PDA

View Full Version : Passive/Tao versus Cosmic Ordering


amy green
05-10-2006, 01:54 PM
Hi - I've recently heard a little about cosmic ordering and wonder how this 'sits' with being passive, going with the flow, a kind of Tao thing? Which is better; are they compatible? Doesn't cosmic ordering imply you're not at peace with yourself, i.e. that until you get something (a bit like materialistic shopping?) then you can't/won't be fulfilled? But isn't being enlightened, spiritually developed being O.K. with whatever life gives you. Am I just denoting these 2 extremes and would a healthier option be something inbetween? What do you think?!

dreamer
05-10-2006, 04:11 PM
Hi Amy, Great post here are my thoughts - Chapter 10 in the Tao Te Ching talks about the mysterious power, through which without moving the sage brings order to all. If you look at things in terms of the law of attraction to feel inner peace should bring outer manifestations that propagate this inner peace but to feel true inner peace is impossible when the universe is viewed as out there and seperate....maybe cosmic ordering is a step in the process towards a realisation that the mind creates reality and when this power is understood, true peace can then be achieved because the out there and seperate become as one with the in here. The outer is a reflection of the inner after all so are they not just one in reality?

I would also say that in my experience passivity is more to do with lack of effort than lack of energy. I can do something I love all day long and it is no effort, I can do something I find tedious for 10 minutes and expend 10 times more effort, both use enrgy but only the second uses effort. In this sense cosmic ordering is perfect because you are only asking for what you want which will in the long run cause much less effort to be used, even if the enrgy i the same...less stress when you enjoy yourself, which is what the universe really wants from us all in the end.

Enlightener
05-10-2006, 05:40 PM
Upside down turvy, I fully agree with your Dreamer, it is the amount of energy you use for one subject, your thoughts about it control your intake. It is whether you find something enjoyable, or whether you suscribe it to a 'hassle'.

I believe if you chose to make everything a breeze, a meditation, you would find that life becomes a lot easier, and you would have far less drama, though us humans seem to love drama, so what the hey???

Enlightener

~Jay~
05-10-2006, 07:28 PM
I would personally be very wary of this cosmic ordering malarkey, remember the old saying "be careful what you wish for, as it just might come true" - and it may not always happen the way you want it to, or for the greater good in the end.

A little example of this, is earlier on in the year, I watched the then hot-off the-press "The Secret", which involves an almost identical concept of cosmic ordering. I decided, in my infinate wisdom :rolleyes: to give it a go with a minor issue. That being the fact that I'd gained a few pounds over the winter & was struggling to loose the weight, so I asked the cosmos for a little assistance in my goal. I got it alright.....came down with an almightily nasty chicken pox infection and was very ill for 3 weeks. That's the way I lost the weight - and it served me a very valuable lesson indeed.

I've read a little of the teachings of the Tao, and I have to say I liked what I read. Going with the flow of the river of life seems like a good idea to me.:wink: I think the whole concept of cosmic ordering is aimed at a very materialistic audience, which I'm ashamed to say I nearly fell for myself.

Glorymist
06-10-2006, 02:14 AM
Amy - - as with all things spiritual - - there is a time for both. There is a time to be passive - - and there is a time to know what you want in life.

In the realm of passivity - - one can learn the limits, structure, and "uses" of it - - and when to apply and live from it - - or one can take to it completely and drop into passivity / complacency / total drift.

In the realm of "cosmic ordering" - - one can learn the limits, structure, and "uses" of it - - and when to apply and live from it - - or one can take to "gimmee this and gimmee that and I want MORE ! !"

And - - as with all things spiritual - - it is NOT an either / or situation. It is a balance. One needs to discover what feeds what - - how to do that - - to what extent - - in what direction - - and to what end. (There's not really an "end" - - but it carries the point.)

When there is the demand that it is either this or that - - you can bet that this is mind - - claiming that there is a right way and a wrong way to it all.

To a spiritual point of view - - it all comes together in a rather balanced unity - - and the trick - - as I have said - - is to figure out which tool to use - - when - - and for what "purpose."

dreamer
06-10-2006, 08:04 PM
Anything that teaches gratitude as a founding principle has to b good, cosmic ordering happens whether you want it or not, might as well use it to promote happiness and well being in your life by taking responsibility for your mindspace, materialism is a precursor for spirituality just as hunger drives you to look for food. In essence going with the flow is a refined use of the law of attraction, whereby material possessions become of secondary importance to inner peace, once you realise you can have anything only inner peace becomes important I would suggest.

amy green
10-10-2006, 02:15 PM
Thanks for your replies. I realise that being passive and proactive both have their place, however I'm uneasy about cosmic ordering...specifically its shopping list approach ("I want this", "I want that"). It panders to the ego's greed and I feel this is where New Ave diverges from spirituality. Cultivating spirituality entails minimising the ego!!!

dreamer
10-10-2006, 03:23 PM
So in effect are you cosmic ordering a smaller ego? Maybe at the same time some negativity towards materialism?

