how do they tie into emotions . . . etc. Do the priestcraft, religionists, scientists, spiritualists, etc. . . . do you believe that any of them have the answer?

2) . . . if a person did have an answer . . . how would you determine on whether to listen to that person . . . given the principle that the answer would NOT go along with current thought and belief . . . and therefore would be highly suspect at best.

[iamthat]

I would like to ask . . .

1) . . . do you believe that ANY-one on this planet has the answer to all of this . . . such as where do thoughts come from . . . how do they tie into emotions . . . etc. Do the priestcraft, religionists, scientists, spiritualists, etc. . . . do you believe that any of them have the answer?

2) . . . if a person did have an answer . . . how would you determine on whether to listen to that person . . . given the principle that the answer would NOT go along with current thought and belief . . . and therefore would be highly suspect at best.

I do believe that there are Yogis on this planet who have the answers to all these questions and more, based on their own practical experience.

And there are teachings which also provide answers, even if for most of us these teachings are just working hypotheses in the absence of direct knowledge.

And I have no problem with such answers not fitting in with current thought and belief. For me, most current thoughts and beliefs are suspect, so the fact that such answers do not fit current thoughts and beliefs does not mean that these answers are invalid.

Peace.

[zorkchop]

I would wager . . . that if there were humans at any level that had actual working “answers” or understandings of how the mind works, what the emotions are and how they interact with mental thought, etc. . . . by now the info would have leaked out to the public LONG ago and that info would have turned the science’s of psychology and psychiatry on their heads. Since that has not happened . . . I would presume that this info has NOT reached an applicable and workable approach to the understanding of such.

One thing I swill say . . . you are to be commended on keeping an open mind on such things. Most people wouldn’t even consider considering beyond what current science tells them. Since people are left dangling on these answers . . . modern science doesn’t tell them much that is beneficial.

But then again . . . most people really do not WANT to know. They are content with juggling new information /data . . . and call that learning. It tends to keep people amused and content.

[janielee]

I do believe that there are Yogis on this planet who have the answers to all these questions and more, based on their own practical experience.


For sure.

JL

[Miss Hepburn]

Funny...where thoughts come from was never something I thought about.
I have no idea....BUT, what I do know is there are thoughts that are harmful, negative and useless, to me...
and over 10 yrs ago was taught I could control them, not be subject to their nonsense becoming depressed way too long over a breakup...

What a difference to see the power I have to simply change the channel, so to speak...
and have 'better feeling thoughts' as Abraham suggests.
Changes my world, my perspective, my letting go of worldly events...I always use the sudden dent in your car
you walk out and find, for example, lol....The lost check in the mail...those things.

Then we can focus our mind and emotions on what we want to...
not be lead around by a moody leaf blowing in the wind, so to speak.
Yay, much better. :wink:

The rudder of our thoughts is firmly in our own hands.


My input.

[FallingLeaves]

I would wager . . . that if there were humans at any level that had actual working “answers” or understandings of how the mind works, what the emotions are and how they interact with mental thought, etc. . . . by now the info would have leaked out to the public LONG ago and that info would have turned the science’s of psychology and psychiatry on their heads. Since that has not happened . . . I would presume that this info has NOT reached an applicable and workable approach to the understanding of such.


it couldn't work that way. At even the gross level, Tesla for example didn't get much mileage even though he had a lot to say. This is because the world actively stood against him.

For example when he said let's transmit power through the air, it would be very efficient, the answer was we couldn't possibly transmit power through the air because there was no way to monetize that. So now we have power lines instead with electricity 'vibrating' at a rate dangerous to humans, and also waste a lot of energy because of it.

there was also something about fusion or fission or something years ago... it was touted as free energy? It was proved to be bunk at the time but I would wager that even if it wasn't bunk it would have to have been proved to be bunk anyway.. Because such a concept would have endangered the bottom lines of energy companies if was allowed to become a reality.

So who knows, maybe it wasn't bunk after all?

And that is in terms of concepts people might be even remotely willing to accept. It only gets worse from there...

---------------------------------------------------
the thing is, from what I understand the path to what you said in what I quoted is inherently unlikeable according to social norms.

