God's science lesson.

[Sammy]

For as long as time can record, we have searched into the explaination of events. When we see a rainbow casting its amazing colors through the sky, its realy the light refracting off of water particles. Does that mean the rainbow never happened? Scientists seem to think this is so. Science has only explained the process in wich it happens, the event is what we experience and both are as real as the other.

Scientists are amazed at how the smaller we can see things the more there is we didnt know about. Doesnt it stand to reason the closer we look, the more will exist to be perceived?

Today God sent me a rainbow to watch.

how did he do that?

He reflected light off of water particles.

[William Schuck]

If you know more or if you know less, it is the observer that is aware of the degree. By knowing the wealth of the universe or the absence there of does not bring to you one more moment of life. Most of our education is nothing more than a process of feeding our egos. There is only one time, Now! The degree of you knowledge is no merit to the universe. Rich or poor the river will provide drink for your thirst. The universe is not a respecter of prestige or privilege. The only honor your life receives in in your own court. Just because you think don't conclude that you are valued. Stop packaging reality to your belief, you are putting it into a shoe box. What we see is not what we see but what we reason. Can you reduce your reason to a value that can be substantiated? No! All that we reason is a subjective mental state that is unique to the individual and only appreciated there. There is no objective world out there, only a subjective awareness of it in our mind. It is only the field of your consciousness that allows you to know that you are. Take it away and you are nothing.

[nventr]

If we do not give equal respect to both the physical and spiritual realms then our lives are out of balance. They are intertwined.

Nothingness/love is the goal of the warrior, while the light/understanding is the goal of the creative. Both are valid in the right circumstances. Both are wrong in the wrong circumstances.

What is right for one person is wrong for another. To declare that there is only one way, does nothing but create strife in the world.

[Sammy]

I like what both of you have said here, many truths. Its true way too much stock has been put into academics for validating self-worthe. You also have to remember those who dont understand their spirituality, need a path to that light. If we dont offer it they cant take it.

My reason can be measured, its 0. As you said its nothing, zero, zilch. However you could never get to 1 if 0 didnt exist. Once you have achieved counting to 1, 0 then becomes something. It marks the beggining of where you started. Or rather your "home base".

[Mathew James]

beauty is always (and only) in the eyes of the beholder

[essencespiritual]

Radhanath Swami: It is due to lack of science that there are so many problems. By ‘science’ I don’t mean the manipulation of the external gross elements. Bhagavad-Gita, spirituality, and Sanatana Dharma are sciences. Without these foundational sciences strong, other sciences that we build on could create many difficulties. So the problem is not science. But the problem is ignorance. When we create great sciences on the foundation of ignorance, that causes a lot of problem, a lot of pollution, and lots of disruption. Penny wise pounds foolish. Have you ever heard this saying? We are creating so many things, but in the process what are we doing to the environment?

[Chrysaetos]

Radhanath Swami: It is due to lack of science that there are so many problems. By ‘science’ I don’t mean the manipulation of the external gross elements. Bhagavad-Gita, spirituality, and Sanatana Dharma are sciences. Without these foundational sciences strong, other sciences that we build on could create many difficulties. So the problem is not science. But the problem is ignorance. When we create great sciences on the foundation of ignorance, that causes a lot of problem, a lot of pollution, and lots of disruption. Penny wise pounds foolish. Have you ever heard this saying? We are creating so many things, but in the process what are we doing to the environment?Science is neutral by itself.

Maybe that dude should help his own country a bit and clean up the mess, the polluted rivers, cure the sick etc.
Here in Europe we do mostly fine with our prevention of pollution.For as long as time can record, we have searched into the explaination of events. When we see a rainbow casting its amazing colors through the sky, its realy the light refracting off of water particles. Does that mean the rainbow never happened? Scientists seem to think this is so. Science has only explained the process in wich it happens, the event is what we experience and both are as real as the other. It's a matter of aesthetics and that is subjective.

How we feel about the rainbow is 'real' for us, but only in our own mind.

[Sammy]

Radhanath Swami: It is due to lack of science that there are so many problems. By ‘science’ I don’t mean the manipulation of the external gross elements. Bhagavad-Gita, spirituality, and Sanatana Dharma are sciences. Without these foundational sciences strong, other sciences that we build on could create many difficulties. So the problem is not science. But the problem is ignorance. When we create great sciences on the foundation of ignorance, that causes a lot of problem, a lot of pollution, and lots of disruption. Penny wise pounds foolish. Have you ever heard this saying? We are creating so many things, but in the process what are we doing to the environment?
Its not the methods, its the practitioner. A good example is Einstein, he wanted to prove the current physics laws wrong. He knew they were wrong, and so he did it and created more mass then existed by splitting a atom in two. Did the people let it stop there? Its a choice to create a bomb, and you only create it for one reason.