Glorymist
10-10-2006, 04:56 PM
amy green - - "cosmic order" - - strength ! ! Of and towards life ! ! Cosmic order - - courage ! ! Cosmic order - - discipline / tolerance / patience / forgiveness / etc.

Mind *wants* you to perceive "cosmic ordering" as good only for material things.

It's not.

All of the people you may consider to be "spiritual greats" - - such as Ghandi / Buddha / Jesus / Mother Teresa / Etc. - - all manifested / cosmic ordered their outer personalities via their inner perspectives. As they slowly "got out of their own way" - - they "saw" greater and more profound levels of Life.

Mind would just as soon you NOT do that. That is the nature of mind. Not YOUR mind specifically. ALL mind in general. Mind is incredibly protective of itself. You can see that.

Such is the "battle." Such is the Path.

dreamer
10-10-2006, 05:26 PM
Well put GM, there are two sides to every coin and inner peace requires an understanding and mastery of the laws of one and attraction anyway. Sometimes we mistakenly look for the wrong things to bring us what we ultimately want, the key is learning what it is we really want and then "ordering" that.....it seems logical that the ultimate goal is a feeling rather than a thing.

Glorymist
10-10-2006, 07:46 PM
dreamer - - watch this ! ! - -

I am (probably) about to throw a big rock in the center of the pond and cause all kinds of "odd" reactions.

For the most part - - the three biggies that most people want as they walk this planet are good health - - great wealth - - and inner peace. We are always asking whatever "God" we are following at the time for those - - in one way or another.

But - - inner peace - - is just a mental ploy. Inner peace - - is a concept that is kinda like "perfection." Neither exists as we believe it to be.

There is little "inner peace" when your life is filled with discipline / patience / courage / strength / etc. One is always on a calling for Spirit somewhere - - if not for yourself. The only real "inner peace" comes from knowing that what you are doing is right - - and is the best for all concerned - - and so you can unplug all those facets of mind that like to constantly "yap" and you and you can just stay focused on the task at hand - - whatever that may be.

But hard-core discipline / strength / and courage - - is NOT - - inner peace.

At least - - not the way most people understand it.

And many people believe "inner peace" to simply be shutting that little yapping mind up for a while. (That's not it either.) (Tho it IS nice ! !)

hee hee hee

All of what I just said there - - is for simple refinement only. Even - - semantics. There IS a peace to it all - - but mind wants you to believe that it is "this" definition of peace and not "that" definition of peace that is "right" or "wrong."

Sort it out softly. Maybe you already have. If so - - I just got some good typing practice in. If not - - then - - you are one who can figure it out and perhaps let go of a few nagging little side-cons that can tie one up forever ! !

:->

chadley
11-10-2006, 08:29 PM
(***he catches the rock in his hand before it splashes into the pond and crushes the rock in his hand. Then, blows the rock dust into the air where it turns into pretty butterflies, one of which lands gently onto Holly's shoulder***) lol!

One of the minds many twists is to influence you to search for "inner peace" with the mind itself. It loves to get you chasing your tail.

Now, I agree that discipline/strength/courage is NOT inner peace. However, as you go along maintaining your spiritual discipline, slowly raising your consciousness, slowly aligning yourself with the divine, diligently facing your fears/negs/blocks/separation with courage, the feelings of spiritual happiness, joy, peace, love, bliss with each accomplishment grow. Your ability to be an expression of love and all of its aspects increases while you are in the physical walking around going about your daily business. The buttons that you once had that triggered unpleasant emotions are no longer there as you slowly discover and address the reason that exists behind each one of them. The process by which you reveal your authentic self results in a more constant state in which you experience emotions of a higher vibrations. This level of experience, this state of being and feeling, IS NOT LITTLE, IS NOT SUBTLE. Guess what, I'm feeling a bunch of it right now. Opening yourself up to the power of the light within you, uncovering your true essence is a dramatic experience that stays with you as long as you maintain your spiritual discipline. If you keep using it, you won't loose it. Your soul is always in a perfect state of love, and your journey down the path can increase and stregthen the integration this love while you exist on earth. If you let it, it will have a powerful impact on your ability to generate heightened spiritual experiences without action. This is my definition of peace--joy and happiness without the need for outside stimulation. . You are happy with out praying, meditationg, astral traveling, without thinking of loved ones, without eating chocolate bits, without a solemate. You simply are.