So few will walk far enough along it to get 'fruits' others might be able to see well enough to form the 'proof' others are always asking for, and if they do
get to that point part of what they learn is a way not to share with the world at large.

Jesus was the exception to that rule, he was relatively open even from the small amount of historical data we now have about him. But most nonetheless find the precedent he set unpalatable so his whole message is suspect in terms of not being something people are willing to act on.

For example how many are the people who even do something as simple as turning the other cheek? It isn't a 'desirable' thing to do in the social sense and as a result many will instead put up a fight at even the slightest provocation. But this is one of the easiest things to do, apparently... yet people won't do more than give it lip service, if even that.

----------------------------------------------------------
This is also the reason 'truth' in general is so hard to find - because the deepest truths are inherently unlikeable to our sense of sociability.

If you are on the path to seeking 'truth' you find yourself having to balance between your desire to relate to others in terms of what they will accept (because part of the truth is we need to be sociable), and your desire to learn what is really going on here.

[zorkchop]

Falling Leaves . . .

AB-SO-LOOTLY ! !

People play on the Path forever . . . some finally claiming to be far along . . . Eastern Monks and Western Religionists claim they are far along the Path . . . making money here and gathering followers there. Even the so-called mystic teachings and esoteric findings . . . all just a bit farther along in it all.

Everything bottlenecks at the “top” of the mental worlds . . . for lack of better words. To even head beyond that . . . let alone to actually get there even a baby step . . . leaves the so-called social or acceptable teachings behind. When I make the statement “Mind is not Soul and Soul is not mind . . . “ most people still believe and demand that Soul is just some kind of higher mental being . . . whether they have put in the lifetimes of “stopping the mind” and believing that this takes them somewhere special or not. Don’t get me wrong . . . it’s a necessary preliminary step . . . but it just doesn’t “take” you where they believe it does . . . but to suggest that to someone that is currently dealing with that entire scenario is to encourage warfare on their part. It’s not worth it. LIFE will be their greater teacher.

It is not necessarily that they do not want to share . . . it’s that they do not want to listen . . . and if they do . . . they just are curiously wondering what it is you have to say and are rarely deeply passionate and “driven” to find out Greater Truth . . . which is part of what gets an individual “there” in the first place. You’ll have the entire teachings of the Eastern people claiming “Boo on desire” . . . and so they stay where they are . . . which again . . . is pretty much normal.

Your statement that “Truth is inherently unlikeable” is brilliant . . . and absolutely right-on-the-money. So is your viewpoint on relating to others. The farther one goes on the Path . . . the less that individual will find walking alongside them.

Yet given eternity times 1000 to work with . . . everyone will eventually get there . . . one at a time . . . but the newbies and those in the “middle steps” make up the throngs . . . and they would just as soon throw a noose over a tree and hoist you up than to listen to you. Many . . . MANY more so-called saviors were killed for their efforts than Jesus.

And yet . . . walking these “ending steps” demands a level of learning some “lessons” that can be learned in no other way. Such is the way of the Path. I don’t make the rules.

[FallingLeaves]

it crosses my mind the point may not be to walk the Path(tm)... something else entirely may be at stake here... but since we are so sure we want a large part of our diet to be ideas about the 'true nature of reality' I guess the powers that be wanna make it count :smile:

[zorkchop]

Falling Leaves . . .

Once again you hit one out of the park.

I heartily agree . . . the term ‘Path’ is just a generic term for the uncovering and understanding of LIFE as the Whole that IT is to the actual Center of Existence . . . on an individual basis . . . the understanding of what Soul is . . . why the entire scenario is set up the way it is . . . and taking on the responsibility of living from that awareness. I’d rather type the word ‘Path’ than go through that entire explanation . . . using whatever words one wishes to use to carry the concept even mentally.

Inherent . . . inborn . . . a facet of Soul Itself . . . is the very, very, VERY subtle curious / passionate / compelling desire to “go back home” to the true Home of Soul Itself and to discover Soul’s inherent nature. This is often called the “Divine Discontent” . . . although other studies may have another word for it. As state above . . . it is VERY subtle and is *easily* obscured by the mental preferences that run the show for Soul for eons. This is part of the design.