There is a way to make it work. Nature can support science because they are one in the same. Just from different perspectives. Solar, hydro, and wind power can support any town if the investment is made. Did you know 1 lb. of water = 1 BTU of energy? We have every energy resource available, but the people insist on a non replenishing fuel source. Why you might ask? Because they can control it, and that means big money.

[unus supra]

Its interesting, but as the above post states, it is absolutely accurate that the closer we look the more we will see. What we have to come to terms with is the fact that, while reality is infinite, understanding is not, in that we understand, through the symbolism of language. Our languages provide us with a very set number of possible permutations. These, while relatively large in terms of possibilities are absolutely finite, next to a reality that is infinite.

in purely mathematical terms, that means our understanding in the form of the aquisition of knowledge, or science, equates to a resounding

zero.

please dont mistake that for saying knowledge and science have no value

quite the contrary, but it is a limited value, and its value is ultimately determined by its usefulness in relation to us. In understanding this we then can find a bit of humility in knowing that we just cant understand it all. and thats alright. This runs in stark contrast to the arrogance that can come with intellect. Science is a means, it is not the end.

but we can know it all. through direct experience.

Likewise, we have designed a method of observation that is in need of remodelling. Because of the way the scientific method is made, it makes
the subjective experience very difficult to study.

And here is the biggest issue. Borderline crazy, bare with me.

Psychology according to mainstream academia, is considered to be a "soft" science, or in some circles it is regarded as pseudoscience.

Whats crazy about that is, that it is the mind that created the scientific method. hahaha. laughter is appropriate.

We have garnered so much knowledge that we have come to the mistaken conclusion that we are subject to the scientific method.

on the contrary, the scientific method and all of the knowledge garnered from it

is subject to us. We created it, along with the symbols (although not what the symbols represent) that we use.

If it is no longer serving its purpose in allowing us to observe, study and understand this reality, then we need to quickly identify where, and change it accordingly.

The same way we have changed and adapted to our needs everything that we have layd hands on including that nifty computer you are sitting at right now.

To put the very subjective experience that created it in the backseat is a mis understanding obviously. Lest we have forgotten that for every man women and child from birth unto death, theirs and ours is an entirely subjective experience, thus it must take primacy in our studies.

Now is a unique point in our development. We have aquired a vast store of useful (and of course not so useful) knowledge through the disciplined and rigorous efforts of many a bright mind. Now though, mankind thirsts for more.
Now is the time to take that same rigor and apply that laser of study to the internal state.

Heres something cool to think about. Our technology has outpaced our spiritual growth. And thats alright Because we all come from the same reality, we and what we make are reflections of each other, thus you can see in our technology where we are headed spiritually. What scientific marvel has propelled the growth of humanity the most....??

The internet.

and thats where we are headed spiritually

Everyone connected, infinite knowledge at your disposal.


cmon board partner, plenty of room, haha

welcome to the evolution of mankind

[Sammy]

Its interesting, but as the above post states, it is absolutely accurate that the closer we look the more we will see. What we have to come to terms with is the fact that, while reality is infinite, understanding is not, in that we understand, through the symbolism of language. Our languages provide us with a very set number of possible permutations. These, while relatively large in terms of possibilities are absolutely finite, next to a reality that is infinite.

in purely mathematical terms, that means our understanding in the form of the aquisition of knowledge, or science, equates to a resounding

zero.

please dont mistake that for saying knowledge and science have no value

quite the contrary, but it is a limited value, and its value is ultimately determined by its usefulness in relation to us. In understanding this we then can find a bit of humility in knowing that we just cant understand it all. and thats alright. This runs in stark contrast to the arrogance that can come with intellect. Science is a means, it is not the end.

but we can know it all. through direct experience.

Likewise, we have designed a method of observation that is in need of remodelling. Because of the way the scientific method is made, it makes
the subjective experience very difficult to study.

And here is the biggest issue. Borderline crazy, bare with me.

Psychology according to mainstream academia, is considered to be a "soft" science, or in some circles it is regarded as pseudoscience.