No doubt, executing spiritual discipline consistantly, facing self, hurdling the roadblocks of life, and growing is not a cake walk. In fact, it can be so intimidating for some that they would rather just stay where they are and not improve themselves so that they don't have to go through the struggle which is necessary for that next level of understanding/experience/enlightenment. However, once you discover that the rewards of discipline/strength/courage, you will hunger for more and develope a greater motivation to do the dirty work.

My point is, you can be happier than you are right now, now get your hands in the S**t and start diggin, you might find sumthin valuable in there.

Chadley.

Glorymist
11-10-2006, 08:36 PM
Chadley - - that's why I said - - "it doesn't exist as we believe it to be."

Most people - - from what they tell me - - want a calm, smooth, care-free, drifting to it all. Just - - constantly ride the wave - - almost without effort.

It's a wonderful pipe-dream. And for a couple dozen lifetimes - - one may find that state of consciousness.

Eventually - - one finds that there is a bit of work involved in it all - - but yes - - it has it's rewards - - as long as one keeps ego out of the way when assessing such rewards.

:->

kundalini
11-10-2006, 08:57 PM
Somewhat enlightening posts Chadley and Glorymist. I have nothing to add!

Kundalini.

chadley
11-10-2006, 09:11 PM
Cool beans.

chadley
11-10-2006, 09:37 PM
Oh, and Glory, I was only teasing you about crushing your rock, you know, right? I knew I was saying basically the same thing as you did with your post, I just wanted to re-state it with some butterflies. I should have added some ferry dust too, maybe next time.

Chadley.

kundalini
11-10-2006, 10:18 PM
Cool beans.

Lol! What's that slang for over in the US?

chadley
11-10-2006, 11:06 PM
Lol! What's that slang for over in the US?

It's just a light hearted way of saying that you are in agreement or ok with it, another example would be, "Oki doki smokey" :)

kundalini
11-10-2006, 11:51 PM
It's just a light hearted way of saying that you are in agreement or ok with it, another example would be, "Oki doki smokey" :)

I figured so.

I like that 'oki doki smokey'. That's a good 'un.

Kundalini.

amy green
13-10-2006, 02:31 PM
I can see cosmic ordering can serve a good purpose, but distrust it for reasons I gave in my previous reply. All the spiritually advanced people I've known and heard of have mastered their egos and are on a more advanced level of love and compassion - giving unselfishly. Listening to how much ego dominates someone, for me, is a good yardstick as to how spiritual they are. Yes dreamer, you're right, I AM negative about materialism - just look at our consumer society with all the upheaval that brings ... need I say more? I'm content not to want very much. I live simply and am richer for it.

AL
13-10-2006, 04:41 PM
I think we are on the subject of desire here. There is of course such a thing as PURE desire. This suggests that it depends on our motive and um, desire.
To be honest, I have been slightly surprised by some coments in life in general about cosmic ordering from some as if it is ok to desire material things.
Perhaps it is the lack of and not the having which is the problem in this world.
The lack of love, peace, hapiness etc.

chadley
13-10-2006, 05:55 PM
Amy--It is important to understand why our consumer society creates upheaval. Seeking materialism or money for the purpose of solving our problems or creating our happiness is what often causes upheaval because it is the only method many people are aware of that they believe can make them happy. When it doesn't they will chase after more and more of it sometimes to the point where the rest of their lives fall apart.
However, it is important to understand that abundance itself is a divine quallity. Your soul went so far as to be co-creator of this entire universe. This very act is an example of your divine creativity and abundant manifestation. You are an unlimited being that creates all that exists around you. This physical world is not separate from that of the spiritual world. Even your shoes or the rock on the ground is a manifestation of spirit. As above so below. If you want, since I already posted on this, you can review my perspective on this subject on this thread:

http://spiritualforums.com/vb/showthread.php?p=7361#post7361

Remember that when you have negative feelings about anything to focus on the feeling itself and not what is the apparent cause of the feeling. If you view materialism negatively, that means that materialism itself is triggering a negative emotion in your energy system. The cause itself is not as important as the actual negative feeling because negative feelings of any sort are not in alignment with your highest purpose.