But slowly . . . slowly . . . as Soul gives up Its mental entrapments and viewpoints . . . taking eons to do so . . . this Divine Discontent gains ground . . . until if unfolds into a demanding desire to “finally figure it out” . . . or . . . “the true nature of reality” . . . at the ultimate level . . . again continuing to use words that carry the concept but the discoveries go far beyond these simple words.

As a final example of this . . . let’s just say . . . that we have a proverbial 36-inch yardstick as the measurement of “Discovery of Reality.” Each individual spends eons not even taking that yardstick up . . . indulging in all kinds of sans-principled, immoral, unethical. criminal, power-driven ways of living life here in these psychic worlds. Finally . . . after eons of getting clobbered by karmic implications . . . Soul decides to figure out “a better way to live.” So the yardstick is take up . . . moving one through all the religions, philosophies, mystic studies and mystery schools, etc. On and on and on. It’s not until inch 34 or 35 that the Divine Discontent really kicks in as the dominant compelling draw to Truth. Until then . . . mind is just too powerful. And but the time we get to inch 36 . . . we are left to only discover that is a very hidden yet quite apparent at that stage of another yardstick beyond . . . that will teach us . . . Truth.

Until then . . . it’s all theory . . . and mental at that.

I appreciate your comments and perceptions. You are to be commended for your previous “work” . . . even if you might not have considered it so.

On we go.

[zorkchop]

I am quite surprised that this thread has seemingly died out. People will discuss beliefs and ego and dreams and such . . . but they seem to have little interest in the process of thought and how it is the emotions that do more to govern our thoughts than the other way around.

Most people think . . . emotionally. It is our emotional passion . . . our like or dislike . . . that tends to govern our entire thought process. It is NOT just some random string of words floating through our consciousness.

If people really wish to take charge of their lives . . . it is the discipline of the emotions and the thought process that brings success . . . and by “emotional discipline” . . . I do not mean to suggest to become an unfeeling zombie.

But . . . the lack of development of this thread has shown a lot . . . to a lot of people.

[FallingLeaves]

I saw a quote on these boards recently.... someone had said that people don't think so much as let their heart decide something and then let their mind try to find the reasons to support it and fight the ones that go against it. I thought that a good point because it is exactly what I see people doing day in and day out... although if you ask anyone they will 'feel' they are being reasonable.

OTOH I've lived it the other way and that is no picnic let me tell you. You can't do it without throwing vanity out the window, and without vanity you lose your ability to always feel 'good' about whatever it is you choose to do. People generally don't like to live like that until forced into it.

anyway it came to my attention long ago that if one wants to do something 'magical' one can't get there by just responding however one wishes to the impetuous of emotions... you have to turn it around and make the emotions (for lack of a better phrasing) respond to you. But even that observation leaves one with so many questions... and if you go down that road then talk about what you are doing too much you only get people telling you 'no' in any way they can think of to say it.

But besides, between the paradoxes and all the missing information, words don't do most things spiritual justice anyway.

as far as discipline, I suppose you need some. I also think you need to rest sometimes though.

[Unseeking Seeker]

***

Very insightful post by Falling Leaves

I’d venture to add that feeling good, if dependent upon external assessment is an induced feeling by conscious thought, hence cannot last. Likewise, the conscience speaks or let us say our heart signals but the ego intervenes. We are at a crossroad. Upward pull vs downward pull. Anchored to the lower, we may yet get free, not by suppression, not by sublimation but by realisation that the external is ephemeral and the internal eternal.

Only our voluntary action enables us to connect. Free will.

***

[zorkchop]

Yes . . . to both Falling Leaves and Unseeking Seeker . . . YES.

One begins to discover that “if my emotions are this way then my thoughts tend to go in *thss* direction” . . . and . . . “if I am feeling *that* way then my thoughts tend to go here.”

Now . . . this observation happens in less than a blink of an eye . . . yet one can begin to “see” it . . . to recognize it. And . . . beyond this . . . the emotions themselves are incapable of making such an observation. Emotions cannot recognize themselves within themselves because it has not sense of discernment. They just feel.