Whats crazy about that is, that it is the mind that created the scientific method. hahaha. laughter is appropriate.

We have garnered so much knowledge that we have come to the mistaken conclusion that we are subject to the scientific method.

on the contrary, the scientific method and all of the knowledge garnered from it

is subject to us. We created it, along with the symbols (although not what the symbols represent) that we use.

If it is no longer serving its purpose in allowing us to observe, study and understand this reality, then we need to quickly identify where, and change it accordingly.

The same way we have changed and adapted to our needs everything that we have layd hands on including that nifty computer you are sitting at right now.

To put the very subjective experience that created it in the backseat is a mis understanding obviously. Lest we have forgotten that for every man women and child from birth unto death, theirs and ours is an entirely subjective experience, thus it must take primacy in our studies.

Now is a unique point in our development. We have aquired a vast store of useful (and of course not so useful) knowledge through the disciplined and rigorous efforts of many a bright mind. Now though, mankind thirsts for more.
Now is the time to take that same rigor and apply that laser of study to the internal state.

Heres something cool to think about. Our technology has outpaced our spiritual growth. And thats alright Because we all come from the same reality, we and what we make are reflections of each other, thus you can see in our technology where we are headed spiritually. What scientific marvel has propelled the growth of humanity the most....??

The internet.

and thats where we are headed spiritually

Everyone connected, infinite knowledge at your disposal.


cmon board partner, plenty of room, haha

welcome to the evolution of mankind

Kind of hard to put that whole thought into words isnt it? HAHA

Great job though, love it.

People will go where they connect best, which I agree is and will be the internet. Perhaps the first step in having no physical restrictions is having no mental limits. To connect to a source it requires a path to it, when enough energy is following the same path it creates light.

[unus supra]

im glad you found it interesting, im supposed to talk, so when i write, it comes out a little....oh....not very pretty?

but ya what i mean is, what you said, the next spiritual jump we make is going to further connect us mentally to each other and other sources of information.

jeez that was supposed to be the shwerpunkt of my post it appears it turned out to be quite the anitclimax.
hahaha

i hate when that happens, furthermore, i have been up for 24 hours.

hmm. later

[Perceiver]

I view the 10 sephirot in Kabbalah as a mystical view of atoms, the elements, molecules, and compounds.

[essencespiritual]

Question to Radhanath Swami: Why is it stressed so much that we understand God from a bonafide Guru (Spiritual Master)? Can’t we resort to scientific research, like we do to understand any other phenomena?

Radhanath Swami: Our Guru Srila Prabhupada, in his purity of heart and humility, again and again stressed, “I am simply repeating the words of my Gurudeva and Sri Guru Parampara.” This is the descending process of acquiring knowledge. Prabhupada stressed this especially because at this particular time within the age of kali, the ascending way of approaching knowledge has become very much prevalent. In fact, modern scientific education especially trains people to doubt authority, to independently research to find out what is truth.

Now according to God Himself, through the process of ascending knowledge—even with the help of the Holy Scriptures—we can at the most attain an understanding and realization of the impersonal Brahman, and perhaps Paramatma. But Bhagavan realization, realization of the personality of Godhead, is utterly impossible through the ascending process. It is only by the mercy of the Lord that we can understand him as he is.

So therefore Srila Prabhupada, who didn’t give the generic idea of ‘God’ consciousness, wanted to stress this point. He was giving ‘Krishna’ consciousness. ‘Krishna’ is Bhagavan. ‘Krishna’ has all 6 opulences in full for all of eternity. As far as ‘God’, ‘God’ could mean the impersonal Brahman to some, ‘God’ could mean a demigod to some, or ‘God’ could mean the Paramatma within the heart to others. But they are all partial understandings of Bhagavan.

The only way to approach Lord Krishna, Lord Krishna declares himself in the Bhagavad Gita, “It is only by undivided, unconditional devotional service that I can be understood as I am.” Prabhupada’s special contribution to the world is that he spread throughout all the continents of this planet the full complete understanding of the Absolute Truth, Krishna, who is the supreme enjoyer, and how to reach him—through unmotivated, uninterrupted loving service. When Krishna is pleased by our service, Krishna reveals Himself to us.

[Dave World]

An historical scientist who I admire was John Muir. A Wisconsin boy, like me. He was a botanist, geologist and an original ecologist. For him it was all the expression, the very real presence, of God.