In regards to passivity--The art of passivity does not mean that you get to hang around and just let whatever happen without a care. Of course, you can try that for a while if you want, but your inner issues will eventually catch up to you. It is important to take responsibility for your actions. The Tao, the watercourse way, does teach to choose the path of least resistance. Resistance to the truth is what causes discomfort. Do not push, and the universe does not push back. However, the very reason you have discomfort or issues in your life is because there is a part of you that is not in alignment with your divine purpose and therefore is a point of resistance to the current of truth. Love does not flow through you out of force, but rather lack of. You allow love, which already exists in abundance, to flow through you. -this is passivity- You do not take action to go out and get love, it is already in you. The same can be applied to life and pain or circumstances that cause discomfort. Instead of resisting pain or covering it up, recognize it as a sign post to show you the way to what you resist. It is a beacon to show you where you need to go. Allow yourself to feel emotional pain, let it teach you and guide you.

The flip side is that molding your spirit on all planes to be an instument of pure passivity for love and truth takes spiritual discipline. As explained above, identifying what needs to be corrected, then actually correcting is no small task. This is were strength and discipline need to be applied.

Chadley.

amy green
14-10-2006, 03:28 PM
I understand Chadley what you say about materialism and it makes a lot of wise sense. The reason I have discomfort about it is that, being very spiritual, I feel like an outsider in this society - it doesn't reflect my values at all... and I don't know many spiritual people. (Am delighted to find this forum though!) Of course I accept that capitalism/consumerism works for most people, but the effect of this just brings alienation. To counteract this I remind myself we're all essentially good and to see our acts/thoughts of humanity is inspirational...I try to stay positive and understand the dynamics of it all but, ultimately, feel I probably belong to some future, more aware/enlightened age that I really wish was here. (In a way, I've already experienced it - had a warm, wonderful time being a hippy in the 1960's!!!)

chadley
14-10-2006, 06:35 PM
Amy--it is very common for spiritual, truly spiritual people to feel out of place. I have spent much of my life feeling this way. For a basic example, I remember being in school and not understanding the actions of other kids and as a result being unpopular and separate from the crowd. Then later on in High school, I became popular, yet still did not feel at home. I still knew I viewed things differently than the people of whom I was well liked. Of course, the liberating realization I eventually came to after school, was that I learned to become centered and found contentment in myself versus seeking it outside of myself. Once you become happy with who and where you are, you will draw others to you who share the same inner wisdom. My point here is that in order to find fulfillment here on earth you must go inward to find your place and not seek it in your environment. The truth is that you do belong in the exact geographic location you are presently in and you do belong in the present time period you are currently in. Discover your place there and you may find out it is no accident as to why you are when and where you are. You have already started this process, otherwise you would not have stumbled onto this forum. There are others around that you will resonate with and have rewarding relationships with. Trust that the universe will do this for you. And remember that the law of attraction is just as involved with your relationships, as well. The more you focus on the people of whom you do not like, the more the universe will surround you with them. Instead, practice gratitude for who you are and what you know, and to not judge those who are less conscious then yourself. A little exercise I like to do when I'm out and about is to look at someone who I perceive to be shallow or foolish or arrogant, what have you, and project love and light to the person. Try to see through this guise and view them for who they are in their core, a being of divine light. The more you see this in people, the more it will emerge from the inside of you. The true master does not spend his whole life on top of a mountain being one with god, because he and everyone already is one with god. Rather, a true master comes down from the mountain from time to time to exercise spiritual law in the physical. This is integration. To live as a spiritual being in continuity with life on earth. Our soul's task or purpose for descending to earth is not to then go where we are one with god, but rather have the courage to go where we are not, so that we may surrender our resistance to love in this area.

Chadley.

amy green
17-10-2006, 03:04 PM
Thanks Chadley for your nurturing, wise thoughts! I'm learning so much from this forum and its healing my sense of alienation! I AM at peace with myself - in fact I thrive on solitude; it recharges my batteries for facing my external environment. It's not that I don't like people that aren't spiritual (remember I've said we're all essentially good?) but that I see most as not "my people"! I try not to judge, just make a distinction. I can see why I'm here presently (i.e. as a part-time carer);looking to integrate more/develop my compassion via voluntary work. I probably come across as sombre but it's because I'm serious about spirituality. I understand the law of attraction - most people find me warm, friendly and witty (in fact, used to do stand-up comedy!!)

chadley
17-10-2006, 04:57 PM
Cool beans Amy Green!

cweiters
17-10-2006, 05:56 PM
Thank you very much Amy for this topic and the courage to share it with us. My feelings are very simple I don't speak French so it would be difficult for me to order from a French menu without an interpreter. Based on my experience I have difficulty explaining to another human being what has been revealed to me. I find this knowledge to be far more advanced than my generation. I agree with Joycee since there is always a chance that "I just might get what I order".

cw

dreamer
18-10-2006, 07:52 AM
Feeling out of place is the driving motivation for self healing, don't stop until you find a way to feel totally comfortable in all situations/free to express your truth to anyone.