The same with the mind. The mind cannot really discernment itself because it has to built-in “brain” to recognize what it itself is doing.

So . . . one is left to discover . . . that there is a greater, pervading Self that is observing this.

And thus lies one of the great discoveries of the Path.

To get true “overviews” . . . there is only one way to do this . . . and that is to get “outside” what one wishes to observe . . . even if only for the fleeting moment. Then . . . as Seeker suggests . . . the eternal is ephemeral and the internal is eternal . . . because Soul does initially tend to reside within the physical body and this gives a sense of “internal / external.” And then Soul begins to realize that It ( Soul ) is actually external to the whole emotional design . . . and then does the same to the mental ploys. Soul begins to realize that It ( Soul ) is “external” to all these facets and that the physical body, the emotions, and the mind . . . are not really IT.

This is the only way one can ever gain any discipline over any of these facets.

Hence . . . free will.

[Taking a Break]

Hi zorkchop, how is intuition related with thoughts and emotions?

[zorkchop]

Taking a Break . . .

The entire intuitive perception can be very tricky to discern. For many . . . beliefs and habits and patterns can become SO habitual that we perform them or engage in them without any predetermined thought . . . and some people believe this to be “intuitive.” It’s not.

But it can certainly be beneficial if the habits and patterns are for the benefit of Self and those round you.

True intuition begins at the high end of the mental realms . . . and it is a kind of softly and instantly understanding something without resorting to a long string of words or thoughts. It is more of a “process” or ability to know without thinking. It’s not a long, drawn-out process. You just suddenly know.

Both the mind and emotions can kind of set up scenarios where it seems as though this is happening. A truly intuitive individual will begin to discern what is true intuition and what is probably not. Many times . . . initially . . . the best way to discern is to plug in the information and then test it out. If it holds true . . . makes sense . . . enlarges the viewpoint . . . gives a more broad understanding of your life and of LIFE IT-self . . . you might lean a bit towards accepting the intuitive information.

But make no mistake about it . . . the entire “intuitive” process is one to be developed too. There is discernment to be learned there . . . but by the time the individual begins to truly encounter this level of realization . . . they are usually ready for the struggle / learning.

Many people get truly sidetracked in what they believe to be intuition but it later turns out to be false. A good example of this is when people begin to get interested in past lives . . . and the person is just beginning to get caught up in that . . . and then suddenly the individual has the “intuitive” hit that they were someone famous . . . Joan of Ark or a King of England or what have you. This is something that the mind and emotions can totally and very easily lead the individual into believing. Entire lifetimes can be caught up in this.

Discernment comes with effort. Keep things simple . . . try not to head off on a tangent. True intuition is a soft knowing more along the lines of “what to do” or “how to go about something” and much less about “who I am.” That’s a very loose discrepancy . . . but . . . somewhat accurate.

When one begins to talk about true intuition . . . one is getting pretty lofty in it all . . . NOT out of a sense of superiority . . . but in the sense of where one is.

[iamthat]

how is intuition related with thoughts and emotions?

The Alice Bailey teachings describe different bodies and different planes.

Intuition relates to the Buddhic vehicle on the Buddhic plane. The element associated with the Buddhic plane is air. This is the lowest plane of formlessness and the lowest plane of unity. Intuition is direct knowing without the intervention of mind.

Thoughts relate to the mental body on the mental plane. The element associated with the mental plane is fire. The mental plane can be divided into the higher abstract mind and the lower concrete mind. We need to develop the higher abstract mind so that consciousness can make the transition to the plane of intuition.

Emotions relate to the emotional body on the astral plane. The element associated with the astral plane is water. The astral plane is a lower reflection of the Buddhic plane and thus there is a natural correspondence. So intuition is often interpreted on an emotional level as a feeling.

If water is to provide a clear reflection then it needs to be still. In the same way, the emotional body needs to be still and serene to provide a clear reflection of intuition. If there is any emotional disturbance then that will distort any reflection of intuition.

Peace.

[janielee]

Thanks....

[zorkchop]

iamthat portrays some valuable information.

Most people have trouble realizing that the thoughts and emotions are distinct from the physical body . . . since they “think and feel” through the physical body. Eventually . . . understanding of this begins to refine . . . and there comes the awareness that these are truly different facets . . . different aspects . . . different parts . . . or different bodies of Self . . . however one wishes to word all of that.