By the way, you are always getting what you are constantly ordering, there is no off switch to the law of attraction, use this knowledge wisely, consider what it is you truly want - you are constantly ordering and your orders are constantly manifesting - the three gunas, see through the illusion that says you are at the mercy of outside forcesand realise your power by letting go and surrendering to the one inside.

rose
18-10-2006, 10:23 AM
good for you amy :) you're last sentence was simple yet powerful as well.

i always remember an episode from absolutely fabulous where saffy laughed at eddie's new found fad of buddhist chanting. she called it "the cosmic cash flow machine" :D

i remember this as i chant...and laugh...but personally i have changed with buddhism. i grew up with the catholic guilt (nothing against catholicism by the way....my parents practise and are very happy, spiritual people) and belief that austerity would lead the way for me spiritually. buddhism is similar in many ways...ie, we need to free ourselves from the material desire. but there are many forms of buddhism and some teachings add that we as beings on this wonderful planet deserve prosperity also. i guess if we crave material wealth for the wrong reasons, believing it will fill a gap in us and our search for happiness, then it will only cause our suffering in a way, being too attached. but i believe all humans deserve prosperity and if i believe they do then i believe i do also. to me it's all about balance i guess.

never denying ourselves what we truly need. comfort, food, good surroundings, and financial freedom. and chanting, praying, wishing that others have access to this basic human right.

i used to think buddhism was egoistical once, because it only seemed to focus on SELF enlightenment...but the more i learned, the more i saw how much compasson for others was the biggest driving force. self enlightenment just helps one with the ability to effectively help others.

but this is a really tricky subject as there are so many layers and on the surface they seem to contradict each other...but in the end they compliment each other. sorry :) i'm a feeler rather than a thinker :D i just confuse people lol

i presume we're talking about buddhism here ...cosmic ordering? it's a common way many people look at chanting. sorry i just read the beginning of the thread.

cweiters
18-10-2006, 05:29 PM
Feeling out of place is the driving motivation for self healing, don't stop until you find a way to feel totally comfortable in all situations/free to express your truth to anyone.

By the way, you are always getting what you are constantly ordering, there is no off switch to the law of attraction, use this knowledge wisely, consider what it is you truly want - you are constantly ordering and your orders are constantly manifesting - the three gunas, see through the illusion that says you are at the mercy of outside forcesand realise your power by letting go and surrendering to the one inside.

If we are constantly ordering, are you saying the level of manifestation is based on the inner persons concept of the truth and how much faith they have in that truth to receive a full manifestation? I beleive we are constantly ordering, yet all manifestations are not visible in physical form, would you explain?

chadley
18-10-2006, 06:38 PM
cweiter, I am fully confident dreamer will give you a great answer on this as I know he and I agree on the law of attraction, but I will throw in a few tidbits while you wait for his reply. Faith, itself, as most understand it, only has a small impact on manifestation. There are elements that need to be added to it in order to excellerate the manifestation process into the physical. Everything in your life, you have manifested, but everything you attempt to manifest with your conscious mind will only materialize in the physical if you use the above elements I illuded to but have not mentioned (I will let dreamer do that if he wants). It is easier and more effortless to consciously manifest when the things that you are trying to manifest are in alignment with your divine intent or your divine purpose. This is why people who have truly found their purpose in life often also find manifestation an easier task. So, manifestation is not necessary influenced as much by a person's concept of the truth as it is influenced by the person having matched their conscious intention with their highest truth. Does that make sense?

Chadley.

e-ma
18-10-2006, 07:12 PM
This is a great thread.. and thank you for all of the amazing thoughts.. I don't want to break up the flow of the conversaton, but chadley you mentioned about allowing our emotions to guide us, to allow ourselves to feel our emotions and know that these are the issues were are supposed to be dealing with..

I have a big, stubborn emotional issue that simply will not budge.. no matter how I try to surrender to the situation and allow it to be, this same issue just keeps coming back, and back, and back again.. it's such a pain. I feel that by trying to tackle it, I am making it worse, but by itself, it won't die.

Any advice?!

cweiters
18-10-2006, 07:41 PM
Perfect sense and very well put. I will not pretend to have knowledge of dreamer because I don't however, I do understand the highest truth which is far better than my mortal consciousness. Thank you again for taking the time to share with me as you can see I am new, yet teachable.

cw

cweiter, I am fully confident dreamer will give you a great answer on this as I know he and I agree on the law of attraction, but I will throw in a few tidbits while you wait for his reply. Faith, itself, as most understand it, only has a small impact on manifestation. There are elements that need to be added to it in order to excellerate the manifestation process into the physical. Everything in your life, you have manifested, but everything you attempt to manifest with your conscious mind will only materialize in the physical if you use the above elements I illuded to but have not mentioned (I will let dreamer do that if he wants). It is easier and more effortless to consciously manifest when the things that you are trying to manifest are in alignment with your divine intent or your divine purpose. This is why people who have truly found their purpose in life often also find manifestation an easier task. So, manifestation is not necessary influenced as much by a person's concept of the truth as it is influenced by the person having matched their conscious intention with their highest truth. Does that make sense?

Chadley.

chadley
18-10-2006, 07:45 PM
This is a great thread.. and thank you for all of the amazing thoughts.. I don't want to break up the flow of the conversaton, but chadley you mentioned about allowing our emotions to guide us, to allow ourselves to feel our emotions and know that these are the issues were are supposed to be dealing with..

I have a big, stubborn emotional issue that simply will not budge.. no matter how I try to surrender to the situation and allow it to be, this same issue just keeps coming back, and back, and back again.. it's such a pain. I feel that by trying to tackle it, I am making it worse, but by itself, it won't die.

Any advice?!

e-ma, first of all, your question is very synchronistic with cwieters because in my reply to him I mentioned unnamed "elements" that fuel the fire of intention and thought to excellerate manifestation. Then, not but a few hours later, you bring up a question about EMOTIONS! This is one of the elements which is the fuel that ignites intention. It is what you apply emotion to, that manifests. "Thought" itself, is just an empty shell. It is given true power with emotions.

Secondly, in regards to your question, the more you isolate your negative emotions, the more they are exposed and the more they reveal themselves. As a result, the discomfort in it can get worse before it gets better. What many people don't realize about emotional pain and really all pain is that you are actually experiencing it as the result of an elevation of your vibration in your energy field. As you increase the over all vibration of your energy field, the energy of lower vibration, which is usually attached to a thought form, bubbles to the surface and reveals itslef. The good news is, that as this pain increases, so should your ability to identify its cause/ original wound/ core issue. Once you realease this energy, you will find yourself able to enjoy the fruits of having a higher level of energy. This is the gift that full surrender offers you once completed. My advice is to not deny the emotional issue. When you meditate or spend time with yourself, allow yourself to really "feel" this emotional turmoil, do not be afraid to experience it. Listen closely if a higher voice will tell you its source. Then, even if at first this source seems totally abscure, send love and light to it from your core. From the divine light that exsists in the very center of your body.

If you want, feel free to PM me with more detail surrounding your issue and I will be glad to offer more advice if I feel I can help.

Chadley.

cweiters
18-10-2006, 07:45 PM
Thank you for putting out this emotion (hard to let go) I just shared something simular quote:

Wish mine family felt that way, they still dislike me telling them what I am feeling.
At present: Grandmother, neice, sister and brother are all angry with me. I tried to insure unity among us months before the wedding, I felt her new husband needed to see us working together more than anyone else. But as usual it turned into chos & confussion this time I was accused of sabatoge and jelousy. I forced myself to atted the wedding after sister had purchased dresses.

I did not force myself to attend the reception.

I want to lean new and better ways to deal with othes no matter how strong a feeling come over me. I shouldn't quarrel, but I do. I shouldn't fuss, but I do. I shouldn't get angry. but I do. I am the first to say help! these emotions damage my spiritual connection. I want to help people and sometimes I do, it hurts me so bad when I make matters worse.

cw

This is a great thread.. and thank you for all of the amazing thoughts.. I don't want to break up the flow of the conversaton, but chadley you mentioned about allowing our emotions to guide us, to allow ourselves to feel our emotions and know that these are the issues were are supposed to be dealing with..

I have a big, stubborn emotional issue that simply will not budge.. no matter how I try to surrender to the situation and allow it to be, this same issue just keeps coming back, and back, and back again.. it's such a pain. I feel that by trying to tackle it, I am making it worse, but by itself, it won't die.

Any advice?!

cweiters
18-10-2006, 07:58 PM
I love it! all seeds grow in the darkness. Isolation is not good for negative emotions, I feel I need help in the area of emotional control and letting go not just the negative but positive as well. I often find myself on rewind doesn't matter weather good or bad some episodes I find hare to let go of only because of the emotions attached. Yes I need help and pratice excersises in this area. Here is an post from today:
Wish mine family felt that way, they still dislike me telling them what I am feeling.
At present: Grandmother, neice, sister and brother are all angry with me. I tried to insure unity among us months before the wedding, I felt her new husband needed to see us working together more than anyone else. But as usual it turned into chos & confussion this time I was accused of sabatoge and jelousy. I forced myself to atted the wedding after sister had purchased dresses.