The Buddha level is accepted as a broad “mental” area. The sub-facets . . . such as intuition, discrimination, intellect, etc. . . . the individual can sort these out for themselves according to how compelling they are in the overall Self as we indulge in Life down here. The stronger the compulsion . . . the more close that facet is to the physical realm. Thus . . . the emotions are “stronger” than mental thought . . . and thus lie closer to the physical realms which . . . indeed . . . the emotions are the reflection of the Astral Plane and are “located” just above the physical.

All of this rather esoteric facets are “invisible” . . . as you cannot SEE the emotions and you cannot SEE thought . . . but you ca certainly “see” the effects of both on and within the physical realm. So . . . if one wishes to actually encounter the “invisible worlds” . . . one needs to settle the physical body down . . . and go inside. Just this one step can take a LONG time . . . like . . . lifetimes. Those who are successful at this should know that they have been at this for quite a while. The chattering mind and the overwhelming emotions do not give up so easily.

Just to get to this “step” . . . is a massive undertaking . . . yet eventually necessary. I admire anyone who is approaching and struggling with this. It is a “battle” you WILL win. Keep at it.

[FallingLeaves]

first there is nothing there
then there is something, and you get lost in the glamour
then people berate you for getting lost in the glamour and basically tell you you are full of it
then you decide to believe what they say, it couldn't happen and you were full of it
----------------------------------------------------
much later you understand that buying the idea you were full of it is just as dangerous as getting lost in the glamour... you are lost either way.

So you begin to entertain it the way you would yesterday's breakfast... it happened, and you know what you ate, but what is the big deal either way?

while knowing all the while... if you could only get back to the place where there was nothing there everything would be perfect.

[MikeS80]

Thoughts & Emotions

Thoughts, Thoughts and Thoughts……..

Where do they come from? How do they fall in to your mind. How are they generated?

If you contemplate on these questions, you will invariably conclude that some trigger from your surroundings coupled with associated memories, lead to spontaneous generation of thoughts. At times these are completely random too.


:icon_cheers:

[ThomasBosler]

What's the purpose of life if there are no thoughts and emotions?

[Miss Hepburn]

What's the purpose of life if there are no thoughts and emotions?I didn't go back to read every post again ...but, I would say we are not saying to
have no thoughts or emotions, except in our meditations...but, ok I'll speak for myself ---
but who wants unkind thoughts or bummer emotions?
We can be more in control of what we think and what we feel.
Also, i think it was mentioned - we are not our thoughts or emotions; like I am
not my hand nor my skin - but I don't need to get rid of them...just take care of them.
Silly example maybe, but it popped into my head. :smile:

[lomax]

What's the purpose of life if there are no thoughts and emotions?
deleted................

[HITESH SHAH]

I would like to ask . . .

1) . . . do you believe that ANY-one on this planet has the answer to all of this . . . such as where do thoughts come from . . . how do they tie into emotions . . . etc. Do the priestcraft, religionists, scientists, spiritualists, etc. . . . do you believe that any of them have the answer?

2) . . . if a person did have an answer . . . how would you determine on whether to listen to that person . . . given the principle that the answer would NOT go along with current thought and belief . . . and therefore would be highly suspect at best.

1. Definitely there are answers. But in blatant pursuit of materialism , it's either forgotten or disliked or ignored or blatantly violated either intentionally or unintentionally.
2. Your observation is right .It requires tremendous conviction, study of history , self belief and self practice before others can really believe it. And that being a very time & resource consuming process (even across life time of many) nobody may ever dream of it.

[MikeS80]

What's the purpose of life if there are no thoughts and emotions?Thoughts and emotions are not the issue. Only thoughts and emotions that are based on negativity, the past, and future are the issue.

Edit: The inner true self feeling of I AM is the same as the outer self-aka the ego that thinks "I am" with a thought. The outer self (ego) gets in the inner self's way by the outer self seperating itself from the inner true self and is not conscious of the true inner self feeling of I AM. Practice feeling you true inner self feeling of I AM.