I did not force myself to attend the reception.

I want to lean new and better ways to deal with othes no matter how strong a feeling come over me. I shouldn't quarrel, but I do. I shouldn't fuss, but I do. I shouldn't get angry. but I do. I am the first to say help! these emotions damage my spiritual connection. I want to help people and sometimes I do, it hurts me so bad when I make matters worse.

cw



Help me please!

e-ma, first of all, your question is very synchronistic with cwieters because in my reply to him I mentioned unnamed "elements" that fuel the fire of intention and thought to excellerate manifestation. Then, not but a few hours later, you bring up a question about EMOTIONS! This is one of the elements which is the fuel that ignites intention. It is what you apply emotion to, that manifests. "Thought" itself, is just an empty shell. It is given true power with emotions.

Secondly, in regards to your question, the more you isolate your negative emotions, the more they are exposed and the more they reveal themselves. As a result, the discomfort in it can get worse before it gets better. What many people don't realize about emotional pain and really all pain is that you are actually experiencing it as the result of an elevation of your vibration in your energy field. As you increase the over all vibration of your energy field, the energy of lower vibration, which is usually attached to a thought form, bubbles to the surface and reveals itslef. The good news is, that as this pain increases, so should your ability to identify its cause/ original wound/ core issue. Once you realease this energy, you will find yourself able to enjoy the fruits of having a higher level of energy. This is the gift that full surrender offers you once completed. My advice is to not deny the emotional issue. When you meditate or spend time with yourself, allow yourself to really "feel" this emotional turmoil, do not be afraid to experience it. Listen closely if a higher voice will tell you its source. Then, even if at first this source seems totally abscure, send love and light to it from your core. From the divine light that exsists in the very center of your body.

If you want, feel free to PM me with more detail surrounding your issue and I will be glad to offer more advice if I feel I can help.

Chadley.

dreamer
18-10-2006, 08:24 PM
Hi cw, just replying to your earlier post. Basically there are two laws from which all others stem, the law of one and the law of attraction which stems from the law of one. The law of one states that all is one. In states of perceived seperation where there is an inner world (myself) and an outer world (the universe) the law of attraction comes into play. The inner world (myself) is the same as the outer world (the universe) they are one as stated in the law of one, you could say that the outer world is a manifestation of the inner world, you could say that the inner world is reflected in the outer world, so that the universe is in fact a reflection of your soul, every "thing" being a reflection of an aspect of yourself. If you think about it in this way you can start to see that to make your reflection smile you must smile yourself.....so the law of attraction is merely a law of reflection, meditate on things that make you feel happy and happy reflections/manifestations will propagate this feeling of happiness, feel angry and the reflection will be of anger. It is happening all the time just like standing in front of a mirror, there is always a reflection - the trick is to realise that you have the power to smile into the mirror and that you will always get a smile reflected back. The problem is this seems too far fetched to be true and so our doubts cause us to cry, sulk, shout etc at the mirror.

Look around you, you are in the manifestation of your own mind, we all share the same mind, we are all different faces of the one mind all looking at ourself from slightly different angles in the mirror - cool huh. Test it out, if you believe it will manifest - learn to believe in yourself both outside and in.

I hope this helps - its so simple but in its simplicity it can be so hard to grasp, it took me ages then it just clicked one day. Good luck.

e-ma
18-10-2006, 08:44 PM
OK! I think I get this.

To chadley, I did notice your reply to cweiters about needing elements to create manifestation. So emotion ignites intention, and then intention together with thought creates manifestation. Am I right?

Thanks for the advice re: my question. The emotion does feel very isolated because I have done quite a bit of spiritual work and have raised my vibration. The breakthroughs come in bursts rather than a nice, even flow and so sometimes it is still easy to get trapped in thought and for negative emotions to engulf me. (I'm sure this is how you feel too, cweiters, my issues are pretty similar actually).

Quote chadley:
'The good news is, that as this pain increases, so should your ability to identify its cause/ original wound/ core issue. Once you realease this energy, you will find yourself able to enjoy the fruits of having a higher level of energy.'

The bit that I get a bit stuck on is 'releasing this energy'. I know how to get stuck in it, I know how to feel it and for it to hurt me, and I know how to forget about it again until next time, but the bit I don't get is how to actually let the thing go.

I will concentrate on sending light to the core issue, and will trust that in time the karma will burn out. To me it is like the chicken and the egg scenario, my heart is closed because I feel hurt, but I only feel hurt because my heart is closed.

Many thanks...

chadley
18-10-2006, 09:31 PM
OK! I think I get this.

To chadley, I did notice your reply to cweiters about needing elements to create manifestation. So emotion ignites intention, and then intention together with thought creates manifestation. Am I right?

The bit that I get a bit stuck on is 'releasing this energy'. I know how to get stuck in it, I know how to feel it and for it to hurt me, and I know how to forget about it again until next time, but the bit I don't get is how to actually let the thing go.

To me it is like the chicken and the egg scenario, my heart is closed because I feel hurt, but I only feel hurt because my heart is closed.

Many thanks...

You are correct, at least with the basics, but enough to make a significant impact in your life.

Releasing---Lower vibration takes on many forms, luckily. It shows its self as shapes in the mind, it can present itself as a demon in the astral or in dreams, it can look like dark clouds or thick mucus etc. in the aura, it can eventually show up on your body, it can prevent you from divine experience, it can show up in life events, and so on and so on. Identification is the first step, of course. You have to acknowledge that the undesirable circumstances in your life are a direct reflection of your internal issues. But then, how to remove them, you ask? The first piece of advice I will give is to not try to remove, but rather try to raise up the energy in the blockage or energy that causes discomfort. Send light to it, heal it, because it is not separate, but a part of you. Also, ask your guides to help you with it. Keep searching and asking and the most appropriate method will present itself to you. The other thing I will say is that remember that this is where spiritual discipline comes into play. Make sure you devote time to this every day, and I am confident that you will find your answer.

There is another process that I really like that I have read about which I think is really good. During meditation, ask your higher self/god/universe to reveal to you your core issue. Then, pay attention. Keep a journal with you and right down every event in your life which presents itself with synchronicity. After 30 days of doing this, read back over everything you have written and often you may be able to see patterns that expose a belief system you have that you are unaware of.

Hope this helps!

e-ma
18-10-2006, 09:44 PM
Wow - Thank you, this is pretty powerful stuff. I like the idea about asking about your core issue. Often I am trying to work on a million things at once when really I'm sure that they are all inter-connected.

I am sure that I have felt the release of the negative entities. Like symptoms I have never before experienced. Breakouts on my skin and loads of throat problems, stuff like that.

I hadn't thought about it in that way before - every circumstance in my life is a direct reflection of my inner issues.

All of this does help. Thank you!!

AL
19-10-2006, 02:01 PM
The big universal clock is also cosmically ordering, a new world/ age.
If you feel out of place, you may simply be an old soul. There are a number of people feeling this way, indeed, the world seems to be geared up to create this feeling of alienation in all. It could even be called divide and rule.
If we live in poverty at all, we are likely to wish for material safety to take the edge off. We can wish for more though. Far deeper ranging things on a grander scale which involve the whole human family. Then the "cosmos" may comply.
Don't let the world tell you you are a freak and need to get help, even if this is so. It is not surprising if we freaks do need help in the current climate, but it will change, it has to. The help is there/ here, there are many of us who feel like fish out of water, and that is official, we can even take confidence from it if, like everything else spiritual, we TRANSFORM it. TRANSFORM the self. When "I"/ "we" change the world changes. Perhaps I could add that, when the universe changes, then we change, end of story. So it changes now.
love and light Al

Glorymist
20-10-2006, 02:32 AM
Nice touch, chadley. I think I have heard of this 30-day bit before.

hee hee hee

One thing that really helps is to be sincere in the asking. If you go in and just ask - - "What are my issues ?? " - - this can be seen by Life as more of a "gimmee" thing than a sincere request. Try going inside during meditation and composing a nice letter on real nice parchment. Compose it well. You are dialoguing with Life. Then roll it up and put it in a bottle and see yourself walk down to the Ocean and toss it in. Or - - to a massive river and toss it in. This is turning it loose to the Stream of Life. It shows a bit more sincerity than just - - asking. There would be many other ways to formalize and be more sincere with requests.

But be careful what you ask for - - in terms of issues - - and how many. If you ask about a dozen issues - - then you might get a dozen subtle replies - - and unless you are incredibly observant in the rather intricate responses offered by Life - - you might overlook some and mis-read others. And if you just wait for the answers that slap you upside the head - - you tend to overlook the subtle nature of Life Itself - - and that leads back to insincerity. That might not be the way you intend for Life to see your overlooking an offered tidbit of info - - but it is often the way Life sees it. Life is constantly trying to stretch you beyond where you already are.

I wish answers always came via Burning Bush. That would make it all MUCH more simple.

BLAIR2BE
20-10-2006, 02:36 AM
.....a big booming voice from the sky would be nice.....

"DO THIS...DONT DO THAT, YOULL REGRET IT LATER, YOUR WIFE ALREADY BOUGHT MILK" etc.